KITCO GOLD FORUM
1997-1999

index
Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:56
oris (darkwing, Soros's article) ID#238422:
The main reason of Russian crisis is a stupid tax code,
Soros should know that, and if he tries to blame it on
something international, it's just BULL SH*T...
It's a political article, which has very specific purpose.
He wants to get paid back after losing a lot of money
everywhere...particularly in Russia,because he knows
he will never collect from them - too big game...



Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:55
HighRise (ORIS, If you liked that one,) ID#401460:

You will love this one.

Yes, the president should resign. He has lied to the American people, time and time again, and betrayed their trust. Since he has admitted guilt, there is no reason to put the American people through an impeachment.

He will serve absolutely no purpose in finishing out his term, the only possible solution is for the president to save some dignity and resign.

From 12th Congressional District Hopeful
William Jefferson Clinton during the Nixon investigations.

HighRise

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:54
The Hatt (Claimstaker follow up!) ID#294232:
Apparently these estimates donot take into account the silver kickers!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:51
The Hatt (Codeman,Chas and Skinny/ Claimstaker Resources is a buy!) ID#294232:
Copyright © 1998 The Hatt/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Thanks to you Codeman I got positioned in this stock at the right time and I believe that this is a true sleeper! Skinny i asked about their costs per ounce a few months ago and was told they were reworking their reserves and costs. Since then their reserves have increased due to the higher average grade of 0.60 ounces per ton and the weaker Canadian dollar. A friend of mine who is a geologist has compared their geological structure to that of Meridians and he fully expects that the mine life could easily exceed ten years. The drilling of the Nevada claims starts next month and that could also prove interesting! This is a junior that is doing things and when gold moves it is my humble opinion that they will be one of the first juniors to move! A real company with cash flow blue sky no debt and to date unpromoted. Not recommending this stock but it is worth a couple hours of DD....... IR guy thought that they were shorted over the last couple of days and feels he has about 100,000 shares caught short. Could be very interesting: )

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:44
oris (High Rise, Cigar problem worries me a lot now...) ID#238422:
Copyright © 1998 oris/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
That is a damn serious problem, you're right. When
all of the U.S. tries to quit smoking, Mr. Clinton
practically proved that cylinder-shaped tabacco products
can be the f*cking weapon of choice for ....eh..say,
right wingers...or as Gazebo said...republicans...

Now, tobacco companies will be obligated to print not
only cancer danger stuff, but also ....do not stick
it in any other place but your mouth warning...

It is in nature of the freedom-loving Americans to do what
they are not recommended ( or allowed ) to do...
so now I'm really scared...

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:31
Envy (@EJ) ID#219363:
Have fun fishing, wish I could go myself. Absolutely love throwing a fresh rainbow trout over the fire. Yummy yum. No guarantees on burning the place down, lots of loose paper blowing around, plenty of spark.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:26
darkwing (Soros) ID#215249:
Copyright © 1998 darkwing/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
The Crisis of Global Capitalism
By GEORGE SOROS

The global capitalist system that has been responsible for our remarkable prosperity is coming apart at the seams. The current decline in the U.S. stock market is only a symptom, and a belated symptom at that, of the more profound problems that afflict the world economy.

Some Asian stock markets have suffered worse declines than Wall Street's crash of 1929, and their tumble has been followed by economic collapse. In Indonesia, most of the gains in living standards that accumulated during the 30 years of Suharto's regime have disappeared. Japan, the world's second-largest economy, just reported an annualized 3.3% decline in economic activity for the second quarter. Russia has undergone a total financial meltdown. It is a scary spectacle, and it will have incalculable human and political consequences.

It would be regrettable if we remained complacent just because most of the trouble is occurring beyond our borders. We are all part of the global capitalist system, which involves not only free trade but, even more importantly, the free movement of capital. The system is very favorable to financial capital that is free to choose where to go, and it has led to the rapid growth of global financial markets. Picture it as a gigantic circulatory system, sucking up capital from the financial markets and institutions at the center and then pumping it out to the periphery.

Until the Thai crisis in July 1997, the center was both sucking in and pumping out money vigorously, financial markets were growing in size, and countries at the periphery could obtain an ample supply of capital from the center by opening up their capital markets. In this global boom, emerging markets fared especially well. At one point in 1994, more than half the total inflow into U.S. mutual funds went into emerging-market funds.

The Asian crisis reversed the direction of the flow. Capital started fleeing the periphery. At first, the reversal benefited the financial markets at the center. The U.S. economy enjoyed the best of all possible worlds, with cheap imports keeping inflation in check and sending the stock market to new highs. Yet there comes a point when distress at the periphery cannot be good for the center. With the meltdown of Russia, I believe that we have reached that point, for three major reasons.

First, the Russian meltdown has revealed certain flaws in the international banking system that hitherto had been disregarded. In addition to the exposure on their balance sheets, banks also engage in swaps, forward transactions and derivative trades among one another and with their clients. These transactions do not show up in their balance sheets. They are constantly revalued, with any difference between cost and market made up by cash transfers, which is supposed to eliminate the risk of default. The transactions form a daisy chain in which each intermediary has an obligation to his counterparts without knowing who else is involved.

This sophisticated system received a bad jolt when the Russian banking system collapsed. Russian banks defaulted on their obligations, but the banks remained on the hook to their own clients. There was no way to offset the obligations of one bank against those of another. A similar situation arose subsequently, when Malaysia shut down its financial markets to foreigners. These events led most market participants to reduce their exposure all round. As a result, bank stocks have plummeted, and a global credit crunch is in the making.

Second, the pain at the periphery has become so intense that individual countries have begun to opt out of the global capitalist system, or simply fall by the wayside. First Indonesia, then Russia suffered an almost complete breakdown. But their collapse was unintended, whereas Malaysia opted out deliberately. It managed to inflict considerable damage on foreign investors and speculators. It also managed to obtain some temporary relief by being able to lower interest rates and pump up the stock market. But the relief is bound to be temporary, because borders are porous and money will leave the country illegally.

The third major factor working for the disintegration of the global capitalist system is the evident inability of the international monetary authorities to hold it together. IMF programs do not seem to be working. The response of the Group of Seven industrialized countries to the Russian crisis was woefully inadequate, and the loss of control quite scary. Financial markets are rather peculiar in this respect: They resent any kind of government interference, but they hold a belief that if conditions get rough, the authorities will step in. This belief has now been shaken.

These three factors are working together to reinforce the reverse flow of capital from the periphery to the center. The flight of capital has now spread to Brazil and put the rest of Latin America at risk. Forecasts for global economic growth are being steadily scaled down, and will probably end up in negative territory. If and when the decline spreads to our economy, we may become much less willing to keep our trade barriers low, which may lead to a breakdown in international free trade.

This course of events can be prevented only by the intervention of the international financial authorities. The prospects are dim, because the G-7 governments have just failed to intervene in Russia, but the consequences of that failure may serve as a wake-up call. There is an urgent need to recognize that financial markets, far from tending towards equilibrium, are inherently unstable. A boom/bust sequence can easily spiral out of control, knocking over one economy after another. Thus, in finding a remedy, market discipline may not be enough. There is also a need to maintain stability in financial markets.

This principle has already been implemented on a national scale in the form of the Federal Reserve. But similar financial organizations are lacking in the international arena. The International Monetary Fund and the World Bank have tried valiantly to adapt to such a role, but additional institutions may be necessary. Earlier this year I proposed establishing an International Credit Insurance Corp., but at that time it was not yet clear that the reverse flow of capital would become such a serious problem, and my proposal fell flat. I believe its time has now come. We shall have to establish some kind of international supervision over the national supervisory authorities.

At the same time, there remains the urgent need for Congress to authorize an increase in the capital of the IMF. In doing so, lawmakers must disregard the influential testimony given by former Secretary of State George Shultz opposing such an increase.

Among his other arguments, Mr. Shultz inveighed against the moral hazard of bailing out irresponsible investors. Here he has a valid point. Bailouts did encourage foolish behavior by banks and other lenders, which could count on the IMF when a country got into difficulties. But the moral hazard now operates in the opposite direction, in not enabling the IMF to do its work when it is most needed. Countries like Moldova and Romania have no one else to turn to but the IMF. The IMF is perfectly capable of assisting them. It would be tragic if it were to run out of resources.

Replenishing the capital of the IMF, however, will not be sufficient to resolve the global financial crisis. A way has to be found to provide liquidity not only at the center but also at the periphery. I believe there is an urgent need for the creation of Special Drawing Rights that can be used to guarantee the rollover of the already existing debt of countries that receive the IMF's seal of approval. If there is no reward for good behavior, meltdowns and defections will multiply. But such radical ideas cannot even be considered until Congress changes its attitude toward international institutions in general and the IMF in particular.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:21
Chicken man (BG --Let's buy puts!) ID#341297:
I'm going to put my money on the pony called BEAR. My thinking goes
like thus... AG only has one trump card left-that is to lower interest
rates. IF that nasty liquidity crunch hits Wall Street on Fri esp. with
triple witching for a kicker we might get more than our money's worth
That is more than likely to spill over in the gold pit.
What is AG going to stop this freight train with other than with TRUMP

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:04
MoReGoLd (@SOROS: Wants all G7 to cut Rates --- I agree --- Inflation is a MYTH) ID#348129:
Copyright © 1998 MoReGoLd/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Financier Soros warns global crises far from over

 WASHINGTON ( Reuters ) - International financier George Soros said Tuesday Russia's economic crisis would worsen, Brazil was on the brink, and the world's lender of last resort -- the International Monetary Fund -- was ill-equipped to fend off a global meltdown.
  Painting a bleak picture of the future for the world economy, Soros told U.S. lawmakers that financial crises gripping Asia and Russia had already spread to Latin America, where panic was setting in, and that Malaysia's foreign currency controls could setback Asia's recovery.
  The multibillionaire philanthropist, who chairs Soros Fund Management, warned that the global capitalist system was coming undone.
  He also said the U.S. Federal Reserve may need to cut interest rates to spur growth, and called on the U.S. Congress to give $18 billion to the IMF to replenish the lending agency's reserves, drained by bailouts for Russia and three crisis-hit Asian states.
  But Soros told the House Banking Committee that even a fully funded IMF could not end the market turmoil. Replenishing the capital of the IMF will not be sufficient to resolve the global financial crisis.
  The IMF engineered multibillion-dollar bailouts last year for Indonesia, South Korea and Thailand to avert the region's economic collapse. In July the fund assembled a nearly $23 billion rescue package for Russia.
  But market confidence evaporated, Russia devalued the rouble and defaulted on some foreign debt, and Russian President Boris Yeltsin's surprise decision to ditch his brash young prime minister, Sergei Kiriyenko, did nothing to reassure frightened investors.
  Soros said the meltdown in Russia had exposed new weaknesses in the international banking system.
  A global credit crunch is in the making, he told the committee. The global capitalist system which has been responsible for the remarkable prosperity of this country in the last decade is coming apart at the seams.
  Soros said the downside for the Russian economy was practically limitless after the collapse of the rouble and a big debt default. He said Russia's banking system had been wiped out by the latest economic turmoil.
  The situation in Russia is quite dire, very, very serious, Soros told the panel. Unfortunately, I cannot be optimistic for the outlook because the government that fell was actually the best government Russia could have produced, he added, referring to Kiriyenko's team.
  Soros said the new government, led by former Foreign Minister Yevgeny Primakov, was a reversal to the regime that has collapsed and I do not think that you now have people that will be able to deal with the situation, this dire emergency.
  Soros blasted Malaysian Prime Minister Mahathir Mohamad for imposing foreign exchange and capital control measures.
  The effect on the economy will be disastrous, Soros said, adding: The measures taken by Malaysia will hurt the other countries which are trying to keep their financial markets open because it will encourage the flight of capital.
  The measures, designed to contain speculation and shield the economy from turbulence in the global economy, marked a giant step away from the free market policies which had underpinned Malaysia's stunning growth since the mid-1980s.
  Ironically, Mahathir has accused Soros and other speculators of attacking Malaysia's currency, causing the country's worst economic slump in decades.
  Soros also warned the House committee of general panic in Latin American markets. The flight of capital has now spread to Brazil and if Brazil goes, Argentina will be endangered.
  With Brazil in the eye of the storm, Soros said it was critical that the United States and other Western powers support emergency loans from the IMF.
  IMF Managing Director Michel Camdessus said late Tuesday the fund had not received any requests from Latin America countries for emergency loans, but added: In this quickly changing world anything is possible.
  A World Bank official said multilateral lending agencies were preparing a package of loans worth $4.5 billion for Argentina should it be unable to access capital markets.
  But Soros said the IMF might not have enough cash to help, because Congress has refused to approve its funding. The Senate has agreed to give $18 billion to the IMF, but the legislation has stalled in the House of Representatives.
  To help calm markets, Soros said U.S. monetary authorities may need to cut interest rates. If my expectations are correct then I think it will be necessary.
  Other Group of Seven major industrial nations should consider doing the same, he added. I think it is very important that they should work together. But I think that some members -- particularly the Germans -- object to any appearance of coordination, which makes it more difficult, he said.
 

