KITCO GOLD FORUM
1997-1999

index
Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:55
Schippi (Fidelity Select Gold Chart ) ID#93199:
To view the solid breakout of FSAGX click on:
http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5969/agboll.gif

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:49
Lan Man (@A Gold Polaris by Jude Wanniski) ID#320108:
Part1: http://www.polyconomics.com/searchbase/gp1.htm

Part5 is where that $350. price comes from...

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:49
TheMissingLink (ERLE) ID#373403:
So what are you saying, my improper use of spit/spat in the face of the IMF slowed down Kitco?

And I love how you try to conveniently turn the conversation to football when everyone knows Chicagoans are basketball fans this decade.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:33
jims (BArt HELP!!!) ID#252391:
Copyright © 1998 jims/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
There are such good comments on this board that I'll wait for the download, but I wish for the good old days. I don't get the black thingie, probably because my system is too primitive. ( I'm probably the only one not worried about Y2K because if my computer lasts that long I'll feel like a real winner - like I had gold and it went all the way to $315/.

Interesting time indeed we live in. I raher think the Asian stock markets may just be the place to be. I liked the earlier comment about the falling dollar, rising commodity prices,. money returning to its original homes and commodities being in up trends for 7-10 years. Would that be nice!!! To see sanity returned to the world and make money in the process - gosh, what a happy ending....

Now what do I do with the small poisition in Japanese stocks I got into yesterday thinking the Japanese stocks could put two days up back to back. Bought Japanese Equity Fund ( JEQ ) . EWJ - the SPY equivalent to the Japaese market had a bigger jump and trades more volumn. Don't want to get spread out into too many things. Got to keep the gold majors covered for now, with my toes in the juniors, don't forget silver......

Yen at 121.25

Love this place - great thoughts, humor and real life participation./

Hope Bart can get back up to speed. Thinking myself there ought to be a $25 initial log on charge - sorta like membership dues - if the money would go to help Bart and his equipment and not be funneled off to some third world pirate.

Go Gold, Go Bart

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:21
ProVeritas (Yen, Dollar, & Gold) ID#222387:
Copyright © 1998 ProVeritas/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
TO ALL:

As noted, the Yen gained 9% against the Dollar today. Not only are the hedge funds covering their short yen positions, but the Japanese Government is selling their US Treasury paper and garnering huge profits made over the past 3 years. During that period the yen went from 85 to the Dollar to a high of 147. It is obvious what the profit potential has been especially if these investments were leveraged. Much of this money will go into reliquefying the Japanese Banking system and perhaps some will be invested in gold ( as Prime Minister Hashimoto mentioned last summer ) since as the Yen strengthens, the price of gold falls in Yen terms. Another indicator of the rush out of Dollars was that the 10 yrs bond fell 4.10% on very high volume. Such a large percentage loss rarely occurs. These indeed are turbulent times. Buy gold!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:15
panda (Then there's the XAU) ID#30126:
coming up to the long term down trendline. Resistance at ~90 then ~100. What's the old expression? In a bull market there is NO resistance, in a bear market there is no support.......... So the question is, are we in a bull market for gold

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:14
Eldorado (@the scene) ID#173274:
What you all have been witnessing is the great erasure. Debt erasure. Happens from time-to-time within usury-based systems as debt accumulates to the point of non-repayment and 'credit' is sustained to keep the pyramid from collapsing. Now we see countries and hedge funds and big banks getting their fingers burned from handling 'hot' paper. Apparently they were color-blind to the flames on the paper. DOH!!! 'Tis what happens when you get your fingers in the way of the big erasure. Don't let it be yours!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:10
D.A. (gold.and.LTC) ID#7568:
Copyright © 1998 D.A./Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
All:

I have tried in vain to post this stuff for the last two days but Kitco doesn't seem to want to take my offerings. Perhaps in the wee hours I can sneak in a post. If this has already been discussed, sorry for the repeat.

*******
Rumor has it that one of the favored financing mechanisms of not so Long Term Capital was the central bank gold window. The little birds have opined that they are currently short to the tune of 10 million ounces of the dense yellow metal. The position is currently hedged with a call position at 310 basis december financed with short puts at 280.

This will most likely put a cap on the gold market over the next several weeks. However, should the 310 area be taken out, an explosive rally would likely ensue.

Goldman has been a strong seller of gold anytime it seems to be getting a head of steam. One wonders whether or not they are on the other side of the call position and are trying to make sure that the market behaves over the short term.

Since it appears that many central banks had speculated with LTC ( Bank of Italy to the tune of a quarter billion dollars ) , it is very difficult to get any read on how their positions are going to be liquidated. There are a lot of competing interests, with big political clout, and some with printing presses at their control. The whole thing is quite bizarre.

******

I wonder if today's move in the Yen was the result of a forced liquidation of some hedge fund or a large bank in Japan going down the tubes. Time will tell.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:09
sharefin (National Guard ready to act on eve of 2000 ) ID#284255:
-
http://www.jsonline.com/news/1007y2k.asp
-----------
Y2K anxiety: They're worried, but few are prepared to push panic button
http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/zdnn_smgraph_display/1,4436,2146090,00.html
----------------
ZDNet Y2k Survey
http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/special/y2ksurvey.html
Y2K survey ( total participation was 6,300 people ) and was notified with results today. 57% of the respondents work in IT, 62% plan to withdraw funds from banks, 61% see serious impact, 57% think it will affect stocks, 75% say employers are working on it, 25% have actually completed projects.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:07
STUDIO.R (@EBuzzzzzzzzz...........(swat)..................(plop)............) ID#119358:
Copyright © 1998 STUDIO.R/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Speakin'O'prophets..........er, profits.........some brain'o'turd public royalty fund, whose name I will not mention, paid me 110 times ( in kash ) the monthly income of a depleting ( 15% decline ) oil field today.....that's less than a 1% annual rate'o'return. ohmy! ( swat ) ( plop ) .....
yup, there's always someone with a buzzin' idea.....thought I'd let you know I'ma heeding your goodly advise to divest dat' oil ( gonna keep a little though, for old times sakes ( and kash flow ) ) .....hell, I'm hooked on it like licorice, baby.

si', beeesball is very good for us.........forgettin' da' crap'o'da'day...uhHuH

soooooooo batter up! allllaboard da' GoldTrain.....chooooo chooooo......

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:05
ERLE (And there was noone posting) ID#190411:
during the two minutes that it hung, not as the wrong tense used by themissinglink. Spat in the face of the IMF. Go Bears, you probably will beat the Packers, after that debacle.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:03
STUDIO.R (@EBuzzzzzzzzz...........(swat)..................(plop)............) ID#119358:
Copyright © 1998 STUDIO.R/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Speakin'O'prophets..........er, profits.........some brain'o'turd public royalty fund, whose name I will not mention, paid me 110 times ( in kash ) the monthly income of a depleting ( 15% decline ) oil field today.....that's less than a 1% annual rate'o'return. ohmy! ( swat ) ( plop ) .....
yup, there's always someone with a buzzin' idea.....thought I'd let you know I'ma heeding your goodly advise to divest dat' oil ( gonna keep a little though, for old times sakes ( and kash flow ) ) .....hell, I'm hooked on it like licorice, baby.

si', beeesball is very good for us.........forgettin' da' crap'o'day...uhHuH

soooooooo batter up! allllaboard da' GoldTrain.....chooooo chooooo......

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:02
STUDIO.R (@EBuzzzzzzzzz...........(swat)..................(plop)............) ID#119358:
Copyright © 1998 STUDIO.R/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Speakin'O'prophets..........er, profits.........some brain'o'turd public royalty fund, whose name I will not mention, paid me 110 times ( in kash ) the monthly income of a depleting ( 15% decline ) oil field today.....that's less than a 1% annual rate'o'return. ohmy! ( swat ) ( plop ) .....
yup, there's always someone with a buzzin' idea.....thought I'd let you know I'ma heeding your goodly advise to divest dat' oil ( gonna keep a little though, for old time sakes ( and kash flow ) ) .....hell, I'm hooked on it like licorice, baby.

si', beeesball is very good for us.........forgettin' da' crap'o'day...uhHuH

soooooooo batter up! allllaboard da' GoldTrain.....chooooo chooooo......

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 23:01
skinny (Yep.. its true) ID#28994:
The Island that is long is situated somewhere in Texas.
Gollum is building a nuclear powered bicycle.
Y2k will turn out to be a bunch of overated crap.
For sure,, one statment is true.
Skinny gonna buy gold from bart on New years day... Yep.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:59
ERLE (Black thing back) ID#190411:
It was hanging for twenty seconds.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:57
TheMissingLink (Gold ready to soar!) ID#373403:
The IMF has finally pulled out their last weapon against a rise in gold, a rumor of selling its reserves. AND THE GOLD MARKET SPIT IN THE IMF'S FACE TODAY!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:54
ERLE (Horridly slow Kitco coincides with) ID#190411:
-
the animated Kitco Backup thingy.
All was well when the revered Mountie ad was on.
The black thing should be put out to pasture until it is given a clean bill of health.
Also, RJ mentioned that the black thing was sucking up about 95K: That's my read on my computer too. The thingy, when loading after the text shows up sometimes reads 95K to go.
During the day when Mr. mountie was up, it went smoothly, excepting the logo and text at the bottom of the page.


SHORT TEXT ISN'T THE KEY. HIT THE ESCAPE KEY SEVERAL TIMES WHEN YOU HAVE ESTIMATED THE TEXT YOU WANT TO READ HAS BEEN RECIEVED.

esc, ESC, NO KIDDING.

When the black thing is gone, just notice the increased speed.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:54
Eldorado (@the scene) ID#173274:
Copyright © 1998 Eldorado/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
EJ -- RE: History Repeats in Finance Company Bailouts - Sept. 7, 1998 WSJ ; I kind of have to laugh about their 'Need of an international regulatory regime' to control currency. HAR! Throughout history, and even now, gold and silver HAVE been a common medium exchange between goods and countries. I.E., basically, what I can buy with an ounce of gold here is the same as I can buy elsewheres, barring more immediate 'concerns' as imposed by the 'regimes'! Thus there is NOTHING they need to do but to let/make gold and silver the monetary whelm of currencies. Gee, what a concept!; no regulations; no controls; no money-lenders; no fiat BS! And it has ALWAYS BEEN HERE! Right in front of our faces! The only thing that has ever changed it from that is some idiots perception that money only comes from a lender! HAR! AND, then some 'majic' that he can give you something that you already have! Another HAR! Congress was given the responsibility to COIN money and to regulate the value thereof. Who in hell gave them the right to give that up? Not I, said the cat! Not my parents neither. Not the populace through any kind of popular vote of the 'cause'. But, regardless, the gold and silver have always been the REAL medium of exchange, and even now, they will buy essentially what they would from the 'devalued' countries. IF and BUT should they EVER learn!!! Take that IMF money and BUY GOLD! Then put it ALL into the peoples hands! MAKE everyone free'r. But, then again, free'r people might want to slak offf the rest of their shackles!

Arden -- A most excellent posting. I like the billiard ball. That's how the markets work, for sure...; I think that someone applied a little extra 'english' upon that last yen shot though!

This unwinding of paper stuff is exciting and rattling at the same time. Given the moves, there is NO way to give any positive way it can end, except that at some point, it will. Except that metals will, somehow, become 'untarnished'. Got your 'foxhole' dug and equipped?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:53
Mole (The Essential Von Mises) ID#34883:
http://www.libpress.com/evm.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:51
panda (A picture, er, chart, is worth .....) ID#30126:
Dollar index and gold. Has the race begun in ernest

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:50
Rack (SDRer-Brazil) ID#411163:
$30bn? I thought that Brazil lost $20bn in FX reserves LAST MONTH!
Just another patch-I think the powers that be have lost control.
This is starting to get interesting

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:50
Gold Dancer (RANGY) ID#377196:
Copyright © 1998 Gold Dancer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I and my girl friend own a lot so..........but we bought a lot

thinking that if what the company is saying ( along with POLARBEAR ) is
true, then it is the most undervalued gold stock in the world. I kept
remembering back to 1974 when a company with $4 in cash and no
debt sold for $1 a share and I didn't buy it because I thought some
one must be lying.

18 months later, that stock was bought out for $24. That is a true
story.


I promised my self I would never miss another opportunity like that
again. Do you know how thick the gloom was in 1974? Just like it is
in the gold market today. And that is the ONLY reason you can buy a
stock like RANGY for under $1.

IMHO this is true.

The future will reveal all.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:45
SDRer (ITN news announced--this evening's broadcast--) ID#286249:
that the USG had put together a $30bn package for Brazil. Has anyone
heard a peep about this? [That stabilization fund must be one
DEEP WELL?!] Off to check the news for confirmation...can't believe it, frankly...

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:38
Boardreader (STUDIO.R: Love it .... and d'ya know what?) ID#20767:

There's a gap in the XAU at 102,
Fill'em up pardner, and get the windows too.

Bob in DC ( in Foggy Bottom! )

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:37
mole (@highhopes re gold stocks-stocks lead metal, then junior stocks-then pennys) ID#350145:
i may be wrong- have been plenty of times, but also had some wins. major metal stocks generally lead the metal, then after the majors become fully valued the metal plays catch up, as well as the juniors and penny's and goat pasture. i like to move from majors to juniors to pennys.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:34
Gold Dancer (crazytimes) ID#377196:
I agree with your thinking about the market and gold. I do
think, however, that the US golds are due for some sideways action.
During this time the South African and Canadian Juniors should rise
strongly for a couple of weeks while NEM bounces around the $26 to $30
level. Should be some great moves in the Canadians as managements get
the courage to dispense news into a now rising gold market.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:33
Gold Dancer (crazytimes) ID#377196:
I agree with your thinking about the market and gold. I do
think, however, that the US golds are due for some sideways action.
During this time the South African and Canadian Juniors should rise
strongly for a couple of weeks while NEM bounces around the $26 to $30
level. Should be some great moves in the Canadians as managments get
the courage to dispense news into a now rising gold market.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:30
EB (normally I'd be offended and start gettin' pissy..........) ID#187109:
-
But after 'netting' almost FIFTEEN G's ( US ) in TWO days I just let the flies buzz around and make ASSES out of themselves........and let me tell you I haven't seen many flies make ASSES outta themselves until I met a few 'PROFITS' at kitco.

I even posted that I THUNK that this would be booooolish fer POG........but peopleos read ONLY what they wanna read. Too bad really, there are some great duckies to be made reading theses pages of kitco.

btw........For all who think that I 'recommended' buying Disney at $35.00/share, I did not. I just mentioned that I bought it at $35.00/share w/ this years IRA ( only $2000.00 US ) . It was either ballsy or plain stoooopid or a long term hold 'em call. Currently I am down around 30%.....it is STILL better than many gold stocks if'n you bought and held 'em last year. Gee....I guess I feel yer pain. 'nuff said here... see ya at retirement......... twenty or thirty years from now....unless I die first............ ( ugh ) ...

I think I'll go buy some MORE Disney with some of todays profits.........$24/share sounds like a steal to me...............¿ohmy?

And to the TURD BRAIN who calls himself/herself/itself GOLDEN PROPHET..................I love you man. I have made ALOT of money selling YOU gold since last year. Would you care to sell me some more ......although the time is not right.........YET.

Now......I think it stopped raining in Atlanta. I will now glue myself to the couch and watch the Padres vs. Braves..................


GO PADRES!!!!!!!!!!! ....been waitin' FOURTEEN years....... ( ugh ) .

away......to beers and ball
Éßaseball rules.......uh huh.




and to hell with the 'flies' around here...........back to lurking. I thought the 'weather' would be OK.........guess I'm stooopid fer thinkin' that..................it only takes a few baaaaaaaaad apples.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:28
Gollum (@Gold Dancer ) ID#43349:
Well put.

The pendulum, having swung to, now swings fro.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:26
sno__A (yk2 news story summaries) ID#289417:
Daily summaries of y2k news stories...

http://www.cruxnet.com/~sanger/y2k/

Good short summaries...

good luck....steve

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:24
Cyclist (Balance) ID#26467:
Copyright © 1998 Cyclist/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
FWIW The exercise for balance has started.Japan Inc will not
accept an overvalued currency and the hegemony of the US dollar.
The only solution is to obtain gold.With everybody short without the physical to satisfy, could become more problematic than the
Yen /US carry trade we witnessed today.The only recourse Japan
has,is to forward purchase and stockpile a basket of commodities.
Platinum,gold,oil,and other commodities have to rise quickly in value if they want to keep the currencies in equilibrium,and supply a life line to the third world,else commerce will dissolve into a black hole and depression will start in earnest
118 yen is the support for the US currency.
Interesting times.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:22
Gold Dancer (arden/clone) ID#377196:
Copyright © 1998 Gold Dancer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
You both make good points on Japan. What I see is each was hurt by
the continuation of a trend beyond prudence. Now both countries
need different things.

Japan needs the YEN to come home to prop up their system. They also
need interest rates to rise to keep the postal money in Japan once that
becomes available end of this year. And this is what is happening.

The US needs a cheaper dollar or we are in big trouble with our exports.
We also can't affort a recession with our debt levels so high. So we
need a lower dollar, fast.

Add to the above a world that needs higher commodity prices for
the Developing Nations to repay their loans and the falling dollar
fits right in.

So why did the extremes happen. Alan Greenspan allowed it all to
happen, when, as Fleckenstein says, he allowed the price of gold to
fall from $375 to $275 by not supplying enough liquidity because he was
afraid of inflation.

Now that the ball is rolling the other way the only thing that is
important is to be on the right side of investments. That means to me
Asia stocks and gold investments. For how long? Well, that is difficult
to say. The yen carry and the gold carry trades are hugh and will take
at least the next 9 to 15 months to unwind. After that Asia will be
strongly recovering and that should keep commodity prices rising for
the next 7 to 10 years with sell offs along the way.

Over the real short term of 2 months we could see some real
fire works in the South African miners because they are so very, very,
undervalued compared to the North American stocks. The Canadian Juniors
should have a real good go at it soon also as the Canadian dollar is
rising now.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:18
EJ (Japanese: So hopeful yesterday, sol bummed out again today) ID#45173:
Japan Nikkei 225 ^N225 10:02PM 13366.74 -458.87 -3.32%
-EJ

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:12
crazytimes (HighHopes....) ID#344326:
Lows holding? I don't think so. NASDAQ, DOW Transports, and the Russell 2000 all hit new lows today. If it continues, the DOW will be dragged down too. Gold Stocks too high? Some Juniors are still 90% down from their highs only a year or so ago. Gold is WAY undervalued. Most people agree it should AT LEAST be in the 400's. The US Markets would still be a bloated pig with another 20% shaved off. I think you are mistaken.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 22:02
TYoung (SDRer...DM price of gold...?) ID#317193:
Do your magic calculations good man...such a drop is not a fluke. The game is afoot. This ain't no bull yet. Me thinks. Must we wait or '99...looks like it.

Tom

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 21:53
Gollum (The carnage continues) ID#43349:
http://www.tampabayonline.net/news/news1019.htm

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 21:50
Highhopes (Gold stocks too high already.) ID#404410:
Sold my gold stocks. Much too high relative to physical gold price.
Bargains abounding everywhere on Wall Street. Too much gold around. Environmental costs very high.

Highhopes

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 21:47
Earl (Studio R:) ID#227238:
Superb lyrics. ...... Studio R on the rhythmn guitar and Stradmaster on the fiddle givin' us their rendition of the Orange Blossom Special. .... At the great Kitco Konfab. To be held on Bart Kitner's very own patio. .... Unfortunately, I believe he will schedule it for some January weekend. But what the hell, we'll all be there ...... if we can find enough fuel to drive to Montreal.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 21:45
clone (Arden, I agree that Japan is selling US securities.) ID#267344:
But I do not beleive that they are being forced to by the US or the FED. I think that they have planned this move for a long time.
-c

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 21:43
clone (Arden, I agree that Japan is selling US securities.) ID#267344:
But I do not beleive that they are being forced to by the US or the FED. I think that they have planned this move for a long time.
-c

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 21:42
sharefin (Cash and Bank chart - $ in circulation) ID#284255:
http://www.y2ksupply.com/bankchart.htm

------------------
Gartners latest report on Y2k:
Year 2000 Global State of Readiness and Risks to the General Business Community
http://gartner11.gartnerweb.com/public/static/aboutgg/pressrel/testimony1098.html


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 21:37
Highhopes (October Calamity? EVERYBODY bearish on stock market. EVERYBODY!) ID#404410:
The odds ( probabliity ) are that we will squeak by this October without the crash that everybody is calling for. So far, we're holding above the lows. That's got to have some people sitting on the edge.
Highhopes

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 21:34
arden (comments) ID#255378:
APH - you are awesome!

Gollum - you speak like you know Frodo or Bilbo my friend!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 21:08
arden (snooker table) ID#255378:
Copyright © 1998 arden/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
After reading a number of comments today I don't think some of you really get it at what is going on. This is my interpretation.

