ALBERICH__A @ 22:34 -- Congress re-ups the War Powers thingee every two years, I think. The President cannot do this by himself, that would be a dictatorship.. :- ) )

I figure it's worth $50. CDN to continue to read your poop on the markets. It has been difficult to get on KITCO lately as a lurker.

Therefore to limit the new guys who have suddenly got religion, I suggest that those of you habitual posters should send Mr. Bart a check for what you think your comments and advice are worth. Especially, the posters who are so distraught about the handles. My check is in the mail Monday.

Date: Sat Apr 04 1998 20:57

sharefin ( How can this be? ) ID#284255:

ANOTHER

How can they reprice gold to $30,000?

Mr. Sharfin,

This question from you, it proves for my eyes what I have said. Indeed, if I viewed as a western person, gold money as $30,000 paper dollar credits, my thoughts would also show this cannot be! But, from another world, I view this US$ and say how can it be of such value to all and have numbers as the stars in heaven? Please understand, money as paper or metal is as perception of value in the minds of people. If all the gold held by earth were placed in the hands as money, it would be used to revalue every real thing at a fair price. A tiny fraction of gold would buy much production of goods and services, on a basis equal for all men, not as a debt for later settlement, as currencies are now!

Thank you

farfel ( @RJ...you describe yourself as a whore in you previous post... ) ID#340302:…..and seem very proud of that fact? What type of whore are you? Do you swallow on command? Do you take it up the butt?

When faced with logic and facts the response is above. Makes you wonder about a mind that can do this. This fellow has some education, tis evident, still he has no class, and spends his time pitching gold at parties. The word boorish come to mind.

Don't know what this guy does for a living, but its my JOB to trade, perhaps his misplaced anger is from when he kicked the dog as a child, but his overreactions seem to be borne in a maelstrom of buried rage.

Hey Beverly Hills Farfel Fellow. I'll be at the Whilshire theater in Beverly Hills tomorrow for a 2pm show of Penn and Teller. Feel free to come on by and say high.

Lazlo -

Not such thing as a bad fill or getting locked out of the cash market.

OLD GSC

I told you to let it die George……… You wanna' play? Say hello to my little friend……

Its called cut and paste. For each post you make, I will respond with 2 of your old posts ( I got 'em all ) . I will pick blindly as ALL were completely and irrevocably wrong. You cannot win this George……..

Let it go……….

Barbie -

The cut and paste works for you too. Your initial posts to me were extremely hostile. You went on the attack immediately and when you tripped up again and again, you disappeared. Should you wish to proudly display your new angles wings, fine, but if you flap them in my face…… perhaps a bit of your prior blatherings to temper this fine and holy visage you now present.

To the rest -

I am not a bear, I am a whore. I will trade any side that makes money.

When called to task for the words they write, the response is usually to change the subject. Perhaps it is arrogance to take a stance and stand by it, right or wrong. The polite and gentile will whisper their heartfelt encouragements to each other, and gladly join in the delusion that anyone actually listens. And when the cumulative total of their written wisdom here adds up to zero, they will change their names and shout from the bushes.

OK

Date: Tue Mar 31 1998 09:58

Allen ( USA ) ( ANOTHER ( THOUGHTS! ) ) ID#246224

So the Euro will be an alternative to this? Its creators must have known that this 'inflation' of the USA and LBMA markets was not liked by oil. When was this recognized? Was this at the time of the Gulf War ( as you have implied in the past ) ? How was it recognized or communicated to Europe? Certainly the Euro has been built with this 'market' in mind?

Allen,

The link to my writing was broken during our discussion. Some items were lost. I do now understand your thoughts. I will now reply, as able, over time.

The Gulf War was the last insult! It was viewed as an attempt to show an unstable area, but the war itself was not intentional, events were out of control.