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:03
HighRise (Clinton may have another problem!) ID#401460:
Copyright © 1998 HighRise/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

Any idea who made Slick's stogie?

Stogiegate

Among the many revelations of the Starr Report is the American Chief Executive's hitherto undocumented fondness for the politically incorrect yet trendy smoke: the cigar. It is further alleged that Mr. Clinton employed a cigar in a manner unintended by the manufacturer; a manner which noted cigar-fancier Sir Winston Churchill might not have approved of, or even imagined.

The origin of the cigar in question was unspecified in the report. Yet, it is well known that cigars of Cuban manufacture are considered the ne plus ultra of stogies worldwide, and it is not inconceivable that the cigar Clinton allegedly employed originated in Cuba, which is located a mere 90 miles from the US border. If so, and if it can be proven, the burden of charges against Mr. Clinton will increase.

For Americans are prohibited for indulging in Cuban cigars in conventional as well as unconventional manners. Due to the decades-old embargo, Americans buying or importing Cuban products are liable for prosecution under the Trading with the Enemy Act, a treasonable offense punishable by up to ten years in jail. As absurd as this may be, it is not trivial: US authorities seized 240,000 cigars worth over US$3 million ( HK$23 million ) last year. High-profile arrests, including that of a senior Chase Manhattan bank executive who was busted by a seller turned FBI informant, have
occurred.

As mentioned earlier, trading with the enemy is considered treason. Perhaps Mr. Clinton should take a little time out from his endless pleas for forgiveness to address this potentially explosive issue.

Source unknown.

I could not help but notice the mention of the Rockefeller, Chase Bank.

HighRise


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:03
EJ (@Bully Beef & All) ID#45173:
Copyright © 1998 EJ/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Amen. Crises do happen, most are unpredictable, otherwise steps are taken to avoid them. Sometimes a crisis is forseen but the market is misinformed and unable to make rational decisions to prevent it, as is the case with market manias.

A market mania is a special form of developing crisis that always ends in a crisis. How will this one end? With a bang or a whimper? Is it even a true mania?

Let's take a look at the P/E of the top ten most active today.

MCI WORLDCOM 171
TELLABS INC 21
DELL COMPUTER 72
THREE COM CP 343
CBT GROUP PLC 58
CISCO SYSTEMS 74
MICROSOFT CP 63
INTEL CORP 27
ORACLE CORP 27
WASH MUTUAL 21

Let's look at the top the most active stocks for 1972 versus 1980, bull top versus bear bottom.

Sony 92 17
Polaroid 90 16
McDonald's 83 9
Intl. Flavors 81 12
Walt Disney 76 11
Hewlett-Packard 65 18

Unless you subscribe to New Era beliefs, we have at least a 50% futher decline to go to reach historical post-mania levels.

But don't try to guess when or how it'll happen or even what the consequences will be. That will drive ya nuts. No one knows.

I hold physical gold, BEARX, Rydex Ursa, and cash in an FDIC insured money market fund. So I guess that's it for me. Tomorrow I'm going fishing for a few days. See you all around. Don't burn the place down!

And don't fret too much. It ain't healthy.

-EJ




Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 23:01
HighRise (To Late for Accountability Check?) ID#401460:
Copyright © 1998 HighRise/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Tuesday September 15, 6:49 pm Eastern Time

Clinton to receive weekly spiritual counseling
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/980915/be5.html
( Adds background, details )

By Randall Mikkelsen

WASHINGTON, Sept 15 ( Reuters ) - U.S. President Bill Clinton will receive weekly spiritual counseling to hold him ``accountable for his behavior'' and resist ``temptations that have conquered him in the past,'' the White House and clergy members said.

Lies and more Lies, co-dependents all they are.
How can they be so blind to his continual denial as presented by his attorneys?

HighRise

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:51
weiser (Steve in TO) ID#202123:
That is scarey. I can say only this: the people that inhabit Kitco are a rare breed. Given the right mixture, a group of these people could make another ' Land of the Free'. Sincerely.

While I own PM, both hard and soft, I am only a small speck when placed beside others on this site.

Wish I could say more but I'm a better lurker then poster.

I hope your thoughts don't become reality---but they could.

Jerry

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:49
6pak (The Great Reckoning (revised) @ Counting On Easy Money page 444 (Davidson-Rees Mogg) ID#335190:
Copyright © 1998 6pak/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
the finest financial coverage in America in 1930. Here and there were hints of trouble. A destructive trade bill was nearing passage. But there was also plenty to feed the imagination of a bull....

As the accounts quoted above indicate, analysis of business and investment prospects in 1930 depended on relationships and indicators similar to those we use today.

Protectionist trade legislation was seen as a far less important indicator of future economic trends than easy money

That what seemed to be easy money at the time was denounced later as too tight may only show that the dynamic of contraction works behind the scenes.

More muscular attempts to counter that dynamic process by inflating faster would paradoxically strengthen the deflationary impulse. This is especially likely in the 1990's, as the experience of inflation is closer to investors than it was in the 1930's

As the 1920's ended, there were plenty of bad debts to go around, but balance sheets were clean compared to the stable rags on which corporations and governments post their numbers today.

Against this background, nervous bond holders will be on guard against government attempts to monetize everyone's bad paper.

The appearance of rapid debasement of the currency would send bonds tumbling. Gold would skyrocket.

.....................A Foolhardy Policy

Determined reflation, because of its disastrous consequences, would be a foolhardy policy. We expect and hope that the authorities will submit to the dictates of the market, and take steps to restore the economy and the government to solvency. This would mean deflation---letting the bad debt be liquidated.

This chapter is written optimistically, on the assumption that the American constitutional system will prove stable enough to hold together, in spite of the adverse megapolitical trends. It is a **guess** that we will have a crash landing, rather than a disintegration in flight.

Deflation will prevail over inflation. Creditors will prevail over debtors. Financial assets will be selectively repudiated through default, not obliterated by inflation.

FWIW....A View from 1993, James Dale Davidson and Lord William Rees-Mogg

Take Care

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:44
IDT (APH) ID#228128:
If you're out there could you comment on the S&P.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:27
HighRise (The Bankers and OUR money!) ID#401460:

“He said this was a long way from the U.S.-IMF bailout of Mexico in 1995 when holders of Mexican treasury bills were paid off in full.” Soros, He must of been referring to the Vice Chairman of Goldman Sachs, Rubin, being appointed to Sec. treasury, where upon he loaned 40 Billion plus US $ to Mexico which in tern paid off the largest private banker invested in Mexico Goldman and Sachs, and others....of course the IMF loaned Mexico 30 Billion of the US’s money so Mexico could appear to have paid us back a year or so later. SHELL GAME GOES ON AND ON.

HighRise


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:26
Leland (@BG) ID#31876:
If the Federal Reserve lowers interest rates, even a little,
the repatriation of funds by Japan, and European countries,
will devistate U.S. bonds and equities. Safe haven investors
will re-evaluate gold. Then the tide will turn.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:19
STUDIO.R (@Steve 'n tO... y Oris..........) ID#119358:
SteveO.......your post to weiser.....now I am worried. salud! disturbingly compelling.

Oris......good that you did not let this Soros have some fine chocolates. Maybe he brings another 2 billion....then maybe he gets some chocolates...maybe yes...maybe no? this is a hard question requiring much vodka.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:14
weiser (Bully Beef; Yes it does rain alot at times) ID#202123:

but the sky rarely falls. This is true. And no, you didn't read more into my
post then I wrote. I was kinda down earlier in the evening and wrote a post that had no bullseye answere. Your reply is actually as close as one could get. Thanks.

Jerry

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:13
Envy (@Suspicious) ID#219363:
Oh, wait, I forgot to take into account the other gain, so we're actually *works calculator*, we're already 2329 points off the bottom, so that's about a, let's see, a 26 percent re-trace, so if you've got a target of 30 percent for the re-trace, you're looking at about 500 more points, give or take.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:12
aurophile (LOL @ oris) ID#201109:
Dog knows I admire the man but I also had to chuckle when he was praising the Ukraine for converting their Tbills to Tnotes which is how the Russkis nailed him. There's more than a little tit for tat there, and as he admitted, there is no one out there to bail out the hedgers,unless you believe the folks on the island which is cigar-shaped who forgot to take their pills.....After all he had all those fax-driven foundations in mittel-europa undermining the sovietskaya way back when.

An angel he ain't, but a friggin' good trader, by Dog!!!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:08
Envy (@Suspicious) ID#219363:
Well, let's see. It had a high this year of 14005 and then dropped down to 4576, and then it rallied 1087 points up ( 18.68 percent ) today, so I'd call that a, let's see *works calculator*, looks like about an 8 percent re-trace back towards the high. If a 67 percent loss straight down isn't a crash, I don't know what is - so figure you might see, what, a thirty percent re-trace, at least, then you're looking at about *punches numbers*, lemme see, about 1700 more points. How's that sound ? *grin*.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:03
BG (@ leland) ID#246441:

Thanks for your post...I am not sure lower interest rates will be good for gold. First one would think money will flow into equites for days,weeks,who knows..perhaps Greenspan will have eliminated a 'safe haven' ( the bonds ) with this move...so the next big equity selloff ..gotta go gold..any thoughts

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 22:00
grant (LGB,,,,,,,SPURT?!!!!!!!) ID#433422:


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:59
Suspicious (When the Latin American sucker rally is over look out !) ID#287312:
How long will it last ? Opinions please.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:54
HighRise (Copper) ID#401460:
Copyright © 1998 HighRise/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Copper ( CMX )
Dec
75.70
77.30
75.30
77.10s
+1.35
9/15/98
17:01

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:47
Bully Beef (Weiser...Take all the prophetic doom and gloom with a grain of salt.) ID#259282:
Copyright © 1998 Bully Beef/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
The sky rarely falls. It just rains a lot.The world won't change overnight into a terrible Situation. It happens slowly and we barely notice ,and we adapt and survive. It will never hurt to have things of value to trade in an emergency.I'm not a gun fanatic but I own one for hunting and I get some satisfaction out of knowing it's there. But I wouldn't put off going to Disney land or whatever you do to have fun because of some unforseeable event in the future. Being prudent is one thing but being obsessive is something else. ( I'm going to check my door lock for the tenth time this evening ) Hope I didn't read more into your post than you meant. I don't mean to be a patronizing S.O.B. Sometimes I am overwhelmed by the doom and gloom on this site. Take Shirley Temple and the Doom and Gloomers and life is somewhere in between. I hope.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:46
HighRise (Newspapers that have called for Clinton's resignation) ID#401460:
Copyright © 1998 HighRise/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

9.35 p.m. ET ( 136 GMT ) September 15, 1998

( AP ) — Newspapers that have called for President Clinton's resignation. Some of those
listed did so before the release of Kenneth Starr's report on Sept. 11.

NATIONAL:
USA Today

ALABAMA:
The Dothan Eagle
The Mobile Register
Montgomery Advertiser

ARIZONA:
The Daily Dispatch of Douglas
The Tribune of suburban Phoenix
Tucson Citizen

CALIFORNIA:
San Jose Mercury News
The Orange County Register
The North ( San Diego ) County Times
The Record, Stockton

COLORADO:
The Denver Post

CONNECTICUT:
The Day of New London
Norwich Bulletin

FLORIDA:
The Orlando Sentinel
The Tampa Tribune

GEORGIA:
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
The Augusta Chronicle.
The Daily Citizen-News, Dalton

ILLINOIS:
Chicago Tribune

INDIANA:
The Indianapolis Star
The Reporter of Lebanon
Chronicle-Tribune of Marion
South Bend Tribune
The Republic of Columbus
The Times of Northwest Indiana
The Commercial Review of Portland
The News-Sun of Kendallville

IOWA:
The Des Moines Register

KANSAS:
The Topeka Capital-Journal

LOUISIANA:
The Times-Picayune of New Orleans
The News-Star, Monroe

MICHIGAN:
The Grand Rapids Press

MINNESOTA:
Post-Bulletin of Rochester

MISSISSIPPI:
Northeast Mississippi Daily Journal, Tupelo

MISSOURI:
Jefferson City News-Tribune

NEBRASKA:
Lincoln Journal Star
Star-Herald, Scottsbluff

NEVADA:
Reno Gazette-Journal

NEW JERSEY
The Trentonian, Trenton

NEW MEXICO:
Albuquerque Journal
The Santa Fe New Mexican

NEW YORK:
Sunday Freeman of Kingston
Utica Observer-Dispatch

NORTH CAROLINA:
The Herald-Sun of Durham
Winston-Salem Journal

OHIO:
The Repository, Canton
The Cincinnati Enquirer
The Cincinnati Post
The News-Messenger, Fremont
News Journal, Mansfield
News-Herald, Port Clinton



OKLAHOMA:
The Daily Oklahoman, Oklahoma City
Tulsa World

OREGON:
Statesman Journal, Salem

PENNSYLVANIA:
The Sentinel, Carlisle
The Daily Intelligencer, Doylestown
Standard-Speaker, Hazleton
The Philadelphia Inquirer
The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
Daily American, Somerset

SOUTH CAROLINA:
The State, Columbia

SOUTH DAKOTA:
Argus Leader, Sioux Falls
Brookings Register

TEXAS:
The Facts of Brazoria County
San Antonio Express-News
Tyler Morning Telegraph
El Paso Times
Borger News-Herald
New Braunfels Herald-Zeitung

UTAH:
Standard-Examiner, Ogden
The Spectrum, St. George
The Salt Lake Tribune, Salt Lake City
Deseret News, Salt Lake City

VIRGINIA:
Daily Press of Newport News

WASHINGTON:
The Seattle Times

WISCONSIN:
The Post-Crescent, Appleton
The Journal Times, Racine

HighRise

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:45
Steve in TO (weiser - a thought) ID#209265:
Copyright © 1998 Steve in TO/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Think back to Germany in the 1920's. The country had lost a war and had an economy in shambles.