Most of us have suffered greatly because we viewed gold and its value as a simple supply and demand situation ( at least that was my thinking when I first joined Kitco 2 1/2 years ago ) . Now after much education from this group I think I see what is going on.

The Yen is not going up against the dollar because of some poor SOB hedge fund caught the wrong way. No, this is much, much larger than that. It is my belief that the US Fed has twisted the arm ( or maybe by simply insulting them ) of the Japanese government to supply T bonds to the market when there is a huge short squeeze going on against the hedge funds - I ask you, who else could cover the shorts? In doing so, the bonds are sold in dollars and converted back to yen and the proceeds repatriated, thus supplying the fuel to save the Japanese system.

This whole chain of events can be viewed like a billiard ball on a snooker table. The ball can bounce from one side to another, but there is no pocket for it to hide within! Such is the current chain of events. First we were told that in August that hedge funds were decimated by the Yen going against them ( by the way, does anyone here remember Steve Kaplan's comments about buying the yen at 145 or so? Truer words were never spoken. ) Then we see this huge runup in US bonds ( a so called flight to quality ) which in fact was a huge short squeeze. The Fed did not do their big intervention in LTCM, no it was done in finding someone ( the only one ) to provide enough bonds for the shorts to cover! Otherwise, long term interest rates in the US would have fallen to 2 percent! ( Like get real! or as a very good friend of mine said - get gold! )

During all of this we have seen a weak move by gold in response to the other financial instruments. It is my believe that there is a very large supplier of gold and gold instruments out there trying to keep the lid on ( IMF? US Fed? someone! ) But systematically, they are losing the battle. The comex floor traders can't help them, they got their wallets burned trying to short gold last week.

No, my friends this ball may bounce around the table alot more, but there is no pocket to hide in. The only pocket of safety left is gold, and its not on their table!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 21:05
Gollum (The squeak that shook the world) ID#43352:
-
Today the DOW was down by a point.

Doesn't sound like much does it?

But there has been more fire put in the hole today than anything that happened on the recent DOW -519 point day.

The yen carry trade over the last dew years built up a tremendous short position borrowing yen and buying treasuries. Especially shorting Japanese bonds and buying US treasuries. They gained not only the interest rate differential but also the rise of the dollar over the yen.

They sucked Japan dry. Which was no mean feat.

Today the dollar dropped as the yen rose explosively. The dropping dollar not only adversely affected interest rates, but it meant a rise in commodity costs. Most notable being gold.

Which hit the gold carry trade.

Who for years have been leasing gold and buying treasuries, thereby taking advantage of the low gold lease rates versus treasury rates and also the benefit of dropping gold prices.

They sucked the price of gold all the way down to below production cost for many mines.

The bond market is capitalized more than two hundred times the capitalization of the equity market.

There will be margin calls.

On a day when the DOW only dropped a single point.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 20:59
Gianni Dioro (There's More Where That Came From) ID#384350:
With the fall of the Dollar, I wonder if there isn't some sort of covert support for Brazil.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 20:42
Silverbaron (Bill Buckler) ID#288295:

Yep - I was just looking at the gold charts in terms of ( especially ) Yen, and also DM, SF, FF and they look like the POG fell off a cliff yesterday. What we REALLY need is one of those $20 up days to break the downtrend in those major currencies, before we can call this a real bull market.

GoGold......

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 20:42
sharefin (Swing charts updated) ID#284255:
-
http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/Charts/Swing.htm

Last week I said I had never seen it rise so fast.
Now this week I have never seen it fall so fast.

New highs/lows show we are well into 'Ping II'
Momentum is increasing to the downside.
Advance/decline is falling through the floor.

I would hazzard a guess that without the PPT being active that the dow would be a 1000 points lower.

They propped the futures up on globex prior to the US opening.
They propped the futures up on opening pushing the PREM up 16 points.
And then they pushed the PREM 10 points at 2:30pm
http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/Charts/Prem10798.jpg

No wonder the Dow stayed square.
While the rest of the indices fell to pieces.
After all, they can only buy the highcap shares, to move the indices.

Seems the Dow is the safest place to be.
Under the protective wings of the PPT.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 20:39
Leland (FLECKENSTIEN -- I don't believe that this leg of the bear market) ID#316193:
can end until we see real panic. I think that is where
we are headed and it will probably culminate in a crash.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.stocksite.com/features/contrarian/rap/

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 20:23
kitkat (Warm Fuzzy Glow ) ID#208392:
Take a look at the currency page at...
http://biz.yahoo.com/n/z/z0006.html
Words like comfortable debt,creditable growth,good progress,bank sell-off on track seem to be in sharp contrast to impending recession,Embattled Brazil,complex problems, professionals scramble,yen explodes. Methinks that the spin meisters are trying to calm us in the midst of a currency storm. Meanwhile, Greenspan opens the door to lower interest rates before Nov. Now what will that do to the $US?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 20:12
STUDIO.R (@BOardreader..... a little music to travel by.............) ID#119358:
Copyright © 1998 STUDIO.R/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
GOLD SHORTIN' BLUES

by Johnny Cash and Ronnie James

I hear dat' train a comin'.... it's rollin 'round the bend and I ain't seen no profits since I don't know when. I'm stuck in dat' Short Position, and time keeps draggin' on. But that Goldtrain keeps a movin' on down to-San-An-Tone

When I was just a baby, my mammy told me, Son...Always be a good boy, don't ever short gold, son. But I shorted gold in Reno, just to watch it die. Now I hear dat' whistle blowin' I hang my head and cry.

Well, if they freed me from this position, yup, that Golden Train I'd ride! I'd sure 'nuff buy it all...a little farther down the line. Far from this Short Position, that's where I'd want to stay. And I'd let that golden whistle, blow all my blues away.

alllllaboard!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 19:51
OLD GOLD () ID#242325:
Nonmercy: Glad that Wayne has changed his tune.Not too long ago he was saying that gold would drop to $250 and that was fine with him.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 19:45
OLD GOLD () ID#242325:
Looks like that German bank add in Forbes denigrating gold was a great buy signal. Those guys have got to be heavily short and they are going to lose big time.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 19:44
nomercy (Wayne Angell on CNN Moneyline) ID#390214:
Feds have stopped price of gold decline...control gold...oil and commodities...to avoid deflation.....
will follow with transcription ...
Go gold

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 19:39
Donald (@Kitco) ID#26793:
XAU/Spot Ratio = .288. The 233 day moving average is .247.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 19:33
Donald (@Kitco) ID#26793:
Dow/Gold Ratio = 25.75. The 233 day moving average is 28.64 and we have been below it for 27 consecutive trading days.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 19:32
Pedro (Volatility) ID#224151:
Like the turbulent weather that oftimes marks the changing of the Seasons, so turbulent
markets signal changing trends. In the current economic climate sudden nasty
surprises ( LTCM ) only add to the woes of Traders trying to adjust to the subtle changes in
mindest required in dealing with a Bear market. As I perceive it the friendly trend these
days is down in the Dow and Going Up with the Golds. Periods of consolidation in each
trend are the expected norm. IMHO some consolidatioin is overdue on the XAU scene.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 19:27
Boardreader (None dare call it .........) ID#20767:
Copyright © 1998 Boardreader/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

MEMO ON THE MARGIN
October 7, 1998
Hurray For Matt Drudge!!!

Memo To: Newspaper and Magazine Editors
From: Jude Wanniski
Re: A People’s Journalism

I write to all the reporters I know and pester all the editors I know. Alas, at the center of my assessment is gold, and gold is not a word that the major media are allowed to discuss in front of women and children. An op-ed editor at one of the major papers has an assistant call and tell me that the piece I wrote about fixing the Russian ruble with gold is unacceptable, that when they said they would like me to write a piece about the new Primakov team, they did not think I would mention gold. If I discussed oral sex in the Kremlin, presumably that would be okay, but not gold. The Wall Street Journal editorial page, which has been citing the importance of gold as the key monetary signal for 20 years, now fails to note that the global financial convulsions have occurred while the Federal Reserve has allowed the gold price to fall by $100 an ounce. Alan Greenspan and the Fed are responsible for the global meltdown, but it is not nice to say so even if you know it is true.

http://www.polyconomics.com/

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 19:24
Gold Dancer (RANGY) ID#430221:
This little underpriced, unloved urchin is about to blossom.
Today she found one golden slipper; tomorrow she will find another and
then she will be able to dance. Right up to $3. By the end of the year.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 19:21
Bill Buckler (Gold up in $US - Down in most other currencies) ID#256381:
Copyright © 1998 Bill Buckler/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Gold ( spot month ) is back above $US 300. When you consider the swan dive of the $US against the Yen in particular, and several other currencies, not least of which is the $A, you have to say that the $US Gold price rise was anaemic.

I've just updated the $A/$US Gold comparison charts at The Privateer website. They make for very interesting viewing. The $A has zoomed from $US 0.586 or so to $US 6225 in a little over a day. Gold has taken a nearly $A 20 hit.

However, the $A Gold uptrend is still intact and $US Gold is now distributing ABOVE its downtrend line. There's no doubt that the Gold technicals against the safe haven currency are improving.

And there's the rub. All those who have come storming into US Dollars and Treasury bonds over the past few months have had a rude shock. Not only is the Dollar down massively against the Yen, but T-bond yields have soared. Ouch - on both counts.

Everybody has flown to quality. Now, the first signs are out that the quality they thought they had flown to is deteriorating. That will be unequivocally good for Gold - over time.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 19:18
STUDIO.R (@howzabout dat rangitO? HuH?) ID#119358:
up a coooool 18 percentile today...why invest in mickey mouse, when you can own the mighty golden dog? arf! arf!! alllaboard........
glennO...I can't believe you got out of your shorts alive...close call pard....choooo chooooo.........

EBogey......never in, never up....allaboard!!!!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:58
George (Mozel) ID#433172:
I haven't always flown straight and level, it's not always simple. I have two military age sons and don't feel so bellicose, I know what it means, my family took some heavy hits in WW 2. You don't ever get over it. But if what I'm watching is true and if those people are really out there in the cold, in fear of thier lives, then it's time to take some more risks. Our own self-respect depends on it. If not? what then? we are poop.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:52
gagnrad (Hmm I saw Platinum today in the 340 range and I said to myself) ID#43460:
Self, that is a good buy. Apparantly there were a whole lot of people who thought likewise. With SWC down below 30 again I expect it may go up again tomorrow. So I put in a market order or just watch it? With my sell target of 45 and buy target of 24 SWC is in no mans land IMHO so I'll just watch it. ( Never follow Gagnrad's musings. His investments are his and yours are yours. )

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:51
STUDIO.R (@PrOmey..........WoW!!!............) ID#119358:
I have seen and heard the fingers of a god.....myOmy...wish you were here to dig it....on second thought, why don't you be the producer of the next benny.discO. it's way too much fun.

hope all is swell with you and yours.....your posts are greatly greeted...uhHuH G&P to YA!!!!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:48
Gollum (Today's action) ID#43349:
http://cnnfn.com/markets/bridge_news/80.1.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:47
crazytimes (Commentary from Bill Murphy....AND Ray DeMoss!!!) ID#344326:
Copyright © 1998 crazytimes/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
October 7, 1998 - Spot Gold $300.70 up $4.60 - Spot Silver $5.12 up 4 cents

Technicals -

Jump back jack. Katy bar the door. It is all she wrote for the gold bears. Uptown we go. In the last Midas we called the technical set up about a 10. The pullback the past couple of days and sudden thrust up today only further strengthens the technical picture. Next stop: $335 gold. The bullish consensus, with all that is going on in the world, was only 33% this morning. That is very, very low for gold and confirms what we have been telling Le Metropole members. There are not that many other real bulls out there. But, there will be. The herd is coming our way.

Silver is doing just fine and has no near term gaps to fill. That is positive and it is doing the work we thought it had to do. The price of silver is going to accelerate up very sharply in the near future as governments around the world step on the gas petal and print money to stave off financial collapse.

Fundamentals -

Tis a lot happening out there to report to you.

One of our more keyed in sources tells us that Long Term Capital has been let out of their short 300 tonne gold borrowing position by a central bank in an off market transaction. In our last Midas we stressed the fact that their short position was actually an impediment to the price of gold rising. There is no way they could just go out and buy 300 to 375 tonnes of gold at the market. That would have undone the bail out boys entire save the system program. Just look at the tremendously, violent bond run up and yen run up. Long term was supposedly short both of those and look what happened. Exiting the yen short and short Treasury Bond positions was painful, but they could get out. Buying that amount of gold could have set off a world panic as other hedge funds and borrowers joined in to cover at the same time. Now, we can have just a normal buying panic ( instead of a catastrophic one ) when the other big gold shorts try and cover down the road .

We think this is important news for several reasons. It shows how desperate our government is to try and keep order. Two, a 300 to 375 central bank sale of gold at the market is staggering and the price of gold has not really budged. Had they done this in the bullion markets, the price of gold could have dropped $60 to $70 per oz. The net effect of this maneuver, in our opinion, is that this is very bullish news because when this news leaks out to others, it will become apparent to all that there must be other big gold shorts out there, but governments will not be there to arrange such an exit deal that lets the gold shorts off the hook so easily. That is why I suggest that the price of gold will fly when these other big gold shorts try and run through the tiny exit door at the same time.

One month lease rates have collapsed to 60 basis points from about 180 basis points in just days. This suggests some confirmation of our theory that the powers to be orchestrated a bear counter attack against gold bulls by borrowing gold and dumping it in the market place to buy time to solve the Long Term Capital problem. Now that they have solved the gold short problem for Long Term, they paid back the gold loan, the lease rates have tumbled dramatically, and the price of gold has risen again.

There is even more fuel or the fire to our story that officialdom is messing with the gold price. Over the past many months and years, every time gold looked like it was poised to really move higher, we heard from the Central Bank of England about gold sales. They did it again on Monday.

( Bloomberg ) , London, Oct.5 - Gold dropped more than 1 percent after the U.K. Chancellor of the Exchequer Gordon Brown said the International Monetary Fund, the world's largest gold holder, will consider selling some of its reserves. Though previous attempts by the cash-strapped IMF to sell gold to pay down debts of the world's poorest countries have been blocked by Germany, that country's position may now be changing, Brown said yesterday at an IMF press conference.

Tell me this was not part of the buying time program by our bail out boys.

These games do not amuse the French. ( Reuters ) , Washington, Oct. 6 - Bank of France Governor Jean-Claude Trichet said on Tuesday the French central bank had absolutely no plan for gold sales and that he believed this was the same case for France's major Western counterparts. As far as the Banque de France is concerned there is absolutely no plan for gold sales, and to my knowledge it's the same as regards the major owners of gold holdings, which are if I'm not misled, the U. S. first, Germany second, France number three, and Italy four, he told Reuters.

Le Metropole Café is developing tremendous feedback and information sources. A very conservative member has heard from his Wall Street connections that Bankers Trust is toast. The word is that they are shopping it around and it has to merge. This has many implications, not the least of which, is they have a very active bullion operation and we believe they carry a fairly large short gold borrowing position on their books. An announcement such as this is liable to create additional, justified fear about the financial system. Our sources tell us that the Federal Reserve is really worried about banks like Bankers Trust, even more than they are about the hedge funds. Some of these banks have proprietary trading desks that are out of control. Financial stocks are plummeting for good reason.

Another Reuters headline ( Oct 6 ) that has very bullish implications for gold down the road, OVERDEPENDENCE ON DOLLAR ONE CAUSE OF ASIAN CURRENCY CRISES LAST YEAR- Miyazawa . The Japanese government is now considering from a broader perspective some specific measures to improve the environment for the yen to be used more actively by market participants in the region an beyond, he said.

King dollar is in trouble. Stronger Asian currencies will give gold demand a big boost in that region and the weakening dollar is likely to influence Asian central banks to buy gold for reserve purposes.

Sine fundamental information on gold's cousin, platinum. John Brimelow pointed out that the perennial long position of Engelhard on the Tocom in Japan dropped by several thousand contracts. Since they are THE Anglophile on that exchange and always have a long book, the reduction in their long position indicates heavy shorting by hedge funds that are still playing the economic collapse game. We think they will be caught going the wrong way as all the precious metals are poised to rocket.

Potpourri and the Gold Shares -

Yesterday the XAU gapped 3 points lower and closed over 2 points higher. That is bull market action at its finest and another clear signal that the gold scene has changed. Holders of the senior shares did not want to give back profits as they have in the past couple of years, so they panicked after gold's lower opening yesterday, thinking another dive was coming. By the end of the day sellers had to buy back their positions as it was clear something else was up. Today's follow through and hefty advance of 5.87 to close at 86.63 is another step towards the XAU headed for 155 down the pike.

We have been asked repeatedly about the great stock market action of Golden Star Resources and members want to more about why I think it will go to $60 to $70 in the years to come. I strongly suggest you read Frank Veneroso's report on this company which can be obtained from GSR's headquarters in Denver.

I will say this. I think they have found Eldorado in a sense that I believe that they have found a number properties ( a few with very big resource potential ) that will eventually become profitable gold mining operations in the Guyana Shield. This is very unusual. How does one exploration company find so many?

The Guyana Shield is one nasty place. It is a big jungle, inaccessible and hard to explore. Compare exploration there to many places like Nevada, Australia and many spots in Africa that have really been picked over because exploring is not so harsh. That does not mean there are not spectacular finds to be found in those locations, but on a probability basis, it explains why one exploration company may have a real big time score in the Guyana Shield.

One of our favorite gold share holdings is Durban Deep, a South African gold stock. We know that many of our lemetropolecafe.com members own it, as we do. As I have stated in the past, Midas's goal is to attract some of the sharp minds and in the know people that are involved in the gold market and the gold shares.

Ray De Moss, successful entrepreneur from Ruston, Louisiana and Café member, is exactly the kind of individual I was hoping to attract. A good buddy of Terry Bradshaw ( NFL Hall of Fame great ) from his collegiate days at Louisiana Tech, he is also a major shareholder of Durban Deep, knows the top brass, and has been to South Africa to see Durban for himself. He has written some commentary on Durban which says it all. Take it away Ray.

Durban Deep by Ray De Moss 10/07/98

Durban Deep is probably the premier gold investment on the market today. South African gold stocks in general offer excellent values in today's gold share market, that is if you are interested in making money! Risks in SA have been way overblown! After doing business in the SA gold shares for 20 years, I went to that country to see for myself just what the political and economic situation was. I found a bunch of GOOD people. Yes, there are places that you would not want to go and other places that you would use the usual common sense about security. You can also get SHOT in Shreveport, LA, ( Las Vegas of the South ) , any afternoon. There are areas of New Orleans that a coach will not go to recruit a prospective athlete. That aside, the sheer beauty of the country will overwhelm any new visitor. In short it AIN'T the way you see portrayed it on the networks.

My primary interest is in making money. In 1978, the first money I had to invest was up over 140 times in 4-5 years with the SA shares. There was a German salesman that called on me, I knew he was a millionaire and I shared some of my concerns about making money with him and he introduced me to the gold market. One thing lead to another, and after doing my due diligence, I met Richard G. Johnson, a broker in Shreveport, LA [318-221-2558] that specializes in the SA gold shares. That was my first experience making money with money.

Another thing I must mention is the houses in South Africa do not have screens on the windows because they have little or no bugs, insects flying around to irritate and BITE you.. The environment has not been screwed up with all the chemicals that we have in the USA today. The main risk with the North American shares is the government regulations and I view that risk to production as more than any political risk in South Africa. Sure there is risk in all places we invest, a good reason to have a diversified portfolio, with YOUR risk tolerance reflected in the mix, ie. some would want a mutual fund and another may want a heavy weighing in a stock like Durban Deep.

Durban Deep- [DROOY is the ADR symbol in the USA, DRD is the symbol for the JSE]- The following are reasons I like DD:

*Huge gold reserves in, and above, the ground that the market values at only $2-$25 per ounce.

*These shares are like buying a call option on the gold price with NO expiration date. They should NOT be traded. Durban Deep is my largest share position and #1 gold play. Only I ain't PLAYIN, I am DEAD serious on makin MONEY!

*800,000 ounce annual gold production, 42 million ounces in reserve and growing every day. Plans and actions are in place to increase production to over one million ounces by the year 2001.

*The profit potential is HUGE. My good friend Jim Blanchard in his Gold Newsletter mentions 2400% profit potential. Jim called me the other day and I told him that was REAL LOW. This share with a gold price of $500 plus could easy be in the hundreds of dollars. Reason- the whole world is used to makin money in the STOCK market. Well, when the FAT LADY SINGS and she is singin NOW and all them PO BOYS start lookin for safety and they want to make money they will turn to gold shares, the whole gold share market is less them HALF the value of EXXON stock. Now for you A students that potential is HUGE!

*Roger Kebble ( Durban Chairman ) is one of the best miners in the world. He knows how to get the job done at the most reasonable price with the most efficient result. His son, Brett, is an attorney, an accountant and a FINANCIAL GENIUS. I TRUST my money with these guys! I have personally been to the DEPTHS of Durban Deep.

Now the name is misleading because much of the ore is on the SURFACE. DD now is many formerly separate mines under one management. It consists of surface operations, dump operations- where new technology is removing gold from formerly processed ore.