We must grasp that all commerce is done, at least, in the US dollar concept of valuations of real things. In this way, the true value of the purchase of real money is hidden from view! Persons will say in the future, how could gold be $500 one day and $5,000 the next? I tell you now, it is already past that level, as in present reserve currency dealings it is not seen! Consider, that in all that you do and think, your western values are of paper concepts. From your birth, real things are not used to cross value themselves! When the battle to keep gold from devaluing oil ( in direct gold for oil terms ) is lost, the dollar will find no problem with $30,000 gold, as it will be seen as a benefit for all and why did noone see this sooner?

Thank you

I do try and go back to complete where we left off. This question was offered for thought:

Date: Wed Mar 25 1998 23:31 ANOTHER ( THOUGHTS! ) ID#60253:

All: I ask you, why did the world go off the gold standard in the early 70s? You have an answer, yes? For all the problems this created, could the countries not just revalue gold upward, to say $300 ( back then ) ? What was the real reason the world entered a period of freely traded managed gold?

This question has more impact on the gold market of today than it did then! In days past, it was held as good knowledge that the US stopped gold backing to protect the dollar and keep gold from leaving to other shores.

But, in the same time frame, all central banks did sell gold to all persons, even the US. All treasuries held gold and dollars as reserves. To what end did the world financial system gain with the dollar off gold backing, and then allowed to dirty float against all currencies? Would the world not have been better off to find gold revalued to, say $300 and then begin a dirty float? Noone would have lost, and the inflation would have , at best, not have been worse!

Truly, I tell the reason for this action. The US oil companies knew that the cheap reserves were found. The governments knew this also. The only low cost oil reserves in the world at this time were in the Middle East, and their cost to find and produce was very low. It was known, that, in time, ALL oil would come from this land. As much higher US dollar prices were needed to allow exploration and production of other reserves, worldwide. But, how to get crude prices, up, when the Gulf States were OK to pump and produce in exchange for gold backed dollars? I will not name the gentlemen that brought this thinking to the surface in that era, but it was discussed. It was known that oil liked gold. It was known that local oil would be used up without higher prices. What if, the US dollar was taken off the gold standard, and gold was managed upward to say, $208 per ounce? The dynamics of the market would force oil to rise and allow for much needed capital to search for the higher priced oil that was known to exist! The producers would find shelter in gold even as the price of oil was increased in terms of a now non gold dollar! Price inflation would rise, but gold and oil would also increase. The dollar would continue to be used as the only payment for oil, and in doing so replace gold as the backing for this reserve currency. All would be fair.

The war in 1973 and the Iran problem did make markets overshoot, but all did work to the correct end. The result was a needed higher price for a commodity that was, as reserves, in much over supply by the wrong countries! It was known that the public would never have accepted this proposition as fair. To this end, we have come.

And it is from this end, that the gold markets are managed for today! I do now take you to my post to Junior:

Date: Wed Mar 25 1998 23:58 ANOTHER ( THOUGHTS! ) ID#60253:

You state: The USA/IMF and its'Hegemoney currency could not withstand cheap oil prices. ?

Mr. Junior,

Be very sure to understand this: They can stand cheap oil prices. But, it is the loss of having the US$ removed as the world reserve currency that makes them fight a lower oil price, and the new world oil currency that it would bring. Bring this thought into focus and you will understand why Iran and Iraq did fight so long. And why Iraq invaded. The warships are an attempt to keep prices from falling! You think long and hard on this!

All:

Look now and see if the US dollar does not fight for a high oil price! In every way, the question of supply disruptions is shown as the need for other suppliers. But, other suppliers cannot produce at a lower price? If the gulf states are allowed to bring oil down to it's true fair production price, in terms of a correctly higher revalued gold price, the US dollar would no longer be priced and backed by oil. Any paper trading currency would do. I would say, if the Euro is strong in gold, and crude oil is allowed to be devalued by gold at $10,000 to $30,000, then all other paper currency reserves held against the EURO would be , for show?

The world is going off the dollar standard as the dollar is going off the oil standard , find this event in your time! We watch this new gold market, together, yes?

away...to change my water ( glass ) to wine ( glass ) ...after all it's happy hour.