Now think about Russia today. The country lost the Cold War and inherited an economy in shambles from the communists.

Germany 1920's: corruption, organized crime and moral decadence run riot, while ordinary, honest-living people suffer economically.

Russia 1990's: corruption, organized crime and moral decadence run riot, while ordinary, honest-living people suffer economically.

Germany 1920's: balance of payments and debt get out of hand and the gov't decides to print money ( inflate ) to try to get out of the trap.
Russia 1990's: balance of payments and debt get out of hand and right now a great debate is going on in government circles about whether to inflate ( it's mainly the communist retreads who want to do this ) or to coin gold currency, let poorly managed institutions fail, and generally let the market heal itself at a cost in short-term pain to everyone.

We're at the cusp of a tumultuous future- and as the French say: 'Plus ça change, plus ça ne change pas . . .'

Winter is approaching, and many people haven't been paid for months. A barter economy is developing which results in no taxes being paid. When some people start to face starvation and the government isn't bringing in enough money to pay its own workers, let alone the soldiers who might threaten to take matters into their own hands- what do you think the gov't will do? My bet is they'll inflate- and we'll see a hyperinflation to match the German or Brazilian fiascos.

James Davidson has pointed out that every hyperinflation has resulted in the overthrow of the government that presided over it. I've been hearing noises among people who are in contact with Russians that the country is ripe for fascism. Will we see Russia follow the pattern of Germany and Brazil and the installation of a dictator?

Will we also see a militaristic Russia launch a new Great War? What will the Chinese do about all of this. I think we will be surprised at the speed with which our world starts to enjoy interesting times.

Anyhow, as George Santayana said: people who are ignorant of their history will be condemned to repeat it, and given the amount of interest Joe Lunchbucket here in Toronto has in history, it should repeat like clockwork this time around.

Sometimes it's an Act of God that leads a country into chaos and war. Japan in the 1920's had won a war with Russia and was busy developing a modern economy when in 1923 the great Kanto earthquake destroyed Tokyo and Yokahama, killing 140,000 people ( a significant proportion of Japan's population at that time. ) Just the reconstruction costs came to half of the country's GNP. The economy was thrown into a tailspin and balance of payments and debt got out of hand and the coutry was facing a German-style financial crisis by 1929, when the stock market crash dealt it a death blow. A fascist government was installed by default as the military essentially declared itself independent of the elected government, using the emperor as a figurehead, and in 1931 launched the invasion of Manchuria, then later Korea. This was the real beginning of World War II. The fascists knew that war industries could kick-start the economy, and that a heavily-populated country could most easily grow through acquisition of territory. Does this sound like the German invasions of Czechoslovakia and Poland?

There are already noises being made by some of the more authoritarian members of Russia about regaining our old borders. Deja vu all over again?

Sorry to sound so bleak, but I think that as the tide of history starts to rise again, it behooves us to look realistically at the changes and prepare . . .

Steve

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:44
Leland (Michael Kosares/USAGOLD Published a P.M. Edition Today) ID#31876:
For those that may have missed it ( mostly about George Soros ) .
----------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.usagold.com/Daily_Quotes.html

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:44
STUDIO.R (@LGB.O...y Isure....Of what?) ID#119358:
LGB..........your 21:06...good stuff, man. you have a firm harness on your ride of lately. salud!

Isure.......Laura's nested in Baton Rouge....learning the strange! ways of you Louisianans. so far ( from home ) ( sigh ) ..so good. We're headed down to the Georgia game on Oct.2..hope to see ya' there! studio. geaux tigers!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:40
oris (Statement from the Kremlin) ID#238422:
Copyright © 1998 oris/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Comrade Soros left us two billion dollars and run away.
We regret he did not leave us more than that...We thank
him for that and hope he'll come back some day to leave
us another two billion...That is his destiny...otherwise,
who needs this great thinker...in Great Mother Russia.

We always thought he is kind of funny comrade...a little
bit outside the real world...We tried to explain him that
the only thing that matters in Russia is vodka/pickle
relationship, and that our so-called stock market is not
really a stock market. But comrade Soros insisted that
our stock market looks right..We are very sorry.

But we will always respect comrade Soros as our proven
financier and very close friend, whose opinions are not
important to us...we got nukes and he does not.

Welcome back, comrade Soros, and screw IMF, they gonna give
us money one way or the other...may be then we'll share this
dirty capitalistic dollars with our friend who suffered so
much...Dah.
















Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:39
BG (Hey Isure) ID#246441:

If any one thing can make a violent pop in the market without any real thing happening,is our Fed chairman
A. Greenspan who will be opening his
trap tomorrow...!!The markets await
his words,to panic one way or another...any takers which way ?


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:36
Monkee Person (Re: Soros, Rubin, Greenspan, Camdessus et al.) ID#350199:
Just what have been THEIR great sacrifices. The ones granting them the freedom to wheel and deal with that which I and generations of my compatriots have furnished with so much value?

That George Soros has appeared before the Banking Committee, proferring what he might in order to save his cash cow, makes me just want to scream.


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:34
Envy (Markets) ID#219363:
Clinton is involved now. Fed chairman is going to lower rates. Japan is going to work with China. G7 is stirring. IMF to get more money. Brazil is headed back up. US markets are headed higher. We're saved! Let's get this bull back on track and head for the heavens.

Oh wait, what are these put options I'm holding, I must've forgot to sell those. Hehe.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:34
BUGal (Homestake Mining...cutting way back on production) ID#206235:
Copyright © 1998 BUGal/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
At the Mt. Charlotte mine in Western Australia. Cutting about 50% of the workforce and production by restructuring the mining activity to cease working the higher production cost areas...as this is not a very economical, also safety considerations of Ground movement.

http://www.infoseek.com/Content?arn=BW0464-19980915&qt=gold+silver+platinum+palladium+rhodium+-olympic+-olympics+-medal+-medals&sv=IS&lk=&col=NX&kt=A&ak=news1486

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:28
BUGal (GOLD....needs to return to equilibrium.....some good comments here) ID#206235:
Copyright © 1998 BUGal/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Full storyGold up in quiet market with Japanese traders absent
07:06 a.m. Sep 15, 1998 Eastern

LONDON, Sept 15 ( Reuters ) - Gold moved higher in Europe on Tuesday in a quiet market still dominated by movements in the U.S. dollar, dealers said.

With Japanese markets closed for a public holiday, dealers said they expected bullion to remain range-bound until trading began in the United States later in the day.

Gold was last quoted at $291.50/$292.00 an ounce, up from the previous New York close at $290.10/$290.60. It fixed just up at $290.35 against the previous afternoon fix at $290.20.

``Japan is quiet and the market is very quiet today,'' one dealer said.

Dealers and analysts said bullion still watched currency moves, especially that of the dollar against the Japanese yen and the German mark.

``The precious sector continues to watch the dollar's movements with gold consolidating in the $290.00 region,'' T Hoare & Co analyst Rhona O'Connell said in a report.

Brokers GNI said with the precious metals complex slipping lower in the past couple of days on a stronger dollar and gains in global equity markets, safe haven buying -- which boosted especially gold recently -- had been reduced.

O'Connell said the latest figures from the CFTC on short positions on COMEX, showed there had been some heavy short-covering towards the end of last week.

The figures, of last Tuesday showed that the net speculative short position on COMEX then was 160 tonnes, compared to 217 tonnes the previous week.

She said the best indicator available until the release of new CFTC figures in two weeks' time was the level of open interest, which increased to 197,099 on Tuesday from 180,607 contracts last Friday.

``Not all of the ( net speculative short position ) reduction would have been short covering but it is a fair bet that it accounted for most of it, the reduction in the short position since last Tuesday -- if all the closures were buying back of shorts -- would be equivalent to a further 51.3 tonnes.

``Now if, as is usually the case, the OTC market ran in line with COMEX, the overall reduction in short positions up to last Tuesday would imply an outstanding short of roughly 800 tonnes, equivalent to roughly ten weeks' Western demand,'' she said.

In fundamental news, Mark Anson, portfolio manager of Oppenheimer's Real Asset Fund, told a gold seminar in New York on Monday that gold is believed to be an underperfoming asset and is currently underweighted in the fund.

``Gold has underperformed riskless investments such as treasury bills, and has also underperformed inflation from 1990 to 1997,'' Anson said.

``Compared to other asset classes, it has been a laggard. It has been the only asset class that has shown a negative total return, and it has done so with very low volatility, which is the worst possible scenario for gold.''

He said later in his speech, ``We don't see any reason for the outlook to be any different than over the past seven years.''

He noted that his fund is currently underweighted in gold, relative to the Goldman Sachs Commodity Index, of which gold comprises three percent.

``We have been a seller of gold in the past several months,'' he said.

Silver continued to track gold. It was last quoted at $4.92/$4.95 an ounce from the previous close in New York at $4.95/$4.99.

Platinum was last quoted at $363.00/$365.00 against the previous close at $365.40/$367.40. Palladium was just down at $289.00/$294.00 against $290.00/$295.00.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:26
ravenfire (@isure ) ID#333126:
if you're so sure of a violent $30 pop in gold, you could take a straddle position on the options markets... make some nice money either way.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:25
skinny (Bu Gal) ID#28994:
Copyright © 1998 skinny/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

The G7 nations, which are ( supposedly ) the world's richest industrialized nations, consist of France, Canada, Germany, Britain, Italy, and the United States. For Bill Clinton to call these countries together for a meeting of the G7 to discuss the world's financial chaos is a bigger farse than the price of gold. Practically all these countries are in severe financial problems of their own. The only way Italy ever qualified was to count the 20% of their underground economy as part of their gnp. I would imagine the meeting, although intended to the press to look as if they are out to cure the world's problems, will be more likely trying to cure their own.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:23
pdeep ((Mike)) ID#174103:
Copyright © 1998 pdeep/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Just a comment on the difference between monetary inflation and price inflation. We already have had one of the most amazing expansions of the money supply in the post-WWII period. M3 is going up at 10%/year, and from '90 - '96 the monetary base ( US$ ) increased by a stunning 55%. Over- and malinvestments, as well as the fact that the US current account deficit has for now been recycled into paper debt reserves by other countries has kept a lid on price inflation by functioning as a dollar sink. I do not think this will continue. Those dollar reserves are going to be pumped back into the real economy because many countries using dollar reserves to back their currencies are running out of liquidity, which must be converted back into their own currency to fulfill such things as bank reserve requirements ( Japan being a good example ) , pay back their foreign debts, purchase commodities such as gold, grains, etc. As those dollars repatriate, I think we will see price inflation in dollar terms. The process should be significantly speeded up if the Fed drops interest rates and boffs long term investors in US paper ( both foreign and domestic ) .

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:21
BUGal (Monica and a Vending machine?) ID#206235:
Are the same because both have a slot that says Insert Bill here

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:17
HighRise (Yesterday or Today) ID#401460:

If that was yesterday? I hadn't noticed that Indonesia had lossed that much, it has been a while since they went down 9%.

HighRise

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:14
HighRise () ID#401460:
Copyright © 1998 HighRise/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Indonesia
Jakarta Composite
^JKSE
5:00AM
292.153
-28.442
-8.87%

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:11
BUGal (Clinton wants 18 billion for IMF) ID#206235:
isn't it interesting, that quite suddenly, Bill CLinton is an expert on the failing world economy, intending to take a leadership role in pushing the G7 and IMF to change economic policies everywhere/ Asking for anotehr 18 billion from the U.S. electorate to help continue funding the IMF.