*Rand depreciation means huge profits for DD and other SA gold mines. Here is a very important point most people do not understand but is a very important reason why you should own SA golds. When the Rand drops in value to the dollar or British /Sterling, it in effect lowers the production cost to the mines. You see expenses are paid in local currency, the Rand, and the product, GOLD, is sold in foreign currency. When I was there, the miners were talking about the RAND falling to 10 to 1 to the dollar or 10 cents rather than the current 25 cents. They explained that every cent fall in the Rand, the more money ( PROFIT ) the mines made. Production costs have fallen to around $225 per ounce with the fall in the Rand.

*Durban Deep has recently acquired the Crown Jewels property just south of Johannesburg. This adds HUGE potential to reserves. Also the richest gold deposits are located in the gold veins in the area south of the city. There are places that have proven 3-5 ounces of gold per ton of ore. These veins are usually very shallow and are only 6 to 12 inches thick but very RICH. I have walked down an incline shaft in this area to such a vein.

*That is it in a nut shell. If you are serious about making money in this bull market in gold you should consider a position in Durban Deep for your portfolio.

Ray DeMoss


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:46
POLARBEAR (STEVE in TO @ Pangea on the move.....( a JV of newly beloved RANGY :) .) ID#183109:
Steve,

Pangea is a JV of, you guessed it : ) , RANDGOLD.

They have the Golden Ridge project, a million or so ounce deposit. Regarding today's jump, Giraffe on S.I. posted this to me.

Results of Victoria Project drilling:

http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/981006/w5.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:39
Goldbug23 (EJ - John Gordan article) ID#432148:
Well worth the bandwidth and thanks. Maybe we can learn from history?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:33
korondy (Clone re: Dow vs. S&P500) ID#222186:
Money is moving to ( perceived ) safer ground.

AXP +3.5% MCD +4.8% MMM +3.5% PG +4.3% T +2.4%

See http://cbs.marketwatch.com/data/dbcfiles/dowt.htx?source=htx/http2_mw

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:33
Bully Beef (I 'm Psst but look ... I think gold has broken the trends. Dow up insignificantly. Gold up.) ID#259282:
Yen up. Go figure! The trends are freaked. Everything is non-sense-ical.Go ask Alice ...when she 's ten feet tall...
I don't give a Flying fiddlers freak what you say... to quote him who shall not be spoken of... ( another ) ....things simply are not as before.
If you don't like it ...tough! Where is the money?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:30
Gollum (@clone ) ID#43349:
The DOW is made up of about 30 BIG companies and is a more conservative, defensive segment of the market. The S&P is broader ranged and includes a lot of smaller companies. Sometimes will see the DOW actually rise as the others fall when the market is going into a decline as people get out of the riskier stocks and into the blue chips.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:27
moa (The big Kahunna.....) ID#269128:
Oct. 15-16...

we'll be waxing down our surfboards,
can't wait for the new moon,
wiping out on the rocks,
or cruising to some new toons?


Golden Shores.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:25
clone (S&P down 1.41%, DOW down only .02% - why is that?) ID#267344:
This seems contradictory. Is there anyone here who would like to address this question?

-c

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:20
Steve in TO (Pangea - anybody know what's happening?) ID#209265:
PGD ( TSE ) was at $1.15 a couple of weeks ago & it's been going up, up, up, closing at $1.98 today. Anyone know why it's going up that fast? Lots of other juniors are doing well- but not like that, I don't think.

- Steve

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:20
SteveIS (Golden Rule) ID#280339:
The world is about to relearn the golden rule: The one with the gold gets to make the rules.

The world wide debt balloon is popping. Banks around the world will find an increasing % of bad loans. They will stop lending. This will cause economies to shrink. Currency values will fluctuate wildly.

Gold will increasingly be seen as the only safe place to put capital. Those countries, banks and individuals with the foresight to buy gold will be around to pick up the pieces.

Remember the golden rule: BUY GOLD!!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:18
Steve in TO (Pangea - anybody know what's happening?) ID#209265:
PGD ( TSE ) was at $1.15 a couple of weeks ago & it's been going up, up, up, closing at $1.98 today. Anyone know why it's going up that fast? Lots of other juniors are doing well- but not like that, I don't think.

- Steve

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:10
MM (Nimmanahaeminda (try that after a gulp & puff...)) ID#350179:
Correction to earlier post
INDEX___OPEN____CLOSE___%CHG____CHG
DOW___7742.98__7741.69__-0.017%___-1.29

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:08
EJ (History Repeats in Finance Company Bailouts - Sept. 7, 1998 WSJ ) ID#45173:
Copyright © 1998 EJ/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
By JOHN STEELE GORDON

It is a commonplace that the only human emotions that operate in the market are fear and greed.
Certainly, they each serve a vital function as a check on the other, pushing the buyers and sellers
toward the profitable center and away from the sterile extremes. But that is what makes bailouts
of large firms in trouble so problematic. One bailout tends to lead to another, and by removing
fear, the expectation of a bailout fosters greed. Alan Greenspan understood this when, reacting
to the Chrysler bailout of nearly two decades ago, he said that what he feared was not that it
would fail but that it would succeed.

Yet this year Mr. Greenspan helped arrange a bailout of failing Long-Term Capital Management,
a huge hedge fund that had guessed wrong on its bets. Why? The answer is simple enough: The
short-term consequences of not bailing it out would very likely have been far worse than the
long-term ones of doing so.

The failure of a manufacturing firm, however painful to its stockholders and employees, has
mostly local consequences. Its assets pass into other, more efficient hands while the economy as
a whole marches on unscathed. But financial institutions, whose stock in trade is, in James
Grant's memorable phrase, the money of the mind, are different. Consider a little history.

On Thursday, Sept. 18, 1873, shortly after noon, Jay Cooke & Co. announced that it was
suspending trading. It was bankrupt.

Near the beginning of the Civil War, Jay Cooke invented the bond
drive, an attribute of every major war since. Cooke sold bonds in
denominations as small as $50 to ordinary people, and allowed
them to pay on an installment plan. By persuading millions to take
their small savings out of mattresses and to put them into
government bonds, Cooke made them capitalists. By tapping into
a hitherto unexploited asset, he helped mightily to save the Union,
allowing it to throw much of the cost of the war onto the future.
And, of course, by being the principal agent by which the national
debt rose in four years to more than $2.7 billion from less than
$65 million, he made Jay Cooke & Co. the most powerful and
prestigious bank in the country and himself its most famous
banker.

But Cooke did not continue to flourish in the financial market of
the post-Civil War era. While his prestige was undiminished, his
financial position quietly deteriorated, especially after the young
J.P. Morgan began to compete for the business of floating
government bonds.

Immediately upon Cooke's announcement, the coal-black steed
named Panic thundered down Wall Street. A wave of selling engulfed the stock exchange as
everyone tried desperately to convert his holdings to gold and cash, while short sellers pounded
the market further with sales for future delivery and banks called in loans as fast as they could to
meet depositors demands for withdrawals. Other banks and brokerage houses followed Cooke
into oblivion, as did dozens of other major Wall Street powers. The new cable across the
Atlantic Ocean, working since 1866, carried the financial contagion to Europe, and London and
Paris markets crashed as well. At 11 a.m. that Saturday, the New York Stock Exchange itself
announced that it would close indefinitely, the first time it ever did so.

Although the Grant administration tried to inject cash into the marketplace by buying up
government bonds, it lacked the power to act decisively, and the panic on Wall Street quickly
rippled through the U.S. economy. Country banks, their deposits in city banks tied up in
suspensions, also closed their doors, and firms laid off workers because they lacked the cash to
pay them.

While the stock exchange managed to reopen in 10 days, it would be six long years of deep
depression for the U.S. economy as a whole. To be sure, with the overexpansion of the railroad
industry after the Civil War, the economy had been headed for a recession anyway. The failure
of Jay Cooke & Co.was only the straw that broke the camel's back. But the panic it caused
greatly worsened the situation and caused many basically sound firms to founder, taking
thousands of their depositors and customers with them.

In retrospect, it is obvious that had Jay Cooke's true financial situation been known, the market
would have been prepared for his firm's failure. Had Cooke & Co. been subject to regulation, it
would have been forced into merger or orderly liquidation before disaster struck. At the time,
however, there was no regulation whatever, and government did nothing to put any in place.

But the next time a similar situation arose, when the Knickerbocker Trust Co. failed in 1907,
Wall Street, at least, had a means of coping: J.P. Morgan. By that time Morgan had the
reputation that Cooke had enjoyed 34 years earlier. But Morgan's bank was a vastly sounder
and more powerful institution than Cooke's had ever been. And Morgan had another asset
Cooke had lacked: a formidable personality. The photographer Edward Steichen said that
meeting Morgan's eyes was like confronting the headlights of an express train.

As panic gripped Wall Street and the stock exchange threatened to close again, Morgan took
charge. He kept the market open by the simple expedient of flatly forbidding it to close and
raising $25 million in 15 minutes to add liquidity. He also let it be known that any short sellers
would be properly attended to, a vague phrase that most bears decided not to risk getting
clarified.

That night he summoned New York's most important bankers to his library on East 36th Street
and told them to devise a plan to abort the panic. After several attempts they came up with a plan
Morgan thought would work. It did. The panic of 1907 was soon over and did not induce a
depression.

The panic also made the government begin to understand that financial firms that were too big to
fail were also too big to be unregulated. With an economy that was now national in organization
and, by far, the largest in the world, the country needed a central bank to provide liquidity in
times of panic and to help regulate financial institutions. The Federal Reserve came into
existence in 1913, the same year J.P. Morgan died. Still, there was a long way to go before we
got it right. The Fed would be reconceived following the debacle of 1929-33, and Wall Street
itself would become subject to regulation by the Securities and Exchange Commission.

The financial regulatory system developed in the 1930s worked reasonably well over the
following six decades of unparalleled economic growth. Today, however, the situation is
rapidly changing. The financial markets have virtually completed their globalization, while the
regulation of those markets necessarily remains confined within sovereign states. Had the
regulators tried to restrict Long-Term Capital Management's freedom of action, it could have
moved its headquarters from Connecticut to, say, the Cayman Islands in nearly no time and
gone on operating as it pleased. Because it was largely unregulated, Long-Term Capital
Management's bailout became necessary, as Mr. Greenspan, no friend of bailouts, realized.

So it is clear that the reach of regulatory institutions must come into line with the international
reach of the financial institutions they are supposed to oversee. This will be, perhaps, the most
important political question to be dealt with in the early 21st century.

Unfortunately, political problems that necessarily involve substantial surrender of sovereignty
are the most difficult to solve in a world still made up of sovereign states. But if there is a silver
lining to the crises now gripping Asia and Russia, it may be that it will force the rest of the
world to establish the proper regulatory regime before the panic spreads.
-----
Pls sqawk if y'all don't want me using bandwidth on this stuff. I can't post the URL because the piece comes from a pay site. Figured I'd share the good stuff. Lemme know.
-EJ

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:07
STUDIO.R (@dat' Chicken Shack........yup, it's just a hole in da' wall........(play on BennyitO)........) ID#119358:
ohmy!, speakin' of holes.......dat' cagey canine-cornholin' camdessus is courtin' ol' clitton 'cause he's cravin' cool cash and commander'n'chief cockollatio....yuk , away!....you sick puppies.......manOman.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:05
TheMissingLink () ID#373403:
Thai Finance Minister Tarrin Nimmanahaeminda tried to focus the discussion on short-term issues that need immediate attention.

Tarrin said that Clinton led a very good discussion, but that we didn't get very far on anything.

I think this is going to be Clinton's legacy. Good talker, no action.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 18:00
mozel (@George) ID#153110:
It surprised me that somebody whose head is level would want to have a dog in that fight. It's a diversionary CON put on by our Federal Mafia in Foggy Bottom to make sure there is continuing conflict for people to take sides on. Just more of the usual divide to conquer crap.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 17:50
Delphi (@mozel, 16:10) ID#258142:
During conflict in Bosnia I was always wondering on how simple propaganda works - Serbs and Moslems: one is ethnic, other is religious. As a matter of fact, both are Serbs, one side is Christian, other - Moslem. But if one will say, that is a war between Christians and Moslems, it will be obvious, what most of the people in USA and Europe will think. So, we have Serbs and Moslems. Historically, Balkans where under Turk occupation. Some of Serbs adopted Moslem religion and where always treated as betrayers by others. That’s history. And now this Kosovo story - best chance for Clinton

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 17:49
SteveIS (Japan shoots down Tbond missile) ID#280339:
Japan sick of stupid arrogant advice from Rubin and CamDISEASE sold TBonds at all time highs and caused a $ route. The financial war has begun.

The dollar rout sank the TBond and US Stocks held on by a thread. With the TBond under distribution my foreign powers the gold bull is now unstoppable.

Buy GOLD!!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 17:49
Greenstone Gold (.............MIGHT be a problem..........) ID#428218:
Copyright © 1998 Greenstone Gold/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

The Clinton administration also said Tuesday that it was holding preliminary
discussions to schedule an emergency economic summit meeting in London next
month, as suggested by British Prime Minister Tony Blair.

.... The meeting, if it takes place, is intended to follow up on some of the few concrete recommendations to have emerged from this meeting. There is clear consensus for one: a series of global rules on transparency, requiring countries to make public reports of far more information about their foreign currency reserves and other data that would tip off investors that trouble MIGHT be brewing.........

This must be a WJC brain wave........only a glitch.......

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 17:42
moa (Yen Carry Unwind....) ID#269128:
explosive stuff dem derivatives eh lads!

This is clearly cheap interest yen loans used to high-gear leverage hedge funds into sure bets based on Black-Scholes shennanigans coming unglued before our very eyes.
Suddenly those loans don't look so cheap after all....didn't factor this much slope ( derivative ) into the equation huh?

Begs the question how long before the gold-carry unwind?

The idiocy of gold loans will be clearly revealed to all paper pushers before Dec. 98.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 17:37
EJ (Auric) ID#45173:
Not only was the NASDAQ down 48pts, it closed below its 52 week average. It's down 28% for the 52 week period. Yooooooch! You might say NASDAQ is in a bear market, no?
-EJ

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 17:27
MoReGoLd (@Hedge Funds getting creamed on the YEN - - - HaHaHaHaHa ....) ID#348286:
Copyright © 1998 MoReGoLd/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
FX IN EUROPE - Professionals scramble for yen

LONDON, Oct 7 ( Reuters ) - The dollar tumbled by eight yen on Wednesday as banks and hedge funds fought to buy yen, driven by a ray of light over Japanese banking reform, analysts and dealers said.

``Institutions have been selling dollar/yen all the way down from 130,'' said a dealer from a UK bank.

``Everyone wants to get out of loss-making positions.''

The dollar sank to near-eight-month lows against the yen at 122.69, a fall of more than 10 yen, or nine percent, from Tuesday's high. The ailing dollar also set fresh 20-month lows versus the mark, and 21-month lows against the Swiss franc.

The dollar rout started after Japan's ruling Liberal Democratic Party submitted bills to parliament to allow the government to intervene to shore up failing banks, analysts said.

The plan was conditionally welcomed by a key opposition group, and Japanese authorities also signalled more economic stimulus measures.

The yen strengthened across the board, also reaching four-week highs against the mark.

By 1445 GMT, the dollar was trading at 123.67/77 yen, from 131.21/31 yen in late Europe on Tuesday.

Mark/yen was trading at 76.56/59, from a low of 76.22 and from 80.32/35 late on Tuesday.

Hedge funds rushed to buy the yen as it strengthened, in order to unwind ``carry trades,'' dealers said. The carry trades involved borrowing yen at Japan's cheap interest rates and buying higher-yielding investments.

The yen's strong upward move against the dollar could not be justified on economic grounds, analysts said.

``The 120 level will be about the end of this move. The Japanese economic situation makes it difficult to be bullish about the yen,'' said Don Smith, economist at HSBC Markets.

Dollar/mark followed dollar/yen lower, though it was not the main focus, analysts said.

The dollar lost ground against the mark after Bundesbank President Hans Tietmeyer rejected recent political calls for lower German interest rates, saying in a German newspaper interview that European rates must first converge at the German level for European economic and monetary union.

But the remarks were not sufficient to have a long-term impact on the dollar, analysts said.

``His comments did not differ dramatically from previous comments,'' said Keith Edmonds, senior analyst at IBJ.

The dollar was trading at 1.6136/39 marks at 1520 GMT, from a low of 1.6052 and from 1.6335/38 in late Europe on Tuesday.

The dollar shrugged off a speech by Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan to a meeting of U.S. business economists.

``It was the usual Greenspeak -- on the one hand, on the other,'' said Edmonds. ``There was nothing really new there.''

Greenspan said the U.S. economy was still strong and labour markets unusually tight but that this was a time for monetary policy to be especially alert.

The pound, meanwhile, hit 16-month lows against the mark as markets speculated about a UK interest rate cut this week.

The Bank of England's Monetary Policy Committee started its monthly two-day meeting on Wednesday, and an announcement on interest rates is due on Thursday.

The pound was trading at 2.7413/18 marks from a low of 2.7251 marks and from 2.7473/78 in late Europe on Tuesday. Against the dollar, the pound was at $1.6979/84 from late Tuesday's $1.6846/56.

The Swedish crown rallied against the mark after the Riksbank intervened several times on Wednesday to support it.

It was trading at 4.8120/70 per mark at 1540 GMT, from a high of 4.7950 per mark, low of 4.9135 and from 4.9020/70 in late Europe on Tuesday.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 17:21
Speed (CRB Index news) ID#29048:
http://www.crbindex.com/reviews/story2333.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 17:02
George (Mosel) ID#433172:
Copyright © 1998 George/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Not a religious argument..Slovenia, Croatia aren't Muslim..they tried the same thing there. They ( Serbs ) are into dominance by they're track record. I hope they don't start big trouble, like they did in 1914?

We are not in the same boat, I've got my own boat and it's got all the G's. I hope I don't have to use it ( I kicked around in the boondocks for years ) I like it here next to the tit. That's where things are now right? We are being screwed into the same bailout boat ala ltcm and AG and IMF and now wjc. Good for the world bank, at least somebody has tyheier head on straight, I wonder if he belives man got to the moon?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 17:00
korondy (Gold is no longer a 4-letter word) ID#222186:
http://www.marketwatch.newsalert.com/bin/story?StoryId=CnHMvWb8ZtJa2mtaYndi4&FQ=c%25HM%20&Title=Headlines%20for%3A%20HM%0A

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 17:00
MM (Took this long just to get back on...) ID#350179:
INDEX___OPEN____CLOSE___%CHG____CHG
DOW___7742.98__7740.15__-0.037%___-2.83
XAU______80.76____86.63__+7.268%___+5.87
( XAU measured from prior close. )

Tomorrows XAU exit triggers @ 76.89 & 101.17

Mozel, I concur. ( Hey I'm just the messenger - I was wondering why they waited until now to release the info. )

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 17:00
TheMissingLink (Advice on GSR) ID#373403:
Copyright © 1998 TheMissingLink/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I tried to buy this stock today but couldn't because my brokerage company would not release funds from yesterdays sale of BEARX until mid day. I spent the rest of the day trying to buy 1/8 below market and watched it get away from me to the tune of 25% up for the day.

Now I am sitting here stewing and wondering if it is worth it to buy in tomorrow or wait for a break in the price. Gold stocks seem very pricey given $304 gold. There is alot of momentum built in right now.

What would you do?

steve@familyjeweler.com

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:59
tolerant1 (and a 1 and a 2 and a 3...) ID#31868:
Oh my Darlin...Oh my Darrrrlin...Oh my Daaarrrrlin Paradigm...not...

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:54
TheMissingLink (Advice on GSR) ID#373403:
Copyright © 1998 TheMissingLink/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I tried to buy this stock today but couldn't because my brokerage company would not release funds from yesterdays sale of BEARX until mid day. I spent the rest of the day trying to buy 1/8 below market and watched it get away from me to the tune of 25% up for the day.

Now I am sitting here stewing and wondering if it is worth it to buy in tomorrow or wait for a break in the price. Gold stocks seem very pricey given $304 gold. There is alot of momentum built in right now.

What would you do?

steve@familyjeweler.com

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:53
Auric (NASDAQ vs DJIA) ID#255151:

DJIA down just 1 point--
http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=^DJI&d=1d NASDAQ
down 48 points, or 3.2%
http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=^IXIC&d=1d

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:46
chas (Anybody re Gabelli Fund) ID#147211:
I would appreciate a phone number for Gabelli TIA, Charlie

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:31
PrivateInvestor (Moa) ID#227444:

not only Jap. repatriation but George Soros & Co. went short the $ last night in a big way & covered this am...that is the reason you saw the dollar slammed...he is going to play a little whoop ass on thinly traded positions...he may whip the dollar as he did the pound ...

