To POLARBEAR: You mean like a platinum Mountie? With a guaranteed buy-back at such-and-such a price? If anyone is interested, let me know at bkitner@kitco.com. If I approach the Mint with a few hundred emails of interest they may find it difficult to ignore.

Kitco Bar & Grill: This is a great idea. I hope the beer that's being served is Canadian. Why doesn't someone create a logo and small banner for it and I'll post it up here as a link?

Technical Glitches Dept: Sorry, this department's on leave for now.

My guess is a crisis in Japan of some kind -- perhaps our dollar reserves are going over there -- any news about our International 'plunge team' doing what they did a few months ago?

Whatever happens there will be red ink in the USA too. Don't expect gold bullion to stand up to this deflationary pressure. It looks like we will have another opportunity to buy bullion.

See http://quote.yahoo.com/intlmarkets

So Clinton, Greenspan, Rubin, Summers all got together for a little chat at the White House. Don't forget, it was a leak from the Fed early last week which brought about the big Dow fall and the big bond yield rise. Then, it was the Clinton Press Conference on Thursday which boosted the stock and bond market - and knocked $8 off the gold price by the end of the week.

Now the Fed is not supposed to leak, and Presidents are not supposed to talk up the stock market. Yet both did, and now Mr Clinton has invited Mr Greenspan to the White House for a friendly chat with Rubin and Summers along for the ride.

Next week, Mr Clinton is off to Germany for another friendly chat, with Chancellor Kohl. After that, there is the Heads of State G-8 summit in Birmingham, England. And after that, on May 19, the FOMC meets.

Finally, IMF head Mr Camdessus, who is presently on a friendly ( ? ) visit to Australia ( where the currency is plummeting ) , has stated that the U.S. would be well advised to lift rates sooner rather than later. If the plot gets much thicker than this, we'll be able to walk on it.

I still think this inventory idea is a loophole to let me stash a liquid asset that I can really sit on or sleep with - GOLD - even better than in an IRA as Eagles and stored elsewhere.

Skinny; On New World Order - go back to Cage Rattler's post on Mon May 04 1998 13:42 and the posts thereafter. Buy the Book. I've ordered mine. I can e-mail you sites for more info - or just do a yahoo search on the topic.

*****

Today's gold action proved to be lacklustre with gold ending

essentially flat. While DOW/NASDAQ stocks moved into a downward

spiral in the last hour of trading, the XAU moved higher on relatively

light volumes at the end of the day, thereby reconfirming the negative

beta ( contrarian trend ) of gold stocks to general industrial

equities.

****

is totally off the mark.

Yes, NASDAQ moved lower in the last hour, however, all other markets moved up by looking at daily activity SIGNIFACTLY SO. You better stay on the mark if you are to provide the market evaluation. Take it from somebody who is 60% of his net worth in a gold market!

1:A mystery?

A:Only to those unable or unwilling to follow the message.

2:Mistake or intentional?

A:We all make mistakes,SOME are intentional.

3:A move above 360 in days?

A: A is repeating what has been discussed here and other places.The

information WE were looking for may have been delayed due to matters of

greater importance.The timetable is in the public domain.Seek and ye

shall find.It may be more correct to express it in DAYS than months.

The degree of rise is unpredicable.I was considering 3-2-5.We shall see.

Mr.J.D.:You express gold values as they may have been relative to a

stronger USD.Is this not the point?Gold is afterall expressed in USD,

and the lenghty analysis here and elsewhere address these variables.Yes?

Mr.Carl:Many of those with an interest in gold stocks are well aware of

the current situation.Those who wish to hold gold down ( for now ) are not

likely to play in the gold stocks sand box for fear of exposure,thus the

divergencies we see between the XAU et al and the spot gold prices.The

gold market ( OTC ) is unverifiable,which allows any one entity with enough

influence to change the percieved price of gold.You dig?

Mr.A Goose:Follow the money indeedy.Very well explained.

Mr.JTF:Enjoy your most observant posts.Well,they are similar in THOUGHT

to my own.A little affermation I am not alone totally nuts?Hmmmmmmmm

ALL:This unusual meeting today may finally address what has been stated

here and elsewhere time and time again.The USG should buy some Mounties

from Bart to help support this site,as it is clearly influencing their

THOUGHTS!YES?

I will return when more is revealed for all to see.

Thank You.

I make one 100% guaranteed iron-clad prediction about gold: It will go up in value -- in the next country to devalue. I cannot lose in predicting that.

When the US is the only country left after the serial devaluations have ended elsewhere, then there will be little to keep gold from going up in US dollars.