Funny, I don't remember CLinton showing this level of interest in the economic crises before now. I wonder what spurred his sudden spurt of concern in this arena?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:07
Mooney* (@Pete's thank-you to The Missing Link) ID#350194:
Our chief want in life is somebody who will make us do what we can.
--- Ralph Waldo Emerson
Thank-You Kitco, Thank-you Bart, Thank-you ALL!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:06
BUGal (@ Clinton blackmailed.... N.Y. Times) ID#206235:
Copyright © 1998 BUGal/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
For an excellent summary article on how Clinton was blackmailed by a flighty, unstable, manipulative, 21 year old intern...check out the New York Times article today by Melinda Henneberger.

It's a lenghty piece that goes into Monica's character, and summarizes what's known about the dynamics between her and Scumbag. A few nuggets;

* Clinton directing Vernon Jordan and a dozen or so other people to help find Monica a cush and important job in order to Mollify her so she wouldn't tell.

* Monica threatening the Pres. with exposure if he didn't find her a suitable position and one that ( quoting her ) I do not have to work for.

* Monica turning down and sneering at a U.N. post that Ambassador Bill Richardson himself, met with Monica over.

* Clinton using Betty Currie to give her gifts to mollify her and then taking them back when it became clear it would all come out.

* The Pres. calling Monica afterwards whenever she managed to position herself somewhere in teh front line where he would see her at public events.

* When she became angry several times, the Pres. would buy her gifts and see her to soothe and mollify her.

* After she hinted in a letter that she might expose the affair, he agreed to see her, first lashing out wiht a warning that it was illegal to threaten a president and then later in that same meeting, she says He was the most affectionate with me he'd ever been.

* When Monica threw a big screaming scene outside the White House in the rain...she wasn't suppsoed to be admitted in....Clinton finally gave in to the hysterical episode by seeing her and giving her a kiss before going to a State dinner.

All this..and a whole lot more is in the article and the Starr report...leaving Heads of State waiting to see the Pres. and Senators on hold for example while the more important business of mollifying Monica was at hand.

Ahh this only BARELY scratches the surface of the judgement of this person, Clinton. But it's interesting to dwell on the fact that our fearless leader was dancing on the puppet strings, and to the tune played...by an unstable, immature, emotional, demanding, and essentially blackmailing young intern.

Of course..none of this has anything to do with what kind of president he is, or the job he does.... right? Just his private sexual life isn't it/ ANd none of our business I would think, yes?

LGB

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 21:05
Isure (Gold) ID#368244:
Have the strangest feeling that gold is about to pop $30 one way are the other.Wish I knew which way, dad- gummit!

Studio, hows Laura doing?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:53
skinny (Codeman) ID#28994:

I looked up Claimstaker in the Northern Miner, they quote the costs of Blackstone mine at $215.00 U.S.
Blackstone is 35% owned by the Japanese firm Jipangu.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:52
weiser (some comment) ID#202123:
Copyright © 1998 weiser/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Help me put this together. I know this is broad, but what's going on in the world. Are we headed for complete doom, or are the world leaders going to patch things back together.

From my point of view, I know that I don't have the resources to weather out 3,4,or more years of economic assult on my finances ( regardless of what the store of value is that I have ) .

I know that things don't look that good, but the world has been through the same before and came out OK. Is it different now? Am I missing something here ( proably ) ?

Bottom line is I'm pretty worried about what I read, see and hear. But is this only because there is so much more available to us through electronic communication--- or ? I don't know.

BTW the post earlier today about the bear was really cool. He's out there and he is hungary and mean, and downright pissed-off.

Jerry

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:49
Allen(USA) (Everyone is hinting at 'events', etc ..) ID#240327:
Well, I suppose they are indicating that 'things' ain't so wonderful in places most of us never see or hear about. My question is 'Why?'. Why tell us these things in advance? What is the point and who is the audience? Usually the pols wait till after things are aparent before they 'react' to the news in public. This whole IMF thing is a serious stupidity. No one, let alone the US, could, let alone would, give them enough US$ to make even a dent in the financial maelstrom.

I wonder when I read these statements intended for public consumption .. why?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:42
arden (BC's debt) ID#257344:
Larryn - yes we will have to pay this debt and I am not very comfortable. My son was in the USMC. He was totally gungho coming out of bootcamp but when he met the real system he became totally disenchanted as are all of his peers. The main reason of course is the CIC - and this was long before Monica etc. No, we have a big debt to pay for weak leadership.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:42
STUDIO.R (@as for Soros.........) ID#119358:
I have time and a slight inclination to observe his deeds further....although, there are a great many better things to do and a great many better men to admire.

T#1 ...you have mail...

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:36
Pete (TheMissingLink) ID#222231:
Copyright © 1998 Pete/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
You wrote:

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:11
TheMissingLink ( Pete ) ID#373403:
Copyright © 1998 TheMissingLink/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Its a tricky game. The Fed is supposed to be independent of government
influence. This is how we are assured that monetary decisions are based
on long term stability instead of short term political considerations.
Of course congress can fire the Fed but short of that there is supposed to
be an arms length relationship.
***********************************************************************
a ) True, that's the way it's supposed to be, but the fed has been influenced in the past by political considerations either by government debt for various welfare programs, subsidy programs, war, elections, etc.. Count the periods of rate increases and decreases that only aggravated the situations of inflation, deflation, stagflation and depressions caused by this so called independent FRB. If the fed were truly serious about stopping government abuses of currency debasement, they could do so easily by saying THAT'S IT GENTLEMEN, WE WILL NOT PRINT MONEY TO BAIL YOU OUT, BANKERS WE WILL NOT BAIL YOU OUT OF YOUR PREDICTAMENTS IN MEXICO, SAVINGS AND LOANS, FUNDING TO THE IMF; GENTS, GET YOUR ACT TOGETHER FOR YOUR IRRATIONAL SPENDING HABITS ARE OVER AND YOUR CREDIT IS CUT OFF UNTIL YOUR DEBT LOAD IS LOWERED.

The Fed is owned and controlled by private banking interests and it is to their benefit for you to get into and stay into debt. The more you spend the better, for we bankers want and need you to pay usury to us ad infinitum. JUST TAX WE THE PEOPLE AS MUCH AS IS NEEDED TO CONTINUE UNTIL OUR DESIRE FOR YOUR WEALTH IS SATISFIED ( NEVER SATISFIED ) ! The governments want and need to overspend to control their power by buying votes from welfare recipients, subsidized sector blocks, contracts to super corporations for kickbacks, campaign financing ad naseum. The government and the fed tell us constantly that they are independent of each other and act ethically with the best interest of the people in mind. SURE, AND THE POPE IS A BAPTIST!
************************************************************************
You wrote:

A lowering of rates or an easing of monetary policy will lead to
stagflation. The world is not short on liquidity, it is awash in
overproduction from previous overliquidity. The contraction cannot be
stopped through monetary policy.
***********************************************************************
b ) The USA is not short on liquidity, but how about Asia, S America and the rest of the third world? A sudden flight of capital from these depressed areas to the dollar has increased our liquidity and strengthed the dollar beyond reason while decreasing in these other areas.
************************************************************************
You wrote:

In the last two transcripts of FOMC meetings which I read, there was
dissention of one and then two governors in that they wanted a tightening
of monetary policy due to the large increases in liquidity as measured by
M3. This while the Federal Reserve was banking on the Asian crisis to
slow down our economy. By slow down, they had to mean slowing down
inflation.

Even if profits are falling, wages are starting to increase. Witness the
willingness to strike. Our low rate of inflation was the result of falling
commodity prices. Inflation was there but hidden. Commodities are not
likely to continue falling and currency devaluations are not likely to mean
ever falling import prices because foreign economies are contracting. The
Fed has mentioned that these are one time benefits which are not likely to
be repeated.

Therefore the inflation which is present will become unmasked by these
one time occurences. The dollar is also not likely to stay as strong as it
is and is indeed falling. This will mean further increased import prices. As
foreign economies fail to invest in R&D and capital improvements due to
their financial crisis, they become less competitive and prices will still
rise further.

All this points to inflation even while economies contract due to profit
squeezes from pricing pressures and credit contraction. Liquidity
injections will not cure the fear of credit risks. Witness Japan.

All in all I say the Fed knows all this and will not lower interest knowing
that they will have to raise it in the near future. It will make them lose
credibility if they flip flop like that.
**********************************************************************
c ) Therein lies the problem. If the USA continues with their stronger than neccessary dollar policy ( FLOW OF CAPITAL FROM USA TO DEPRESSED AREAS WILL HAVE TO BE IMPLEMENTED, the USA will be all powerful temporarily ( UNTIL BANKS HAVE TO UNWIND THEIR BAD LOANS ) while the rest of the world goes into bankruptcy. IF RATES ARE NOT LOWERED SUBSTANTIALLY, UNDER THE PRESENT CONDITIONS, THE WORLD INCLUDING THE USA ARE READY TO TOPPLE OVER THE EDGE. IF THE FED RAISES RATES, THE DOLLAR WILL ONLY GET STRONGER AS THE MARKET TAKES A BIG HIT MAKING A BAD SITUATION WORSE. THIS IS WHY THEY WILL OPT TO LOWER RATES. LOWERING RATES WILL BAILOUT THE BANKS THAT ARE AWASH IN BAD LOANS TO THESE DEPRESSED AREAS AND MAJOR CORPS. THAT ARE LOSING BUSINESS AND INCOME.

EITHER WAY THEY ARE BETWEEN A ROCK AND A HARDPLACE AND WHATEVER THEY DO WILL BE TOO LITTLE TOO LATE. LOWERING RATES WILL ONLY BUY THEM MORE TIME.

When I capitalize my fonts, I'm not hollering, just highlighting, so please forgive me. This is just an opinion-ALL DISCLAIMERS APPLY.

Thanks MissingLink. I've learned from your posts and they made me think more than I normally would because I'm basically lazy.

Best regards,

Pete



Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:33
larryn (LBJ) ID#32078:
Copyright © 1998 larryn/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
SELBY..

IMHO it was obvious at the time ( spring 1968 ) that LBJ had such a bad time with his own party over the conduct of the Vietnam war that he was tired of being bitched at by Bobby Kennedy, Eugene McCarthy, and half the Senate. Since he had been king for about 5 years, he felt like he didn't want to mess with another campaign and therefore threw in the towel. I don't remember cancer being a public factor, although he might have considered it.

One reason that he was so discouraged was that his strategy on Vietnam, led by McNamara, was stupid and based on his extreme personal arrogance and only prolonged the war with no real effort to win or get out. McCarthy was getting good response from peaceniks as the only opposing candidate in the Democratic party and LBJ felt personally rejected. As soon as LBJ bailed out, Kennedy came in. Shortly thereafter he was shot.

From a personal perspective, LBJ and McNamara were arrogant fools. Their pride was costly. When I see Slick, I am reminded. We have yet to pay his bill.

By the way, LBJ's fiscal policies were one reason that the dollar was flying overseas and began to be redeemed by foreign banks for gold. Nixon eventually stopped it in 1971 because the US was losing its stockpile.

Today's situation is not very unlike 1967-70 where a mutual fund 'bonanza' ran out of steam and gold woke up.


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:32
tolerant1 (STUDIO_R, Namaste...Bilderberg my ass...these pricks and prickess's do not mean) ID#373284:
crap...their conversation could not reach as tall as the bran they discharge...trust fund scumbags one and all...I fear naught...not from crap with a microphone...nor muffled worthless parents...out picking up American garbage…washing windows…sweeping streets…no complaints…none…saying hello and being greeted by Americans…

America…as long as you and yours raise the flag…Hmmmmmmm……..we will let one eye sleep…

On a personal note…sombreros travel tomorrow…



Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:30
arden (Soros gold bet) ID#257344:
GD - Soros has already made his statement on gold. I believe he is still the largest shareholder of Newmont.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:26
Randomwalker__A (just out on Yahoo...unforseen events....) ID#409232:

EPA chief says quick deal needed on bank
bills

TOKYO, Sep 16 ( Reuters ) - Japanese Economic Planning Agency
Minister Taichi Sakaiya expressed hope on Wednesday that ruling and
opposition parties would agree as quickly as possible on legislation to clean up Japan's banking
sector.

At a regular news conference, Sakaiya said quick action was needed because of the possibility
of ``unforeseen events'' occurring in financial markets.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:25
chas (codeman re CLN) ID#147201:
Sounds good. I think I think I'll get some more

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:23
Gold Dancer (Soros) ID#430221:
Copyright © 1998 Gold Dancer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Soros has been very successful at making money. But I fail to
see any changes he wants being different from what is already being done.
He just wants MORE money for the IMF etc.
Sometimes he talks a good line. In the end, the common worker in
these countries suffers. He hastens their demise. While he blames those
who run the economies of foreign nations he enjoys destroying them to
prove he is smarter. But he takes the little guy with him. I sometimes
think there is a little too much German in him.