ÉßakaRJ...I think you are on to something Barb... ( not ) ...uh huh. Welcome back.

has everyone bought their mounties

I know that they will show it to their friends, and they also will be amazed at the raw beauty of a gift that will last forever. I will carefully explain about it's unique qualities. I will tell them that the coin they hold may have been minted from gold that was held in the hands of Kings or ancient rulers.

Physical moves markets, let's do our part to make it move. If the 'little guy' gets in this market, look out. And guess what We have 5000 years of history to back us up. WE have the power.

I congratulate you for your good play into the metal mutuals. I have been considering such a move for many months now. But, until now I have done nothing. There are plenty of other low priced stocks out there that have the same, if not better, potential as some gold funds. These gold funds and gold stocks are not so immune from a terrible crash that is so prophesized at these hallowed walls of Kitco. I am still trying to figure what would hold them back from pure collapse as well. It is my struggle and I am dealing with it.

Hold gold if you want. It is your decision not mine...good or bad. btw, I bought one Mountie from Bart today. Just one. It looks like a beautiful coin and I want to have one. I like the idea of limited quantity. Gold is good food. I am slowly getting hooked on the metals but my fancy is for Platinum mostly.

I have no beef with you missinglink. Just the opposite, I enjoy your participation in this group. A 'licensed' Economist is a good person to have on your 'team'.

George is my beef. He has consistently cheerleaded the same stuff here since I joined kitco. And now that the gold bull is FINALLY shaping up he has to call it his own and deride others who trade from both sides....who, btw, are now profiting on the way up. I have scratched my head for too long and I became confused when I saw his post mentioning my handle. Old Gold...er....GSC has some good tihngs to say but he also says some REALLY BAD STUFF too. And I feel obligated to call him on it. Don't know why I just do.

And, as far as being bitter.....hmmmmmmmm. I am not. In fact I am happier than a pig in mud and the future is looking quite bright to me. I must wear darks shades sometimes..... ;- ) .

George - if you do not read any of my posts that is OK too. I will continue to read yours. Gotta keep you on the straight and narrow ya know.

Carry on troops...

away.

Éß©

Gotta like that one.............

''Cash is like a hot potato - no one wants to hold on to it too long,'' said Alan Ackerman, senior vice president at Fahnestock & Co.

If your flux-capacitor capacitates to it's capacity,does it explode?Huh?

OK, thanks for the tip, always a good idea.

I am still concerned with bad executions and lock limits.

John: You wrote, I will refrain from calling someone named Big Time Tom stupid when he criticizes me using a real name so that he becomes a real person . . ..

How about Bernatz? Would that qualify as a real name? Actually, Tom *is* my real name. I chose the handle Big Time Tom because I knew it would give my father, who knows how naive I am on financial matters, a big laugh. Incidentally, some of your own plays on my handle have been very clever indeed. The best, I thought, was when you referred to me awhile back as Bib Time Tom. I still occasionally chuckle over that one!

-Tom

Forgive me as a newbee to this forum for speaking out. As a lurker I was impressed by the intelligence of the posts at this site. Today things have really deteriorated beyond control and it becomes impossible to to harvest the nuggets from the sludge.

Bart:

The Silicon Investor site has a Bull/Bear graph which tracks the sentiments of the contributors in graph form compared to an index of Tech stocks. Amazingly enough, the group can actually predict the movement of the index by a short time period. Would it be possible to duplicate such a tool for this group?

Regarding the upside risk of a short position:

Use buy stops.

I like all of your possible choices for the OPEC currency.

I do appreciate what you are saying, and it would be a huge

accom[plishment to get them to agree on anything .

However it is certainly in their best interest to persue a form of settlement other than US $.

Maybe we can get Henry Kissinger to explain it to them, I understand he is still running for Secretary of State.