We don't have to worry about China - they won't sell gold, and South Korea probably doesn't have any left. A key question is whether China will devalue in steps or all at once. If the China debt is as bad as that Brookings Institute fellow says it is, China's hand will probably be forced -- sooner or later.

The exact time scenario is the part that is unclear -- predicting the dates of major downturns is fraught with major risk of error, as our friend S. Peutz has found out. But -- the world equity markets are ripe for a big one -- sometime very soon.

After this next wave of devaluations, the US markets are again likely to rise ( flight to safety ) , unless BC loses control. AG will not dare raise interest rates if Japan, Hong Kong and South Korea are still in trouble, IMHO. I think the US markets will be the last to fall, repeating the 1929 era scenario.

The oil producing countries might feel entitled to these tactics as there is a break of moral contract with the US.The price of oil should never have been so low and the US did their best by trying to prevent IRAQ from exporting oil again.I think the statement is still a few months away and will follow the announcement of the level of GOLD backing the EURO

Anyway, I can summarize for you. Basically, Smith sold timber off his land only in exchange for Eagles which he valued at face of $50. The Tax Court agreed with the IRS that Eagles are property not money and thus must be valued at market. The case cited an older case ( you can't actually cite Memo cases as precedent ) , so this isn't new law.

Sure sucks though.

T.C. Memo. 1998-148

WILLIAM RAY SMITH, Petitioner v. COMMISSIONER OF INTERNAL REVENUE, Respondent

UNITED STATES TAX COURT. Docket No. 20916-95. Filed April 23, 1998.

William Ray Smith, pro se. Kathey Shaw, for respondent.

Excerpts:

Issue 1. Value of American Eagle Gold Coins

At trial, petitioner acknowledged that he insisted on being paid in gold coins for the timber he sold to

C&D. Furthermore, petitioner conceded that he received the form of payment he requested. 6 Petitioner

asserts, however, that for Federal income tax purposes, the gold coins he received should be valued at their

legal tender face value amount of $50. Respondent argues that the gold coins received by petitioner have a

fair market value far in excess of their face value. Thus, respondent contends that for purposes of

determining the amount realized from the sale pursuant to section 1001, the coins received must be classified

as “property” rather than “money”. For the reasons discussed below, we agree with respondent.

Snowbird

Norilsk is the largest nickel mine in the world and the source of virtually ALL Russian PGM production.

Aprox 60% palladium, 20% platinum of world production. Since Russians PGMs are not on long term contract, as the South Africans for the most part are, these supplies have a bigger effect on NOW prices. Palladium is too high, it may top platinum, but there is an exodus out of palladium and back into platinum by the largest auto manufacturers.

Eldo -

I don't know. It is one of the great mysteries.

When backwardation kicks in things get dicey

Have seen wide differences twixt the spot prices on my screen and the prices on Kitco. I think Bart has explained it before. When I talk spot, I am talking the cash market.

Believe me

I do NOT underestimate the Russians

No, indeedy

T1 -

I have personally spoken to some who have been inside Norilsk in the last year. Production capacity is 25% at best. Electricity does not extend throughout the mine. 1940s era equipment is breaking down with nobody to fix it and no parts available in any case. The miners have not been paid for two years. At best the Russians can produce but a trickle of their former production.

The ore depletion story fits well with the rest of the picture and is confirmed through independent sources. I am a hard man to fool and all such stories must pass a rigorous credibility check.

I believe it.

Read what Teddy says

Then believe the opposite

I have GREAT respect for the abilities of Russian spin pros.

Any assessment of ore must be made by insiders in the industry, yes?

A cement contractor would not be a qualified source for this info, no.

So here is ONE source from Friday:

Seymour Schulich, chairman of Franco-Nevada Mining Corp Ltd ( FN.TO - news ) , told analysts at a London presentation that the company believed the Norilsk ore body was close to depletion.

The main source, which is one of the ore bodies at Norilsk, is pretty well exhausted and that is why you are not seeing palladium coming onto the market, Schulich said.

I subscribe to the belief that information is useless, unless you know the source.

Yes

Bid price is a couple bucks OVER spot.

I still haven't figured out where that $1 trillion + debt is going -- probably will be rolled over as another form of debt -- to turn up as inflation at some later time -- 5 - 10 years from now.

Based on 397 spot, $421 delivered. I cannot beat it, but to tie is good, yes?

T1 -

That's the point, these are trusted western sources. Much has been written of late as to the general disrepair at Norilsk. I posted a link to the story on Saturday, I think. I have seen reports from Baron's and others about Norilsk. It does not look good. And no western money to be had as long as the government is in such turmoil.

OK

T1 -

Have you read the reports about the depletion of Norilsk ore?

This is big news, from independent sources.

And this news should be trusted.