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:30
EJ (Will World Leaders quickly reach agreement and take action on the global crisis? Nope.) ID#45173:
Copyright © 1998 EJ/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Dissention Erupts at Talks on World Financial Crisis -- October 7, 1998 New York Times

By DAVID E. SANGER

WASHINGTON -- As President Clinton argued anew Tuesday that we
must find a way to temper the volatile swings of the international
marketplace, the president of the World Bank publicly broke with the
approach that the United States and the International Monetary Fund have taken in
managing the global crisis.

In a speech to the finance ministers and central bank governors from 182 nations
meeting in Washington, World Bank president James Wolfensohn said that in the
rush to stabilize currencies and bring about economic reform, too little attention was
being paid to the growing ranks of unemployed and the risks of undercutting
political stability. The poor cannot wait on our deliberations, he said.

Wolfensohn's warnings underscored the extraordinary dissension and
disagreements at this year's meetings of the World Bank and the International
Monetary Fund over whether the strategy for stopping the global turmoil has been
misguided.

While the fund and bank often disagree privately, Tuesday's speech brought into
the open months of tension between the two sister institutions over the right strategy
for dealing with the crisis. The tension is so great that Treasury Secretary Robert
Rubin said Tuesday that the two huge institutions must to settle their many
differences.

Little progress was made Tuesday on forging short-term solutions. President
Clinton, in his second speech on the world economic crisis in two days, repeated
his proposal that the major nations of the world set up a precautionary lines of
credit that would help countries that are taking the needed tough economic steps
but nonetheless are caught up in the wave of financial turmoil.

The Clinton administration also said Tuesday that it was holding preliminary
discussions to schedule an emergency economic summit meeting in London next
month, as suggested by British Prime Minister Tony Blair.

The meeting, if it takes place, is intended to follow up on some of the few concrete
recommendations to have emerged from this meeting. There is clear consensus for
one: a series of global rules on transparency, requiring countries to make public
reports of far more information about their foreign currency reserves and other data
that would tip off investors that trouble might be brewing.

There is far more dispute, however, over whether those rules would also apply to
private entities, especially hedge funds, the huge investment pools that are blamed
by many for exacerbating the crisis with huge bets on the currencies of small
countries. Nor is there agreement yet on rules that would force big lenders -- banks
and other investors -- to pay a far greater share of the burden of bailing a country
out of financial trouble.

What we want to focus on are funds that attack a currency with a view to toppling
it, said Sir Donald Tsang, the finance secretary of Hong Kong. But he said that
there was still considerable argument over how far governments should go in such
regulation.

The debacle at LTC helped, he added, referring to Long Term Capital
Management, the Greenwich, Conn., hedge fund that required a Wall Street bailout
two weeks ago, organized by the Federal Reserve. Suddenly there was a
recognition in this country that we are all in the same boat.

Wolfensohn, an Australian-born former investment banker known for speaking his
mind, painted a bleaker picture than did IMF managing director Michel Camdessus.

We are not in 1928, Camdessus declared Tuesday, with his very comparison
sending a chill through the vast hotel ballroom where the officials of the 182 nations
were meeting.

If we keep a steady nerve, if all countries pursue stability, he insisted, the world
will not slip into recession and this crisis can be overcome. But he insisted that
the burden of economic reform falls on individual nations. And he made specific
reference to Russia, saying that the IMF could not resume funding to the country
until its new government embraces reforms.

Wolfensohn's criticism of the IMF's to the crisis echoed a frequent criticism heard
during the meetings: that the focus on stabilizing currencies and balancing budgets,
the usual IMF prescriptions, was causing far too much pain to the poor and the
middle class. Wolfensohn contended that with millions of people slipping below the
poverty line in Indonesia and with many Russians unable to afford basic
commodities, the risks of political upheaval are greatly increased.

If we do not have greater equity and social justice, there will be no political
stability, he said. And without political stability, no amount of money put together
in financial packages will give us financial stability.

He argued that before the world can turn to building what the Clinton administration
calls a new international financial architecture, it must adjust its approach to the
crisis so that mathematics will not dominate humanity.''

Without building political support for the bailout programs that have led to
government austerity and unemployment, Wolfensohn said, we may build a new
international financial architecture. But it will be a house built on sand.

Wolfensohn's critique struck to the heart of the complaints from many nations --
especially Indonesia and Russia -- that have found fault with the Fund's priorities.
But officials of the IMF and the U.S. Treasury -- which strongly influences its
policy -- say that Wolfensohn has not come up with alternatives that would reform
sick economies fast enough.

It's easy for the bank to play the good guy, said one finance minister in
Washington on Tuesday, speaking on condition of anonymity, because helping the
poor is a lot more popular than convincing the Russians to collect their taxes and
crack down on corruption.

Other officials here, though, describe the problems differently. At a meeting of 22
nations with Clinton on Monday night, Thai Finance Minister Tarrin
Nimmanahaeminda tried to focus the discussion on short-term issues that need
immediate attention.

The first is the drying up of all investment in the emerging markets, he said in an
interview this evening. And the second is spurring growth in the largest
countries, which buy the goods of Thailand and other nations. Tarrin said that
Clinton led a very good discussion, but that we didn't get very far on anything.

European nations, Tarrin and other Asian leaders said, are complacent, since they
have been hurt the least by the global troubles. He said they are immersed in the
launch of their common currency, the Euro. The spending limits European countries
have placed on themselves to make the currency strong has limited their ability to
spend more money to stimulate their economies, Tarrin noted.

And Clinton, he noted, is also limited, by his continuing effort to get Congress to
approve $18 billion to support the IMF.

This has been a big limit on the U.S. Tarrin said, because it has prevented Clinton
from proposing any short-term cures that involve spending more U.S. funds.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:29
Charleston Gold Bug (GC8Z) ID#344389:
Dec gold closed @ 303

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:10
mozel (@Sh*t Eaters) ID#153102:
There may be some sh*t George won't eat, but Propaganda Sh*t it ain't.
Baaad Serb Christians. Goooood Albanian Moslems. What a f*cking Joke !
Either way you tell it.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:06
Cyclist (Plat) ID#26467:
FWIW Price-action today will give the metal 400 within the next
9 trading sessions.Gold should be at 320.
SGOLY is giving a hint what is to come 7 and 11.
Selling Rangy ?Nah,that mongrel is worth at least 2.75
Have a nice and profitable day.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:03
Dave in CO (@MM - Serb anti-aircraft defenses) ID#229141:
I'm sure Klintin, Hillary, Eleanor Mondale, Carville, Begala, Albright, and Cohen have accounted for this in their strategy for NATO air strikes.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:03
Charleston Gold Bug (GC8Z) ID#344389:
Dec gold closed @ 303

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 16:03
PrivateInvestor (Moa) ID#227444:

not only Jap. repatriation but George Soros & Co. went short the $ last night in a big way & covered this am...that is the reason you saw the dollar slammed...he gonna play a little whoop ass on thinly traded plays

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 15:57
Earl (XAU) ID#227238:
The XAU seems to have cleared every downsloping line I could draw on a chart. Even a 30 month ma will be cleared at XAU over 90. In short, it's looking more positive than it has in a couple of years. ... Having the dollar index down 2 full points didn't hurt any either.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 15:55
Boardreader (George, MM: It goes both ways over there!) ID#20767:

MEMO ON THE MARGIN
October 6, 1998
Pat Buchanan at His Best: On Kosovo

http://www.polyconomics.com/


George: Sorry about your Rangy.

MM: Its interesting how the Brits are always around when there's trouble, isn't it. Of 31 high level terrorist organizations listed by the CIA, 21 have offices in London!

Bob in DC

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 15:51
EJ (Gollum) ID#45173:
Earlier today you posted a list of Greenspan notes. Thanks. One of them was:

08:28 GREENSPAN SAYS HIGH EARNINGS EXPECTATIONS UNBELIEVABLE.

It's a great quotation but can't find a story that contains this anywhere.

I don't know about you but I, for one, feel VERY confident that Rubin, Clinton, and Greenspan have this thing COMPLETELY under control.

-EJ

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 15:41
Hut (Cowgirl) ID#347235:
Some of the Fidelity Select Funds can be purchased by the hour. I know the precious metals fund can be done this way. Good luck!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 15:27
MM (Russia supplied Serbs with advance missiles) ID#350179:
http://www.foxnews.com/js_index.sml?content=/news/international/1007/i_ap_1007_85.sml

Quoting unidentified senior defense officials in London, The Times said the Serbs have acquired new air defense systems that had to be taken very seriously.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 15:25
Gold Fevor (It's that time!) ID#432137:
What are you guys waiting for?
Get out of those class C stocks.
Buy the top gold stocks and make lots of money.
These lowball stocks will bust.
Good luck.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 15:18
Gold Fevor (It's that time!) ID#432137:
What are you guys waiting for?
Get out of those class C stocks.
Buy the top gold stocks and make lots of money.
These lowball stocks will bust.
Good luck.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 15:11
Gollum (Volatility) ID#43185:
Well, I think we've come to the place where we get to see some volatility with a capital vee.

Yew call THET volatility? Thet's not volatility, now ther's some REAL volatility.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 15:10
Allen(USA) (Ditto Yen Shorts crushed) ID#257351:

We have entered another universe, gentlepersons. The 'owners' have decided to name the tune and it isn't God Bless America. Japanese have decided to destroy what was ruining them, namely those who fled the Yen. It may well take down half the world, but they will own the other half.

The volatility is killing everyone in derivatives .. at least the half this goes against. Notice this move comes just after the unsuccessful G7 mtgs.

Its a new pair-a-dimes. Got gold? Got cash?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 15:07
George (Prometheus..Nato) ID#433172:
Either NATO strikes soon, very soon, or we will have to hang our head. A lot of helpless people are being trashed by the Serbs. If it was my decision I'd knock them iunto next week, to hell with the crumby Russians ( Oris & co excepted ) . When you get into a fight it's not so much what you think of the other guy, it's what you think of yourself that gets you in. Like there is some shite I will not eat.

Sold Rangy this morning....now it goes up..So where is the bigger fool in Canada Somebody wake up the fool killer while I selp?


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 15:01
Auric (Brazil Stocks Off 4%) ID#240288:

http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=^BVSP&d=1d

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:52
lenaxe (Does anyone have the close ) ID#263184:
for December gold?
Thanks

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:49
moa (Sheeple are in the stocks and pens (bonds)....) ID#269128:
big fat pigs ( hedge funds )
are up to the knees in derivatives shite...

time to crank up the band
for that fat lady's final number.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:49
THE GOLDEN PROPHET (FRANK CUZIO ON CNBC SAYS) ID#372262:
SELL DISNEY NOW!!!!!! SELL, EB!!! SELL!!!! .........NOW!!!! Uh huh!
In fact SELL EVERYTHING 'cept GOLD!!!! Uh huh!!!! Away to watch the dollar-denominated carnage!!!!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:49
Obsidian (Suspicious @ Your 13:37) ID#237299:
Why will there be a large margin call tomorrow? What in particular about tomorow were you refrencing?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:48
THE GOLDEN PROPHET (FRANK CUZIO ON CNBC SAYS) ID#372262:
SELL DISNEY NOW!!!!!! SELL, EB!!! SELL!!!! .........NOW!!!! Uh huh!
In fact sell everything 'cept GOLD!!!! Uh huh!!!! Away to watch the dollar-denominated carnage!!!!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:47
Cage Rattler ($/JPY biggest loss in 25 yrs) ID#33184:


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:47
Cyclist (Plat) ID#26467:
FWIW Plat is roaring,holding for 450.Oil is going to be next.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:46
Cowgirl (Mike...Mutual Fund prices seem to be only figured once a day at the market) ID#34191:
close. Your decision to buy or sell is made blind based on the price tonight. We are into the BEARX and BGEIX funds and recently added to those positions. The annualized return on the 10/2 Prudent Bear purchase posted at about 75,000% yesterday! Irrelevant I know, but fun just the same. I added to the AmCent Global Gold fund and BEARX the other day because GOLD had dropped that day and the DOW was up, but alas both funds were up that night anyway. Sigh...... I'm not complaining.
GO GOLD! Got gold, guns, generator, grub, and cash.

Cowgirl

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:45
clone (Plants Can Remove Gold From Ore) ID#267344:
Filed at 2:00 p.m. EDT By The Associated Press

Scientists have found a way to make plants soak up gold from ore, suggesting a new way of mining the precious metal.

This approach, called phytomining, has been demonstrated before for recovering nickel. Scientists have also studied plants for removing pollutants like lead from soil; just last month, researchers said hybrid poplar trees might be useful for soaking up mercury.

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/a/AP-Golden-Plants.html

-c

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:44
Boardreader (The Yen .......) ID#20767:

is now 119.30 .......

STUDIO.R we need some music for the colapso

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:43
Cage Rattler (Bye bye dollar --- $/yen = 119.00 !!!!!) ID#33184:


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:43
Oro (Japanese repatriation - why gold is so slow) ID#71231:
Note the change in the bond - stock behavior. The bond is not going down when the stock market is up and vice-versa. It is going down in a straight line. The same direction as the stock market.

Why? Japanese repatriation and yen short calls are the main cause. The yen carry is unwinding. The net flow out of the US has become an avalanche. Though foreigners want to buy gold, but are worried of loosing 1/2% or more on the transaction during the transition through the dollar, to make the purchases.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:34
MtHighNC (Gold moving up strongly/Dec. 303.00) ID#347239:
.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:13
2BR02B? (J. Disney) ID#266105:

Sir 2bro2b..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Maybe this was for Studio.R, not I. Still got some Rangy
though.

Then there's the one about an NFL placekicker setting a
new field goal distance record high on LSD way back when.
'It just flew.'

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:13
Lou Paquette (@moa thanks - of course, I shouldn't expect gold to react in lock-step minute by minute.... ) ID#320200:
Darn, I was hoping placer dome would fall back to $13 again so I could reload my position, doesn't look like that's in the cards.....

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:11
JTF (LTCB trades getting pummeled today) ID#254321:
All: Just think about what today's events mean for LTCB! Big time trouble for their new owners.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:10
moa (Watch these derivative BLOW!!!!) ID#269128:
This is the final thrashing of an unstable system ripping itself to pieces....

oh the best laid plans of mice and men.....

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:07
Cage Rattler (New attack on the dollar happening ... $/yen = 121.27) ID#33184:


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:06
moa (lou...there is a little lag in the system.) ID#269128:
but yes GOLD will FOLLOW YEN....expect huge jump up in gold as Gold carry unwinds...real soon...this is the red flag....get on board.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:03
Lou Paquette (Forgive me if this has already been addressed - but with the US$ off as much as 51/2% ) ID#320200:
today against the Yen - should gold not have reacted more?

Off topic - the site is working much faster than usual today nice to see, has anyone else noticed or did I just get a faster connection today?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 14:02
Cage Rattler (@moa: overnight percentage only +/- 9%) ID#33184:
Current $/yen = 122.55 ... testing year's low right NOW !!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:59
Frustrated (Suspicious...and Mike K...) ID#298259:
Suspicious - I will remain Frustrated until gold hits $340 - got into this market way too early. But every little bit helps.

Mike K - intraday quotes on Fidelity funds available at the Fidelity Website. You must have a Fidelity account to get the real time quotes.

https://scs11.fidelity.com/realtime/accounts.shtml

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:58
moa (Yahoo has Yen dollar at 122....) ID#269128:
could this be correct?

Far out! this is out of control!
15-20% swings in major currency overnight...someone is getting slaughtered.
Yen carry unwinding....methinks yes.

Next play gold carry unwind....expect the same...10-20% rise in gold next week.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:56
HighRise (Another Kind of Margin Call!) ID#401460:

Coming soon to your neighborhood, in a shopping center parking lot near you - BMWs on sale........CHEAP!

HighRise


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:51
LSteve (Somewhat interesting) ID#316256:
British take on us. http://www.sightings.com/political/deathtonwo.htm

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:49
HighRise (Suspicious) ID#401460:
Copyright © 1998 HighRise/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

Margin Calls already happening big time. You are right though, as the markets approach these new critical low levels, like DOW 7500, there has to be an incredible margin call that will be heard around the world....unfortunately no one will know about it, because of the recent news blackout over the last few months, and more will be hurt then need be.

I think it will continue to be a silent crash. They are controlling the media reports. We use to see people in the streets of Indonesia, not any more. We here about the market drops but not about the pain of the masses.

The only thing we have to fear is fear itself it is all in the perception of the public. All is well!

Later off to work, just wanted to take advantage of this posting window at Kitco, doesn't happen to often these days. Kitco gets more than two posters and it shuts down.

HighRise

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:49
2BR02B? (which walnut shell is the pea under) ID#266105:

Ok, so the Japanese banks repatriate capital from their
overseas subsidiaries to meet Oct. 15 reserve reporting requirements,
triggering a bunch of other stuff caught on the wrong side of
the dollar/yen. My question, what shape are the overseas
subsidiaries presently in if currently audited after repatriating
all that capital. I guess that's a different reporting date
in which the pea gets shifted back.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:42
Cage Rattler (Re: oil inventories) ID#33184:
The last time oil inventories peaked last this was just before the gulf war in 1990 ... prices rose a 'little' ...

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:41
THE GOLDEN PROPHET (GOLD ABOUT TO SMACK EB AND HIS ILK) ID#372262:
AROUND THE COURSE! Uh huh!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:39
Mike K (Frustrated) ID#153283:
Where do you get intra-day reports on mutual funds?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:37
THE GOLDEN PROPHET (IN YOUR DREAMS, EB!!) ID#372262:
Is this the same yahoo who told us all to buy Disney at 35? Uh..huh! You be one funny dude, EB! Ha ha! And one hell of a trader! U wish!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:37
Suspicious (Folks: There's gona be a serious amount of margin calls) ID#285121:
that must be satisfied by the end of trade tomorrow. I'm ( Suspicious ) that lack of liquidity will cause some serious selling in the pm tomorrow.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:36
JTF (Kitco slow today -- Judical Watch manuscript in Congressional Record) ID#254321:
Copyright © 1998 JTF/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
All: Just in case you didn't know -- all the really criminal stuff about WJC just went into the Congressional Record via the Judical Watch report. Now -- proving WJC involvment is another matter, but at least Congressional members can look at the report.

http://www.WorldNetDaily.com/exclusiv/981007_committee_accepts_j.html

Wow -- US dollar down 1.50 today! How much more upward pressure on gold can we get? We may have deflation as JP so eloquently points out, but since we are net debtors ( unlike Japan ) , if the markets head south, so does the US dollar. So far -- the last few weeks anyway, the inflationary effect of a dropping dollar ( and rising commodities ) seem to be dominating the deflationary effects. We will probably have a tug of war between commodity price/dollar-generated inflation, and deflation. Perhaps the deflation part is longer term.

Now -- just how much more can the US dollar drop before investors get nervous, and interest rates begin to rise? The US dollar has dropped 10% in the last month or so, and 30 year rates are still dropping.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:35
HighRise (Rotation Into Gold Mining Stocks) ID#401460:

XAU up 3+
Even RANGY is moving!

Dollar down big time 10 yen in two days!

Nasdaq is down -22.55 S&P down -4.62
Look out below!

HighRise

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:34
Monkee Person (@Highhopes) ID#350199:
Copyright © 1998 Monkee Person/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
The U.S. equities markets coming out of La La Land will not crash our economy and nation. It may, however, feel that way to some as their wealth ( easy money ) is being eradicated.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

As I see it

I think that for the last five years, investors have been able to get away with ignorance toward world events and how they are inter-linked. Basically, if you have knowledge of history, you have been penalized. But if you have believed in nonsense like stock splits, you have been rewarded. Information has not been useful and thinking has been a waste of time.

From Market Rap with Bill Fleckenstein, September 28th

------------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:33
Suspicious (I'd rather be Suspicious than Frustrated :) ) ID#285121:
Frustrated, if you are an investor in that fund your surely not frustrated today.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:31
MM (Pakistan's army chief resigns) ID#350179:
http://www.foxnews.com/js_index.sml?content=/news/international/1007/i_ap_1007_67.sml

His call for a National Security Council was seen by the opposition as a final warning to Sharif's government and a harbinger of possible military rule.

In Pakistan, the army has ruled for 25 of the past 51 years.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:25
Frustrated (Fidelity's gold funds...) ID#298259:
Money moving in? FSAGX up 4.47%...FDPMX up 4.62% as of 1pm price.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:25
strat (oil update from noesis) ID#93241:
Copyright © 1998 strat/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
The brakes are on! Crude oil input to refineries
dropped about 1 million bpd to 13.95, which is 88.5% of
capacity. Imports continued the decline dropping
almost 1 million bpd over the week ( from 9.1 to 8.2 ) ,
for a four week moving average of 8.36 million bpd. Meanwhile,
inventories continued to rise - from 319.5 to 322.2
million barrels, which is an indication that the
slowdown and reduction in imports was not quite enough
to match the overall reduction in demand.

We must have reached maximum capacity to store
distillate since inventories held constant. -- Check
the full report on Monday at the NOESIS web site.
http://www.oil-gasoline.com --George


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:23
chas (Arden re mozel reference on Jap sales) ID#147201:
Excellent call. The talking heads on CNNfn are way wide of the mark. The only simple answer is yours. Japs are selling into strength. Thanx for the notification, Charlie

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:20
John Disney (Do you remember the story ..) ID#24135:
about when Broadway Joe Namath was asked whether he
played better on grass or on astroturf ... and he said.
Ah cant say .. never smoked astroturf .

