Oris -

Gold will need to break 330 coupled with negative economic news ( worse than a quarter-point rise in interest rates ) and a loss in confidence in the Dow before everyone will cover their shorts. It is not speculative shorting that has hurt, or will hurt gold in the future, it is CB sales and forward sales responsible for these price levels. Absent those conditions listed above, any gold rally is doomed to be capped off by producer selling.

If at least two of the three conditions above exists, you will see modest short covering with an eye toward selling the next rally. Only when all three conditions are met, will gold offer a sustained rise. I will not ride shorts that high. If we hit above 325 or below 295, I will cover my existing shorts.

Yes

I have one caveat for the BIS. The whole reason for their existence is the security of gold -- its scarcity and durability makes it an ideal currency. The problem is this -- the nuclear threat shifts the balance somewhat, because gold does not offer the security it once did -- a nuclear confrontation can make gold worthless ( or nonexistent ) in a flash. Perhaps the BIS/Rothschilds are hedging their bets by diversifying at several sites around the world. I would.

Henry D -

Common decency played no part in the numerous attacks made on me just because I said gold would fall to exactly where it fell before. I simply said gold will do what it did a couple months ago; I did not bring in all sorts of mysterious machinations and speak of 30K gold. My posts have been treated with grave disrespect, yet my words pointed the truer course. Perhaps if I were to write in quatrains and parables people would find the wisdom within. Seems speaking plain is not good enough.

I have noticed Henry, that you care little for the negative side to this forum. Perhaps when I am next roundly attacked, you will come to my defense as publicly as you have disdained my own posts, or are your words of wisdom only reserved for those you agree with?

Sharefin -

You have a kind and trusting soul. Yet reality does not leave you blinded by your fealty. When you wake to find the world as it is, you will call it thus and put away yesterdays beliefs now proven wrong. I call this clear vision, and you see far.

IDT -

Never heard of Veneroso.

TYoung -

My target on platinum has been focused on the June contract for months. I will buy all I can at these levels. These prices are a gift. I still believe we will se massive gains by the first week in June. That is the short term outlook, longer term, I believe platinum will settle into a 450 - 600 trading range over the next couple years.

Rob ( RJ & Another ) @ When Big Trader was about the same stuff went on. People used to parse his statements etc. One day, I snapped and made a post. It was, Danger like dagger now. I couldn't believe what the response was. That post, which I lifted from a B UFO movie, was treated with deference and awe. It was a sight.

Rob -

These are the truest words I have read today. Mystery is sexier than day to day trading, especially when it panders to a particular bias. This is why the world will always have fraud, for people want it this way. For those who doubt, look at your elected representatives.

In-Damn-Deedy

Yes

You won't be surprised to learn that this has all been seen before. A high IQ is no guarantee that you won't fall prey to greed in a mania. No less than Mr. Gravity himself, Sir Issac Newton, managed to get in and out of the South Seas Bubble after doubling his money, about 5,000 pounds in all. BUT - before the mania ended, he succumbed once again; he was fully invested at the end, and lost at least 20,000 pounds sterling. For the rest of his life, he continued to be very grumpy about his foolishness, and nevermore would tolerate anyone mentioning the South Sea Company in his presence.

One level head of his period is quoted as saying, The additional rise above the true capital will only be imaginary; one added to one, by any stretch of vulgar arithmetic will never make three and a half, consequently all fictitious value must be a loss to some person or other first or last. The only way to prevent it to oneself must be to sell out betimes, and so let the Devil take the hindmost. ( translates roughly to: Dogs bite the laggards ) .

Read and reread that last paragraph! In the end, it was the WINNING formula.

Namasté

When Big Trader was about the same stuff went on. People used to parse his statements etc. One day, I snaped and made a post.

It was, Danger like daggar now. I couldn't believe what the response was. That post, which I lifted from a B UFO movie, was treated with defference and awe. It was a sight.

of the software industry and that my post may have

been inappropriate ( my poor attempt at humor ) .