Yes

The gold market for the time being is a one-issue market and that market is the European Central Bank,'' said Merrill Lynch analyst Ted Arnold in a report.

The bulls... argue that no more gold sales will be allowed by the ECB for some years to come and that lending to the bullion market will be strictly controlled, he said.

But without the traditional tools of interest rate control and exchange rate adjustment, individual national governments... will be left only with fiscal powers.

And one great revenue source will be the gold sitting in vaults of the national central banks.

Does anyone want to bet that Merrill is short gold?

It would seem to follow a pattern, yes?

Eldo -

I got connections……. At the very top …………

Yes

http://www.zolatimes.com/V2.14/Drdg1.html

Remember last year, when the Russians manipulated the price of palladium by press release alone? Witness the following. There will be more of this. Platinum is still the buy of the year here.

Russia may delay PGM export to end summer-Interfax

08:43 a.m. May 05, 1998 Eastern

MOSCOW, May 5 ( Reuters ) - Russian exports of platinum and palladium may be delayed until the end of the summer because of government restructuring, Interfax news agency quoted a source at state export agency Almazjuvelirexport as saying on Tuesday.

The unnamed source was quoted as saying that because of the impending merger between Russia's Economy Ministry and the Ministry of Foreign Economic relations and Trade, exports would start no earlier than the end of the summer.''

He added that a range of supplementary documents which needed signing before exports could begin would not now be signed before the end of the summer.

Almazjuvelirexport was not immediately available for comment.

The head of the finance ministry's precious metals and stones department said the comments represented purely the opinion of Almazjuvelirexport, and he would not confirm that the extra delay may take place. Russia, which is the largest producer of palladium in the world and the second largest of platinum, has not exported either metal so far this year, sending prices soaring as a result.

Last year exports did not start until the second half of the year due to similar delays in granting export licenses, and the Almazjuvelirexport source was quoted as saying this year exports may start even later.

These are clever folks, yes?

Yes

General -

A combination of all three , I would guess.

1998 Platinum Eagles are available.

Speed -

I like those old proverbs. Seems they had a clearer view back then.

Planning to get some sleep, when I'm dead.

Aurator -

the hirsute pursuit of the de troot

This line will not be topped today.

Farfel -

How much of the global trade in oil and gold is conducted in pounds?

None. Oil and gold are traded in US Dollars

OK

The Toronto Gold Mining Summation Index peaked on April 24th at +934 and has been in a gentle downtrend since. This is viewed as short term negative until it reverses.

The New Lows for Toronto Mining issues has remained between 0 and 4 per day over the past two weeks. This is what you would expect in a correction.

The trendline that rises at 2% compounded weekly ( from the last bottom ) is at 7087 this week. The Toronto Gold Index closed yesterday at 7352. This trend line usually contains corrections in a bull market. Turnarounds often occur around this trendline. ( +- 100 points )

I use 3 day charts with Bollinger Bands to guage the XAU and Gold during a Bullish phase. The middle band usually contains short term corrections and is still holding this time.

So far, no serious damage to the gold shares, but I would like to see the Summation Index turn up before getting too excited.

Eldo -

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm Soylent Green

http://www.intersurf.com/~vor/crude.html

Constant-dollar Crude Oil

http://www.topline-charts.com/HotCharts/CrudeOil.htm

Gold Sentiment

http://www.topline-charts.com/HotCharts/GSAIIndex.htm

I sold my sp-500 calls yesterday, and will wait for the next bottom.

I wonder -- does the strange behavior of the Europeans regarding their launching of the EURO have anything to do with a desire to inflate their part of the 1 trillion in bad debt generated during ping I? I agree with SDRer that gold-backed currencies will not be in vogue until after SEAsia launches one. It seems that the Europeans do not want to seriously challenge the US dollar.

Maybe it was the elbow bunions..........

Is your computer on a desk?

Just asking......

I thought it was the stooped over posture

And the limp, that gave me away

Could use some sun too

Lookin' a bit pale

If you pull some dollars out of your pocket

And buy some gold

You are wise, yes?

Is the fellow who sold it to you

To be considered stupid?

Hmmmm

Maybe it is late

And I am tired

But I don't have a clue

About what your last post meant

Huh uh

This has been my battle cry from day one

There is just too much gold in the world

What other use indeed?

None but to lie there

In a blanket of dust

I guess I am missing your point

Gold is traded internationally in US Dollars

If they are so entirely worthless

They sure buy lots-o-gold

Don't they?

