fascination with bombs

'That's enough,' wrestler said before tackling shooter

SPRINGFIELD, Ore. ( AP ) -- The guns that a boy allegedly used to kill his

parents and shoot 24 classmates were bought by a father trying to

redirect his son's fascination with weapons into a supervised hobby,

friends said Sunday.

Kip Kinkel's parents knew of his bomb-making fetish for at least a year

before Thursday's shooting in a crowded school cafeteria in which two

students were killed, friends have said.

The 9 mm Glock pistol and .22-caliber rifle Kinkel allegedly used in the

shootings were bought by his father, Bill Kinkel, said Rod Ruhoff.

Bill felt that the boy was obsessed enough with guns that he would have

a gun, one way or another, said Ruhoff, a friend of the father. The way

Bill could control the situation is if he owned the gun and had control

over it.

The parents told friends they tried to discipline Kip, 15, and got him into

anger-management counseling for a while. A distraught Bill Kinkel even

sought the advice of a stranger after learning the man was an expert in

antisocial behavior and juvenile delinquency.

Dan Close, who met Bill Kinkel six months ago at the San Diego airport,

recalled the father saying at the time that the boy was totally obsessed

by guns and would become uncontrollably angry when denied anything.

I told Bill that raising kids is the toughest thing we'll ever do, Close

said. And Bill said, 'If we survive.'

Bill and Faith Kinkel were believed to have been shot to death

Wednesday afternoon by their son. Kip is accused of driving their sport

utility vehicle to Thurston High School the next day, opening fire in a

crowded cafeteria and killing two students. Two other students remain in

critical condition.

The boy has been charged as an adult under Oregon law with four

counts of aggravated murder.

As this blue-collar town continued to mourn its loss and recover from the

shock Sunday, Kinkel was on suicide watch at a juvenile detention

facility, monitored by closed-circuit television.

It was about a year ago when the Kinkels discovered he was

downloading bomb-making instructions from the Internet and building

bombs, said Kim Scott, a best friend of Kip's sister, Kristin.

Police found five sophisticated bombs and 15 other inactive explosive

devices in the Kinkel house.

Somehow, we didn't think it was ever going to turn out to be this

serious, Scott said. Obviously we were wrong.

Kip ended his anger-management counseling sessions by convincing

his parents they were no longer needed, she said.

They tried to discipline him and they tried to keep him from making

more bombs, said Scott, who grew up across the street from the Kinkels.

But at some point, Kristin said, they just pretty much had given up on

being able to control him.

Ruhoff and other friends said Bill Kinkel normally kept the guns in a

locked gun safe and kept the only key with him at all times. But Ruhoff

said the father once placed the Glock temporarily in an athletic club

locker because Kip gained access to it without permission.

Thurston Principal Larry Bentz said that despite family friends and other

students knowing of Kinkel's fascination with guns and bombs, the

information never came to the attention of school authorities until they

suspended him for bringing a gun to school Wednesday.

There was a little bit of a chip on his shoulder at times; he was a little

lippy, said Bentz, who said the school will reopen Tuesday. There was

no ... outward signs.

I am in Christ and I am invested in gold. The word tells us that Gold well be thrown in to the streets , having no value. My guess is the world will fall into depression, Gold well rule, then one well rule,then Gold well be thrown into the streets.I hope my fellow Goldbugs have found the only thing we can really trust in. CHRIST

away.....to the couch

Éß

go silver.......go plat......go guns ( ? ) .....easy cowboys..........

I noticed with this school shooting in Oregon, that the shooter was wrestled to the ground by a wounded student. Aparently the perpetrator said at the time , just shoot me. The wounded student, although having a strong motive, chose not to take up the assailants offer. This would prove that guns do not kill, however easy access to guns certainly helps nuts to kill, even ones who are rendered temporarily nuts by alcohol.

As a teacher said at the time, maybe it's time for some kind of gun control, I could flunk a student and he could waste me..

guns are for killing, aren't they?

2 ) Enjoy most of your posts, mate. Have put a couple into my Kitco classics file.

3 ) I grew up in the US. My father was a peripatetic pilot. My childhood memories are of never locking a door, never getting robbed, and the only drugs we saw were aspirin tablets. You have heard all this 'remember the good old days' stuff before. I was in L.A. during the Watts riots. In fact I had naievly driven through Watts a few days before on the way to LAX. Watts, JFK being murdered by 'persons and/or groups unknown', and the Vietnam war changed my thinking about the US. The problems had been there all the time. I was just tardy in recognizing them. They have increased exponentially in the last 30 years.