I know some of you think he is great and I can see your appreciation
of his making billions. But if he is really honest and wants to help
the world why doesn't he stop destroying and start building.
He could do this by trying to bring about a gold based monetary system.

My take is he won't do this because he loves the manipulation too
much. He is like Clinton in a way. He is addicted to power. He runs
too much money for anyones' good.

Let me hear him say something about gold being the only real money
there is, and the only money that will promote free trade and a better standard of living for the working people of the world and I will change my mind.

In the meantime I think his comments before Congress are to please
Congress. He wants to pretend to be on their side. So he promotes the
IMF etc. He does that so governments will leave him alone. He is
mearly trying to save his reputation. He is mainly a destroyer not a
builder. I think that was what Tolerant1 was talking about. He just
went a little overboard.

The world would be better off with gold as money.

Thanks, GD

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:23
Who Cares? (Soros Evil!) ID#242214:

I'm glad somebody else took issue with the Soros is evil thread.

Soros knows exactly what he is doing. He's taking advantage of
government-inspired inefficiencies, and working damn hard to
eliminate them; by bankruptcy if necessary.

Last time I checked on him in-depth, he had donated $300M to
various institutions in eastern Europe.

He knows what he is doing.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:23
arden (Hi Bill - I moved) ID#257344:
Bill - I moved this summer from the City of Sin to Middle America where my lovely daughter is going to college! ( I had to get her out of there! )

It is so nice to be back among normal people - who say things like please and thank you! And when the smile they really mean it!

Yes I enjoyed our visit also - say hello to your lovely wife!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:20
Carl (@SDRer) ID#341189:
Situational logic - When these people start building bridges or repairing planes with situational logic, I only hope they will be the first ones to use them.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:19
BillD (Silverbaron 19:43 ...) ID#263456:

ROTHLMFAO....Great site.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:14
codeman (The Hatt Re: Claimstaker) ID#159145:
Copyright © 1998 codeman/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I do not know weather you have seen the news release dated today, but it's a very interesting read. Apparently Blackdome is now in production and is capable of producing 3600 oz of gold per month. I phoned their marketing guy and got the cost of production in canadian dollars. His number was about $250.00 per oz. With gold selling for approximately $450.00 Canadian that leaves a hansom profit of $200 per oz. If you extrapolate that over the year you have profits of approximately $6,300,000 per year or 35 cents per share. The company is currently selling for 26 cents per share. I will pick up some of this tommorrow for sure.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:13
SDRer (Carl-Re: IMF and Do they really mean this…?) ID#290172:

When one watches/listens to All the President's Men ( the legal squad & the political troopers ) and/or listens/watches to Betty Freidan and the NOW legions, the chronic prevalence of the situational logic is apparent. As you see, they have absolutely no difficulty in holding two conflicting views at the same time.
On reflection, Fischer's cognitive dissonance is comparatively minor

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:12
BillinOregon (Arden) ID#262242:
Hello, looking forward to coming to Las Vegas again. Will let you know, lets get together. Enjoyed your company last time.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:10
Greenstone Gold (aurophile .......Soros) ID#435212:
Copyright © 1998 Greenstone Gold/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

I agree with your comments.

Soros is a bit of a star, and his comments concerning Russia and other countries are particularly valid at this time.

Pumping money into countries will only solve the problem provided that there is a level playing field , which frankly does not exist at this time of floating currencies.

Perhaps it is time to create that level playing field , and as I see it this can only be created by GOLD and not the US$.

It is astounding that the current mess evolved from the decoupling of the US$ and GOLD back in 1973, and the powers that be still want to perpetuate this farse.

What is it going to take to resolve the monetry crisis ?

Listen to Soros.........

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/business/the_economy/newsid_172000/172222.stm

Haggis

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:09
Mooney* (Speak Of the Devil! ;-)) ID#350194:
Hi Arden!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:08
arden (Hi yourself) ID#257344:
Mooney - hi yourself! Good to see such old friends tonight! ( I haven't sent you the sequel to my move - it only gets better! )

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:05
Mooney* (BBC - Soros Article) ID#350194:
This particular warning that Soros gave before the committee is not exactly Brahms before my beddy-time:
The remarkable prosperity of this country in the last decade is coming apart at the seams, Mr Soros said.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:03
arden (Soros) ID#257344:
Copyright © 1998 arden/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
To all - I watched with intense interest today when Soros testified. Keep in mind his statements today and his previous actions. In 1993 Soros led the gold boom buy first buying a huge chunk of Newmont, then he bought gold. Last October he sold a bunch of Newmont at 45 per share and gold subsequently fell from 340 to 275. I have heard that his hedge fund borrowed 2000 tons ( or is it tonnes? ) of gold from the BIS, sold it and bought US treasuries with the proceeds. If so, that was an excellent trade. Now, however, someone bought one hell of a lot of Newmont last week, driving the price from 14 to over 20. Rumour is that it was Soros. If so, the pattern fits well with previous behavior. He testimony today was a warning. He has already made his bets.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:02
BUFFORD (Special Buffet/Berkshire shareholders meeting tomorrow) ID#253246:

Shareholders meeting for Berkshire / General Re in corn country tommorrow. Maybe Warren will chat the box a little about his precious
positons in silver.

Come on Warren *******hep a po silverbug out

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 20:00
Mike Sheller (Mooney) ID#347447:
Yes, absolutely, some income producing apartments ( 17%-20% per annum ( ( plus capital gains based on inflation to come ) ) , a gold mine, the best Chief Geologist in the whole world...hey what more do we need?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:52
Mooney* (@Mike and Mr. Gold!) ID#350194:
As I was saying to Rhody just the other day, a nice bout of inflation is the ONLY way to save this world from a 'dirty thirties' Depression. Gold, Silver, other commodities and income-producing land ( with or without buildings, a small apartment building, a farm, a forest or perhaps a gold mine for instance - right Mike? - say hi to Arden for me! ) that you can keep away from bank repossession will be THE places to be.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:43
Silverbaron (Heh...heh...heh...So THIS is the way we get them to tell the truth) ID#273432:
http://www.reversespeech.com/clinton2.html

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:42
3-cubed (@DARKWING) ID#344239:
BBC NET HAS SOROS http://www.bbc.co.uk/home/today/index.shtml

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:39
MoReGoLd (@Hmmmmmm /////// SOROS ?) ID#348129:
Is his Quantum Fund loaded with GOLD derivatives ?
This guy sounded panicked, if I am reading him right.......

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:38
LongorShort (sharefin:RTC retest ) ID#318271:
went back for retest. failed RTC first time. passed this time. maybe they changed the test. http://www.zdnet.com/vlabs/y2k/testy2k.html

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:37
HighRise (Strange Relationships) ID#401460:

All Bonds and all currencies are down, Oil and some other commodities up.
Gold down?
http://www.mrci.com/qpnight.htm f

HighRise

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:27
Mike Sheller (auro) ID#347447:
cheers to wifey & thou! Remember - ONE olive. Two displaces too much Gin!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:26
Mike Sheller (aurophile, Mooney) ID#347447:
There can be no doubt, from Mr Bill's speach ( sic ) of the other day ( sick ) that REFLATIONE is the order of the day. Now if all those crusty Central Bankers can only be enlisted, we can have the Momma of all inflations. We've already had the biggest expansion of credit and money under GREENspan ( how prophetric is a name!!!! ) in history. Now all we need is a conscious and concerted inflation. And we will.
Get real...get gold.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:24
Fred (To: LGB) ID#341234:
-
That article you posted Tue Sep 15 1998 13:24 is the most optimistic I have heard for gold. Reduction in exploration will eventually cause the price of gold to rise. A low price alone is aparently not enough to reduce production. We have to wait until the mines run out of ore. The article did not mention that the mining companies are mining their high grade ore at an accelerated rate. The mines may start to run out sooner than they think.

Here is the best shot I can make at a timetable for investing:
1998 - Stocks go down some
1999 - Stocks go down a lot. Recession ( or depression ) begins. Gold is still so cheap that many mining companies go out of business.
2000 - ( Assume Y2K does not destroy the economy. ) Government begins to prime the pump by causing inflation. Gold starts to rally. Because mining has been reduced, there is not enough physical gold to go around. Gold rallies more.
2001-2002 - Economy does not get much better. Gold continues to rally. Stocks stay depressed.
2003-2006 - Sometime around here, things start to turn around. Stocks are so cheap, they are actually worth buying again. The cycle continues.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:22
aurophile (@ MIke Sheller) ID#201109:
Thanks bud! How goes it? oops, wifey bringing the liquid sapphire jewel! I be gone............

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:19
aurophile (@Mooney*) ID#201109:
Copyright © 1998 aurophile/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Hi guy! In retrospect I was wrong by about two years on what it would take to put in a commodity bottom and begin reflation. Not having lived though the previous one as an adult and not having understood Soros's central concept in Alchemy I did not appreciate sufficiently that it would take panic on the downside to get people's attention.

It has never been in doubt that reflation would come, since it always does at those famous intervals I won't bore you with just now. In any event I remain a reflationist as always and am optimistic that a few good men may be found amongst the cretins running the ship who will help steer it in the right direction. The Greenspan, Clinton, and Soros statements of the past week are an encouraging start.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:18
STUDIO.R (@T#1....) ID#119358:
is a word made to be minced? or, is a word to mince minds? i believe you know....what purpose one has to mince. i, as you, place honor before decorum. salud! studio.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:18
moa (Gold under pressure...) ID#269128:
pre-emptive strike....
nastiness to unfold for the remainder of the week.


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:18
darkwing (Soros) ID#215223:
Does anyone know where I can find the Soros transcript from todays speech?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:14
gagnrad (What's all the shouting about?) ID#43460:
I went back and did a Yahoo search on Soros today. It proves interesting but not alarming, at least to me, complacent as I am. I would hope all you folks take the time to go on a walk this evening and count the flowers. http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news?p=soros&n=10

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:12
Mike Sheller (aurophile) ID#347447:
How be you, man. You are absolutely on target with your comments re Soros. This is a true individual and a shining rebuke to government bullsh*t. If governments want to escape Georgie's wrath, they need only get their sh*t straight. Viva Speculatores!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:08
Mike Sheller (Thisn'that) ID#347447:
Mooney: I'm still in the inflation to be camp.

Soros evil? I refer you to Hedgehog's 18:19. He beat me to it, & probably a lot more eloquent.
If governments would get their acts together, speculators would have nobody to pick on.

Takshimi: Hope you found a nice coat. Arrigato.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 19:00
Fred (To: JP) ID#341234:
Your analysis of the market makes a lot of sense. You, SteveIS AUH20, EJ, etc. are doing a service by reminding people that this market is sick -- do not be fooled by this sucker rally.

tolerant1: Please do not get yourself kicked off this site. Your posts are too valuable.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:49
Mooney* (@The Missing Link @17:11) ID#350194:
Copyright © 1998 Mooney*/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
As we all know this place is the best! While many here are poinying out that a serious deflation is inevitable, others, such as yourself, believe, and provide valid reasoning, that the exact opposite is true.
My take on the current Stock Market mini-rally ( bilge pumps working at full speed? Aye aye Cap'n. ) is that the sheep are buying based on the expectation they are being fed ( ? ) that rates will soon be lowered. WHETHER or NOT this actually takes place it is presently priced into the market and NO MATTER WHAT happens the market will afterwards DIVE. ( Will the Cap'n go down with the ship? )
This, then, I predict, ( ignoring the advice of Sam, below ) is a perfect example of buy the rumour and sell the news or fact. ( Perhaps a day or two beforehand, may be the safest exit? Get INTO the lifeboats! )
Never make forecasts, especially about the future.
---Samuel Goldwyn

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:45
Mooney* (@The Missing Link @17:11) ID#350194:
Copyright © 1998 Mooney*/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
As we all know this place is the best! While many here are poinying out that a serious deflation is inevitable, others, such as yourself, believe, and provide valid reasoning, that the exact opposite is true.
My take on the current Stock Market mini-rally ( bilge pumps working at full speed? Aye aye Cap'n. ) is that the sheep are buying based on the expectation they are being fed ( ? ) that rates will soon be lowered. WHETHER or NOT this actually takes place it is presently priced into the market and NO MATTER WHAT happens the market will afterwards DIVE. ( Will the Cap'n go down with the ship? )
This, then, I predict, ( ignoring the advice of Sam, below ) is a perfect example of buy the rumour and sell the news or fact. ( Perhaps a day or two beforehand, may be the safest exit? Get INTO the lifeboats! )
Never make forecasts, especially about the future.
---Samuel Goldwyn

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:26
Tantalus Rex (XAU TODAY) ID#295111:
Copyright © 1998 Tantalus Rex/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
XAU END OF DAY SUMMARY
1998-09-15
ABX-Barrick Gold-------CLOSED AT $17.5625 -0.3125 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.38
ASL-Ashanti Gold-------CLOSED AT $07.2500 -0.2500 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.09
BMG-Battle Mountain---CLOSED AT $04.9375 -0.2500 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.19
CDE-Coeur D'Alene----CLOSED AT $05.1250 -0.1250 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.01
FCX-Freeport Mc-------CLOSED AT $12.6250 -0.6250 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.37
GGO-Getchell Gold-----CLOSED AT $14.1875 -0.0625 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.01
HL-Hecla Mining--------CLOSED AT $03.9375 -0.2500 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.04
HM-Homestake Gold---CLOSED AT $11.1875 -0.3125 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.21
NEM-Newmont Mining-CLOSED AT $19.3750 -0.3750 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.19
PDG-PlacerDome Gold-CLOSED AT $11.8750 -0.3125 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.25

XAU CLOSED AT 65.13 -1.79

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:25
chas (AUH2O your 17:46) ID#147201:
You got that right. They have to get them up to sell. Great discourse- shows understanding.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:24
aurophile (Soros) ID#201109:
Copyright © 1998 aurophile/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I am amazed when successful traders like Soros are vilified by other traders as at Avid. The man started very small and has made a great success by his wits and skill, something I should think we would want to emulate. He is unliked by imbecilic governments who don't know what they are doing ( redundant ) , and who resort to name calling of the vile gutter sort which then is adopted by those who should know better.