OLD GSC -

I took some losses on gold shorts. Again, big deal. The long silver and platinum has outperformed the short gold. The loss is negligible. I wonder why you, of all people, would stand on your shaky soapbox and point fingers?

NOBODY has a clue what will happen tomorrow in these markets. It is all a crap shoot to some extent. It becomes trickier when you trade both sides of the market. It does take a bit more acumen to day trade, quite apart from sitting at home and calling this a bottom for gold and the end of the Dow from 400 down and 6000 up.

Sooner or later you will be right George. Not yet, but someday. I'm sorry you don't like my arrogant writing style, much of which is an affectation for effect than anything else. Many at this forum, who have spoken with me personally, find my writing to be vastly different than my personal style. I'm pretty laid back and casual about all this stuff, quicker to laugh or joke, than to deconstruct the market with all sorts of charts and crystals and Fibonaccis and wedgies and heads and shoulders and all these things that are delved into endlessly and are still more or less wrong or right.

If all these things worked, why isn't everybody here rich? Because they are simply tools; when used correctly can add some comfort to a trade, but they tell you nothing of tomorrow.

I detail my trades on these pages. This comes with the necessity of standing by my calls or changing my name. I opt to accept the responsibility of my trades and will drag the bad ones out into the light to die an ugly, but not silent death. Others here do the same. APH, JD, D.A. and more don't hide when they made a wrong call, they say, ooops and move on.

You, however, have an anchor of mistaken calls around your neck which has dragged any credibility you may have ever had to the bottom where you can be the king of lumps on bumps on frogs on bumps on logs at the bottom of the sea.

Why don't you go back to the GSC moniker, and keep silent until everything goes to hell and gold goes to 10K? Then one post of I told you so should clue the world into your own particular brand of insight.

OK

Don't ever clean any type coin that might have collector value. Junk coins is one thing, but any numismatic coin with collector value will be ruined. You may already be aware of this, but just a friendly reminder.

TOKYO -- Grim new warnings that Japan may be

on the brink of economic ruin have plunged

the country into a full-blown funk. For the

first time, Japan's predicament is now openly

being likened to the United States during the

Great Depression of the 1930s, when collapsing

prices inflicted economic havoc.

Old-Bullsh!tter-Gold-G-S-C .... Yeah right......whatever. Name the funds....you BIG BS'er!! Eat my heart out.......really.....keep your powder dry!! Old-BS'er-Gold.........now THAT is one WHALE of a story...........shouldn't you be out spending your million-billion-gazillions? My math says GSC LOST six figures last year and had NO dry powder this year to make ONE figure......figure it out.

Ted - easy man, it's just the same old-mold-gold....I didn't know you were into the Ted Spread.....hmmmmmm.

away...from his nonsense

ÉßonceagainROFLOL

year, and to this date...

Data from

( a ) beginning of 1998 to now followed by

( b ) From 1998's low to now

DOW ( a ) +14% ( b ) +19%

XOI ( a ) +7% ( b ) +17%

XAU ( a ) +18% ( b ) +42%

and the XAU is ze weiner

Interstingly enough, here are the performances for DOW, XOI and XAU this year, and to this date...

From beginning of 1998 to now From 1998 low to now

DOW +14% +19%

XOI +7% +17%

XAU +18% +42% and the XAU is ze weiner

I guess gold was a bad investment at the beginning of 1998 and still is a bad investment... Let's short gold and gold stocks... especially because the XAU is making higher lows and higher highs recently...rofl...

And make sure nobody buys this coming commemorative Millenium gold coin designed to take 500 to 2000 tonnes of gold off the market. Puuleeeese! don't buy it: that could be bad for your financial health.... gggg

Corner:

After blasting gold as lousy investment early this year, she went on

criticizing Peter Munk's speech in Davos Switzerland as a Goldpec type

of move.

She had 3 choices for the 1998 gold problem, in this week's Barron's.