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:17
Delphi (Russia) ID#258142:
Copyright © 1998 Delphi/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
According to Kremlin officials, about 10 million people participated in today’s protest meetings and demonstrations. Trade unions claim more then 25. They don’t get it. Only 10 million people…. How many will go out, to the street now to support Yeltsin? Regime is bankrupt. No wonder -it’s a thief’s regime. In 70s it was the second world economy. A few people privatize it. It does not really matter, that it’s less then 50% left - still a lot of money. Actual question: how about help from IMF? Continue ( to avoid social unrest ) or to stop for a while? Reality: part of IMF and other international loans go now to cover outstanding interest payments ( to the same borrowers ) , the rest is being stolen. Who in his clear mind will expect that people, who are responsible for all this will stay much longer in their chairs? They don’t. They simply steal more. Does Russia or IMF need to go on with these loans? No, both not. And people on the street - well, let’s hope it will not be too tough - as one Russian writer said - there is nothing more scary and nonsense thing, then Russian revolt

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:17
MM (Prometheus) ID#350179:
Don't forget about Belarus pledging military aid to the serbs...

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:08
John Disney (ADR .. me no ADRs) ID#24135:
Sir 2bro2b..

No clue .. However ADR or DAR .. a breakup would
involve issuing script that may not be listed or
registered in the US .. Im pretty sure that is a
NoNo.. Check with your friendly broker .. who I predict
will not have the foggiest idea.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:07
Prometheus (Any thoughts on NATO?) ID#210235:
Copyright © 1998 Prometheus/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I'm scratching my head trying to figure what's coming from this game of chicken being played by Russia over the NATO air strikes. Back during the Bosnian crisis, the UN Security Council approved and legitimized the air strikes. But Russia has repeated its determination that it will veto such strikes now to knock the Serbs back in Kosovo. We seem to have Clinton and Yeltsin going at it head-to-head. 5 NATO members are unwilling to approve these strikes if they are clear violation of UN law. hmmmmmmm

Holbrooke called it Brinksmanship by Milosovich, who is defiant and apparently quite comfortable in his position. The Russians sure could use a nice diversion right about now.

My big question here is how long can these sabers rattle before one strikes? And are the players still motivated to contain it?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:06
Dave in CO (@No, more like dreading) ID#229141:
Highhopes ( Wishing for bad things to happen. Is it productive? )
ID#404410:

EVERYBODY'S got cash, gold, guns , ammo., and food stocks. What bearishness! I'd rather PRAY for good things to happen. Why wish for our economy and nation to crash. Doesn't make sense. Anything for a buck!
Highhopes

Were you one of the many wishing for the stock market to rise to the most overvalued levels in history?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:05
Spud Master (Phone call to the President from Greenspan & Rubin..) ID#28586:
Mr. President ... hell Bill, the PPT can't hold this back any more. It' s time to issue the E.O. and start gold confiscation.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:05
EB (crystall ball dude.....and pulling slats fromunda...(and that ain't no cheese)...) ID#187109:
-
it was I...... ( tee-hee ) ......who bought the breakout............liquidated already....................... ( tee-hee ) .................650± ticks.............. ( in two days!! ) ..... ( $$$ ) .... ( ! ) ...git out yer calkeelator and slide rule................ ( and multiply times $12.50/tick ) ........................PER contract............I had a few.........hedged w/ puts............ ( you like apples )

Now........ya gotta ask yerself 'bout somethin'....................goes like this..............

Who cares about gold now............ ( ? ) .....! But, now ya gotta axe yerself 'dis one..............How will 'dis affect POG

...I wonder.......... ( is it boooooolish ) ......... ( ? )

away...¡ohmy!...

ÉßeCha-Ching$

I'm gonna go smack the ball around..............I kinda feel an extra kick in my swing 2day...........uh huh.

oh yeah....... ( gotta yippee ) .......

YIIIIIIIIIPPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!$$$

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:04
NTEOTWAWKI (@HIGHHOPES) ID#389387:
Copyright © 1998 NTEOTWAWKI/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
You jump into your fiat-currency burning hot air balloon and launch stratospherically.
The O2 deprivation places you in an extended state of euphoria.
You conveniently ignore 9.8 meters per second squared gravitational constant.
An urgent UHF flash traffic comes blaring on your two-way.
“Increase your allocation of large numbered proton-neutron atoms ( Pt, Au, Ag, Pb ) vs. ( H & He ) … Extreme updrafts and wind shear approaching… Reduce altitude”
Do you ignore the message entirely? Do you heed the message and not radio the other balloons? Do you heed the message and tell your friends?
I opt for the latter.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:04
kitkat (Swan Dive or Rocket Ahead?) ID#208392:
Gold steps up to the platform, hitches up its shorts and...
Is everybody else here holding their breath also? Switching to short text mode mode to help keep Kitco alive.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:00
mozel (@Where Is Absolute Truth @chas) ID#153110:
The ideal of Absolute Truth is in the neighborhood of right and wrong. As in it is wrong to speak a lie knowingly. Plain, if imperfect, Truth exists among truth tellers.
There is no truth in the places where men deny it.

@chas Arden was my source.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 13:00
LSteve (Highhopes) ID#316256:
Copyright © 1998 LSteve/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
With more than a year till the Y2K thingy hits I'm relatively surprised at how well prepared people are getting ( at least in my peer group, i.e. engineers and computer science types ) . Went on a canoe trip two weeks ago and all night long around the camp fire everyone talked about the precautions people are taking. Got quite a few good ideas. Still quite a bit of time left to get ready. So now I'm thinking alright we boosted the economy by buying guns, ammo, accessories, food, food storage material, gernerators, fuel, oil, etc. Enter the NWO, they take a look at all these folks who are ready. They say to themselves, let that sleeping dog lay. In the end we got ready to face our fear, and the threat never really materializes. So eventually the excess food gets donated to the needy, and the high dollar guns get sold. Had an argument with a German girl once. She thought it was wrong for the U.S. to build up its military. I argued that every time Germany built up their military they got in a war. Every time the U.S. disarmed we got in a war.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 12:57
EJ (Highhopes ) ID#45173:
Maybe you're right. Do you have a logical explanation why bearishness at the top of a bear market in the traditional crash month probably means the market will not go down? The contrarian in me likes the idea.
-EJ

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 12:48
Prometheus (@Studio.r) ID#210235:
You get to listen to Benny Garcia and we have to read this d#%@ world news and think about investments? Not fair ATALL.

I am in the fortunate position of being able to put on his CD, so at least I'm not fuming jealous. My regards to the master.

http://www.onaxis.com/cope/seecds.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 12:34
Highhopes (Wishing for bad things to happen. Is it productive?) ID#404410:
EVERYBODY'S got cash, gold, guns , ammo., and food stocks. What bearishness! I'd rather PRAY for good things to happen. Why wish for our economy and nation to crash. Doesn't make sense. Anything for a buck!
Highhopes

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 12:27
chas (mozel re Jap yen) ID#147201:
The dumb heads at CNNfn don't have it yet!!!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 12:27
Highhopes (MOST publicized October bear market I've seen. Odds are it wouldn't happen!) ID#404410:
.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 12:15
Cyclist (Plat) ID#26467:
FWIW Plat/gold spread is positive and should widen until
third week of this month.Money in the bank spread Wheat/corn
is starting to reach the 1.00 target from .46.
Gold should peak next week when the general market gets slammed.
Have a nice day.
John Disney ,delighted with Rangy's production.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 12:14
Cyclist (Plat) ID#26467:
FWIW Plat/gold spread is positive and should widen until
third week of this month.Money in the bank spread Wheat/corn
is starting to reach the 1.00 target from .46.
Gold should peak next week when the general market gets slammed.
Have a nice day.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 12:14
Cyclist (Plat) ID#26467:
FWIW Plat/gold spread is positive and should widen until
third week of this month.Money in the bank spread Wheat/corn
is starting to reach the 1.00 target from .46.
Gold should peak next week when the general market gets slammed.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 12:09
Will (Oh Yeah Sure Japans Healthy Now......) ID#240248:
Copyright © 1998 Will/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Back in Dec 96 I was holding a bunch of Bear Stearns Yen Put Warrants. The Yen did one of its occasional short term reversals and my broker called me telling me now was the time to get out. I asked him what basic fundamental change had occured in Japan that would encourage me to believe that the bottom was in for the yen. No answer. I held them until about two months before expiration and made a fairly spectacular gain.

On Monday the Japanese Government warned that their biggest 19 Banks may be at or below the minimum reserve levels to trade internationally ( 8% ) and some of them may even be below Japanese reserve levels ( 4% ) .

What fundamental change has occured in Japan since Monday? Nothing. My cronies and I believe Japans total bad debt picture exceeds 1.5 times their GDP.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 11:53
STUDIO.R (@LOrd D.............) ID#119358:
Your ADR caution on rangitO prompted me to dig out my buy confirmation slips. None of the rangy confirmation slips mention ADR on them, however, my Harmony and Durban slips all do....would you happen to know why? TIA. studio.sportsfan

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 11:52
George (Polarbear-Sharefin) ID#433172:
Polarbear- Well I'd like to see it your way and I've been reading your posts here and at SSi. I've got some bucks parked on Rangy too which is why I watch it. Watch it where, at .68 the last time I looked and where will it sleep to-nite?

I liked your last post, Orwell was imortant to me,still is. I'm in conformance with your profile of y2k readiness I think. Just one thing, where do you find absolute truth?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 11:46
Boardreader (Japan's Hatakeyama--appropriate dollar/yen level 110) ID#20767:

http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/981007/ti.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 11:28
John Disney (rangy rangy rangy) ID#24135:
Copyright © 1998 John Disney/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
for polarbear ..
Bidness day reports that Randgold Resources increased
gold production by 33% in the september quarter ( 41000 oz ) .
A higher grade was also obtained ( 4.12 Gm/ton up from
3.6 ) . I also spoke on phone to man in RRS who said all
was going well and phase 2 complete end of Sepetember.
Also Rangold will issue NAV September 29 .. we will
see who is closest .. checked figures I gave you
last night .. they were OK.
Bought some CAM today which also at discount to NAV
and owns lots of Rangy .. ie thats a discount times a
discount. It looks a lot better on a chart than does
rangy ( for the moment ) .

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 11:25
MoReGoLd (@CAMBIOR: Maxed out on selling Forward.........) ID#348286:
Copyright © 1998 MoReGoLd/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
OCTOBER 7, 1998
Cambior Reports Third Quarter Gold Hedging Program and Debt Position

MONTREAL, QUEBEC--Cambior Inc. reports that the active management of the gold hedging program continues to protect revenues against the negative impact of the weak gold market. The gold hedging program generated an average realized price of approximately $360 per ounce for the third quarter of 1998, a premium of $71 over the average market price of $289 per ounce. For the first nine months of 1998, the hedging program generated an estimated average realized price of approximately $405 per ounce for a premium of $111 over the average market price of $294 per ounce. In addition, as of end of the third quarter of 1998, Cambior has in place a hedging program with a net position of 1.2 million ounces at an average price of $351 per ounce for the next four years ensuring a minimum average realized price of $350 per ounce for its expected gold production in the fourth quarter of 1998. This hedging program will be achieved with the benefit of the hedge positions on the forward sale of gold production and the amortization of deferred gains generated by the conversion of gold loans to dollar loans. The program also covers 100 percent of the 1999 gold exposure at $348 per ounce and 76 percent of the 2000 exposure at $344 per ounce.



September 30,

1998 1998 1999 2000 2001 Total -------------------------------------------------------------- Forward position


( 000 ounces of gold ) 152 603 472 19 1,246
Average price ( $/oz ) 327 319 314 321 318
Deferred gain ( $/oz ) 23 29 30 35 33
--------------------------------------------------------------
Average price ( $/oz ) 350 348 344 356 351



Gold exposure

coverage ( percent ) 100 100 76 3 --------------------------------------------------------------



During the third quarter, Cambior took advantage of weak gold prices to buy back the gold loan outstanding, thereby generating a gain of $18 million and a corresponding reduction of its debt. This gain will be amortized over the next three years. As of September 30, 1998, Cambior has a balance of deferred gains of $41 million, which are scheduled to be amortized over the next three years.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 11:21
Cage Rattler (@ BART - Compressing images) ID#33184:
You can use the URL below to compress graphic files - it may make the loading of pages faster. you can use the demonstration feature and save one of the reduced images.

http://useast.gifwizard.com/PGW?task=formurl

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 11:14
ravenfire (boy, kitco is slow tonight!) ID#333126:
bonds down, dow rally seems unsustainable ( but this *may* be premature ) , Nasdaq looks absolutely anaemic

internet stocks getting hammered

US$ ... ahem ... if you haven't already noticed ... well.

US$/Yen=123.8 -- oops ... 123.4

gold still up.


say hello to the Tokyo roulette table :- )

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 11:11
ravenfire (boy, kitco is slow tonight!) ID#333126:
bonds down, dow rally seems unsustainable ( but this *may* be premature ) , Nasdaq looks absolutely anaemic

internet stocks getting hammered

US$ ... ahem ... if you haven't already noticed ... well.

US$/Yen=123.8 -- oops ... 123.4

gold still up.


say hello to the Tokyo roulette table :- )

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 11:02
chas (mozel your 4:50 and 3:47) ID#147201:
So far, you are the only source of the true rate reactions. Japs are dumping and none of the BIG heads on CNNfn have caught it. They are submerged in the usual Wall St. doodoo. I really enjoyed your characterization of the NWO here at 3:47. Same goes for corn trapped posums and hogs. Thanx for the truth and humor, Charlie

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 10:28
POLARBEAR (My Daily RANGY responses...you guys are killing me.... :) ..) ID#183109:
Copyright © 1998 POLARBEAR/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
GEORGE: Did you miss by post to you a while back about your infliction with the VANCOUVER PENNY VIRUS? This delusion you have about someone dumping cheap rangy shares is TOTALLY unfounded. You need to study the facts…please! Rangy has never traded for pennies, so how would one acquire these penny shares you continue to refer to? Check the charts, read the articles. There’s hundreds of them on the rangy website. There are certainly many sellers and many buyers….thus the increased volume. My bet is that the sellers will soon realize they’ve been making a BIG mistake, and the current holders, myself included, aren’t going to even CONSIDER selling any shares until it approaches $2. It could also be a very short trip once we get over $1.


TSCLAW @ “where is all the rumor coming from that they maybe merged into another company. Is that just one of their possibilities?” http://www.geocities.com/~polarbear47/rangyfuture.htm


JOHN DISNEY @ DELISTIING:

QUOTE #1
The group is rethinking its future and all opportunities are being evaluated with the primary objective being the unlocking of the discount to net asset value at which the Randgold shares trade. THIS IS CERTAINLY GEARED TOWARD INCREASING SHAREHOLDER WEALTH. IF IT WILL HURT THOUSANDS OF U.S. INVESTORS, IT SIMPLY WON’T BE DONE…IMO

John, you certainly bring up a very valid concern worth weighing, but I’m personally betting that this is highly unlikely. For added safety, minus the hassle, the JSE could be a good move—everyone needs to make their own decision on this I guess. In my own eyes, the risk is low, but like most other people, I only have two eyes as well.

QUOTE #2:
“Kebble ( JR ) said a deal to include Randgold Resources in the JCI Gold structure was not on the table.”

As I posted on S.I, this is the best news I’ve heard all year. As junior has said, the key is to give shareholders choices, and by keeping companies separate where feasible, this is accomplished.

I certainly would not claim to be an expert in all the intricacies of the S.A. mining scene, but that said, here’s a quick thought. Both Father and Son Kebble know the incredible value of RANDOLD RESOURCES. So we have Junior knowing how valuable Randgold Resources is, and he wants it. Dad says no way, this one is my baby! Junior says fine….I didn’t really want it anyway ( ya right! ) Ha ha ha you ain’t getting’ it!

QUOTE #3
Case in point--JR Kebble is quoted this past February with the following:

“Kebble junior notes that with CAM owning 29% of Randgold, the two are perfect partners. HE IS PARTICULARLY IMPRESSED WITH RANDGOLD RESOURCES.”

QUOTE #4
( December ) “AT PRESENT THE COMPANY IS LOOKING AT THE POSSIBILITY OF EITHER LISTING THE [MINERAL RIGHTS] ASSETS IN A STAND ALONE CASH SHELL OR SELLING THEM TO ONE OF THREE INTERNATIONALLY-LISTED RESOURCE COMPANIES WHICH HAVE EXPRESSED AN INTEREST”

It seems to me they wanted to stress “INTERNATIONALLY-LISTED” which of course demands a listing outside of the JSE, and with a significant percentage of RANDGOLD being owned by investors outside of JSE, I think it safe to assume that a U.S. Exchange is a necessity with any deal that RANDGOLD Management puts together. Judging by Mr. Kebble’s current tour schedule, he is placing a significant emphasis on U.S. Exposure.

Mr. Kebble is a very smart man…just THINK of the repercussions he, Durban, and all S.A. mining shares in general would suffer if they left RANDGOLD shareholders out to dry….I just can’t--in my wildest dreams-- fathom this ever happening. In fact, we could very well see Durban merging with Randgold, and we’d all live happily ever after : ) At any rate, on the 9th of October, this concern will be presented, along with all the questions we’ve come up with, to Mr. Kebble while he is in San Francisco.

QUOTE #5
“Randgold [and Exploration] is currently structured in such a way that its regular income is sufficient to cover its costs. All its resources are, however, essentially at the disposal of [Randgold] Resources … to ensure long-term future and growth. Resources [has] a strong position, with a clear strategy of developing a number of cost-effective opencast mines in Africa, and the necessary funds to finance the implementation of this strategy over the next two to three years.”

This suggests to me that we may very well continue to see the same RANDGOLD with the same stated business plans, simply realizing investment assets when they consider it beneficial to do so ( when the price is right ) with the proceeds continuing to expand and develop Randgold Resources. There is little chance in my mind that the name RANDGOLD will be leaving the mining scene in the forseeable future. This stock is going to be a major player in international gold mining. R.Resources is the ultimate reason I own so much of RANGY.



GRAND FINALLE QUOTE: FROM OUR BELOVED LEADER, MR. ROGER KEBBLE. ( Apr/May 98 )

Looking ahead then, the most important step for our company still remains the final commissioning of the Syama expansion programme of which the first phase or Syama I is currently being commissioned - the first results of which will be experienced in the next quarter and specifically the month of June.

I am confident that we will then be able to show a steady improvement up to our full production rate of 270 000 ozs by the last quarter of this calender year.
This is expected to increase further with the commissioning of the oxide heap leach next year.

Our future production potential is further underpinned by the Morila project.
We have recently updated our medium term business plan in which we have made provision for :
- completing Syama,
- tightly focused exploration expenditure,
- developing Loulo and Morila on a combination of our own cash and project finance,
- bringing a further, not yet identified, project into development.
Towards financing our share of these activities, we have;
- the IFC loan for Syama in place,
- the balance of the facility from our parent,
- the proceeds from a proposed rights offer of $ 35 million in November this year in which the parent’s $ 20 million loan is converted and our other shareholders invited to participate.
We will continue to focus our management team, on building a profitable production base which will ensure our position at the lowest end of the cost curve for the foreseeable future.
Our stated objective is to grow into a half a million-ounce producer with production costs in the lower quartile of the industry, within 5 years.

At this stage we have the management team which we plan to strengthen operationally, we have a focussed and proven strategy and WE MOST CERTAINLY HAVE THE ASSETS, CONSEQUENTLY I AM CONFIDENT WE ARE WELL ON TRACK TO MEET THIS OBJECTIVE.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 10:26
POLARBEAR (My Daily RANGY responses...you guys are killing me.... :) ..) ID#183109:
Copyright © 1998 POLARBEAR/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
GEORGE: Did you miss by post to you a while back about your infliction with the VANCOUVER PENNY VIRUS? This delusion you have about someone dumping cheap rangy shares is TOTALLY unfounded. You need to study the facts…please! Rangy has never traded for pennies, so how would one acquire these penny shares you continue to refer to? Check the charts, read the articles. There’s hundreds of them on the rangy website. There are certainly many sellers and many buyers….thus the increased volume. My bet is that the sellers will soon realize they’ve been making a BIG mistake, and the current holders, myself included, aren’t going to even CONSIDER selling any shares until it approaches $2. It could also be a very short trip once we get over $1.


TSCLAW @ “where is all the rumor coming from that they maybe merged into another company. Is that just one of their possibilities?” http://www.geocities.com/~polarbear47/rangyfuture.htm


JOHN DISNEY @ DELISTIING:

QUOTE #1
The group is rethinking its future and all opportunities are being evaluated with the primary objective being the unlocking of the discount to net asset value at which the Randgold shares trade. THIS IS CERTAINLY GEARED TOWARD INCREASING SHAREHOLDER WEALTH. IF IT WILL HURT THOUSANDS OF U.S. INVESTORS, IT SIMPLY WON’T BE DONE…IMO

John, you certainly bring up a very valid concern worth weighing, but I’m personally betting that this is highly unlikely. For added safety, minus the hassle, the JSE could be a good move—everyone needs to make their own decision on this I guess. In my own eyes, the risk is low, but like most other people, I only have two eyes as well.