I got a chuckle from his jabs at that cretin Muhathir who has made Malaysia a laughing stock and pariah which will come to a very bad end.

Soros understands the financial system better than anyone I know and has consistently written and spoken for years about the need to do something about the out-of-control swings exacerbated by free trade, floating fiat currencies, free capital flows, and inadequate regulation of credit and market risks.

I wouldn't like to be on the opposite side of a trade from him, but I think Soros is as honest and decent a man as you get in finance: which is to say several orders of magnitude of decency above anything you get in politics where his true enemies live and work.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:20
SteveIS (The Sick Willie survives (although shriveled) rally is almost over) ID#280339:
Copyright © 1998 SteveIS/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Even if Starr doesn't drop the other shoe impeachment hearings will start
and erode Bent Left Willie's support.

The Dollar has continued to fall for this entire so called rally.

Volume has been light accept for the 380 point rebound day.

Advance decline has been very moderate during the rally.

1055 basis cash on the S&P will provide provide hugh resistance.

Bonds will continue to drop if the market rallies.

The 200 day moving average will provide added resistance at 1060 cash.

Earnings warning season will soon begin in earnest.

Maybe a rally to resistance tomorrow as RR and AG testify then down hard.

Buy GOLD!!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:20
EJ (Gold Dancer ) ID#229207:
Good point. Everyone sees the emerging markets as a ready source of new consumers, but not if they're earning $20 per month. Even in the US, where wages have been declining in real terms for 20 years, we can compensate for a drop-off in exports with greater domestic consumption from wage increases. But if corporations pay workers more, then corp. earnings go down. Bad for the stock market.

Hmmmmm. What to do.

-EJ

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:19
Hedgehog (Soros) ID#39857:
He is a leader, philanthropist, and whipping boy. Anyone who
has a problem with Soros has a bigger problem with their
government. And governments are quite happy to be blaming
currency traders at this point in history. What we need is
less devil worship and more respect for someone who is trying
to change the way things are done and at the same time
bobs up as a peoples safty net when the government net fails.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:17
MM (You'll find this said more and more.) ID#350179:
Recent economic news around the world is causing us to reassess our near-term business prospects in key international markets.

Tolly - Why don't you quit sugar coating it and tell us how you REALLY feel...

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:16
clone (Tolerant - wow! That was quite the post. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.) ID#267344:
Congratulations buddy! Say hello to F* for us! You will be sorely missed. -c

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:15
SDRer (From today's FT: the Look Like You're Doing Something ploy?) ID#290172:
Copyright © 1998 SDRer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

1. Global Leaders Anxious to make Financial System More Resilent to Further Shocks ( Biggest challenge in 50 years, says Clinton )

2. IMF May Change Stance: Capital curbs seen in more favourable light

3. GM Chief urges cut in US rates

4. European leaders urge reforms ( Strauss-Kahn in France and Oskar Lafontaine in Germany )

5. G7 Statement Response to Turmoil-Interest Rate Hint Reflects Deep Concern

6. And, from Comment & Analysis-Wake-up call for Greenspan: 'It is just not credible that the US can remain an oasis of prosperity.'

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:13
tolerant1 (message...Hmmmmmmmmmmm.....,,,,,,,,Soros....Hmmmmmmmmmmm....tapping) ID#373284:
Hmmmmmmmmm...Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm...eorge...forgot the G...NO disrespect intended...Hmmmmmmmm...Hitler was the piece of garbage you and yours drenched...the world with...MY FATHER...I will not speak for him...

There is America and then there is your death...fuck you...

The Republic...fuck you...

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:09
Speed (CRB Index has changed a bit in form) ID#28861:
http://www.crbindex.com/reviews/index.htm

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 18:00
lakshmi (Fundamentals in the market, also to Mike if you are about this late) ID#26350:
Copyright © 1998 lakshmi/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I can see the metals, especially precious having their own life irregardless of whether the DOW tanks or not. I mean either way they are undervalued at these levels, with junior mines selling for less per share than they would be worth if they broke up. Also, the less mines producing the less the supply. For instance copper--I hear no one is even scrapping it. Not that things can't always get worse.
Mike: I don't have an ephemeris that goes back past 1908, so I couldn't chart the NYSE. I drew up what I have ( eyeballing it, no computer finesse ) and by the system I use, which is sidereal I get Mars, Venus and Mercury in Leo with the sun moving into Virgo for today. The eclipses of course move counter clockwise opposite direction of the planets and orbs, so perhaps that will place them in Cancer this Spring. Looking over everything I have I get Oct 27th or 24th or 25th as buy dates, but then better buy dates at the end of December when the waxing moon is again in Taurus, increasing in potential right up the day of the sun and moons greatest brillance. I don't have any exact times yet, but patience is almost always a virtue even when making decisions. The fundamentals don't really change. This is a great time to buy a coat! For the price of what it costs to dry clean one. Must go shopping this weekend before anything else happens..... More soon, regards.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:59
lakshmi (Fundamentals in the market, also to Mike if you are about this late) ID#26350:
Copyright © 1998 lakshmi/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I can see the metals, especially precious having their own life irregardless of whether the DOW tanks or not. I mean either way they are undervalued at these levels, with junior mines selling for less per share than they would be worth if they broke up. Also, the less mines producing the less the supply. For instance copper--I hear no one is even scrapping it. Not that things can't always get worse.
Mike: I don't have an ephemeris that goes back past 1908, so I couldn't chart the NYSE. I drew up what I have ( eyeballing it, no computer finesse ) and by the system I use, which is sidereal I get Mars, Venus and Mercury in Leo with the sun moving into Virgo for today. The eclipses of course move counter clockwise opposite direction of the planets and orbs, so perhaps that will place them in Cancer this Spring. Looking over everything I have I get Oct 27th or 24th or 25th as buy dates, but then better buy dates at the end of December when the waxing moon is again in Taurus, increasing in potential right up the day of the sun and moons greatest brillance. I don't have any exact times yet, but patience is almost always a virtue even when making decisions. The fundamentals don't really change. This is a great time to buy a coat! For the price of what it costs to dry clean one. Must go shopping this weekend before anything else happens..... More soon, regards.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:56
Gold Dancer (EJ- How will they lower capacity?) ID#377196:
Copyright © 1998 Gold Dancer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
They don't have to lower capacity. They have to increase demand in
the developing countries. How? The same way Henry Ford raised the
demand for his cars. He paid his workers enough money so the could
afford to buy a Ford. How novel an idea!!!!

We have been thru the biggest period of income redistribution to the rich for a long time. Now they are stuck. No demand. Gee, I wonder how
that happened. You can downsize just so many times and you can be a
blood sucker by paying 25 cents an hour for only so long.

Supply side economics was nothing more than take care of the rich.

Demand side economics is the only way out. Funny we still don't hear
about it but wages are rising in the US. They must rise in Asia before
recovery can happen.

Thanks, GD

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:46
AUH20 (DISTRIBUTION PHASE) ID#200235:
Copyright © 1998 AUH20/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Over 600,000 registered stock brokers and numerous other Financial Managers are currently in the last phase prior to a hugh decline in the markets. It is called distribution. The big boys, the banks, Mutual Funds the insurance companies, the hedge funds are busily unloading at ever inflated prices their $2l Nations bank stock to the little guys ( mom &pop ) at the current price of $75.00. The market is being propped up by some limited buying on the part of these behemouths for the simple reason that they are slowly unloading their overvalued stocks to the average investor. Anyone buying anything in this market is being set up. This happens just before every decline in the markets.

The fund Managers will eveen appear on tv pushing certain stocks like coke, McDonalds, GE , Intel, MS swearing that they will double in value within the next 6 mos even as they are selling their funds position.


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:39
Gold Dancer ( Moa) ID#377196:
Agree with you about Soros. Smart as they come. And a cry baby like
they all are when they lose. I don't trust the man. He is after all the
money including mine.

He has too much money for any one person to have. That invites the
devil.

Thanks, GD

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:38
EJ (Lots of EPS estimate expectation setting going on today) ID#229207:
Copyright © 1998 EJ/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Morgan Stanley sees disappointing Q3 for 3M
NEW YORK, Sept 15 ( Reuters ) - Morgan Stanley Dean Witter
analyst Mark Gulley said in a research note to clients Tuesday
that he wouldn't be surprised if Minnesota Mining &
Manufacturing Co. pre-announced or released a disappointing
third quarter earnings report.
The current First Call third quarter earnings estimate is
$0.98 a share, and $3.88 for fiscal 1998.
We are becoming concerned about 3M's near-term earnings
outlook for a long list of reasons, Gulley wrote, adding the
principal one being slowing global economic growth.
-----
A commonly held falacy is that the global economy has been growing fast before the crisis. It's been growing at an average rate of 1.3% over the past decade. The globe already has too much capacity, resulting in deflation. Even a small drop in global growth will accelerate deflation. How will world leaders lower capacity?
-EJ

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:33
gwyz__A (Gold Dancer...) ID#432130:
Once again I agree with your opinion! : )

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:31
Chrisophilos (AUH2O....you forgot England in your list...) ID#277302:
and why England is not participating in the launch of the Euro, making the American's task of derailing a weakened Euro stay right on track.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:29
JP (Bully Beef--- You ar right) ID#253153:
Some people will not invest back in the market after the recent debacle,
but these are in a minority. The majority of investors are assuming that the worse is over and have resumed their mutual funds purchases. Unfortunately they have never dealt with a primary bear market and don't know what to expect. The second phase of this bear market will teach these new investors a lesson never to be forgotten again.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:16
Bully Beef (JP.... I don't know diddley but your take sounds plausible.) ID#259282:
Surely stocks aren't going to rocket again are they? My Brother in law bought,boeing ,bf goodrich and a drug co.,PMCT at the beginnning of Aug. against my advise. ( What would I know? ) He's lost almost 30% in his first foray into stocks.I don't think he is a happy customer. I don't think he will come back. Do you? He is an early generationXer in the aerospace industry. He is lost to the market for a long time. I think. Anyone young with money has about had it and will be suspicious about stocks and thus a loss of a big market. Am I repeating myself?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:11
moa (Soros is evil....but he knows gold.) ID#269128:
Copyright © 1998 moa/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
All sorrows noise right now is intended to put the wind up politicians ,bankers and people in general....he's intentionally adding fuel to the fire...as he has been doing all along.
This is the best indication yet that gold is about to skyrocket....if there ever was a baying of the wolves this is IT!.

Soros is hugely positioned in PM's and now is only waiting for the BANG. All his posturing about losses is as believeable as Clintons sincerity...this man knows how to manipulate media and opinion like the best of them ( sorrows that is ) . He is on our side but I don't know if I like it....sort of like laying down with the devil!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:11
TheMissingLink (Pete) ID#373403:
Copyright © 1998 TheMissingLink/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Its a tricky game. The Fed is supposed to be independent of government influence. This is how we are assured that monetary decisions are based on long term stability instead of short term political considerations.

Of course congress can fire the Fed but short of that there is supposed to be an arms length relationship.

A lowering of rates or an easing of monetary policy will lead to stagflation. The world is not short on liquidity, it is awash in overproduction from previous overliquidity. The contraction cannot be stopped through monetary policy.

In the last two transcripts of FOMC meetings which I read, there was dissention of one and then two governors in that they wanted a tightening of monetary policy due to the large increases in liquidity as measured by M3. This while the Federal Reserve was banking on the Asian crisis to slow down our economy. By slow down, they had to mean slowing down inflation.