Yes

Even though I needle

Your message is important

And should be heard

To make ourselves wiser

I admire your persistence

Keep it up

WB bought his silver

For all the right reasons

And he will hold it

For the same

Mozel -

No matter where on this blue orb you trade gold

It is done in US Dollars

As is the case with oil

This mine currency

Over these commodities reign

I did not decide this so

But that it is so

Is

Indeedy so

SUBTITLE IV - MONEY

CHAPTER 51 - COINS AND CURRENCY

SUBCHAPTER 1 - MONETARY SYSTEM

§ 5103. Legal tender

United States coins and currency ( including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks ) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues. Foreign gold or

silver coins are not legal tender for debts.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`

31 USC - MONEY AND FINANCE

SUBTITLE IV - MONEY

CHAPTER 51 - COINS AND CURRENCY

SUBCHAPTER II - GENERAL AUTHORITY

§ 5112. Denominations, specifications, and design of coins:

. . . ( e ) Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the Secretary shall mint and issue, in quantities sufficient to meet public demand, coins which -

( 1 ) are 40.6 millimeters in diameter and weigh 31.103 grams;

( 2 ) contain .999 fine silver;

( 3 ) have a design -

( A ) symbolic of Liberty on the obverse side; and

( B ) of an eagle on the reverse side;

( 4 ) have inscriptions of the year of minting or issuance, and the words Liberty, In God We Trust, United States of America, 1 Oz. Fine Silver, E Pluribus Unum, and One Dollar; and

( 5 ) have reeded edges.

( f ) Silver Coins. -

( 1 ) Sale price. - The Secretary shall sell the coins minted under subsection ( e ) to the public at a price equal to the market value of the bullion at the time of sale, plus the cost of minting, marketing, and distributing such coins ( including labor, materials, dies, use of machinery, and promotional and overhead expenses ) .

( 2 ) Bulk sales. - The Secretary shall make bulk sales of the coins minted under subsection ( e ) at a reasonable discount.

( 3 ) Numismatic items. - For purposes of section 5132 ( a ) ( 1 ) of this title, all coins minted under subsection ( e ) shall be considered to be numismatic items.

( g ) For purposes of section 5132 ( a ) ( 1 ) of this title, all coins minted under subsection ( e ) of this

section shall be considered to be numismatic items.

( h ) The coins issued under this title shall be legal tender as provided in section 5103 of this title.

( i ) ( 1 ) Notwithstanding section 5111 ( a ) ( 1 ) of this title, the Secretary shall mint and issue the gold coins described in paragraphs ( 7 ) , ( 8 ) , ( 9 ) , and ( 10 ) of subsection ( a ) of this section, in quantities sufficient to meet public demand, and such gold coins shall -

( A ) have a design determined by the Secretary, except that the fifty dollar gold coin shall have -

( i ) on the obverse side, a design symbolic of Liberty; and

( ii ) on the reverse side, a design representing a family of eagles, with the male carrying an olive branch and flying above a nest containing a female eagle and hatchlings;

( B ) have inscriptions of the denomination, the weight of the fine gold content, the year of minting or issuance, and the words Liberty, In God We Trust, United States of America, and E Pluribus Unum; and

( C ) have reeded edges.

( 2 ) ( A ) The Secretary shall sell the coins minted under this subsection to the public at a price equal to the market value of the bullion at the time of sale, plus the cost of minting, marketing, and distributing such coins ( including labor, materials, dies, use of machinery, and promotional and overhead expenses ) .

( B ) The Secretary shall make bulk sales of the coins minted under this subsection at a reasonable discount.

( 3 ) For purposes of section 5132 [see below] ( a ) ( 1 ) of this title, all coins minted under this subsection shall be considered to be numismatic items.

( 4 ) ( A ) Notwithstanding any other provision of law and subject to subparagraph ( B ) , the Secretary of the Treasury may change the diameter, weight, or design of any coin minted under this subsection or the fineness of the gold in the alloy of any such coin if the Secretary determines that the specific diameter, weight, design, or fineness of gold which differs from that otherwise required by law is appropriate for such coin.

( B ) The Secretary may not mint any coin with respect to which a determination has been made by the Secretary under subparagraph ( A ) before the end of the 30-day period beginning on the date a notice of such determination is published in the Federal Register....

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

ibid.

SUBCHAPTER III - UNITED STATES MINT

§ 5132. Administrative....

( 2 ) ( B ) Notwithstanding any other provision of law, for purposes of this

paragraph -

( i ) the coins described in paragraphs ( 1 ) through ( 4 ) of section 5112 ( a ) shall be made of an alloy of 90 percent silver and 10 percent copper; and

( ii ) all coins minted under this paragraph shall have a mint mark indicating the place of manufacture. ( C ) All coins minted under this paragraph shall be considered to be -

( i ) numismatic items for purposes of paragraph ( 1 ) and section 5111 ( a ) ( 3 ) ; and

( ii ) legal tender, as provided in section 5103.