Antipodeans have a love/hate relationship with the US. The biggest kid on the block is always going to be resented. You should be thankful that Aurator lets off a broadside every now and then. The rest of the world is thinking much darker thoughts about you but still smile and kowtow in your presence. Antipodeans tend to shoot from the lip. Must be that anti-authoritarian convict past. Probably why we like Kitco so much. Criticism from these parts should be taken as your best friend telling you that you have bad breath before the big date.

Long weekends on Kitco.... :- )

While we're at it, wouldn't what the U.S. Govt. did ( Re. Mexican bailout I ) constitute the crime of hiding a cash transaction? I know that if I tried to 'structure' a financial transaction so as to hide the real cash flow, I would be in deep doo doo with you know who. :- ) )

I have Supercharts and Trade Station 4 Real time. For end of day data I use Worden brothers. I have had no problems with end of day data or SC/TS 4.0. Omega commands a high $ for their product. I don't know why, other than we're willing to pay for it? :- ) )

Worden Brothers has just released a newer version of their TeleChart 2000 software for Windows 95/98/NT. I've tried it, but haven't made up my mind yet. The daily download cost $1.99 for all of the data in their system along with 20 minute delayed intraday data. That's it! $1.99 per day. Beats the cost of real time data. The Worden system downloads over the Internet. They also provide fundamental data on Saturdays for around $3.

You are a clever and sly fellow

I would enjoy blowing the froth

Off a few cold ales with you some day

Yes

That looks negative for silver.

How do you like the Omega Supercharts.

In the early 80's I spend 2 big ones on System Writer Plus.

Never liked the program. Had always problems with the data downloads.

( Omega still keeps in touch with old customers ) but on other threads I hear about the old problems with data downloads other than the DIAL.

Would appreciate your opinion.

TX S.

I am published here:

http://www.MONEX.com/mt.html

A more ballanced view, yes?

On USA GOLD

The hook is set

Those who follow this jokester

Astound me with their wide eyed naiveté

Get a clue: It is a Hoax to sell books

And increase traffic on an Internet site

And you all are dancing the jig

With nary a thought into the reason

Of, why?

I know, I know………

What harm does he do?

None to me, for I know he is a crock

Others here seem to be making financial decisions

Based on what this guy says

They deserve what they get

They were warned well in advance

No sympathy or empathy to be found

For those who are so easily misled

Grow up

Yes

EJ -

I own all of HST’s works, and reading them is an ongoing activity. It began when I was 14 years old and will continue until I die. I have written here before that HST is the finest writer of our generation. This is like comparing platinum to gold, there is nothing to compare.

There are many fine writers with many fine voices. Once in a generation or century comes one who has a truly unique perspective and the ability and talent to invite the world inside to peer at itself through new eyes. HST is such a man, and the world is better for it. His frenzied apocalyptic rantings are balance by razor sharp observation and a rabid unwillingness to compromise the Truth, whatever It may be, and wherever It may be found.

The movie does him an injustice. It shows HST as a drug addled paranoid. While this is a pretty accurate description of this fellow, the movie did little to bring his words to life. It is the words, after all, that keep me interested, and these are words I can read time and again.

What was true yesterday, is probably still true today.

Regarding Gun Control:

Prohibition has never, and will never work in a free society. If the demand is there, the contraband will appear, always. The only way to effectively fight this is to trash the Constitution and give the State unprecedented powers of intrusion into our lives in order to enforce this prohibition.

Witness the drug war. How is it that one may loose his property and assets, without ever having gone to court or even been found guilty? The Government shat all over due process in the national zeal to stop drugs. We are a far worse nation today than when the drug war started. This disintegration is due, in a large part, to this very war.

Gun ownership is ultimately to protect oneself from the Government. That they kill burglars, rapists, and little cute fuzzy animals are all side benefits. A well armed populace will never be defeated or overthrown. Forget that the government has lots more guns. The Afghanis proved that a refusal to quit and a determination to the death will beat any superpower with superior forces.

We leaned this in Nam, yes?

Yes

Ersel on Aurator -

It is precisely that our own 64K friend from through the earth is so congenial that his latest posts caught my attention. I must admit, I can find no fault in his logic. It may be impolite to speak the truth, but it is the truth, and no amount of glitter and polish will shine this ugly truth up. Perhaps this particular holiday is the best time to think upon this?

Rhody -

New York has among the tightest gun control laws in the nation, yet the murder rate there is higher than most nations on earth.

Gun control has nothing to do with the murder rate.

It is a person’s willingness to pull the trigger.

Americans are very good at pulling the trigger.

Yes

I tried to post several times but I get a Save File dialog box when I press Submit Comment. Has anyone else had this problem? This small post should go through, but the longer one I'm trying to post is stuck?

?

Prospector -- Chameleons? Just because someone bears an 'R' in front of their name does not mean that they are any different than someone who bears a 'D'. The common interest seems to be money and power. We, the people, have given over too much authority to these boobs. We have become complacent and lazy.