Even if profits are falling, wages are starting to increase. Witness the willingness to strike. Our low rate of inflation was the result of falling commodity prices. Inflation was there but hidden. Commodities are not likely to continue falling and currency devaluations are not likely to mean ever falling import prices because foreign economies are contracting. The Fed has mentioned that these are one time benefits which are not likely to be repeated.

Therefore the inflation which is present will become unmasked by these one time occurences. The dollar is also not likely to stay as strong as it is and is indeed falling. This will mean further increased import prices. As foreign economies fail to invest in R&D and capital improvements due to their financial crisis, they become less competitive and prices will still rise further.

All this points to inflation even while economies contract due to profit squeezes from pricing pressures and credit contraction. Liquidity injections will not cure the fear of credit risks. Witness Japan.

All in all I say the Fed knows all this and will not lower interest knowing that they will have to raise it in the near future. It will make them lose credibility if they flip flop like that.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:08
jims (TO APH Dow 10,000 before gold $315?) ID#253418:
Copyright © 1998 jims/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
It may be a horse race if commodites and stocks rise as a result of an interest rate cut.

As usual the market looks set to confound all. Rather than rolling over and going down today as broadly perdicted around these parts - it rallied. Maybe headed for a spurt if the interest rate cut gets more credence as a cure to what ailes the world economies.

Gold and Silver and mining shares put in their second day of declines, showing no resiliance despite a lower dollar in Europe and those same interest rate possibilities.

I suspect the timing and direction of the markets will need some rethought tomorrow. Watch stocks rise and the metals continue to retreat and we all raise and lower our rally and pullback objectives.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 17:00
AUH20 (George Soros invented derivatives) ID#200235:
Copyright © 1998 AUH20/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
and now he is about to get the same treatment he has given to Indonesia, Japan, both Koreas, Malasia, Hong Kong, Mexico, Brazil and Venezuela and the list goes on and on but now it appears that he is on the losing end of the trades and is sucking up to congress to bail him out. It is a case of not who you know, but who you blow ( pun intended ) .It will be very interesting to watch this international gangster do a number on his like minded cronies in congress. It will also be interesting to see if the US taxpayer gets stuck with the bill for saving his @ss.

SELBY: LBJ diagnosed with terminal and inoperable cancer just prior to announcing he would not be a candidate for pres, nor would he serve if nominated...........


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:56
JP (Markets observations) ID#253153:
Copyright © 1998 JP/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I have been following bull and bear markets for over 30 years and would like to share with the group some observations regarding current markets.
We are in a confirmed Dow Theory Primary Bear Market as of Aug 4, 98. Every bull or bear market has 3 phases. The first phase in this bear market started when the Dow recorded it's high's on July 17 at 9336 and ended when the Dow closed recently at 7525. Usually the first phase is denial and disbelieve. Although the Dow declined 20% many people think the worse is over and are bottom fishing. Following the current brief rally, we should embark on the second phase which is very long in duration, very frustrating and very devasting in terms of stock losses. During the second phase, stocks respond to basic economic fundamentals. Since we are in a runaway deflationary phase, earning will vanished and instead investors will read about losses in the companies they own starting no later than the first quarter of 1999. No one can predict the length and duration of the second phase. We will be able to identify the bottom of the second phase once it's over. Following the second phase and a power rally, the third phase will commence. The third phase is the liquidation phase where stocks are being sold for no reason except for the fact that their owners need money to survive. Japan, Indonesia, South Korea, etc have entered the third phase in their stock markets. It's during the third phase down and first phase up where common stocks should be acquired. By then, the public will no longer be interested in stocks. Their primary interest will be in cash and JOBS. I'll provide more information in future posts.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:46
Gold Dancer (I couldn't believe it...) ID#377196:
Copyright © 1998 Gold Dancer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
A month or so ago when my girl friend was going to open a brokerage
account she called around and just talked to a few people. As soon
as she mentioned buying resource or gold stocks they ALL tried to sell
her Microsoft. They told her it was safer.

She stuck to her guns and decided to trade on line so she didn't
have to listen to a broker. I am sure they were well meaning and that is
my point. No wonder Microft has such a high capitalization. That's
where the money is!!! For now.

I wonder if Microsoft will follow RCA. As some of you will remember
RCA was the darling of the 20's crowd. It went to well over 100 and
then went to $3 by 1932. Can MSFT do the same thing? Judging by how
much that stock is owned and promoted it will be interesting to watch.



Thanks, GD




Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:38
James (Soros the humanist@After playing a major role in destroying the economies in ) ID#252150:
SEAsia, & the contagion that followed, he now has the formula to prevent future recurrences. You have to admit the, guy is all heart.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:29
James (You KNOW that the equity mkts are in terrible shape when you see a low key) ID#252150:
guy like Peter Lynch doing silly commercials on CNBC for Fidelity.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:29
chas (QT your 12 something today) ID#147201:
I have read literature, scirntific material neurosurgery etc for the last 40 years. What the hell was the real significance of your post Can you put it in a few pertinent sentences? I really enjoyed it, but have come away worse than I went in. Thanx, Charlie

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:27
Pete (themissinglink) ID#222231:
We'll know shortly about a rate cut or not. AG may be a big man, but he takes orders too.

Best regards,

Pete

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:16
Gold Dancer (Pete) ID#377196:
Maybe they just pulled the rabbit out of the hat. Let's see
what Fast Track does. Anything is possible. I just don't see new
highs. A good bear market ralley? Let's watch and see.

The wonderful thing about opinions in the market is that we get
to see what they are worth. This is a no bull s*** arena.

Thanks, GD

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:13
powmain (For the last 6 years WJC has been giving the world what he got ) ID#21275:
from Monica and that ant no lie.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:12
TheMissingLink (Predictions) ID#373403:
Alan Greenspan will not be bullied into lowering rates. The stock market is still above irrational exuberance. I think he will compromise by shifting to a bias towards lowering.

Everyone will be happy and it will not mean anything.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:12
6pak (USofA Fast Track @ Corn INDUSTRY & Low farm prices? By design maybe?) ID#335190:
Copyright © 1998 6pak/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
CORN INDUSTRY UPDATE

September 14 - NEWS CONFERENCE TO ADDRESS FAST TRACK: Illinois Corn Growers Association, Kankakee County Farm Bureau and J.R. Short Milling Company will conduct a joint news conference Wednesday, Sept. 16, 1998 to address the need for Fast Track Trade negotiating authority.

Short officials indicate they would likely double their corn grind if the U.S. commitment to trade was increased in order to eliminate unfair trade practices and subsidies. Fast Track is critical to arming U.S. trade negotiators for the World Trade Organization talks scheduled for 1999.

September 11 - FAST TRACK CAMPAIGN GAINING GROUND: It's an election year and the noise being made by farmers about the need to pass Fast Track is beginning to have an effect.

Our elected officials are taking notice of Illinois Corn Growers Association's pro-Fast Track advertising campaign and the milk jugs filled with corn showing up on the doorsteps of Congress.

Although difficult to track, we have a rough count of more than 60 jugs of corn being delivered to the White House, 131 to Senator Carol Moseley-Braun, and more than 125 going to various Congressional offices.
More are arriving each day with an attached letter supporting Fast Track from one of their constituents. And beginning on Sept. 9, radio and print ads began running across Illinois explaining the need for Fast Track.

Now, it's time for a last minute push. This is how you can help.....

ACTION NEEDED NOW ON FAST TRACK: If you are concerned about low corn prices and profitability, then there is something you can do today which can help address the problem. Call the 1-888-WHY-CORN ( 1-888-949-2676 ) , ask for your Congressman and Senators, and tell them it is essential they pass Fast Track as soon as possible.

Immediate action is necessary because a vote could come as early as the week of September 21, 1998.

http://www.ilcorn.org/update.htm

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:12
MM (I hope the spaces aren't parsed out (close)) ID#350179:
OPEN CLOSE %CHG CHG
7945.35 8024.39 .99% 79.04
66.92 65.13 -2.67% -1.79

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 16:09
STUDIO.R (@JackO.........) ID#119358:
will the spin-meisters ever run out of thread? probably not. salud!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:56
6pak (USofA Fast Track @ MAI (Agreement on international investments) ) ID#335190:
Copyright © 1998 6pak/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
September 15, 1998

Lott sees U.S. Senate fast-track vote next week

WASHINGTON, Sept 15 ( Reuters ) - U.S. Senate Majority Leader Trent Lott on Tuesday said the Senate was likely to vote next week on fast-track legislation giving the president special powers in negotiating trade agreements.

We're going to vote on fast track ... probably next week, the Mississippi Republican told reporters.

The House of Representatives was also expected to vote next week on fast-track legislation, which would allow Congress to vote for or against a trade pact negotiated by the White House with other countries, but not to amend any agreement.


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:34
Highhopes (Regional currency stability pact) ID#404410:
CNBC says that they've gotten wind of a regional currency stability pact being prepared to be put in place. Who knows?

Highhopes

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:31
Selby (Local US Historians) ID#286230:
At the time LBJ announced he would not for a second tome I was in graduate school and had no idea or interest or time to find out why he chose not to run. Now 30 years later I'd like to know. What issue or problem prompted him not to run?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:24
Jack (Studio R) ID#237264:

When that truth happens, to be sure the blame will be placed upon something like a military confrontation IRAN/AFGANISTAN or the like.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:19
NightWriter (Status) ID#390415:
XAU off 2.29%

Gold off 30 cents

Clinton up 1/2 at 63.4%

Gold acting very contrarian today, pretty much as it is supposed to.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:18
Pete (Gold Dancer) ID#222231:
Your world view is as good as mine if not better. I think that they will have one more trick up their sleeves; reducing rates will get the herd stampeding back into the market as AG would say, EXHUBERANTLY. One more chance to fleece the suckers before the end. IMHO.

Thanks,

Pete

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:17
Sojourn (Lurker 777, be prepared to cover fast) ID#28939:

The next move for gold after a week or so of consolidation in a wave 2 of C will be a move above 300 in a point of recognition move in wave 3 of c. This will also break the Feb 96 downtrend line. The April-August downtrend has already been broken on the Xau, Gold & Silver index on Toronto , and the price of gold itself.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:16
STUDIO.R (@one day, when we see a $30. increase in the POG.....) ID#119358:
we'll know that some soon-to-be-poor bastard just got his gold loan called ( not renewed ) . shouldn't be long now........

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:13
moa (Russian gold production falls...) ID#269128:
I think the tons should be ounces..

http://dailynews.yahoo.com/headlines/ap/financial/story.html?s=v/ap/980915/financial/stories/russia_gold_1.html

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:11
Pete (3-cubed) ID#222231:
Soros and his ilk are beginning to panic. Is the meltdown far away? I think not.

Best regards,

Pete

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:08
MM (Afghanistan, Iran POV's) ID#350179:
http://www.iran-press-service.com/
http://fermat.stmarys-ca.edu/~twafa/afghan.html
http://www.taleban.com/

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:07
moa (America is a SICK country....proof.) ID#269128:
Want to go crazy...move to the states....

gogold, down yankee toilet paper.

http://dailynews.yahoo.com/headlines/ap/ap_headlines/story.html?s=v/ap/980915/ap_headlines/stories/immigrant_illness_1.html





Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:06
3-cubed (@PETE) ID#344239:
I HAD NOT READ YOUR POST OF 14:31 BUT I THANK SOROS HAS IN MIND OF SETTING UP THE WORLD CENTRAL BANKS LIKE THE FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTEM.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:05
STUDIO.R (@Senor Soros........merchant of the dollar.....) ID#119358:
undermining economies worldwide by hooking them on the dollar....in the name of capitalism, no less!....whilest his pimp Camdessus and the IMF whores take care of the dazzling entertainmentwork. Yes, the dollar is economic crack cocaine. I just need one more more hit, baby.

The dollar must be banned by emerging markets. outlawed.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:03
John Disney (confirmation.) ID#24135:
to all ..
someone asked me to confirm that my
favorite RSA stock was Harmony ..
Yes it is .. I also like and hold
drooy ( which I like a lot right now ) ..
randfontein, and st-helena. I also
hold avgold, avmin, northam, jci-gold,
and a small company called east-dagga.
This last company is for the moment
a little slot machine .. there are no
adr available so you wont be able to
do much about it.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:03
Gold Dancer (Pete and the world according to Gold Dancer) ID#377196:
Copyright © 1998 Gold Dancer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Great piece. Sounds good but I am not so sure the dow is going to
a new high. Yes, I can see a rate cut by the end of September but maybe not. If so, I would worry that the markets will see this as an
admission that all is not well and instead of going up will actually
head down big time. This makes more sense to me.

Lower interest rates mean a slowing economy. Investors are already
noticing that earnings are declining. Stocks have already been
pounded once so I don't think the market is going to new highs.

The affect on gold, however, will be different. As the US lowers
its' interest rate it makes the gold carry and the Yen carry trades
untenable. So the Yen and gold rise and the dollar falls.

As the dollar falls all commodities rise in price against the dollar.

