There is another item which I need to remind everyone about. If there is a worldwide financial implosion, all equities will get hit -- including precious metals. Even if they are hit less.

If the financial collapse is slow enough, gold/gold equities may rise dramatically before things really start to fall apart, especially in the countries with the greatest external debts and weakest economies. All depends on which country you are in, doesn't it? I think all will eventually suffer a repeat of the events of the 20's and 30's -- but that happened in slow motion too -- and some countries got hit first, some later.

My guess is that the US has some distance to go -- probably it will be last to fall -- just as in the 30's. The US seems to excell in excess -- all the way to the ultimate heights of a boom -- to the lowest lows.

Does anyone doubt that the 500 FBI files ( or WJC's private investigators ) dug up the dirt on Livingston?

Gollum -- I still don't know why you think gold is going up tomorrow. I wish it does, given my investments. But I am begninning to think that deflation will rule for some time. I think we are reaching 20 years lows on the CRY0's. I too had thought it was bottoming.

http://www.canoe.ca/MoneyNews/dec17_agnicoeaglegold.html

Here's the quote:

Butler's conclusions were welcome in Washington, which helped orchestrate the terms of the Australian diplomat's report. Sources in New York and Washington said Clinton administration officials played a direct role in shaping Butler's text during multiple conversations with him Monday at secure facilities in the U.S. mission to the United Nations. Spokesmen for Butler and the Clinton administration declined to comment on those conversations.

And once again, here's the URL:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/WPlate/1998-12/16/125l-121698-idx.html

Donald tells me that Mr Butler has denied this on US TV

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/WPlate/1998-12/16/125l-121698-idx.html

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Long-term, WJC impeachment followed by a trial in the Senate will be bullish for gold. However, I don't think the markets realize yet that they are in trouble. Just in case, I bought some equity market calls to partially cover my long position in gold equities.

It is odd that the Congress seems to know how much trouble WJC is in -- but not the markets.

If that happens, it is still possible that we will have another gold 'fire sale' similar to Oct 97. I hope not to fall asleep at the switch, and lose another bundle on gold equities.

Any idea how soon the impeachment proceedings will affect gold? I think a trial in the Senate might be very effective. All depends on how fast the bad news about WJC comes out.

There are a number of factors that will make gold go up -- long term.

1 ) The end of deflation. When this happens, the Fed will expand the money supply -- just like in 1932 or so. And gold/gold equities will shine.

2 ) Cycles -- there are 30,60,90,120 year cycles in Silver, which coalesce around 2010-2015. I am not so confident about gold, but it should be similar. The peak in precious metals will be a strong one -- probably as much as $2000/oz. US for gold.

3 ) Baby boomers -- The baby boomer cycle will peak around 2015, and the population will shift from spending to retirement. This will make a big dent in equities, and the entitlements.

5 ) National debt -- exponential growth will return. The US FED has no choice but to inflate the US dollar to get us out of the entitlement noose we have made for ourselves, to come due about the time the baby bommers retire. Currently the federal debt is about 25 trillion ( official plus entitlements ) and the private debt is about 20 trillion.

So that is the very long term trend in precious metals. Shorter term, we can expect some mice rallies fairly soon -- as the 2 year gold bear is ending. Many of the Gold producer excutives have jumped in during the last major gold bottom -- and are presumably waiting for the pending rise-- possibly delayed by deflationary events. All depends on how fast the US dollar drops during these deflationary times. If it drops fast enough, the US dollar will inflate -- even now. Could be -- because we are up to our eyeballs in debt.

As someone else who used to post here would say --

Together we wait and see -- don't we?

http://www.nytimes.com/library/world/mideast/121798iraq-assess.html

All -- today may not seem like very much, as the Gold manipulators are still in control as Allen ( USA ) says. But -- just think for a minute -- can you remember when the mood of the media and Congress were more pro-impeachment than today? They tire of the lies coming out of the White House.

And -- just a few days ago WJC was in Palestine, trying to cement the peace deal that he orchestrated a month or so before.

Now -- I am not pleased that the US presidency has reached a new low -- near Christmas 1998 when the time should be joyous. But -- I am pleased that Congress is once again showing the American spirit once again. Perhaps we are still a government of three strong branches -- executive, legislative, and judicial. And -- perhaps our news media are finally breaking out of their shell and reporting the news as it is, rather than through rose-colored glasses.

It seems that the US people have woken up, and have finally realized that our leader has warts. Or -- that the emporer has no clothes. Today for the first time in a long time, I would be proud to have a conversation with Abraham Lincoln -- and say: 'Today the American people have seen through the veil of lies, and they are seeking the truth'.