QUOTE #2:
“Kebble ( JR ) said a deal to include Randgold Resources in the JCI Gold structure was not on the table.”

As I posted on S.I, this is the best news I’ve heard all year. As junior has said, the key is to give shareholders choices, and by keeping companies separate where feasible, this is accomplished.

I certainly would not claim to be an expert in all the intricacies of the S.A. mining scene, but that said, here’s a quick thought. Both Father and Son Kebble know the incredible value of RANDOLD RESOURCES. So we have Junior knowing how valuable Randgold Resources is, and he wants it. Dad says no way, this one is my baby! Junior says fine….I didn’t really want it anyway ( ya right! ) Ha ha ha you ain’t getting’ it!

QUOTE #3
Case in point--JR Kebble is quoted this past February with the following:

“Kebble junior notes that with CAM owning 29% of Randgold, the two are perfect partners. HE IS PARTICULARLY IMPRESSED WITH RANDGOLD RESOURCES.”

QUOTE #4
( December ) “AT PRESENT THE COMPANY IS LOOKING AT THE POSSIBILITY OF EITHER LISTING THE [MINERAL RIGHTS] ASSETS IN A STAND ALONE CASH SHELL OR SELLING THEM TO ONE OF THREE INTERNATIONALLY-LISTED RESOURCE COMPANIES WHICH HAVE EXPRESSED AN INTEREST”

It seems to me they wanted to stress “INTERNATIONALLY-LISTED” which of course demands a listing outside of the JSE, and with a significant percentage of RANDGOLD being owned by investors outside of JSE, I think it safe to assume that a U.S. Exchange is a necessity with any deal that RANDGOLD Management puts together. Judging by Mr. Kebble’s current tour schedule, he is placing a significant emphasis on U.S. Exposure.

Mr. Kebble is a very smart man…just THINK of the repercussions he, Durban, and all S.A. mining shares in general would suffer if they left RANDGOLD shareholders out to dry….I just can’t--in my wildest dreams-- fathom this ever happening. In fact, we could very well see Durban merging with Randgold, and we’d all live happily ever after : ) At any rate, on the 9th of October, this concern will be presented, along with all the questions we’ve come up with, to Mr. Kebble while he is in San Francisco.

QUOTE #5
“Randgold [and Exploration] is currently structured in such a way that its regular income is sufficient to cover its costs. All its resources are, however, essentially at the disposal of [Randgold] Resources … to ensure long-term future and growth. Resources [has] a strong position, with a clear strategy of developing a number of cost-effective opencast mines in Africa, and the necessary funds to finance the implementation of this strategy over the next two to three years.”

This suggests to me that we may very well continue to see the same RANDGOLD with the same stated business plans, simply realizing investment assets when they consider it beneficial to do so ( when the price is right ) with the proceeds continuing to expand and develop Randgold Resources. There is little chance in my mind that the name RANDGOLD will be leaving the mining scene in the forseeable future. This stock is going to be a major player in international gold mining. R.Resources is the ultimate reason I own so much of RANGY.



GRAND FINALLE QUOTE: FROM OUR BELOVED LEADER, MR. ROGER KEBBLE. ( Apr/May 98 )

Looking ahead then, the most important step for our company still remains the final commissioning of the Syama expansion programme of which the first phase or Syama I is currently being commissioned - the first results of which will be experienced in the next quarter and specifically the month of June.

I am confident that we will then be able to show a steady improvement up to our full production rate of 270 000 ozs by the last quarter of this calender year.
This is expected to increase further with the commissioning of the oxide heap leach next year.

Our future production potential is further underpinned by the Morila project.
We have recently updated our medium term business plan in which we have made provision for :
- completing Syama,
- tightly focused exploration expenditure,
- developing Loulo and Morila on a combination of our own cash and project finance,
- bringing a further, not yet identified, project into development.
Towards financing our share of these activities, we have;
- the IFC loan for Syama in place,
- the balance of the facility from our parent,
- the proceeds from a proposed rights offer of $ 35 million in November this year in which the parent’s $ 20 million loan is converted and our other shareholders invited to participate.
We will continue to focus our management team, on building a profitable production base which will ensure our position at the lowest end of the cost curve for the foreseeable future.
Our stated objective is to grow into a half a million-ounce producer with production costs in the lower quartile of the industry, within 5 years.

At this stage we have the management team which we plan to strengthen operationally, we have a focussed and proven strategy and WE MOST CERTAINLY HAVE THE ASSETS, CONSEQUENTLY I AM CONFIDENT WE ARE WELL ON TRACK TO MEET THIS OBJECTIVE.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 10:16
Crystal Ball (Ramping) ID#340392:
Had trouble with access to Kitco. Someone just ramped up the SPOOS in the last half hour. Who kicked the slats out from under the dollar? Good grief ! Gold's reaction is disappointing thus far. Could be the sign an internediate top is in for this gold rally. Dollar's gonna hafta snap back some time soon, and SPOOS look like a good rally is in the making.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 10:02
sharefin (Check out the premium - PREM) ID#284255:
-
http://www.quote.com/cgi-bin/jchart-form?genApplet=yes

What is Clinton on TV?
It just went from -2 to +15
A 17 point move.

PPT at work?

---------------------------

// Techniques of the Enemy //

( 1 ) Compromise of the truth and outright lies.

Truth partially revealed causes confusion and erroneous conclusions.
What passes as truth is often just spin intended to redirect
attention to the desired conclusion. At times, even pernicious lies
are promoted as truth. Unfortunately, when manufactured lies are
found out, the damage is usually already done. For an eye opening
view of how susceptible we are to spin rent the movie Wag the Dog.
[Not recommended for children.]

Sadly, our highest elected official, the President of the United
States, is a master at partial truth and outright lies. We are at the
height of hypocrisy in this nation exemplified by our twice-elected
leader, Bill Clinton. By his own words he should resign:

Yes, the president should resign. He has lied to the
American people, time and time again, and betrayed
their trust. Since he has admitted guilt, there is no
reason to put the American people through an impeachment...
He will serve absolutely no purpose in finishing out his
term, the only possible solution is for the president
to save some dignity and resign.

From 12th Congressional District Hopeful,
William Jefferson Clinton, during the Nixon investigations.

[Also see http://www.wildershow.com/clintononnixon.htm]

The Clinton Administration continues to be a complete failure on the
Y2k issue. How can we possibly trust Bill Clinton to lead this
country with integrity through what promises to be the greatest crisis
in American history? We are reaping the just rewards for our failure
to hold tight to the principles and precepts of the Founding Fathers
of this once great nation.

( 2 ) Pejorative Labels

The use of despicable labels to characterize an opponent is another
common technique used by propagandists. Lenin stated that an enemy
must always be described in terms that cause revulsion to the masses.
Terms like Hun, Wop, Jap, and Gook have been used in times of war to
dehumanize the enemy. The media uses this technique with terms like
racist, fascist, anti-Semitic, Nazi, right-wing extremist, bigot,
intolerant, hate-monger, etc. to achieve the same purpose.

Amazingly, nobody seemed a bit concerned Hillary Clinton's accusation
of a vast right-wing conspiracy out to get her husband. What an
outrageous comment! Clinton's worst enemy is his own behavior and his
own words ( see below ) . Bill Clinton cannot meet HIS OWN STANDARD,
much less that of the office he holds.

We are told to beware of the Y2k preparedness fanatics and
survivalists when the real threat is the uninformed masses who are
uninformed and unprepared. The so-called wackos and kooks who
are preparing for Y2k are a tiny minoriy, generally keep to themselves
( unlike intrusive government ) and are part of the solution, not part
of the problem.

If the White House devoted just a fraction of the time they invest in
inventing crisis and manufacturing spin to distract the populace from
their incompetence, a REAL crisis like Y2k might not have become such
a threat.

As the Y2k issue heats up, be wary of manipulative tactics from
government leaders who use pejorative labels to characterize those
who are preparing as unpatriotic or selfish.

( 3 ) Compromise of the language

A more insidious and subtle method of cultural destruction is the
sabotage of words. Human reason relies on words and their abstract
meanings. If semantics are sabotaged, our ability to reason is lost.
At one time the word patriot meant a man or woman who loved their
country and would willingly die for it. Today the spin-doctors have
changed the abstract meaning of patriot to the point where it now
conjures up the picture of a redneck, tobacco chewing, gun-toting
fanatic with a Y2k rural retreat and cache of ammo.

In his famous book 1984, George Orwell called this technique of
changing the meaning of words to suit a political objective,
Newspeak. It not only changes the meaning of the words, but their
grammatical structure, and leads to the Orwellian condition called
Double Think where a person holds two contradictory thoughts at the
same time and believes they are both true. In psychological terms
this is called cognitive dissonance. Double Think, or cognitive
dissonance, is the pathetic result of moral relativism and situational
ethics which deny the existence of absolute Truth.



Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 09:25
EJ (Steve in TO) ID#45173:
Thanks for the explanation. Much appreciated.
-EJ

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:57
EJ (Gollum: That AG sure has a way with words) ID#45173:
Earnings estimates 'unbelievable' says what everyone already knows, but coming from him, that's a biggy. Think he's looking to jawbone the market down a bit more?
-EJ

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:44
Steve in TO (EJ - Used to be what's good for the dollar . . . ) ID#209265:
Copyright © 1998 Steve in TO/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
is good for US equities. This still true?

The relationship is indirect and complicated. For the past few years, as foreigners looked at the risks in their own countries they decided to get money into a safe haven ( flight capital ) where they could make higher returns ( i.e. US rates of 6% vs. Japanese rates of 1.25% ) and profit from the US bull market in stocks ( as opposed to losing money in Japanese stocks. )

As foreigners puored their money into US investments, they were buying US dollars to do so, driving the dollar up and giving them windfall exchange profits. This produced a positive feedback effect where more foreigners were encouraged to invest in the US because exchange profits boosted their earnings- driving the dollar up still more . . and so on . . .

What the rise in the US$ did, though, was put US businesses in a very uncompetitive position. They just couldn't sell their stuff overseas with such a high exchange rate. What was happening before was simple asset inflation, but now that the dollar is trending down, the equity bulls see a return to profitability of US industry as imports decline and exports rise. Also, interest rate cuts always have a positive effect on the stock markets.

This will all change, though. Soon you'll see the dollar still trending down, and stocks heading back down too.

- Steve

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:30
Gollum (Greenspan) ID#43185:
-
08:28 GREENSPAN SAYS HIGH EARNINGS EXPECTATIONS UNBELIEVABLE.
08:26 GREENSPAN: US ECONOMY STILL GROWING, HASN'T COLLAPSED.
08:26 GREENSPAN: NO IMPACT YET ON REAL ECONOMY.
08:24 GREENSPAN: LABOR MARKETS STILL PUTTING PRESSURE ON WAGES.
08:23 GREENSPAN: US FAR SHORT OF CREDIT CRUNCH.
08:22 GREENSPAN: MARKETS CAN'T FUNCTION IN ENVIRONMENT OF FEAR.
08:18 GREENSPAN SAYS UNCERTAINTY AND FEAR ARE GROWING IN MARKETS.
08:17 GREENSPAN SAYS INVESTORS DEMANDING HIGHER ILLIQUDITY PREMIUM.
08:14 GREENSPAN: INVESTORS ALSO MOVING TO PROTECT LIQUIDITY.
08:11 GREENSPAN SAID MARKETS HAD BECOME TOO COMPLACENT ABOUT RISK.
08:11 GREENSPAN SAYS MARKET SHIFTING TO SHORT-TERM FINANCING.
08:10 GREENSPAN: JUNK BONDS HAVE DRIED UP.
08:10 GREENSPAN SAYS BANKS INCREASING COLLATERAL REQUIREMENTS.
08:08 GREENSPAN SAYS US ECONOMIC OUTLOOK HAS WEAKENED FOR 1999.
08:08 GREENSPAN SAYS JUNK-BOND SPREAD SHOWS SHIFT IN RISK-AVERSION.
08:07 GREENSPAN: WORLD ECONOMY IN UNUSUAL PHENOMENON.
08:04 US DOLLAR SKIDS MORE THAN 8 YEN TO 123.21.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:27
Cage Rattler () ID#33184:
Copyright © 1998 Cage Rattler/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
RANDGOLD chairman Roger Kebble says in the annual report that
adverse gold sentiment is changing, with commodities such as
metals and minerals attracting greater attention, and that it is
not unrealistic to expect a gold price rise to $340 an ounce
over the next 12 months.The challenge is prudent mine management
whIch can keep costs down to $280 an ounce, and to maintain
this level even though the gold price recovers. It would also
make sense, some time in the future, to exploit the synergies
between the JCI gold mines and RANDGOLD.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:26
Steve in TO (Rhody - perhaps lease rates are going down because . . . ) ID#209265:
Copyright © 1998 Steve in TO/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
the gold bears are getting cold feet. Even though gold got a little boost the week before last, it has been essentially going sideways for a couple of weeks, and you wouldn't think that would scare the bears, but I think there may be a sea change happening.

Shares of the well-managed gold producers ( not the explorers? ) have been steadily trending upward at the same time gold has risen only slightly. I think insiders know that something is coming down the pipeline, and they're accumulating. The bears may be getting the same readings and demand for leased gold is going down.

Steve Kaplan has been getting very positive indications from insider buying among the gold miners.

Alternatively, do you think the derivatives uncertainty is giving people cold feet about the carry trade?

- Steve

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:25
Steve in TO (Rhody - perhaps lease rates are going down because . . . ) ID#209265:
Copyright © 1998 Steve in TO/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
the gold bears are getting cold feet. Even though gold got a little boost the week before last, it has been essentially going sideways for a couple of weeks, and you wouldn't think that would scare the bears, but I think there may be a sea change happening.

Shares of the well-managed gold producers ( not the explorers? ) have been steadily trending upward at the same time gold has risen only slightly. I think insiders know that something is coming down the pipeline, and they're accumulating. The bears may be getting the same readings and demand for leased gold is going down.

Steve Kaplan has been getting very positive indications from insider buying among the gold miners.

Alternatively, do you think the derivatives uncertainty is giving people cold feet about the carry trade?

- Steve

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:24
DBog (WRONG AGAIN) ID#267298:
ALL: As of this a.m. ( 5:17 local time ) I am most pleased
to announce that I am absolutely WRONG again, I honestly
thought I would awake only to see GOLD down once again.

As of this posting our hope seems to be doing rather well.

GO GOLD and to ALL a fabulous day..................


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:22
Boardreader (The Yen ........) ID#20767:

has stabilized at .008121 ( 123.14 )

.... a trillion here, a trillion there, pretty soon .... hmmmmmmmm

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:13
Boardreader (The Yen ........) ID#20767:

seems to have stabilized at .008121 ( 123.14 )

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:10
Gollum (Action) ID#43185:
Globex up, bonds down, dollar down, metals up oil up

Japanese market up, Yen up. Japanese bills pass. Hedge fund unwinds some more.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:03
Gollum (Action) ID#43185:
Globex up, bonds down, dollar down, metals up oil up

Japanese market up, Yen up. Japanese bills pass. Hedge fund unwinds some more.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 08:01
Greenstone Gold (The Yen, the US$, GOLD, and last but not least the BIS......) ID#428218:


http://www.users.dircon.co.uk/~netking/finart1.htm

Perhaps this may explain todays rise in the YEN......

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:58
Cage Rattler (Possible reason for $/yen movement) ID#33184:
Bank of Japan loaning US Treasury holdings to banks at low rates if banks bring YEN home. Hayami says his weekend remarks re: capital levels were misinterpreted. Apparently Japanese banks were having trouble Monday and Tuesday with overseas banks. US bond market starting to correct panic runup of Monday

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:58
Tantalus (Japan considering bank bail out with public funds) ID#317211:
Copyright © 1998 Tantalus/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
LTCM bail out arranged by the fed. Clinton arguing to the Council on Foreign Relations for a New World Financial Order ( read if Hong Kong
can do this, we must also be able to ) . IMF bailing, but the ship is
still sinking.
I feel a very ominous door is being opened, and on the other side
lurks free enterprise socialism.
Take away the smoke and mirrors, and read runaway national debt and
surging taxes in the near future world wide to keep this pyramid scheme afloat.
Why wouldn't a 40 something boomer just cash out his 401k, take the penalty and tax hit now, and sink a healthy portion into gold?
If he/she waits til age 62, the gobmints will just take a bigger chunk
than they would now, and 401k portfolios don't include gold.

And it would be fully owned, in hand before year 2000.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:57
Greenstone Gold (Gollum (Ha Ha).........) ID#428218:

WHO IS BILL MURPHY........... the inventor of Murphy's Law no less....

Going up actually means going down.......

Turn left, means trun right.......

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:57
Cage Rattler ($/yen = 122.86; 10% devaluation over the last 2 days) ID#33184:


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:56
EJ (Dollar down, DOW up?) ID#45173:
Used to be what's good for the dollar is good for US equities. This still true?
-EJ

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:56
BillD (Man...the USD is in freefall....) ID#258427:
Didn't someone or ANOTHER have something to say about this Heh Heh

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:49
mozel (@Cellulose Fiction) ID#153110:
Competing internal and external and military branch intelligence agencies of the Mafia masquerading as governments of nations are seduced by the opportunities for profit from market manipulation which their spying reveals to them. But, a series of secret alliances among them and their commercial allies and clients goes awry and an elaborate leveraged house of cellulose or Paper Palace comes tumbling down due to a lack of competent Japanese Translators at a critical moment.

Will it sell ?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:45
Greenstone Gold (Ersel.........we broke that some time ago..............) ID#428218:

.......you Americans are lagging behind....


....pity about the Aussie Dollar, a bit of a paradox ?!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:41
Silverbaron (GCZ8 $302.5 !!) ID#288466:


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:41
Greenstone Gold (Donald, is the.....) ID#428218:

Dollar starting to chase it's tail...........never ending circle, with no solution, except a WAR or two .... now, where are the Balkans ?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:38
Ersel (Haggis...aye !) ID#230376:

Would be a bit more golden if we could break through $303.30 on the comex soon...APH R U out there ?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:37
MtHighNC (Comex night/Dec.$302.10) ID#348309:
x

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:36
MM (Not exactly on topic or is it?) ID#350195:
Hedge-fund operator irked at feds
http://www.denverpost.com/business/knox1006.htm

After all, the premise of hedge funds is that a few obviously wealthy, obviously sophisticated investors ought to be able to get together and invest their money as well or as stupidly as they want.

I don't like the feds involved in my business, Wroblewski says. I want them out of the picture.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:36
mozel (@Celsius) ID#153110:
Fahreneheit was invented because human beings can detect small increments of temperature change, but a generation of mindless, politically correct education and propaganda for metric has regressed us to the stupid opinion that weather reports in Celsius are more scientific. When, actually, they are just less useful.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:35
STUDIO.R (@gOld's up, i'm up........living life charmed.........) ID#119358:
Way off topic...but, just have to say........Benny Garcia, protege of Charlie Christian ( the First jazz guitarist ) ( and both OKC boys ) , is headed over here to the house this a.m. to pick and drool with ol' studio....ohmy!. what a privilege. Benny is featured on several Benny Goodman albums, Patsy Cline's guitarist, Bob Wills' guitarist, played with Ellington, Basey, etc..... May have to hit the record button in studioR and let the gold flow....wish ya'll were hereTOhear. GO GOLDBUGS!!! A-Train.....uhHuH.....

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:34
Greenstone Gold (John Disney (Pulp Fiction)........) ID#428218:

You surely are not suggesting that a Soweto neckless should be used... what a waste of rubber.....

Aye,

Haggis

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:33
MoReGoLd (@USD Down BIG) ID#348286:
Can $ up 1.5 cents. Aussi $ up 2.67 cents !

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:29
Greenstone Gold (Ersel............) ID#428218:

Here at Kookynie in Western Australia it's 28 deg C, the sun is shining, summer is on the way, and.........we are drilling holes and finding GOLD

Och aye the noooooooooooooooooo..................

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:28
John Disney (Pulp Fiction) ID#24135:
Copyright © 1998 John Disney/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Film script outline ..
The US is run by a power mad cowardly sex fiend ..
In parallel with this . A severe financial/currency
crisis occurs .. markets fall .. To save his putrid
skin US president sells all US gold holding to try
to make dollar and US market the only investment
choice .. Gold falls to 200 $... within weeks people
realize dollar and US financials are worthless junk ..
gold soars to $2000 .. President burned at stake
by masses of unemployed in Washington DC.

Nah .. too nutty a plot .. nobody would go for it..

