Speaking of bailouts, is anyone checking our official federal debt?

With all of these promised bailouts, and little cash available to do same, it might be tempting to boost the national debt once again.

It seems there is a common thread in bailouts over the last 40 years or so -- and that is -- the unsuspecting public usually pays the bill, one way or another.

Got gold, grub and guns -- engineering books, subsistence farming books, and a Chevy? I have a 3000 gallon water tank behind the house.

Still haven't got around to the gieger counter, but I do know how to make a leyden jar with aluminum foil leafs. Almost as good. Have good books on radiation shielding, too.

If everyone assumes that we will be immolated, they may get what they wish for. I do not. I would rather always have my eyes open so that I can move out of the way, rather than passively await my fate. Isn't that a survival characteristic?

Wish I had more time to work on that 'free energy' device. Would eliminate alot of wars.

By now I don't believe anybody and decide to get scientific about this ( I am a geologist ) so I set up an information system that allows me to monitor all stocks ( i.e. options, warrants, indices ) on the Ozzie market on a daily basis and the entire North American market ( approx. 20,000 stock, mutual fund, option prices ) . I have also compiled historical databases of commodity prices ( gold back to 1889 ) , all globally traded currencies, the Dow going back to 1915, all the major global stock market indices - and have come to the conclusion that everybody else has that we are in the most serious global financial crises for 60 years. All at a time when there is SO MUCH paper out there.

So, in answer to your question I have put all my remaing superannuation assets ( I am single, involved in consulting in the exploration knowledge industry - which pays the bills - and so can afford to take a risk ) into bank put warrants ( expiring 1st quarter 1999 ) and gold call warrants on some of the major gold PRODUCERS ( NOT explorers ) in Australia ( Normandy, Acacia, Lihir, Resolute Resources, etc ) . I am sceptical about gold miners in third world countries ( if the price of gold goes up then local people will confiscate the mines - nwhat we in the mining industry call Sovereign Risk ) .

So there you are - thats my strategy using completely objective information from my financial database. Oh, by the way, maximise your use of the Internet - both for getting the widest possible view of the world ( even all the nutty ones ) and for building up your financial databases in order to remove all emotion from the financial decision-making process.

Cheers & Beers,

Melbourne.

My spouse finally sees the light about WJC -- it took years. She voted for him in 1992 and 1996. Now she finally sees him for what he is -- a hypocrite when it comes to women's rights and childrens' rights. Monica is not much more than a child -- emotionally.

Time is a necssary element for people to see the truth for what it is.

I think we were put on this earth to learn, and become wiser. You learn more when you do not return to reality in a flash of light.

Perhaps that vinyard will produce wine again, if it is not too badly damaged. Renewal is also part of that cycle of life.

My spouse finally sees the light about WJC -- it took years. She voted for him in 1992 and 1996. Now she finally sees him for what he is -- a hypocrite when it comes to women's rights and childrens' rights. Monica is not much more than a child -- emotionally.

Time is a nessary element for people to see the truth for what it is.

I think we were put on this earth to learn, and become wiser. You learn more when you do not return to reality in a flash of light.

Perhaps that vinyard will produce wine again, if it is not too badly damaged. Renewal is also part of that cycle of life.

I think AG is not in the past, fighting inflation. I think he is afraid of repeating the inflationary mistakes of 1925-1929, when the fledgling FED inflated the US money supply on the urging of desperate European bankers, who had nothing to lose from watching the US market bubble and crash. I think then there was an element of inevitability, as equity from all over the world had fled to the US markets.

So -- what would you do if you were AG? Lower rates? Or let the markets do it for you? I don't know. I think before we criticize someone such as he, we ought to walk for a bit in his shoes, and think about what a gold bug might do if he were a FED Chairman. It might not be that much different from what he is doing now. The WJC fiasco is working out perfectly for him, I think, depressing the US markets when they need to be depressed. No one can do anything about the runaway derivatives markets, but hopefully preventing a runaway market bubble like we had in 1929 might ease the pain a bit.