Yes - gold may not be going the right direction today -- the 'truth' is still not fully evident. But the glimmer is there. What we must remember is that at the peak of every cycle is the foundation for the next one. I think I'm going to like one aspect of what is happening in the last few days -- the truth matters once again. The veil has lifted. Too bad it took us nearly 7 years to realize that we have been duped by the master of lies. We may have to accept a 'hangover' of some kind as atonement for our folly.

a vote by the Lower House of the Swiss Parliament combined with what Rhody discussed this morning about lease rates rising as gold is aquired from CB's to dump onto the market would be consistent with what we have seen in todays price action. The artcile does't explain this because the author Patrick Chalmers seeks out those bearish on Gold as a rule. However the lower house vote will be followed by a vote by the upper house in the first quarter of '99. If this vote is passed there will be a referendum sometime in early 2000 which requires a 2/3 majority to pass. The Swiss have also stated that if they achieve this mandate they will sell 500 of the 1300 tonnes of gold they consider surplus over a period of 10 years so tha tit has minimal impact on the Gold markets. This is what they said last year and I don't know if they will reiterate these viewpoints. Don't hold your breath on the mainstream media providing this info if last years coverage of this process is any guide.

Here is the link: http://www.infoseek.com/Content?arn=a2384LBY231reulb-19981217&qt=gold&sv=IS&lk=noframes&col=NX&kt=A&ak=news1486

Anyone have any idea just how strong the current rally in gold/gold equities is ( was ) ? I am keeping one somewhat uneasy eye on Brazil -- probably a good early warning indicator of big time deflationary trouble. As long as Brazil is relatively stable I will keep my gold equities position.

I suspect that Saddam will not do anything foolish like lobbing something into Israel, because he will try to get the maximum mileage of being the 'innocent' target of US aggression.

I heard Dale Bumpers talk on the radio this AM -- I have always liked listening to him -- I think he is far more honest than the average politician. To my amazement, he said without a moments's hesitation that WJC will be impeached -- and he is a Democrat. He implied that the tide is shifting in the Senate as well, though the 2/3 majority vote is not there yet.

So -- the die is cast -- and any 'Wag the Dog' shenanigans will not work. I agree with esotericist that the issue with Iraq is far more complex than 'Wag the Dog' even if it appears that WJC was the cause of this action. Historical trends are now working against WJC for some reason -- he has lost his teflon coat.

I wonder -- perhaps the reason that WJC is in so much trouble is because he listened too much to Hillary ( with the exception of his weakness with the ladies ) . Hillary is the far more dangerous one who sees ( or creates ) conspiracies under every bush. Good thing that WJC has little of Hillary's drive, or we would be under martial law already.

Sadly, I agree with Tolerant1 that terrorist attacks will be coming to US soil -- eventually. The world is getting smaller and smaller, and the US has had some success in keeping a lid on potential hotspots -- but at a price -- due in part to our own ineptitude/corruption regarding foreign policy -- and in part due to historical trends beyond our control.

I have always been intrigued by how the broad strokes of history seem to be made, irrespective of the actions of the players. Sometimes actions due to selfish motives still have a beneficial effect longterm. WJC is now caught up in what is to be, as are the rest of us. We must make the best of what is to come, and try to change things for the better when we can.

We still have a chance to regenerate our government as it was defined in our Constitution and in our Amendments. I wish I could say that I was confident that the cleansing process will be complete -- but -- any progress will be appreciated.

2 ) If the tulip stocks blow-up, then this bodes ill, yeah verily ill, for the overall markets.

3 ) I was just looking over some of the writings of Scott Ritter. The actions taken in the Iraq 'thing' are late indeedy. My opinion is 'Wag the Dog'. Ritter quit over the Administration blocking the UNSCOM teams investigation. No matter what the evidence, more evidence was demanded. It is either bungling of the highest order, or political postioning for this 'event' in Washington. Funny how Berger, Albright, and Clinton supressed the evidence now cited as the reason for the current mission.

Me think Administration speaked with forked tongue..... What else in new? Impeach and remove.

Current news on the Euro pegs it as initially stronger than the dollar. Curiouser and curiouser. Perhaps the best investment in gold, is in coins

When opportunities abound for grasping this period in world history, the United States hasn't a grip. It's leadership employs a carrot tied to a stick. The minions yip and yap after it. Their trainer is entertained.

What a shallow lot my countrymen are.

Children of the 60's, the anti-establishment American subculture, opposed to sacrifice and commitment in most any form, forever creating their convenient controversies, opposing all things dutiful, will never-the-less hurry to don the mask of duty. Plastic personas -- much as the ones in the mindless loathing of their youth -- always willing to feed at the expense others, they do so now from both sides of the political aisle. Their children, well-schooled in the same techniques, now fake their way down the path of their parentage, hoping to employ the same or similar ruse -- the one or ones that assault and destroy genuine substance of character. Blending capitalist and communist, socialists and plutocrats, all together, they practice whatever better benefits their hedonist appetites.

America, imperiled and adrift, yipping and yapping all the way down.

http://nypostonline.com/news/8539.htm

DEFLATIONARY CAPITALISM

You have two cows. You kill both to avoid paying to feed them.