However, I am puzzled as to why Mr Gates ( microsoft )

is being villianized as the supreme controller of

all software and their application potentials.

Is'nt it reasonable for a business or inventor to

protect his/her product or invention? One has to

keep one step ( at least ) ahead of the competition,

right? If one's product or creation is readily received

or accepted by society or the consumer is this not

the choice made by them ( consumer ) , not the inventor

or business providing the product. If the inventor

or business continues to improve his product and the

consumer continues to readily purchase this product

is this not a choice of the consumer?

If I, as a competitor then complain that the consumption

of my product is impeded by the inventor's innovations

or wide spread market acceptance, is it not my

responsibility ( if I wish to compete ) to invent a

product or innovate my existing product to influence

the consumer to purchase my product instead of the

product of the original inventor?

I have a difficult time understanding why the creator

of a product should be forced to sell his conpetitor's

product along with his own.

P.S. I hope this makes sense. This is not my area

of expertise.

Hey, shall we chip in to buy you that pair of shoes? Oil hasn't been very good to you lately.

BTW. Notice that the Dems pulled out the argument yesterday that George Bush wanted to have the Chinese send up military satellites. Mentioned that AL GORE wrote to him not to do so. Two very important points here:

1: Bush didn't do it after he learned the facts.

2: Dems are polishing up Al Gore and getting him ready for a squeaky clean takeover.

Wondering why the market didn't tank? Remember the derivatives market. 40 trillion dollars a day moving around and around. Who keeps tabs on it? Does anybody really know what the daily movements are? How do they the affect the price of AU? Does anybody have a handle on this?

Out of every 462 explorations there is One Winne.r.

The Canadians by and far are the best exploration artists in the world.

And when it comes to mining they are the best,no argument.

However.. as I said yesterday there promotors are so CROOKED they could stand behind a corckscrew and you couldn't find them.

They have some woman over there on the Vancouver exchange trying to clean it up.She is taking all the fun out of it.

With the odds running 462...1 you have to separate the water from the whiskey.

I subscribe to a Canadian Paper on line, called the Norther Miner,You should get it. It is the Bible of all exploration and mining activities worldwide. It does not matter what country , if its exploration or miningthe Canadians will be in on it.

As a starter, to lower your odds check what % the company you are looking at holds on the exploration, most times there are many working together on the same project with different % holdings.

I've been looking, but I can't find any other reference to the Mexican Bank indictment than the one you already cited, which of course doesn't say what the basis in law or under which treaty/body of law the indictment stands. Please let us know if you find out more. I'm still wondering what the heck the US government is doing indicting another country's institutions. Also wondering if it was quietly approved at the G8 meeting of last weekend.

It's amusing watching the powerful of the world going on, calling the shots as if all was normal in the world while it disintegrates around them. They won't see it until the very end, I think.

Absolutely

Yes

PH in LA ( RJ's Amnesty for LGB? Never! )

Your call for a general amnesty for LGB this weekend was an ill-conceived and unconvincing gesture for some very compelling reasons.

PH -

Believe me the idea was entirely well conceived and fully baked.

LGB could beat a derisive….. joke ( for want of a better word ) into the ground but so can many here. What I like about his approach is the generous helping of simple common sense. I'm sorry this does not set the world on fire but it does chart the truest course, and is light years ahead of some here who think themselves rational when they speak of $30,000 gold. His battle with JD is between the two of them.

As for ANOTHER:

Screw him/her. I told everybody this was a hoax before Christmas. What truly amazes me is the majority of posters here seemed to hang on his every ridiculous post. You heard no words of derision from me about this fellow because I never took a word of it seriously. I got a kick out of watching his disciples argue every absurd nuance. This was all a FRAUD. So was Big Trader. So will be the next one. Somebody made some money selling the book though, didn't they? Second printing even. If you can't sell gold, sell books, right?

When you say we have all lost with ANOTHER's departure, I agree. We have lost the BEST jokester on this forum.

IF my words appear even slightly ambiguous, let me state in all earnestness:

TO HELL WITH ANOTHER.