I really don't think you want that -- because that would almost certainly mean a world-wide depression. And -- if you had any money in any equities -- even gold equities, you could kiss it goodbye. You would probably lose your job, and if you had any debt you would have to pay it off. Further, if you had any savings outside your own physical possession, you would have to kiss that googbye as well!

Just how long could you live only on what you have stuffed in your mattress?

Moa: this is why I want to make money in gold -- slowly. AG et al may be able to pull this off, and if he does, I will make alot more money investing in precious metals and precious metals equities than if you get your wish. Your investments would probably also benefit by a delayed rise in gold -- you would have more savings to buy it.

If AG steps down for any reason, we may very well be in serious trouble, as I doubt anyone else in the wings has the skills he has. Any thought about what might happen to the FED around y2k if their finely oiled fiat currency machine falters?

Don't blame AG for our fiat currency. He would also like to go back to the true gold standard we had before the 1900's. The worlds financial system was more stable than it is now. But -- it is too late for that, and the fiat currency hand must be played out, whether we like it or not. Fast or slow -- the outcome will be the same, eventually. I vote for slow, even if that means the illusions and corruption of our current economic system persists a bit longer. If I were alone in this world, I might prefer to get it over with. But I am not, and alot of innocents less prepared than I would suffer. There is much suffering already, with 1/3 of the world in a depression. But if the other 2/3 goes, there will be noone to pick up the pieces and start over.

Then our depression will be much longer -- and all will suffer longer. Do you really want everyone in the world to go through what Russia is going through right now? I am preparing for that eventuality -- subsistence farming would be a necessity -- and others will need access to knowledge about such matters. But I will be quite happy not to have to disseminate this kind of knowledge. As the result of being an ( experimental ) physicist I also can fix just about anything, and I know full well how important that survival skill is. Ever been to Utah? In virtually every other state most Americans have lost the skills of self sufficiency, although it persists in rural areas. Got a Chevy?

Gollum: If I'm right, I'll pick you up in my new sports car, if not, I'm out my original July gambling money.

The world will probably have ANOTHER form of currency by then.......or it won't even rely on currency ( it will exist as something else ) . The world will be a DRASTICALLY different place. No worries mate ;- ) Our children and our childrens children will adapt......what choice have they? Live or die..........

But......gold will still be around.....more of it............used for jewelry and various other trinkets. And it's value will be the same.............and ( some ) kitcoites will still be calling it to skyrocket to 30,000+.......... ( won't happen ) ...................uh uh.

Gold will ALWAYS have it's allure......perhaps.

away...to wait for spud to have a word ;- )

Éß

For the past 48 hours, a ripple of deep fear has gone through stock markets everywhere. The main victims have been the banks. The spectre of systemic risk is surfacing in the popular press from Australia to Asia to Europe to Latin and North America.

How would a fear of systemic risk be confirmed? Well, a fast rising $US Gold price would certainly be a good way to do it. That happened on Friday morning, but didn't last. If the Gold price has been depressed in the past by forward selling, shorting, threats of CB sales etc, why would anyone expect it to stop now, in the midst of increasing fear over a looming systemic risk as presented by the hedge funds?

If the world now expects a Fed rate lowering on Sept 29, then the time after the FOMC meets will be even more dangerous. Meanwhile, Gold is NOT in a $US bull market. The technicals look promising, but no cigar yet.

http://www.nypostonline.com/business/5765.htm

Amazing how quickly LTCM was propped up -- no need for the ineffective IMF this time. Certainly shows you that whatever they were up to was too big to fail -- apparently too closely enmeshed in the world's financial syste. There may be less reserve the next time something like this happens. And, Wall Street will remember that it was the derivatives superstars that got in trouble this time, not some mere rogue traders. Just wait till we hear about those mere mortal investment firms that got burned.

Just a thought -- the great depression began somewhere near 1925 with the US markets crashing in 1929. But -- it was not until 1932 or so that the Rothschilds bank Creditatenstat ( sp? ) in Austria failed. I think if we do have a world financial crisis -- even with derivatives -- it may occur unexpectedly -- possibly farther into the future than we might guess.