1 ) talk down gold and gold investments ( that would have been bullish )

2 ) suggest that gold and gold stocks is the way to go now ( that would

have been bullish, but not as much as 1 ) and 2 )

3 ) ignore gold altogether ( that is what she did and that is bullish in

view of her background as being negative about gold ) . She talked about

oil instead! Great... time to load up on some more gold.

Is Barron's take on gold a casual mistake? Or is it manipulation? Or

simply incompetence? ( In Germany and Europe: they talk about gold and

suggest to invest in it, right now,... and suggested that 1 month ago

despite local CBs gold selling! ) .

Inte

btw, what funds have brought you these lofty profits from a measly 25 dollar rise in POG ( assuming you even bought at the bottom which is highly unlikely )

away...to NEVER believe a word of his crap!

Éßroflolandspillinghotcoffeeonthecat.... ( meow!...phffffttt! ) ...

turned off by George S. Cole..........aka....Old Gold.... ( duh ) .

Can anyone expand on this. IMHO, once the euro becomes reality and is in fact backed with a percentage of gold the Asians will surely notice. Then, the OPEC countries will surely initiate their own currency.

These two new, and viable currencies will spell doom for the ability of the US to print unlimited dollars.

Stay tuned . The next 6 months will be very interesting.

TO BART: Keep up the good work. This is the best bulletin board on the WWW.

To all Kitco -

A passage from The Early Ayn Rand, A selection from her unpublished fiction. The play is called Ideal

KAY GONDA. I want to see, real, living, and in the hours of my own days, that glory I create as an illusion! I want it real! I want to know that there is someone, somewhere, who wants it, too! Or else what is the use of seeing it, and working, and burning oneself for an impossible vision? A spirit, too, needs fuel. It can run dry.

JOHNNIE. I want to tell you only this: there are a few on earth who see you and understand. These few give life its meaning. The rest - well, the rest are what you see they are. You have a duty. To live. Just to remain on earth. To let them know you do and can exist. We can't give up the earth to all those others.

Sha mat. Gooo Gooold ! ! !

- A.I.

CENTURY AMERICA and the central thesis: 5% of the population control 90% of

the assets:

You have hit the nail on the head. It is somewhat normal for this inverted ( concentration of economic wealth ) pyramid to occur over time in any economy. Recently, even in developing countries, this has become more prevalent than any time in history. I am in no way a socialist, but I truly believe this is an untenable situation, and is a crucial and central issue of our times.

Hepcat: I already replied to your customer suggestions. Time to cool down the rhetoric. Calling another contributor stupid is stupid, and increases the likelihood of getting tossed. Some teeth have been added that you should know about - there’s a one week delay from the time you register until you can post.

SDR: If you had many metric tons of gold to sell ( or buy ) would you do your marketing in the classifieds? Thanks for thinking of us just the same.

Gold & Silver & Platinum Bug: Take as much thunder as you desire. I would be difficult to make the time to involve myself in organizing such an event.

Poorboys: 30,000 mounties were minted. There are roughly 9,000 still being stored at the Mint. Once those are gone supply will have to come from the secondary market which will dictate price. We are charging the greater of $325 or ML+5 ( $5.00 premium over the maple ) . We’ll buy them back at the greater of $310 or spot gold +5. The premium will increase as supplies decline.

Here’s why I think they’re an excellent alternative to Maples or Eagles:

1. ) Until Jan 1, 2000 they will never be worth less than $310.00

2. ) They are scarce, much rarer than Eagles and Maples and may always carry an additional premium for that reason. The 30,000 minted are dated 1997.

3. ) If gold is less than $310 on Jan 1, 2000, they will become even scarcer as people take them out of circulation for their redemption value.

4. ) They can always be easily swapped for Maples & Eagles, but not vice versa

5. ) Each coin comes individually sealed for scratch resistance and freshness.

6. ) They cost only a few dollars more than Maples and Eagles.

7. ) Sales, at least OUR sales, help support this site.

8. ) They have ten sides. That’s ten more than both Eagles and Maples put together.