For Mozel ..
Yes sir I pass on those brown snakes and butt biters.
I mean count me out !!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:28
MoReGoLd (@Gold Is Confirmed UP ) ID#348286:
Let's see what the Comex will do with it --- possible $10 day here ?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:28
Ersel (Unwinding your shorts.........) ID#230376:

can really put a wrinkle in things. GOLDen sunrise forthcoming!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:26
Greenstone Gold (kapex.................) ID#428218:

kapex ( MRCI quotes page is blank? ) ID#275194:
Why did Japan go up 800 points last night? Did a hedge fund unwind a short position? Anybody know? Go Gold!!!

===========

Seems too good to be true !
When one is taken to the brink, one tends to do a deal which may not necessarily be to one's advantage. Could the Japanese have done a dea; concerning US Treasures and GOLD. I wonder !!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:23
Ersel (FTSE) ID#230376:

Anyone have acurrent Quote or a link I can use to get same/ Gooday from the chilly Midwest.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:19
mozel (@Disney Relatively speaking, it still beats playing with Brown Snakes and) ID#153110:
Butt Biting Toilet Spiders in the dark.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:16
mozel (@Arden @Thanks are due to you. Reading the exceptional is easier than writing it.) ID#153110:

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:14
kapex (MRCI quotes page is blank?) ID#275194:
Why did Japan go up 800 points last night? Did a hedge fund unwind a short position? Anybody know? Go Gold!!!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:12
John Disney (special situation ..) ID#24135:
For Mozel ..
How'd you like to run a hedge fund that's leveraged
25 times with puts/calls longs/shorts and all kind of
stuff in every which direction and then a major shwoosh
like this hits .. and at the same time you lose the
power and your computer wont work .. and you have to
calculate your position with a slide rule .. I call that
double jeopardy or sh!t hits two fans situation.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:12
mozel (@sharefin) ID#153110:
It's when the mortgage payment comes due that people become more tense. Then, there's the car payment. And the Massa Card payment. Debts R' US.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:05
arden (Thanks Mozel) ID#257344:
I am pleased you read my comments. ( My post last night at 2300 or so ) .

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 07:02
mozel (@Ohmy, A Misunderstanding) ID#153110:
While not commenting in detail, he ( Hayami of BOJ ) said he had been using a narrow definition of banks' capital in his talks with the U.S. Treasury and Federal Reserve.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:56
mozel (@Disney) ID#153110:
I calculate the collateral damage done tonight by Japan at many multiples of Pearl Harbor. Multiples of all of Hawaii, in fact.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:56
Bully Beef (I just wanted to recommend the buy and hold scenario. Here at...(fill in withyour own brokerage)) ID#260119:
we say there are some enormous buys out there in small to mid -cap companies.Some bargains on blue chips... remember to buy dips...rather buy the dips.We all know that times are rough right now but hang on and don't panic sell. We are going to play some elevator music now so go lie on the couch now and chill. I write the songs I write the songs...

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:55
MtHighNC (MM/Market update) ID#348309:
London spot:299.50 Up 5.00
Comex Dec. 301.70
US dollar down -170

Just maybe....today will be the day!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:47
Donald (BOJ tells parliment that financial sector needs a massive infusion of public money.) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/981007/e8.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:46
mozel (@Just Figuring) ID#153110:
Yen linked to gold according to Disney's law. Yen up; Gold up. Yen down; gold down.
Mozel's Conclusion: Somewhere there is a Hedge Fund that was short both Yen and Gold. Or Two. Ba Boom ?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:43
Donald (@MM: Amsterdam at noon shows $299.75) ID#26793:
http://www.aex-optiebeurs.nl/koers/GD.htm

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:42
sharefin (Mozel) ID#284255:
I think Nick@C wrote that between chasing snakes.

Wouldn't surprise me one bit.
I think it'll be kind of like the way people react with road rage.

P*ssed that the world doesn't revolve they way they want it to.
Basic infrastructure is soilid enough to last for decades.
But the socialogical way people react will be awesome.

Talk about ANGST

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:40
Donald (Australian slant on possible IMF gold sales) ID#26793:
http://www.theaustralian.com.au:80/finance/4245736.htm

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:40
mozel (@I guess tonight means the Japanese answer to calls for Transparency and Open) ID#153110:
Markets was No.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:39
THC__A (Yen Bull) ID#367411:
This is not funny! As the yen rages tonight, the commodity prices in yen will tank tomorrow in Japan. At 124 yen, I know I'm going to get a margin call in the morning.......

Someone pull the yen back down!!!

THC

PS: RJ, congrats on the Pt move....I see you are safely headed towards $350.....this is good, but I am not anywhere near safe with the yen bull running wild. Hope I don't get a yen bull horn in the *ss.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:36
MM (Bart's spot) ID#350282:
+$4.65 ( confirmations? ) @$299.15
I'm now the proud owner of 5 inklings.
Hoping to have a full clue by month's end.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:35
Donald (World gold stock indices showing rises of 46-70% this past month.) ID#26793:
http://www.smh.com.au:80/news/9810/06/text/business8.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:33
Cage Rattler () ID#33184:
Dealers in the fx mkt for $/yen totally at a loss to explain fall. All technicals and fundamentals out of the window ...

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:30
MM (Doesn't feel like the whole story, IMVHO) ID#350282:
Tokyo shares and the yen soar on govt signals
http://www.foxmarketwire.com/wires/1007/f_rt_1007_1.sml

The short-covering was also prompted by expectations that government-related public funds may buy stocks to prop up the Nikkei average, taking advantage of the optimism about new government action.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:29
John Disney (Weee!) ID#24135:
to all ..
This yen move is an eye popper. We're 124 !! Yesterday
we opened 134 !! Holy Maria!! Are they gonna bomb Pearl
Harbour too

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:27
sharefin (Globex trading unreal) ID#284255:
Massive volumes trading tonight.

And now selling off hard.

Volatility abounds - price and time so erratic.

Makes one wonder what's coming - not!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:27
Steve in TO (Rhody - ThanQ for your 6:08) ID#287337:
Copyright © 1998 Steve in TO/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I think you're right. Hedge funds being unwound will create massive deflation. I'm sure Greenspan was aware of what was developing well before the Sept. 29 Fed rate cuts, and that's why he looked like he was changing his views toward deflation, but wasn't committing to anything. He couldn't let the cat out of the bag, of course.

I think I'll extend the old saying to cover the hedge fund disaster:

If you owe the banks $100,000 and you can't pay it, you've got a problem; if you owe the banks $100,000,000 and you can't pay it, the bank has a problem; if you owe the banks $100,000,000,000 and you can't pay it, the government has a problem!

- Steve

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:27
mozel (@Yen Short Hedge Funds) ID#153110:
Went Belly Up Last Night.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:26
rhody (Lease rates: We are now on the verge of going back down under) ID#411440:
1% in one month gold lease rates. This is deflationary. One year
lease rates have been firming. This indicates a slight increase in
producer hedging. These are not positive signs for spot POG.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:25
mozel (@Y2k) ID#153110:
Copyright © 1998 mozel/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
There are many countries today where gasoline costs $2 to $5 a gallon. Where great factories run half-shifts and unemployment has crept into double digits. Where intermittent shortages of various consumer goods cause inflation, long lines, and even government-imposed rationing. Where the power system suffers rolling brownouts, and the water in some cities is not safe to drink without treatment. Where martial law is imposed from time to time in certain areas to help calm domestic unrest.

Hey, sharefin, was this taken from the tourist brochure for Downunder ? BTW, I think this is an accurate assessmnet of what Y2K will produce in the US. Living in a Third World infrastructure and economy won't be the end of the world, but it will be TEOTWAWKI.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:25
sharefin (Last night was a Yahoo mistake) ID#284255:
I commented on Europe reversing.
Because when I opened Yahoo up that's what it showed - was it a premonition

Cause it sure looks like it is doing it tonight.
After being up 2% - 4% tonight most are now in the red.

Even globex is loosing its lustre.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:23
Boardreader (Yen ..... ) ID#20767:
.008099 ( 123.5 ) !

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:16
sharefin (Debt: $7.7 Trillion in Financial Service Obligations, Late 1996; Worse Now) ID#284255:
http://www.garynorth.com/y2k/detail_.cfm/2787
It's not just the $6 trillion in U.S. direct debt that threatens us ( plus Social Security ) . It's an additional $7.7 trillion ( $6 trillion + $1.7 trillion ) in financial service obligations.
--------------------------------
Y2K and the Food Supply - Connecting the Dots
http://y2ktimebomb.com/Tip/Lord/lord9840.htm

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:10
Boardreader (The Yen!) ID#20767:

Now .008032 ( 124.5 ) .... increasing/ ( dropping ) as I watch on Globex!

http://www.cme.com/cgi-bin/gflash.cgi

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:08
rhody (@ geofs: hedge fund activity equals massive deflationary ) ID#411440:
Copyright © 1998 rhody/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
force operating in the world economy using leased physical assets
that are only borrowed for short term liquidation ( read conversion
into paper assets ) . IMHO this is just as deflationary as banks
making money out of thin air, and then lending it at miniscule
lending rates to business which then builds overcapacity into
the economy.

If the hedge funds are to be bailed out, one way or another, then
the world is toast. Between the banks building in overcapacity,
and the hedge funds selling out physical stockpiles at firesale
prices, we end up in the biggest depression since 1884. The hedge
fund exposure is now so massive, that I think the powers that be
can't let them fail lest the world financial system collapse.
The moral of this story is if you do something wrong for long enough,
and the consequences of the behavior have accumulated to excess, then
there are no consequences. Buy gold. These **s holes are going to
make the whole world pay for their excesses. Oh for the good old
days when we only had communism to worry about!

Have a nice day.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:08
sharefin (SEC Guidelines to Yield Data on Year 2000 Risks) ID#284255:
http://www.nytimes.com/library/tech/98/10/biztech/articles/05year.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 06:01
sharefin (Expert Tells Congress Millions of Things Will Break Down, But no Collapse) ID#284255:
-
http://www.garynorth.com/y2k/detail_.cfm/2795

The Cutter Consortium was asked by the International Finance Corporation to assess a specific list of global economic sectors for potential impact by Y2K. They determined the following to be vulnerable: financial services, utility and power industries, telecommunications, manufacturing, industrial and consumer services, social services ( including health care and education ) , food and agribusiness, chemicals and petrochemicals, and hotels and tourism. Cutter also singled out transportation as being vulnerable, even though they had not been asked specifically to evaluate it. In addition, they identified several smaller sectors tied to those above and so also at risk, including mining, cement and construction materials, textiles, timber, pulp, paper, motor vehicles and parts, oil refining, fertilizers and agricultural chemicals.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 05:59
Gollum (Ha Ha) ID#43349:
Bill Murphy is the guy who says LTCM was let out of their big gold short position. Probabaly the same guy who started that story in the first place. He is also the guy who said Warren Buffett was buying silver last week just before it went down.

As nearly as I can tell there never was an LTCM shot position in gold, although there are a lot of people who want to believe there was.

Who is this Murphy guy with, anyway?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 05:59
sharefin ('Blinkered view' will cause triple 2000 bug crash) ID#284255:
-
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/dynamic/news/business_story.html?in_review_id=81380

Small and private investors are going to lose out because they can neither be sure returns have been calculated properly nor prove they haven't, said Kearns. There is no regulatory body to appeal to.

What is going to happen 15 months from now isn't going to be good for anybody's business.

----------------------------
Government responds to Y2K report
http://www.yahoo.ca/headlines/top_stories/n100558.html

------------------------------
Y2K threat to telecoms
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/extras/007/4003847.htm

Asian and European countries were not disclosing their exposure to Y2K, she said.

There are definitely some countries struggling to get their infrastructure compliant, Ms Weiss-Dolev said.

Europe has left it late, but it has the technology to deal with the issue.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 05:57
mozel (@Considering Strategy) ID#153110:
Governments are defeated by collateral damage. To defeat a government, destroy or damage beyond repair its collateral. Collateral is an asset which assists war making. Anything which produces anything assists war making. This means anything contributing however remotely to production of anything. Also, anything which can be put up as security for a loan or which is needed to collect on a loan. People are not necessarily collateral. Refugees are nothing but liabilities to a government.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 05:57
Cage Rattler (Is there no stop for the Yen? $/Yen back below 126.00, at new low 125.67/75.) ID#33184:


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 05:43
contrarian (comex spot) ID#203236:
should reach 303 tonight

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 05:37
mozel (@Commie Socialists Default on Debt) ID#153110:
Big Surprise. Payment isn't moral among the ROR's, is it ?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 05:29
geoffs (Other Thread--Bankers Trust is TOAST) ID#432157:

Bankers Trust is toast and has LARGE GOLD short position also somebody said that LTCM has been let OFF the hook, there large short GOLD position by a friendly Central Bank.

Comments---PLEASE

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 05:28
Donald (Major Chinese investment trust goes belly-up) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/981007/bh.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 05:09
Donald (Japanese banks dumping dollars worldwide to get much needed yen.) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/981007/c0.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 05:08
mozel (@Somebody Knew LTCM was short Treasuries) ID#153110:
and that buying Treasuries would precipitate this crisis. And give them an exit with a profit. The source and users of this information could have been on the bond market short list. Goldman Sachs ? Extra benefit: put a billion plus hurt on UBS.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 05:03
Donald (@Mole: Here is the repost you wanted) ID#26793:
Copyright © 1998 Donald/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Tuesday October 6, 3:52 pm Eastern Time

Company Press Release

Belcor Changes Name to Silver Assets
Inc. Reflecting Position as Silver
Resource/Mining Company, Announces Preliminary
Mining Plan, Reserve Studies, Drilling Plans, ...

and does application of Black-Scholes option pricing to demonstrate how
publicly traded silver companies appear to be valued.

SONOMA, Calif.-- ( BUSINESS WIRE ) --Oct. 6, 1998-- Silver Assets Inc. ( OTC-BB: CILV -
news ) announced a corporate identity change to reflect its role as a silver resource/mining company
and announced the release of its President's Letter.

The company, previously named Belcor Inc. ( OTC-BB: BLCR - news ) now trades on the OTC
Bulletin Board with the ticker symbol ``CILV'', CUSIP No. 827321-10-0.

Silver Assets Inc. ( ``Silver Assets'' ) has 58.4 million shares outstanding and owns over 88% of Rio
Grande Mining Company ( ``Rio Grande'' ) . Rio Grande owns the Shafter-Presidio Silver Mine, in
Shafter, Texas. Silver Assets' and Rio Grande's unaudited consolidated balance sheet as of
September 30, 1998, shows cash balances in excess of $500,000 obtained through private equity
investments at $.11 a share in Silver Assets Inc. by its largest shareholder, a private investment firm.

During the early 1980's, a major mining company invested in excess of $16 million in developing the
remaining resource potential of the Shafter-Presidio Silver Mine, and identified in excess of 26
million ounces of silver reserves at an average grade of approximately six ounces per ton. Since this
reserve estimate is now out of date, Pincock Allen & Holt, Denver, has been retained to commence
new preliminary reserve studies.

As outlined in the President's Letter, available at the company's website at
http://www.silverassets.com:

-- management has identified a higher grade resource and developed a
low cost mining plan which management believes will allow it to
mine approximately 20 million ounces of silver at an average
grade of approximately 10 ounces per ton
-- management estimates that its cash mining costs will average
approximately $3.50 an ounce over an eight-year project life,
with early year costs of approximately $3 an ounce
-- a 6.25% royalty on the property has been repurchased
-- a 16,000 acre contiguous on trend mineralized property has been
optioned

In addition, management has taken bids for, and intends to undertake, a limited drilling program
focused on proving an estimated two million ounces of silver in the shallow old Presidio Mine
workings adjacent to the Shafter Deposit. If confirmed, this open pit silver deposit may enable low
cost, early year silver production in the overall mine development plan.

The President's Letter includes an Appendix discussing management's view that publicly traded silver
producing companies appear to be valued as silver call options, and that such valuation dynamics
may be key to understanding what Silver Assets Inc. may ultimately be worth. The Appendix gives
valuation examples using Black-Scholes option pricing to show how producing silver mining
companies may be valued, and how such companies may be valued after acquiring the
Shafter-Presidio property. This discussion may be found by going to Silver Assets' Website Home
Page and selecting the menu button entitled ``Option Pricing Dynamics.''

This statement contains forward-looking statements regarding events, conditions and beliefs that may
affect the company's plans, business and finances. All shareholders are cautioned that any
forward-looking statements are not guarantees of asset quality or performance and subject to risks
and uncertainties and that actual results may differ materially, as a result of various factors, from
those included or referred to in the forward-looking statements. Such risks and uncertainties include
those described in the company's Form 10KSB, as amended and other public reports.

Contact:

Silver Assets, Inc. - Sonoma
John Durkin, 707/935-3284
or
Howard Bronson & Co., Inc. - New York
Howard Bronson, 212/867-6160

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 04:58
Donald (Taiwan central bank discusses its gold reserves; they have enough they say.) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/981007/h.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 04:50
mozel (@What's Going On (courtesy of Arden)) ID#153110:
Copyright © 1998 mozel/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
So, who is the beneficiary of this bond move? Why, of course, it is Japan. For many years they have bought ( had it shoved down their throat ) US bonds with their excess dollars from their balance of trade. Each time they did it, the yen-dollar exchange rate moved just enough to keep them frozen in their position! Until now, when they need the help the most, they have a golden ( sic ) opportunity. Their bond protfoiliol has exploded in value and they have massive buyers on the other side ( hedge funds ) . Therefore, I believe they are liquidating US bonds big time which is weakening the dollar ( have you noticed the dramatic move in the Yen today and tonight? )

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 04:34
contrarian (jims upside down) ID#203236:
yes i usually get things arse up. that's why i am still trying to make a shekle out of gold. my screen only shows gold at 298.10

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 04:24
Gloomy Gus () ID#431129:
I miss my moon princess.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 04:18
jims (Yen at 127.50!!!!!!!!!!!!) ID#252391:
Dollar continues slide against yen, European currencies now gaining on dollar, Australian dollar 60.61.

Something is happening here but don't know quite what it is.....

Come on gold get going.....

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 04:00
Dabchick (Tuesday's Gold and Silver Lease Rates) ID#258195:
Copyright © 1998 Dabchick/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Here are the Lease Rates for 06 Oct calculated from data published in the Financial Times this morning.
MGLR and Silver Lending Rates are supplied to the FT by NM Rothschild .

GOLD------------1- month--------3-month--------6- month---------12- month
LIBOR--------------5.41--------------5.31--------------5.16----------------4.91
MGLR--------------4.33---------------3.58-------------3.38-----------------2.96
Gold Lease Rate-1.08---------------1.73-------------1.78-----------------1.95
( Change ) ----- ( - 0.29 ) -------- ( - 0.12 ) ------- ( - 0.04 ) ------------ ( + 0.03 )

SILVER----------1- month--------3- month-------6- month----------12- month
LIBOR--------------5.41--------------5.31--------------5.16-----------------4.91
Silver Lend Rate--3.20--------------2.30--------------1.70-----------------1.50
Silver Lease Rate-2.21--------------3.01--------------3.46-----------------3.41
( Change ) ------ ( + 0.03 ) -------- ( - 0.05 ) ------ ( - 0.11 ) ----------- ( 0.00 )
The lines labelled ( Change ) = change in lease rates since yesterday's figures.
Aurator........Many thanks for kind remarks. Much appreciated.

My 'puter has to go into the shop today for rectification ( again ) . If I am absent this spot tomorrow I will post Wed's Lease Rate data with Thursday's at 04:00 Friday.
Regards................Dabchick

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 03:54
Gloomy Gus (Everybody hurts.....REM.........) ID#431129:
ravenfire

That hurts. across the hertz..

Don't let it bring you down, it's only..


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 03:47
mozel (@To Have Our Cake & Eat It, Too or Turkey Thinking) ID#153110:
Copyright © 1998 mozel/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Gold Dancer put up a long post that boasted, essentially, Gold coin is too heavy to carry around. I Love my credit card ( debit is better ) , don't you ?

At the rate of $300 to the ounce, money is too heavy. The hand of this degenerated type trembles at the burden of one ounce. Their pockets sag. They walk stooped over from the weight. They cannot bear the one ounce needed to spend more than $106,000 per year which is what one ounce per day comes to. ( Making a deposit and writing a check is also too great a burden for these folks. They will only be satisfied with truly Easy Money. )

And this aversion to the weight of substance is why these people are so fit for the New World Order, Because in that order they will also be relieved of the weight of bullets & gun metal. In that New Convenient World of Perpetual Easy Money, they will also be relieved of the weight of keys because what is the point of locking doors where privacy is not a right and surveillance through transactions is a way of life ? A world in which, to assure the security of your Easy Pocket Money and your Easy Retirement Money, you are biometrically databased, so Control Central knows where its collateral is and what it is doing at all times.

What value has a Constitution and Law and Liberty compared to the Convenience of Easy Money ?

What value has ownership of land and things next to the Convenience of Easy Money. Why not just accept the right to use land and things according to the Bank's and Governments Rules & Regulations when it's so Easy. Esau was smart, was he not, to exchange his birthright for Easy Porridge ?