I guess that is a very polite thing to say to a Saudi/Chinese prince/princes royalty demi-god who is letting a little Internet forum in on the machinations of the century. But I don't feel very nice today. I have little regard and less respect for anybody that still buys this fool's story. Is that mean enough? Maybe ANOTHER will reappear and complain that I represent a biting ears company when I post and that all will be clear soon, yes?

Yes

After a time……………

a pot to put in the window.

http://www.insightmag.com/investiga/dnc1.html

The Henry Kissinger/China connection is intriguing. Perhaps that Trilateral Commission stuff is true after all. Just a thought -- what if there really were organizations infiltrating various world governments that have no loyalty to anyone except themselves? If such organizations exist, they probably have existed for centuries or longer. The problem is that any human organization is likely to become corrupted sooner or later. Let us pray that these actions are not detrimental to world peace and the advancement of the human race. I don't know, and I probably will never know.

One thing we do know, is that AG would not dare raise interest rates. Not for our sakes, but for the sake of Japan and SEAsia.

Incidentally, today's drop in gold is remarkably little given the trouble in Indonesia. This is very different so far from the scenario of Oct 97. I would like very much to hear from D.A. about silver, and his opinions about US inflation coming down the pipeline. This gold bug Tsunami surfer is getting a little worried about a wipeout.

PanAmerican Silver is now slightly below $9.00, responding very little to silver's drop to $5.30 or so today. Which would you choose, PAASF or HWP as the better bet?

If this is the silver low, we are doing well, I think.

I wish gold was more transparent.

If mines are hedged at a profit, why do gold shares change so much because of a decline in the price of gold?

Where do these hedge profits go? For more exploration so that the price of gold can be driven lower ?

I think the mines and CB'S have a racket at shareholders expense.

Why not take these hedge profits, pay down debt, curtail production and serve notice that enough is enough.

If not , at least pay dividends to the shareholders.

Someone explain please, my business sense says a snake is in the woodpile. How can we chop his head off?

Back on Fri May 08 1998 16:10 I wrote here:

Is there someone out there who knows someone in the Gold business who could get a DeBeers style campaign going to persuade individuals to buy just a few Gold coins - for insurance - to take care of their families, etc? The same spiel life insurance companies use.

On Fri May 08 1998 16:13 tolerant1 responded:

Squirrel - the horror of it is that you can even make such a comment, I still ask the question, who is and what is The World Gold Council. If I had half their budget for the past ten years you would be finding soverigns in boxes of CrackJacks by now.

On Fri May 08 1998 16:33 I told Tolerant1 - screw the World Gold Council! Is there some other potential group who can DO SOMETHING instead of talking or reacting. Sovereigns in Cracker Jack boxes not. But for a measly few hundred US dollars a person can give an valuable heirloom to their children {who will hock it at the nearest pawnshop for party money}. Even a 1/2 ounce coin could be an cornerstone in the foundation of their child's future. {Now I'm starting to sound like a life insurance salesman!}

Starr Adds Lawyers, Doubles Office Space

From Times Wire Reports

Independent counsel Kenneth W. Starr has hired 10 new lawyers and

more than doubled his Washington office space since January. U.S.

News & World Report said Starr's office rented an additional 7,400

square feet, which brings his operation's monthly Washington rent to

$43,186. Starr's inquiries, which began as a probe of Arkansas land deals

involving President Clinton and Hillary Rodham Clinton, have expanded to

include the president's relationship with former White House intern Monica

S. Lewinsky and the possible misuse of FBI files.

Copyright Los Angeles Times

---------- Forwarded message ----------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 09:29:37 -0500 ( CDT )

From: John C. Goodman- National Center for Policy Analysis

ncpa@onramp.net

To: ncpa@onramp.com

Subject: NCPA Policy Digest

( snip )

ALL THAT GLITTERS IN THE HIGHWAY BILL

Fiscal affairs consultant Scott A. Hodge has a comparatively

inexpensive notion: gold-plating the nation's highway system. He

points out that the cost would be comparable to the $200 billion

plus to be spent under the highway bill now being hashed out in a

House-Senate conference committee.