I shudder to think what would happen if AG and RR were not at the helm.

Whatever you think of our financial leaders, they are competent, and are charting a difficult course. Those of you who do not think they are doing an admirable job ought to think what it might be without them. Think about what you would do if you were AG, and thrust into the position of defendint the fiat currency system.

It is not a matter of whether you agree with whether or not we have a fiat currency system, it is a matter of maintaining the status quo.

I personally do not want the price of gold to skyrocket, as it would probably mean the end of our current financial system. This may very well happen anyway, but it would be good if it happens fairly gracefully. I think AG knows his role quite well in this matter. I sincerely hope that AG and RR are able to maintain their current level of involvement until the world's financial crisis is over. Might take years, unfortunately.

**Mr. Foster of ( L ) iberty ( C ) oin ( G ) alleries says his customers cite not only the recent stock-market roller-coaster ride but also rumors about the havoc that could be wreaked by the Year 2000 computer problem as a reason for buying gold. If your credit cards don't work and your bank cards don't work, what will work? Gold, he says.They buy it 'just in case.' Some people think the world's coming to an end.**

Some people think the world is coming to and end?..........HUH?

So is this dealer saying his customers are a bunch of doom and gloomers?

Whackos?Retards?Fatalists?Survivalists?End O'da World'ers?

Is this dealer implying his customers are..........

Stupid?Wrong?Ignorant?

Reminds me of a poster HERE!!yuk yuk yuk yuk yuk yuk yuk yuk

Where's Ted when ya need him?yuk yuk yuk yuk

Think I'll open me a coin shop.Must be a REAL easy business when you can lambast your customers in a National Newspaper,eh BART?Yuk yuk yuk yuk...

I will make a commercial with--- bombs going off-----comets plummeting to earth-----

fire and brimstone----moon turning red----- and at the end saying--- GOT GOLD?

Ha ha ha ha ha......I love it!!

Go gold.........Go Disaster

Go UBS

Go producers

Supposedly.....during the other days 'session' he was overheard talking about Sammy Sosa and the fact that Sammy said that Mark M. would win the home run race.........AG said something to the effect that Sammy may be dead wrong about his prediction of Mark winning the 'race'.

Well......that day/night Sammy WHACKED 64......AND......65 to TIE Big Mac.

Hmmmmmmmmmm.......moral of the story: Well, there is no moral....it's just a neat story and it goes with what 'Who Cares' has been saying regarding the omnipotent AG..........and that old commercial saying.......when he talks, people listen....or something like that.

Anyway, thought youse bugs would like a break from the grind and have a little levity thrown yer way.......uh huh.

go gold...

cherosaki! - when gold gets to 300+ ( IF ) then their will be MANY peopleos waiting to sell it into the dirt from which it came.............RJ has mentioned it too..............take heed. Ten cuidado..........this bear ain't dying as quickly as one would imagine. I wil put in some shorts too.........I still believe the bottom is not quite in yet..............but, what do I know.............. ( proud Disney owner ) ....... ( comin' back? ) ........ ( or sinking, sinking, SUNK ) ..... ( ? ) ...

go DELL! ( smile ) ...

and Silver is a dog.........but I like dogs....... ( eh Ben? ) .....whoof whoof!! ........get ready for the selling to commence......... ( ugh ) .

Mr ¥en.....you are my fren...yuk-yuk...

away....back to grinding......

Éß

By TERZAH EWING

Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL

Gold still trades below $300 an ounce, but the sector of the market favored by individual investors -- bullion coins -- is showing life.

The U.S. Mint says sales of its Gold American Eagle coins, partly triggered by world economic turmoil, are thriving. Foreign nations' bullion coins, including the South African Krugerrand, also are selling well. It's insurance. It's financial security, says Ray DeMoss, a floral-marketing consultant in Ruston, La., who has been a buyer of gold in various forms since the 1970s. But he has accelerated his gold buying

lately and says the 30 South African Krugerrands he has purchased over the last six weeks are the first gold coins he has bought in a long time. We're looking at a global money meltdown right now, he explains. The stock market tanking was just the latest sign. The public's not stupid.