Yes, the Banksters and Government Gangsters are smart. They make it Easy to sell out yourself and your Posterity. You feel you are Entitled to a life of Ease with instant access to credit to buy on impulse and they will provide it. The only burden you have to carry is the burden of the debt and the interest on it. And the changes in the rules and regulations to make sure you pay it.

When a Turkey is being corn trapped, I imagine he figures it's just Customer Service.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 03:46
jims (Swiss, German and French stocks up 2.5%) ID#252391:
Europe is opening stronger...yen continues to strenghten at 128.15. Gold at $300 +/- Silver $5.15. Looks like an interesting day developing. Expect traders to be timid given yesterday's reversal in the DOW and Nasdaq, but believe the buying will come in at the close.

If gold should get over $300 watch the mining shares take out 85 on the XAU.
So African opening higher but up another 2% they run into resistance from previous day's lows.

Looking for $305 DEC Comex to propel HGMCY over $5.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 03:46
ravenfire (@sharefin - thanks) ID#333126:
:- )

that's me in the corner, that's me in the spot-light, losing my religion ...

( another REM song )

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 03:39
sharefin (ravenfire) ID#284255:
It was taken from a song written by the pop band 'REM'

Their chorus line was;

It's THE END OF THE WORLD AS WE KNOW IT ( and I feel fine. )

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 03:32
jims (Australian Dollar @60.50) ID#252391:
The Australian dollar is very strong tonight. Its stock index was up 49 points - several percent. The Australian dollar has risen from a low of 55 to the dollar to 60.50 since its lows a couple of months ago. As heavily dependant as Australia's economic health is on commoditiy prices I see this a a strong sign for gold.o mgingh

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 03:08
jims (Dec Gold 300.40 bid at its high) ID#252391:
Gold on the overnight is up $2 picking up steam as the dollar has gone off on another drop --Yen 128.10!!!!!!!!!! This is a very recent drop coming as Europe prepares to open.

Contrarian - I think you have it upside down. This looks like falling interest rate, lower dollar driven stuff.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 03:02
Gloomy Gus (Something I know about.....) ID#431129:
ravenfire
The End Of The World As We Know It

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:57
ravenfire (@sharefin - re: acronyms) ID#333126:
I can figure out TSHTF but what the heck is TEOTWAWKI?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:53
sharefin (Don't ask me what you'll find here - it's far from finished.) ID#284255:
http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/Markets/Misc.htm

And it won't be linked for a while.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:48
ravenfire (news from Singapore: Japan and US interest rates) ID#333126:
http://business-times.asia1.com.sg/3/fmony32.html

http://business-times.asia1.com.sg/3/fmony33.html

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:44
sharefin (Snipped from the Web) ID#284255:
-
The Five Stages of Y2K

Stage 1 - aka hiccup. Minor inconveniences. Example: You get a letter
from your bank indicating you are 100 years delinquent in your mortgage
payments, please send $8.2 million back interest or call us. You call,
both have a good laugh, they fix it, and on to the next one like that. The
general population is not alarmed. No economic repercussions. Largely
business as usual.

Stage 2 - aka bump in the road. Local, minor, infrastructure breakdowns
lasting days. Example: Power goes off 3 hours then stays on a week before
next brief shutdown, occurring in small but noticeable numbers nationwide.
The general population is cautious and beginning to show signs of
preparation. Economic downturn but not yet a recession.

Stage 3 - Regional, more severe infrastructure breakdowns lasting weeks.
The general population is now at the panic point. This stage also
characterized by bank runs, trouble getting food, high unemployment,
significant corporate bankruptcies, layoffs, and recession. Y2K-related
deaths have begun in significant numbers.

Stage 4 - aka TSHTF. Nationwide, severe infrastructure breakdowns affecting
the majority of the population. Problems of such a magnitude and duration
that most believe they will continue long term. This stage also
characterized by large numbers of people fleeing cities, more deaths, and
deep recession.

Stage 5 - aka TEOTWAWKI. Massive, long-term infrastructure breakdowns so
severe that most people believe it will takes years ( possibly decades ) to
restore them. This stage also characterized by societal upheavals,
violence, massive numbers of deaths, and hopelessness for the vast majority.
Worldwide economic depression similar to 1930's.

Thanks, Rich

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:27
contrarian (re tanking) ID#203236:
I hate to say it but maybe a solid gold double barrel tank tonight!!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:23
jims (Big Stock moves) ID#252391:
Copyright © 1998 jims/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Big stock moves all over Asia tonight. Up 804 in Japan. HK only up 2%. DOW over night challenging yesterday's highs. Gold up less than $1 while Dec silver is at $5.14 bid.

Heard on analyst say he thought the dollar would decline against the yen from here. Dollar strenght current thought to be the effect of Hedge Fund unwinding.

If we hold above the highs of yesterdays early rally in the DOW, I'd look for strenght to really come into the US stock market at the close.

Maybe a yawner for the metals but the force behind this has to be lower interest rates which would seem bullish for gold - but not if nobody wants to buy it.

Don't see a tank in the world stock markets today - quite the opposite. This in fact may be the start of a significant rally. Bearishness, as I caught myself saying last night, has gotten to an extremn. 8100-8300 first objective.

I can see the headlines now - DOW rallies 500 points on the heaviest vloumn in history. Gold up 40 cents.

Dow 10,000 before gold $315? Both seem impossible.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:16
sharefin (The 'Killing Zone') ID#284255:
http://www.freeyellow.com/members2/grizz/index.html


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:13
contrarian (volatility) ID#203236:
usually when market indexes show extreme volatility over a period of time, see sawing, this signals a major change in trend. Am i right or wrong?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:12
DBog (Contrarian) ID#267298:
Hope your chart is right.....



Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:09
contrarian (DBOG) ID#203236:
but my chart says it's going up. now yr talking of a tank. hope yr wrong

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:05
DBog (Contrarian) ID#267298:
You were pulling my leg - No ?

We shall watch this pulling of the leg together

Yes ?

GO AGAIN


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:03
Cage Rattler (FWIW - rumours about $/yen) ID#33184:
Rumours are also sweeping the market that Japanese banks, desperately in need of capital, are asking for unprecedented proportions of their subsidiaries' profits to be repatriated to Japan. Sumitomo, for example, allegedly is requiring its wholly-owned offshore subsidiaries to send it between 80% and 90% of their earnings. Normally, the proportion is only 50%. When those foreign profits are converted en masse into yen, the Japanese currency rises

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:03
Open-Loop (TANK!) ID#65118:
is for the Nikkei right now! Run em over! Hope I'm wrong...

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 02:02
Auric (Japan Smoking This AM) ID#240288:

Up over 750 points. Have read nothing but doom & gloom in the news releases. Something must be going on behind the scenes. S&P also up about 20 points in overnight trading. http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=^N225&d=1d

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:59
contrarian (tank--DOWN) ID#203236:
THANKS A LOT. now you tell me!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:55
DBog (Contrarian) ID#267298:
TANK is DOWN

Hope I'm wrong.......

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:52
contrarian (tank) ID#203236:
could someone please explain what is meant by tank in the context here. I thought tank was where you put petrol in yr car, or a four wheeled army vehicle with a gun. When you say tank is that up or down
confused#%** ( /::'''?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:51
mole (@DONALD re silver assets) ID#350145:
i can't retrieve your earlier post for some reason. i mess around with a lot of these obscure little devils. could you post that name again. the precursor to silver assets. it was alcore or something like that. thanks

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:44
sharefin (John) ID#284255:
Oleman would have to be one of the best SP500 traders alive.
Probably the best.
But don't try to play his trading hints.
You will come undone so fast.
His SAR ( sell and reverse ) is the quickest there is.

Earl
I would guess we have a small brother of FEMA here.
They probably call it the Gov't ( :- ) ) )

Don't worry the FEMA will be there to protect you come Y2k.


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:42
DBog (Gold Dancer & Gloomy Gus) ID#267298:
Gold Dancer: I hope your right and I'm wrong but
the reason I say I think it will tank is that so often lately
when it's up a good bit overnight and then fades at the
close overnight it tanks in N.A. the following day. That's
what I see happening tonight. Again, I hope I'm wrong,
but don't think so.

Gloomy Gus: Didn't mean to dampen your spirits
but I'm right pissed off too.

GO YOU KNOW WHAT








Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:35
Gold Dancer (More) ID#377196:
Even J. Stack believes that when the money returns to Asia it
will return FAST. I have always thought so. This could be the beginning.
The dollar will fall and gold will rise. This completes the picture.

Looks like this is happening now. We will see over the next few
weeks.

Thanks, GD Big profits to be had in Asia as well as gold.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:31
Gold Dancer (DBOG) ID#377196:
I don't think gold will tank tomorrow. Asia going up and gold
going up is what I expected to happen while the US markets go down.

This may be the case. Time will tell.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:31
mapleman (Bulls running wild today.) ID#348127:

I think that what is getting factored in tonight is the Brazilian bailout. Like someone said earlier, this will only postone the enivitable. Earnings season should take us into the 6000 - 7000 range. Its just my hunch but I am looking for Japan to start selling their US debt soon. Should this happen the greenback will tank and gold will soar. If this ones wrong, then my next hunch is that the Euro debut in Jan. will severely cut into the greenback and gold will soar. I'd say go gold but I need to make some moves today so go gold Thursday

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:31
Gloomy Gus () ID#431129:
DBog
I've got nothing to be optimistic about. In fact, I'm quite miserable.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:27
DBog (GOLD DANCER) ID#267298:
I just don't understand it. The entire freaking world
is in economic turmoil, but as one looks at things
tonight, you would think that things couldn't be
better. F**cking unbelievable....

I hate to say it but I think GOLD will tank tomorrow...

GO GOLD


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:25
John Disney (dire warnings..) ID#24135:
Copyright © 1998 John Disney/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
hi there..
I will repeat this for all Rangy sportsfans .. IF
Rangy should break up its assets to shareholders I
would be very carefull .. IF you can .. I would
purchase the Rangold shares locally in Joberg
( ML has an office there .. it should be easy ) ..
rather than the ADRs ... Ignore my words at YOUR
PERIL .. If things go bad .. Im keeping this posting
so I can say I did my best.
In the event of a break up .. I believe that assets
NOT LISTED IN THE US WILL BE AUCTIONED by the bank
issuing the ADRs.
NOW I dont think RRS which is HALF Rangolds assets
is listed .. Im sure that ALL the rest except for
DD Randfonts and the other STOCKS are UNLISTED..
Im not making this up ... IVE DONE THIS sort of
thing myself.
The assets would be disposed of like this .. my broker
would call and say .. was just advised that Citibank
is auctioning 11.25 million shares of randgold resources
day after tomorrow ( one share group must
go in one single LOT ) .. do you want to make an offer
Since we'd be talking 25 million smackers .. Id say
lemme sleep on it ..
However mercury asset management owns 25 % of rangold
( source Mining Journal ) and would have been in
close contact with the bank and be fully prepared ..
same goes for the kebbles .. So these assets would
obtain at best 60 cents on the dollar at that type of
auction ( there might even be a little collusion ..
perish the thought ) .
SO .. In the event of a carve up .. either buy the
local shares or bail out at the first sign of such a
move .. Remember .. I told you .. I keep a copy.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:24
aurator () ID#25490:
who said I'm happy?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:24
Reify (RANGY-AGAIN) ID#413109:
For the chart readers, I'm sure it's been obvious that Rangy is in an up triangular configuration.

For those that don't follow charts, but require a story - here's mine... Buy - Rangy, it'll do you a lot
of good some day soon.... Now don't go gettin tooooo excited, now, hear?

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:19
Gold Dancer (DBOG) ID#377196:
Don't know. Probably will by morning US time. IS something
going on? Maybe Japan raised interest rates. Or maybe ended compound
interest. Or maybe they will announce having made hugh gold purchases.


Or maybe nothing.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:15
DBog (QUESTION) ID#267298:
All: What the HELL is everyone so optimistic about ?

GO GOLD


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:14
Gold Dancer (POLARBEAR) ID#377196:
If it is not JCI or CAM it must be DROOY. What else is left?
That of course would make for a powerhouse of a mining company!!!!!!

I posted today that I thought it would be the best thing for
Father Kebble to do, and the smartest. The new company would be
rerated fast,especially if RANGY can come up with $220 by Nov.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:09
Gold Dancer (POLARBEAR) ID#377196:
So RANGY won't be included in JCI merger. That is good news. But

what was meant by his comment on non earning asssets in refering to
Rangy?

Thanks GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:05
Squirrel (Let's try FEE's catalog url again) ID#280214:
http://www.fee.org/98catalog.htm

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:03
Squirrel (For a pretty comprehensive catalog of books by Hayek and others) ID#280214:
Copyright © 1998 Squirrel/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
On Gold, Liberty and Free Economics see
http://www.fee.org/98catalog.html>http://www.fee.org/98catalog.html
and its parent page at http://www.fee.org
LOTS AND LOTS of great books by the masters. You must check it out!

I've subscribed to the magazine for years but it must be mailed in a plain brown envelope to survive the censors in the US Postal System. Even though it has been published for fifty years by this Foundation For Economic Freedom ( FEE ) , the title of The Freeman obviously has caused it to be intercepted somewhere in the mails as subversive material because the Montana bunch has given new meaning to the term Freeman. Thus I have given up my subscription and will get it instead in annual bound volumes since FEE has not been able to convert their mailings to plain brown envelopes. Playboy arrives fine, but The Freeman does not.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:02
DBog (JAPAN'S BANKS) ID#267298:
I guess Japan just solved it's banking problems.

Most ( if not all ) other asian markets are up.

N.A. futures are all up tonight.

Everything in the economic world is great tonight.

Methinks something came out of the week-end meetings
that niether you nor I know about, but, will only postpone
the enevitable a while longer.....

GO GOLD


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 01:00
HighRise (Rack) ID#401460:

I don't think so, earlier Kitco was slower than heck for me. A real mess! Long Post etc., I don't know what is the cause. A lot of posters have moved on.

HighRise

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:56
Rack (WOW-Kitco is going so fast tonight my fingers are getting burned!) ID#411163:
The new stuff must be up and running-I like it!

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:53
Gold Dancer (Japan) ID#377196:
Japan is up 600 pts. The rest of Asia is up also. Big.

Japan is 13,600. About.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:50
Open-Loop (@sno_a..WELCOME ABOARD!) ID#65118:
Too bad there are not more people that see things as we do. Duck and cover is a very prudent thing to do. People these days are just too
stupid to put out thier burning paper. Kitcoites are a rare breed and
I feel fortunate to be a part of it. History you know....

Regards, O.L.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:43
aurator (more lies.......) ID#25490:
EJ
Your news report on Tibetan Buddhist monks killing rats, sounds more like another salvo in the Propoganda war that China is waging on Tibet. I suspect we'll hear other stories as unbelievable as that one as the Chinese gobmint continues it genocide in Tibet.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:42
Gold Dancer (DBOG) ID#377196:
I think Soros wants to be king of the world. So that everything
is done his way. I don't trust the man and it bothers me that he
was present at all the weekend meetings. When the super rich and the
government types get together it's to F*** the people.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:29
DBog (SOROS) ID#267298:
It seems to me that of late, George has been talking a lot
about the necessity of rate cuts.

It is my understanding that if rates go lower GOLD will most
probably go higher.

Who has been BUYING all the GOLD that has been sold the
past couple of years ?

Anyone want to venture a guess ?

You don't suppose George would advocate anything that
would benefit him personaly do you ?

GO GOLD


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:27
Gold Dancer (LTCM /FED) ID#377196:
Copyright © 1998 Gold Dancer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I don't think any of us was surprised that the gold short position
was bailed out by a central bank. Had to be the NY FED. One way or
another.
One of the ways for the fed to increase the money supply is to
do these bail outs. Buy whatever needs buying. This adds liquidty to
the markets, for a while anyway. In the past they lent money to the
banks and the banks had to loan the money to someone. Now they just
take a position.

Maybe they will buy back the T-Bonds LTCM is short. In the end the
markets will get the idea that the dollar is going down the drain
and the FED will meet resistence to bail outs. This will probably
happen when the dollar falls too fast, like say: freeee falllling!!!!

Hey, if your going to go belly up be the first on your block. You
will get all the attention. If your in a long line, forget it.

I smell fear. That is why gold is up overnight.

Gold loves fear. Absolutly loves it. That is why there is NO bull
like a gold bull.

Clinton, Rubin and Greenspan are all caught in the web they have
woven. And they want to pass the evil onto us. Shame on them.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:27
sno__A (Mapleman 06/1421 kitco - Next year....) ID#289417:
Copyright © 1998 sno__A/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
What's going to happen next year...who knows..but here is some of my thinking...

Sometime during next year investors are going to realize a certain percentage of stocks aren't going to make it through yk2...1%-5%-10%?..

Other companies probably aren't going to have profits for years ( IBM profits going to pay off lawsuits ) ( GM with no parts for extended period )

The idea will snowball and toward the end of the year all investors will be holding their breath, along with everyone else - and there will be no buyers of stocks, nor sellers of physical gold/silver....

The only stocks that may have a chance are those which are felt to be relatively y2k immune - local businesses with little outside parts sourcing, ones that do not have a great dependence on computers, and those that can be brought back into production quickly after y2k....

This fear is going to drive the precious metals shares to heights never before thought of...at that time 30,000 USD/oz may not seem so unbelievable...

My plans for the next year are to split my investment funds into three parts...1/3 stockpile for hard times, 1/3 precious metal stocks ( in my case mutual fund ) , 1/3 physicial, gold and silver....as y2k gets closer will change these ratios as seems prudent...

This run up in shares and physical may be another bubble...so it may be prudent to short the pm market just before y2k... ( grin ) ...trying to cover all the bases....

Please pardon mispelled words...length of post...this is my first kitco post....good luck....steve


Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:26
Gold Dancer (LTCM /FED) ID#377196:
Copyright © 1998 Gold Dancer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I don't think any of us was surprised that the gold short position
was bailed out by a central bank. Had to be the NY FED. One way or
another.
One of the ways for the fed to increase the money supply is to
do these bail outs. Buy whatever needs buying. This adds liquidty to
the markets, for a while anyway. In the past they lent money to the
banks and the banks had to loan the money to someone. Now they just
take a position.

Maybe they will buy back the T-Bonds LTCM is short. In the end the
markets will get the idea that the dollar is going down the drain
and the FED will meet resistence to bail outs. This will probably
happen when the dollar falls too fast, like say: freeee falllling!!!!

Hey, if your going to go belly up be the first on your block. You
will get all the attention. If your in a long line, forget it.

I smell fear. That is why gold is up overnight.

Gold loves fear. Absolutly loves it. That is why there is NO bull
like a gold bull.

Clinton, Rubin and Greenspan are all caught in the web they have
woven. And they want to pass the evil onto us. Shame on them.

Thanks, GD

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:17
Regulus (The beast with no face ) ID#413156:
As the World economies collapse most Americans watch dumb sitcoms on their idiot boxes while drinking Bud beer and get news from the controlled and contrived media. There are a few gun toting rednecks hiding in the bushes playing cowboy and Indians that think they alone will save America but beware the N.W.O. is coming coming coming FASTER THAN A SPEEDING BULLIT.

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:10
EJ (Not as off-topic as it appears to be) ID#45173:
Copyright © 1998 EJ/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Tibetan Monks Taught to Kill Rats

BEIJING -- ( Agence France Presse ) Buddhist monks in Tibetan monasteries have been
turned into practiced rat-killers, thanks to an extermination program run by Chinese
authorities, official media reported Tuesday.

Buddhists are taught not to kill any living creature. Yet monks at the famed Jokhang Temple
in Tibet have waged a protracted crusade against rats in the past four years that has resulted in
annihilating thousand upon thousand of rodents, Xinhua news agency said.

It quoted lamas at the temple as saying that rats had been responsible for biting power lines,
spoiling ancient scriptures, starting fires and even biting the ear off a 1,300 year-old statue of
the Sakyamuni Buddha.

Widely-held religious beliefs that no living thing should be killed had turned Lhasa into a
paradise for pests, the agency said.

The rodents were often seen strolling in temples during the day or walking side by side
playfully with monks in the middle of rituals and ceremonies, it said.

The rats took refuge in temples and monasteries in the early 1990s after the Chinese
authorities in Lhasa mounted an extermination campaign in the early 1990s.

Their annoying presence finally made the monks resolved to get rid of them, Xinhua said.
( ( c ) 1998 Agence France Presse )
-----
Moral: No religious tenet holds where expediency is long denied. The dollar is a key element -- if not THE key element -- of the US economic and cultural religion. Don't count on it living when the time comes to kill it. ( Why are the Europeans so reluctant to acknowledge the global crisis and play ball with the USA? Have they not hung on a dollar cross since Bretton Woods after WWII? )

G'Nite.
-EJ

Date: Wed Oct 07 1998 00:00
Earl (SP up 14+ on the evening.) ID#227238:
Coming soon to a market near you. Either one hellacious blowoff top or the bait for a trap. Gonna be an interesting open in the AM.

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