First, experts informed him that it would cost about $30 per

square foot for heavy gold electroplate. Then Hodge took up his

calculator.

o With the typical lane in the Interstate Highway System

being 12 feet wide, and a mile having 5,280 feet, those

63,360 square feet could be gold-plated at a cost of $1.9

million for the mile.

o With 46,000 miles in the Interstate system as of 1996, it

would cost roughly $87.4 billion to gold-plate a single

lane the length of the system.

o Since that falls far short of the costs of the highway

bill, he threw in the nearly 27,000 miles of urban highway

in the National Highway System -- adding another $50.7

billion of gold-plated lane.

o Still falling short of what Congress wants to spend, Hodge

added another 40,000 miles of highway in the 84,700-mile

Rural National Highway System.

That brought the total roughly to what Congress is intent on

spending in the highway bill.

Source: Scott A Hodge, Let's Gold-Plate the Roads -- Really,

Washington Post, May 18, 1998.

For more on Federal Spending see

http://www.ncpa.org/pd/budget/budget.htm

( snip )

I'd be really interested in seeing a breakdown of derivative trading, how they compare in dollar amount to the underlying markets and currencies they influence. Anyone have a handle on it, or some informative links?

But -- we might get the sudden news that the French are revaluing their gold to 150% of the current price, just as they did in the 70's. This news will probably be unexpected when it happens.

RJ and EB are right that if we really want to make money now ( short term ) , we should not be investing in gold. I am beginning to think more and more that deflationary effects are dominant in the world right now. This will be confirmed if Mexico and Venzueala implode next. If the script is to be as I suspect it is, the US markets will continue to rally for a time, and will be the last ones to go -- just like the sequence of events leading up to the great depression.

We Tsunami Gold surfers may not get quite what we expected -- we must be nimble.

http://www.crbindex.com/

CNBC reports that NY's Advance-decline line looking technically weak for 2 - 3 weeks. World markets are weak. Russia down nearly 12% and not even reported on the business news! Their 3rd day significantly down. This is very worrisome, as Russia is likely to be the next implosion. It appears to have been triggered by a small, contained military mutiny. If this is a rolling deflation we're seeing, plan to see more of the same. Don't look to see where the money is going, most of it is just dissapearing. They were only paper profits in the first place, they didn't really exist. Watch Brazil and Russia closely. If they pop, all our shoes are going to pinch.

http://quote.yahoo.com/intlmarkets

Perhaps the question could be rephrased: Are there any individuals who could not enter the White House, as long as they did not threaten the safetry of the president? I doubt it. I would guess that horns and a tail would not be enough for refusal of admission.

If I worked for the FBI, CIA or Secret Service, and I was responsible for security at the White House, I would be going nuts.

The historians are going to have a field day with WJC, and it will not be complimentary.

The gold they long

( a dollar they short )

Go gold they say

( drop dollar exhort )

Thousands an ounce!

( pennies a buck )

Don't wait to pounce!

( the buck's outta luck )

Gold is cheap!

( the buck's overpriced )

And beautiful too!

( George needs a 'doo )

Back up the truck!

( dump all your cash )

Can't wait a moment!

( if it burns do it fast )

Didn't you see overseas!?

( they look pretty cheap )

It's coming here next!

( Giant Frog's gonna leap )

Gold is oppressed!

( the dollar is free? )

They're keeping it down!

( and Elvis ate three )

They can't do it long!

( but they caaAAHHNN do it short )

I'm hanging on!

( for bugs that's a quart )

Where do I buy unreportable?

( to hide a loss? )

How do I hide in my plumbing?

( use mental floss )

We need change in perceptions!

( pocket change I perceive )

I bought five more Maples!

( his tree he did leave )

It's the CIA!

( and maybe your wife )

There's still time!

( place a call on a life )

The Fed's on the loose!

( chewed through the restraints )

There's no tomorrow!