Once upon a time, politics was played out when the work in the fields was done. Nowadays, the politico's work the same hours we do, hold hearings and vote on issues relevant to us while we are at work and unable to speak for ourselves. Thus we are taxed more as we labor to pay our already heavy burden of taxation. Such a deal, huh?

SouthernEra Resources ( SUF:TSE ) announced that it has

withdrawn its case preventing the Marsfontein heirs through NGS

Minerals ( Pty ) Ltd. from dealing with the mineral rights on the farm

Marsfontein 91KS in South Africa. The claim by the heirs opposing

SouthernEra's acquisition of the mineral rights was also withdrawn.

SouthernEra has decided, according to a report by The Financial Post

that it is further ahead to settle with the heirs by way of a $21 million

offer, matching an offer made by DeBeers. The heirs want a big

cheque rather than mineral rights. SouthernEra is calculating that the

heirs will be better off with them than DeBeers, whose offer is

contingent upon exploration results. ( May 22/98 )

http://www.info-mine.com/daily.news/dp-may23-25-98.html

Sorry about the digression there, but schools have become the dumping ground for kids while parents are working to pay the bills and ever increasing levels of taxation. Who teaches these kids moral values? That's not the teachers job. Reading, writing, and mathematics is their purview.

Also, dishonest money has something to do with this. In the old days, people would cheat by shaving the coins ( gold and silver ) . Nowadays, the gubament does this for you. It's called inflation. Guess what? They also measure it for you to! :- ) )

@10:53

It has never worked and never will work. Firearms are not the problem.

panda ( John Disney__A ) ID#30116:

My problem is that I've seen, first hand, the work of communists, socialists, and liberals.

My question is just who are these lefties? We have seen for the past few generations a lot of left wing ideology and thinking creep into politics and the way western society is now structured ( & thinks ) but not by socialist but by some so-called right wingers.

It seems voting right wing does not ensure right wing ideology. I think Lawyers have some part to play in all this...

One thing that I have to say for the left though, they do a damn fine job of screwing up the education that the 'churldren' receive. All in the name of 'protecting the children'. Then the children grow up to be the fine idiots, or barbarians, who later vote more of the lefties in to further corrupt our society. Of course, from this well spring comes the animals who commit mass murder and mayhem in the schools as well as the streets.

And this I am forced to support through taxation on my earnings.

BBML.

But wait! If you were seen in violation of this 'kind act', you would be pulled over and cited or given some type of warning. Hmmm. That doesn't sound like a free country to me. Sounds sort of like a police state. Of course these measures were undertaken for the, 'good of the children'.

Now safety is a wonderful thing, but we all have ( had? ) the right to be foolish and, at times, stupid. There is a price to be paid for acting foolish or stupid. Sometimes it is very high. When we seek to abolish it ( impossible! ) , then we let others think for us. When we do that, tyranny is not far behind. Besides, who are these people who think they know better than I, how to live my life and dispose of my work ( read income ) ? I think that they are a most vile group, if you ask me.

I wonder why so many 'social liberals' are on a gold site? It seems very antithetical to me, after all, don't you trust your governments and their fiat currency?

Investing gold bullion is the polar opposite of socialist B.S. in all of its' forms. It implies that you believe in keeping what you have EARNED. If you're here, then you're NOT interested in the redistribution of YOUR wealth.

http://www.hkabc.net/cgi-bin/mtl-cgi

-Tom

On K2 she asserts that gold will rise to $320 in the face of full scale nuclear war. The Dow may only correct 5% though.

Either she is completely hysterical and irrational or she is incredibly naive. There is no in between.

Yep

( A good name for a 60's rock band )

ERLE -

The last post about the 650 Lightning got me thinking on another piece by Hunter Thompson about electricity. I am cursed by finding an analogy in almost everything; but this seems as good an analogy of these markets as any I can think of - and in keeping with my warnings about speculation this morning.

It is not hard to see where some influence in my own writing may be found.

So:

Electricity - They Laughed at Thomas Edison

It has been raining a lot recently. Quick thunderstorms and flash floods…. Lightning at night and fear in the afternoon. People are worried about electricity.

Nobody feels safe. Fires burst out on dry hillsides, raging out of control, while dope fiends dance in the rancid smoke and animals gnaw each other. Foreigners are everywhere, carrying pistols and bags of money. There are rumors about murder and treachery and women with no pulse. Crime is rampant and even children are loosing their will to live.

The phones go dead and power lines collapse, whole families plunged into darkness with no warning at all. People who used to be in charge walk around wall-eyed, with their hair standing straight up on end, looking like they work for Don King, and babbling distractedly about their hearts humming like stun guns and trying to leap out of their bodies like animals trapped in bags.