The U.S. Mint's sales figures appear to back that up. As of Sept. 23, the Mint this year has sold around 1.2 million ounces of Gold American Eagles, valued at $350 million, to precious-metals dealers, more than double the 447,750 ounces sold in the same period last year and well above the Mint's average yearly sales of between 300,000 and 350,000 ounces.

In August alone, the Mint sold 255,000 ounces of the gold coins, beating the 198,000 ounces sold in October 1987, the month of the Black Monday market crash. This month, as of Wednesday, it has sold another 209,500 ounces. If the pace continues, the Mint says it will sell 1.5 million ounces this year, the most in more than a decade.

The Mint won't comment on the reasons behind the sudden demand for coins, beyond noting that gold prices have languished near 18-year lows, presenting investors with a buying opportunity. But dealers and other investors echo Mr. DeMoss, saying that despite the two-year bear market for gold, which has seen prices plunge from highs of nearly $415 an ounce in February 1996, they expect the yellow metal soon will play its traditional role as safe haven.

Precious metals, including gold, have rallied in recent days on the weaker dollar and what some believe is the growing possibility of an interest-rate cut in the U.S. They continued the upward climb yesterday. On the New York Mercantile Exchange's Comex division, the December gold futures contract rose $3.90 to settle at $296.40 a troy ounce. December silver settled at $5.153 an ounce, up 11 cents, also on the Comex.

Bullion coins are different from collectible rare coins in that they are backed by the governments of their issuing countries and, in the case of the American Eagle, are eligible for use in retirement plans, including IRAs. American Eagles come in four standard weights ranging from a tenth of an ounce to a full ounce; an ounce coin costs 4% to 6% more than the per-ounce spot price of gold, which now is around $294.

Dealers, who market the coins to investors like Mr. DeMoss, say they have ramped up their buying from the Mint and from other countries with similar bullion products because individual investors are snapping them up as fast as the firms can stock them. ( Investors can't buy the coins directly from the Mint. ) Says Chris Holton, vice president of marketing at New Orleans-based Blanchard & Co., the largest coin dealer in the U.S., We've seen unprecedented demand. We've never come close to selling this much gold before. Mr. Holton won't divulge specific sales figures but says August sales alone were 18% higher than what the firm usually books in a three-month period. September sales, he says, are on pace to be only slightly below August's. Mr. Holton says his firm recommends a 10% portfolio allocation to gold.

Other dealers tell similar tales. Jim Foster, owner of Liberty Coin Galleries in Long Beach, Calif., where the bulk of the trade is done with walk-in customers, says his sales so far this year have more than tripled

from the same period last year. It's accelerated in the last two or three months, he says, but the whole year has been more active than last year. Meanwhile, the Mint says silver and platinum coins ( the latter were launched last year ) also are faring well, with platinum already outpacing projected sales for 1998. But it's gold that is the real star. It's mainstream investors reaction to what's going on in the world both politically and economically: the events in Russia and Southeast Asia and also events in Washington. They caused turmoil in the stock market, and investors decided to diversify into gold in order to protect themselves, says Mr. Holton of Blanchard.

Mr. Foster of Liberty Coin says his customers cite not only the recent stock-market roller-coaster ride but also rumors about the havoc that could be wreaked by the Year 2000 computer problem as a reason for

buying gold. If your credit cards don't work and your bank cards don't work, what will work? Gold, he says. They buy it 'just in case.' Some people think the world's coming to an end.

Richard Harmon, an unemployed plant-production planner in Broomfield, Colo., says over the last year, and particularly over the last two months, he has bought six gold coins, including four American Eagles

and two Canadian Maple Leafs. He also holds stock in gold-mining companies, and says he bought the coins because we can't tell the world gold is a good investment if we don't own it ourselves. Gold, he says, has history behind it. Ten thousand years can't be wrong.