( then no more complaints )

Gold: Who is selling gold? Sure does look like Gold bullion is the way to go, doesn't it? It is ridiculously cheap. Silverbaron -- I liked your comments about why gold is behaving so poorly -- because the average individual only considers gold as a hedge against inflation. The idea that gold is a hedge against 'fiat' currency ( debt ) implosion is a more subtle one, only to be understood by Kitcoites. Wouldn't it be nice if the WGC advertized gold like diamonds are advertized: instead of 'Diamonds are Forever', 'Own gold -- it is no one else's liability'.

India: They do have the hydrogen bomb. That explosion was for China's benefit, as you might expect, not Pakistan.

WJC and Chinagate: So WJC met with the daughter of one of the highest ranking members of the Chinese military, who just happens to be a select member of the Chiness Communist party. I wonder if WJC realizes that those Chinese nuclear missles pointed at Washington DC are now alot more accurate, complements of the US corporate desire to save several hundred million dollars on Iridium and other communications satellite launches.

The markets: My guess is that the US dollar and the US markets will recover fairly soon and rally again due to 'flight to safety'. Gold and silver will languish for a time, until the pros quietly start to head fot the exits. I still can't tell for sure if deflationary or inflationary forces are daominant -- but for now I am following D.A.'s assessment.

Mexico: Forrest/brush fires are now so severe that smog alarms are spreading in Texas. Just a thought -- Is this to be a ElNino-related effect, repeating the SEAsian debacle? If so, deflation, not inflation may be next. It all depends on how fast AG can turn the crank.

D.A.: Comments?

You said,

Gold seem to be tanking contrary to ALL LOGIC..

No so. The public has only a vision of gold as a hedge against inflation, and ( for now ) they see no inflation. Their logic is part of their life experience, and this should not be completely discounted.

All here know that gold is a store of value, a hedge against crisis and chaos, and is NOBODY ELSE'S LIABILITY. The public will learn this, and they too will then turn to gold, but not until it is obvious that their paradigm is incorrect and there is no other reasonable alternative - when everything else is going down.

away...to squirrel AWAY plat hoards....ohmy.

Éß

From my post 4/26/98

Silver will drop below 6 before another run at 7.

Palladium will rise above platinum in the next couple weeks and, for the first time ever, be the most precious of the metals.

Platinum will follow palladium and spike above 500 before settling in a 450 - 600 range for the next couple years.

From Today:

Seems the magic happened overseas overnight:

Palladium overtakes platinum while gold idles

06:44 a.m. May 18, 1998 Eastern

LONDON, May 18 ( Reuters ) - Palladium prices leapfrogged platinum for the first time ever on Monday, reaching a fresh all-time high on the way, as this year's Russian supply delays caused further heat in futures markets.

Palladium was fixed at $407.00 an ounce, up on Friday afternoon's previous record of $392.00, while platinum was at $403.00, unchanged from its previous fix.

Yen-based palladium futures in Tokyo had earlier ended limit-up for the fifth consecutive trading day for all months bar the limitless spot May contract, as buying overwhelmed selling, traders there said.

Palladium's price rise, the second year running it has moved sharply on Russian export problems, has increasingly brought questions from including car catalyst manufacturers, electronics companies and in dentistry.

The move is already causing some switching of applications - from alloys to gold-based ones in dentistry for instance,'' brokers GNI said in a report.

However, the big move is likely to be in the auto sector, where palladium catalysts were introduced when the price ratio against platinum was at least two to one or three to one,'' GNI added.

Palladium-based car catalysts are used to cut noxious gas emissions in vehicle exhausts. Palladium's rise above platinum is the culmination of a rally which began at the turn of the year, when palladium was near $200.00 while platinum was above $360.00.

Russia, the world's main palladium supplier, has failed to ship a single ounce this year, causing sharp spikes and corrections as both consumers and those selling exchange-traded palladium futures have had to scramble for metal.

Tokyo futures trade on Monday again saw those with short positions in nearby contracts looking to square their books.