People get very conscience of electricity when it goes sideways and starts to act erratic…. Erie blackouts, hissing, and strange shocks from the toilet bowl, terrifying power surges that make light bulbs explode and fry computer circuits that are not even plugged in…. The air crackles around your head and you take a jolt every time you touch yourself. Your lawyer burns all the hair off his body when he picks up the cordless phone to dial 911.

Nobody can handle electricity gone amok. It is too powerful… Ben Franklin was never able to lock a door again after the day lightning came down his kite string and fused that key to his thumb. They called it a great discovery and they called him a great scientist; but, in fact, he bawled like a baby for the rest of his life every time he smelled rain in the air.

I find myself jerking instinctively into the classic self-defense stance of a professional wire wizard every time I hear rain on the roof. That is an atavistic tic that I picked up many years ago in my all-night advanced intelligence electronics class at Scott AFB, on the outskirts of East St. Louis - where I also learned about pawnshops, oscillators, and full bore lying as a natural way of life.

The stance was the first thing we learned, and we learned it again every day for a long, crazy year. It is as basic to working with serious electricity as holding your breath is to working underwater…

Lock one hand behind you back before you touch anything full of dissatisfied voltage - even a failed light bulb - because you will almost certainly die if you don’t.

Electricity is neutral. It doesn’t want to kill you, but it will if you give it a chance. Electricity wants to go home, and find a quick way to get there - and it will.

Electricity is always homesick. It is lonely, But it is also lazy. It is like a hillbilly with a shotgun and a jug of whiskey gone mad for revenge on some enemy - a fatal attraction, for sure - but he won’t go much out of his way to chase the bugger down if ambush looks a lot easier.

Why prowl around and make a spectacle of yourself when you can lie in wait under some darkened bridge and swill whiskey like a troll full of hate until your victim appears - drunk and careless and right on schedule - so close that you that you almost feel embarrassed about pulling the trigger.

That is how electricity likes to work. It has no feelings except loneliness, laziness, and a hatred of anything that acts like resistance…. Like a wharf rat with his back to the wall - it won’t fight unless it has to, but then it will fight to the death.

Electricity is the same way: it will kill anything that gets in its way once it thinks it sees a way to get home quick…….. Zaaaappp…… Right though your finger and through your heart and your chest cavity and down the other side.

Anything that gives it an escape route. Anything - iron, wire, water, flesh, ganglia - that will take it where it must go, with the efficiency of gravity or the imperative of salmon swimming upriver.… And it wants the shortest route - which is not around a corner and through a muscle mass in the middle of your back, but it will go that way if it has to.

Some people had to have their loose hand strapped behind them in a hammerlock with rubber cords, just to keep their hearts from exploding and their neck nerves from being fried like long blond hairs in a meat fire when the voltage went through. But sooner or later they learned. We all did, one way or another.

One night - perhaps out of boredom or some restless angst about the fate of Caryl Chessmen or maybe Christine Keeler - I connected a 50,000 volt RF transformer to one end of the thin aluminum strap on the Formica workbench that ran around three sides of the big classroom; and then I grounded the strap to a deep-set screw in the wall socket.

Severe shocks resulted when the generator jumped its limiter and began cranking out massive jolts and surges of RF voltage. A 50,000 volt shock ran through my stomach, just below my naval, burning a long, thin hole that I can still pull a string of dental floss through on wet nights.

It was horrible, and still is, but it was also a massive breakthrough; and I will never forget the warped joy I felt when the first surge of electricity went through them. They squawked at each other like chickens….

My own pain was nothing compared to the elation of knowing that I had just made an unspeakably powerful new friend - an invisible weapon that could turn warriors and wizards into newts, and cause them to weep.

HST - 1990

Yes

After reading this again, I see how gold, or silver, or platinum, or any investment could be substituted for electricity in the above. The market is mindless and entirely unassuming. It will go where it will, with, or without, any one of us. In keeping with the focus of risk with which I started this day, I thought this piece would give another view; perhaps a peripheral flash that catches the light in just the right way to see a reflected truth in the calm waters of the pond before some damn coy fish wrecks the whole serenity thing by breaking to surface for some slimy bug. The coy eats, and my vision is ruined. Some deal. Some serenity. Some fish.

Indeed

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0465049052/002-5193232-3941442

Read my prior looking to cover under 290 as: Looking to cover below 295.

ERLE -

That was not my piece, although I wish it was. That was from Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, by Hunter S. Thompson. The 650 Lightning referred to his days riding with the Hells Angels in the Sixties.

I saw the movie today, which was hilariously dangerous and completely twisted, and they used just portion of that piece. This offended me, so I posted the entire quote here.

I just like the way he writes………

Yes