Comment: A recent but presently departed poster bought several

hundred gold coins and hedged with gold puts. This is an

accepted and viable technique, and I employed it myself

with some moderate but varying degrees of success during

the bear market. This is the design intent of hedging, and I

take no exception whatsoever to this technique.

The subject of shorting metals was discussed by DA on this forum.

His rationale to avoid shorting, as I recall, had a basis in

mathematics relating to unlimited liability on naked shorts,

and a corresponding unlimited upside on longs, with an approximate

$300 downside. I concur. I value all posts and inputs.

I respectfully submit that I regret to see any animosity on this

forum, as I find it to be a waste of very valuable talent.

Your thoughtfull comments are always appreciated, and rest

assured that I am aware that every development is not fundamentally

positive for the metals. That said, I do believe the highs

are behind us, and also ahead!

Selby -

Seemed we took the same offense of the same post by the same guy who keeps saying the same thing about gold being the same thing as a sure thing.

Also, the fellow who fell far railed against ideological shorts, then went on at some length about how one should support gold and only speak optimistically. He screamed in capital letters that he is a GOLD BULL and only looks one direction. How is it, when any metal spends 80% of its time moving sideways or down, that so many here can only see one direction? Markets move both ways, why would one look at only a small part of a market?

The reason for my shenanigans with the farfel post, was to show that the vocal gold crowd at Kitco sounds EXACTLY like the talking Heads on CNBC ( fingers marking air ) , separated only by a couple substitutions in words. When he reads that post he will probably try to respond by doing the same with my posts. Again, no original thinking there. It'll be fun to see him try. He 's kind of like flat beer; It get's you drunk, but it just ain't no fun drinkin'

OK

Away……………..Toputthefizzback

Just wanted to see how this post from this morning reads with a couple of word changes, to which the response will probably be repetitive and unoriginal.

Date: Fri Apr 03 1998 18:32

farfel ( And finally, the ALMIGHTY DOW... ) ID#340302:

Copyright © 1998 farfel/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved ( guess I'm messing with the law here )

The failure of the GOLD to close above 310 today should be of significant concern to all GOLD investors.

Despite enormous strength in the SILVER market in the early morning...despite the never-ending spate of producer forward selling by many of the GOLD heavyweights....despite today's Kitco posts deemed by farfel propagandists to be mildly deflationary, thereby auguring lower interest rates....despite the flood of farfel analysts trotted out by the media ( notably Himself ) to announce new GOLD targets of $10,000 and higher by mid-year...despite the entire telethon approach of the GOLD 310 exponents...

...the close did not hold above 310.

When the GOLD bulls employ every strategy conceivable to ballyhoo GOLD and come up with a mere whimpering gain, then one must truly ponder whether the GOLD is now completely topped out, ready to confirm a bear market soon with a particularly dramatic tumble.

There is truly little doubt that after today's anemic performance, any left field event that develops on the domestic or global scene will probably impact the GOLD in a particularly negative way. GOLD liquidity inflows seem to be mated out and their cash margins dangerously low.

OLD GOLD -

You Wrote:

RJ: When are we going to hit that $285 target you have been pushing for weeks? Your record is very good, but you got overconfident and arrogant.

Covered some of my gold shorts today. Beware there fella', forward sales are tempting at these levels. The first $15 dollars of the gold move was all short covering. This is not a strong rally. So I lost a bit on some gold shorts. It happens when you play. If you followed your own past advice, you own a lot of gold above $400. I would rather have a short at $303 than holding over $400 gold for all those years.

I must admit I was a bit surprised by your post since you have shouted from the rooftops that the Dow was over at 6000, and 7000, and 8000, and that gold has hit a bottom at 380, and 350, and 325, and 300. You live in a glass house George, don't throw stones. I stand by my posts, and always with the same name. Some here find it easier, when consistently proven wrong, to change their handle and continue on as if they had any credibility.

It was a cheap shot from the most consistent staggeringly wrong guy on this forum: GSC

OK