``Investors with palladium shorts continued to cover their positions as it is totally unclear when Russia will resume exports,'' said one Tokyo trader.

Russia's platinum group metal ( PGM ) export agent, Almazjuvelirexport ( Almaz ) ,had yet to tell customers in Japan, a major user of palladium, when it will visit to negotiate 1998 supply contracts, traders

Indeedy

For those of you frustrated with prices:

Accurate live quotes can be found at

http://www.MONEX.com/prices.html

All prices are SPOT

Updates are live during NY market hours

OK

Spot palladium missed topping platinum by just $4 this AM.

It will rise above, to become briefly

The most precious of all metals

Indeedy

The website for the Islamic Mint is

http://www.netmatters.co.uk/users/murabitun/The_Islamic_Dinar.html

I wish I could share with you a great deal of important new information on this topic, but it is a developing story and most of the information I know is on their website.

The only other communications I am aware of, are

( 1 ) A private communication ( not orignating from the Islamic Mint ) about a sizable purchase of Dirhams and Dinars by a well-known entity in the safe money arena - I cannot disclose the name of the purchaser.

( 2 ) A communication that was relayed to me ( originating from the Islamic Mint ) that the Dinars and Dirhams would become available in North American in the not-too-distant future.

If you have specific questions, I suggest that you contact the Islamic Mint , at the following email address

Islamicmint@netmatters.co.uk

or perhaps just wait and see if they come here next week to talk with us. ( ;^ ) )

Regardless of our individual religious convictions or our thoughts about the Islamic faith - with respect to their feelings toward usury, honest money, gold and silver, these people are our friends and our allies. And they may be legion.

This note received over the weekend from the Islamic Mint.

P.S. Welcome to the Islamic Mint next Saturday on the Kitco forum!

Tom

********************************************************************************

My name is Mahmud Lund. Please allow me to introduce myself as a director of the Islamic Mint. Umar Vadillo has asked me to communicate with you, give his greetings and the news about his recent trip to Malaysia. To quote from his report, entitled: The Islamic Dinar in Malaysia An historical step was made a few days ago by the Islamic Party of Malaysia with more than 500,000 members and the Government of Kelantan ( A state in the NE of Malaysia ) when they adopted the Islamic Dinar as part of their policy. In a public event on the 28th of April, in the city hall of Kuala Krai in Kelantan, members of the Central Committee and other senior members announced the decision to introduce the Islamic Dinar as part of the party policy. Then the same day in the evening in a large gathering of 10,000 people in the mini-stadium Kelaburan, the Chief Minister of Kelantan personally endorsed the establishment of the Islamic Dinar as the currency of the Muslims. In a talk which I was invited to give at this gathering there was a resounding acclamation for the choice of the Islamic Dinar over the US Dollar as the currency which the audience would choose for themselves. I finished my talk with the words, Allah does not say in the Qur'an, 'US Dollar or Malaysian Ringgit'. Allah says, 'Dinar' and 'Dirham'. If we use the Islamic Dinar prosperity will come to us; if we accept the US Dollar misery will come to us. Let us say from Kelantan to the world The Islamic Dinar is our currency. No more inflation. No more Soros. A flood of people came afterwards wanting to immediately take dinars and dirhams.

Tom, Umar asked me to request an assistance of you. He wanted to post the above report on the Kitcom ( ? ) site - the site you had recommended to him - but their password system won't let us on until next Saturday. Could you please post the above as a message from the Islamic Mint? Together with the following postscript? Umar and I express our gratitude in advance and appreciate your help.

The PS follows:

The Islamic Dinar is on its way to becoming the currency of the Muslim

peoples. And, Allah knows best, it could once again become the currency of all people who are tired of being cheated.

The Islamic Mint acknowledges the many requests we have had for purchase of the Dinar and the Dirham and ask your patience as we proceed methodically towards a successful world-wide launch in significant numbers for these most important coins, a real money! We hope to be able to fill orders in the near future. Please visit the Islamic Mint for news updates.

Thanks once again, Sincerely, Mahmud Lund.