Seeing this the public will slowly at first then more rapidly
start buying the gold funds. The funds will buy more gold stocks
and the gold boom is here. This could last 3 months or 15 months.

Thats what I think is and will be happening more and more.


Thanks, GD

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:01
powmain (will tomorrows pitch by AG & RR bost the close above 3 digits?) ID#21275:
I think so

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 15:01
6pak (U.SofA Small Farmer require Aid @ Likely Industrial Farmers will receive aid NOT Farmers.) ID#335190:
Copyright © 1998 6pak/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Clinton to press U.S. Congress to help farmers

WASHINGTON ( Reuters ) - President Clinton urged U.S. Congress Tuesday to approve emergency legislation to help farmers out of a crisis he said threatened to cause thousands to lose their farms this year.
There is suffering on the farm. There is agony on the farm, Clinton told representatives of the National Farmers Union.

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Update — Milk Marketing Order Controversy
March 19, 1998

Judge Doty ruled that these prices were unlawful because USDA has not shown that they reflect supply and demand conditions in most parts of the country, as is required by the federal law that authorizes milk marketing orders.

Shortly after the district court issued its decision, USDA asked Judge Doty to delay the effect of his order until an appeal of the decision was completed.

In addition, several dairy interest groups and state departments of agriculture from regions outside the Upper Midwest attempted to enter the lawsuit on the side of USDA and also asked the court to delay the effect of its decision until an appeal was completed.

On December 5, 1997, Judge Doty granted USDA a short stay of his order prohibiting enforcement of most of the Class I differentials until February 15, 1998.

National Commission on Small Farms Issues Final Report
March 12, 1998

USDA’s National Commission on Small Farms has published a final report, A Time to Act. The Commission made nearly 150 recommendations to correct what it believed were biases against small farms in federal policy and markets.

The Commission defined small farms as those with sales of sells than $250,000 and that were operated by families that own or lease the farm’s assets.

http://www.flaginc.org/news/news.htm#980312

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:59
SteveIS (Soros recommends increased IMF funding) ID#280339:
Soros is a statist dirtbag. Giving more money to Cam-disease and IMF will lead to a Latin American debacle. But at least Rubins buddies will get paid off.

Buy GOLD!!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:58
Lurker 777 (The play of the day!) ID#320226:
Today I bought November 290 puts for $400 each. I am looking for a retest of $275 spot gold by October 9th. Seems like a no brainier to me but what do I know! By the way, I am heavily invested in Austrian Philliharmonic 999.9% pure gold bullion coins with a Guaranteed Face value of 2000 shillings ( $160US ) . Bought all of them for under $300 each and have December 99 290 puts to cover my ASSests.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:56
Gollum (DOW +46) ID#43349:
I have been busy today with no chance to keep an eye on things. I see our yellow submarine is acting like a balloon. I guess I'll just give this lever a yank ( I think it's the dive lever ) and come back later this afternoon to see how it did. I CAN trust you guys, right? See ya latah.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:56
3-cubed (SOROS) ID#344239:
IT LOOKS LIKE GEORGR SOROS IS TRYING TO CREATE ANOTHER INTERNATIONAL CREATURE FROM JEKYLL ISLAND. ANY COMMENTS?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:48
Jack (Soros;) ID#237264:

telling the good buddies over at Congress how pandamonium in Brazil could infect Argentina.
Pleeze Boys, save my investments, duh speculations, which somehow overshot my initial intentions to make a buck.
Full artical supposed to be at Yahoo soon.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:48
3-cubed (test) ID#344239:
test

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:46
MM () ID#350179:
-
Iran must know that if the soil of Afghanistan is attacked, we will target Iranian cities and the entire responsibility will rest with Iranian authorities, Taliban spokesman Wakil Ahmed told the independent Afghan Islamic Press.

Taliban threatens retaliation if Iran strikes - Iranian military on alert
http://cnn.com/WORLD/meast/9809/15/iran.afghan.tensions.02/index.html

QT: enjoyed your post ( the first time; ) Hint: when the load on Kitco is high, server response is hindered - Wait for the response screen, save your text, and check to see if it posted. Resist the temptation to go Back or Refresh in the posting screen. Good luck.

Gollum - watch for cavitation...

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:31
Pete (The world according to pete, or a misguided look at the BIG PICTURE?) ID#222231:
Copyright © 1998 Pete/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Update on my post 9-02-98

If anyone noticed, our illustrious leader, WJC addressed the CFR on the need to stimulate economies world wide recently ( IN REALITY, INFLATE ) . A rate cut is now a certainty.IMO. The rate cut is neccessary to stop world wide deflation caused by strong dollar.

For other nations such as Germany, France, etc., it would be counterproductive for them to co-ordinate a rate cut in conjunction with the USA. It is clear that a shift of funds flowing into the USA has to be curtailed before a world wide currency collapse becomes a certainty.

Here comes my prognostication re: the world economy and especially the USA. Sometime, probably before the end of September, the FRB will make a substantial cut in rates. At that time the following will happen:

1 ) The equity market will explode up to possibly 10,000.

2 ) All commodities and especially the PMs will rise.

3 ) This rise in commodities will boost nations economies and halt currency devaluations.

4 ) Inflation will occur rapidly. By this means the internal and external debt problems will abate temporarilly.

5 ) Sometime after the market makes new highs and inflation shows its ugly head, the FRB will have no choice except to begin raising rates.

6 ) The USA market will begin to implode ( CRASH ) . Puetze's and ANOTHERS predictions will become a reality and his trashers and tormentors will have egg on their faces.

SOROS IS ABOUT TO SPEAK. LISTEN CAREFULLY!


Date: Wed Sep 02 1998 09:49
Pete ( ALL-Repost with additions ) ID#222231:
Copyright © 1998 Pete/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I really did'nt take the time to post the following with more salient points:


Date: Mon Aug 31 1998 23:53
Pete ( ALL-Dead cat bounce? ) ID#222231:
Copyright © 1998 Pete/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Even as bad as the drop has been the past week I think we have one more

leg up, possibly to 10,000 before the final implosion. I will try to
enumerate as follows:

( 1 ) Many have profits that would be subject to capital gains taxes of 20%

or more. The herd will not sell until their losses are substantially greater
than 20%. ( Below Dow 7000 )

( 2 ) The herd mentality will be to reenter the market at 7000+ as a buying
opportunity one last time because they have the mistaken belief that the
equity market is still viable.

( 3 ) The FRB will lower rates very soon because if they don't, they will
fear the consequences.this will give one more final breath of life to the
market.

( 4 ) Finally the pundits and media will be convincing the herd not to
panic, a fact that is apparent from surveys of the ignorant investors. This
will give the imputus to # ( 2 ) .

All of the above should occur within the next two months. Do not despair
for I believe this will be the last hurrah before the final meltdown. The
precious metals will shine as never before shortly thereafter. IMHO.

I for one have no empathy for greedy investors that expect 20%-30% gains

yearly forever. They will finally get what they rightfully deserve.



( 5 ) Many Corps. are planning and announcing share buyback plans such
as IBM did last October.

( 6 ) Until the average investor is burned by THE BURNING MATCH
convincingly, this market will continue in an uptrend for a while.

There is an old axiom, turn bearish SLOWLY and turn bullish fast.

The following by Larry Williams:

Market tops are difficult to identify. This is true partly because of the
long duration and partly because tops are made as prices break to new
highs. Logically the break to new highs should produce even higher prices
and is very difficult to get bearish about. But close study of major market
tops shows they ALMOST always come immerdiately after a break to new
highs!

In the event you fail to notice the actual market top, there's always one
more chance to get out before the real serious damage is done by the
rampaging bears. This chance to bail out usually occurs about 3 months
after the major market top has been formed. The pattern is one
whereprices break badly from the major market top and decline for almost
1 1/2 months. Then an intermediate term rally begins that most people
wrongly call the start of a new bull move. It is'nt! It's just the opportunity
to do your final selling as prices rally back towards the original high
point.

We have what I would call sinister forces such as the PPT, extraordinary
media propaganda and biased analysts and pundits that have been
working overtime to delay the inevitable. This is probably the reason for
long delay of a true bear market from the last October meltdown.

IMHO, I believe that we will break to new highs again ( 10,000+/- )
because of the above. Then an extraordinary event will occur ie: Clinton
impeachment, Japanese market and bank failures etc. that will put the
final nail in the coffin.

Then and only then flows of capital into PMs, will after major currency
devaluations, raise the PMs to unheard of before HIGHS.


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:30
Chrisophilos (The american farmer will also give the American....) ID#277302:
a nasty case of heartburn along with a real reason to worry about accelerating prices when he soon starts a campaign of burning his crops and slaughtering and burning his livestock en masse....soon.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:10
Speed (Add an L to the link) ID#29048:
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/exclusiv/980915.exbre_starr_indict_.html

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:10
SDRer (The Road to Chaos is paved with fine distinctions?) ID#286249:
Copyright © 1998 SDRer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
QUESTION: Where a national currency is to be converted into the euro ( or vice versa ) , what method will be used and how will the resulting amount be rounded?

Conversion rates will be stated to six significant figures ( not to be confused with decimal points ) .[Isn't THAT interesting! SDRer] So, using a hypothetical example, one euro might be equal to DM 1.97048. To avoid inaccuracies, conversion rates will be fixed only between the euro and national currency units. Inverse rates ( I.E. AN APPROXIMATION TO THE RECIPROCAL OF 1.97048, SUCH AS 0.507491 IN THE ABOVE EXAMPLE ) MAY NOT BE USED. Bilateral rates between national currency units will be derived from these conversion rates. Monetary amounts to be paid or accounted for after conversion into euros will be rounded up or down to the nearest cent.
http://www.lovellwhitedurrant.com/NewSite/ARTICLES/emu.htm

Isn't power wunderful...the numbers after the decimal point shouldn't be
confused with decimal places. They are the Wizard's Significant Numbers!




Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:09
Speed (Starr indictments said to be imminent ) ID#29048:
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/exclusiv/980915.exbre_starr_indict_.htm

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:08
EJ (sharefin) ID#229207:
Copyright © 1998 EJ/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
The market's looking for a sign.

Investors have complete faith in world leaders to get together to solve the global financial crisis. It is believed that governments control economies, and governments do much to reinforce this belief by taking credit for the economy during good economic times. World leaders are now setting high expectations of their ability to rise to this occasion of world financial turmoil.

In this environment, a hint of maybe perhaps lowering interest rates by Greenspan mutates into a promise to drop interest rates that AG now cannot deny. Likewise, the act of meeting sets the expectation that after the meeting, all will return to normal, the G7 leaders having magically fixed the problem.

What a shock, then, when the next new problem shows up after the meeting.

-EJ

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 14:01
pictech__A (crazytimes) ID#214218:
That magazine you are referring to has it got a web address?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:59
Goldteck (N Korea satellite 'failed to enter orbit' ) ID#431200:
Copyright © 1998 Goldteck/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Tuesday, September 15, 1998 Published at 04:00 GMT 05:00 UK
World: Asia-Pacific The satellite never reached orbit
The United States now says a suspected North Korean missile launched two weeks ago over Japanese territory was in fact a small satellite which failed to go into orbit.
Katy Kay: US at first dismissed the idea of a satelliteDescribing the satellite launch as dangerous and destabilising, State Department spokesman James Rubin said it demonstrated North Korea's capacity to threaten its neighbours.
Japan has since suspended most aid and co-operation with North Korea, which maintains that the satellite was successfully launched.
Initially thought to be a medium-range ballistic missile, the object flew nearly 2,000km over Japanese territory before landing in the Pacific Ocean. A few days after the launch, North Korea announced the object was a satellite - an assertion that was supported by Russian evidence but met with doubt in the United States and Japan.
Russian observers have said the satellite is circling the earth every two hours and 45 minutes in a high, elliptical orbit.
BBC Defence analyst Nick Childs says the realisation that it was a satellite launch will only reinforce concerns about North Korea's missile ambitions and the pace of missile proliferation around the world.
Weapons fears remain
North Korea retains powerful missile capabilities.North Korea retains powerful missile capabilitiesNevertheless, the technologies needed to produce a ballistic missile and a satellite launch vehicle are in many respects indistinguishable, so the realisation that the rocket was indeed carrying a satellite has done nothing to calm fears of North Korea's weapons potential.
The official Korean Central News Agency announcement said the satellite would help Pyongyang in its research for launching practical satellites in the future.
It is transmitting, according to the announcement, the melody of the immortal revolutionary hymns 'Song of General Kim Il-Sung' and 'Song of Kim Jong-Il' and the Morse signals 'juche Korea' in 27MHz.
Juche, or self-reliance, is North Korea's guiding philosophy.
Satellites and starvation
Correspondents have linked the timing of the rocket launch to the 50th anniversary of the Communist state last week.
The BBC correspondent in Seoul, Andrew Wood, says it is difficult to see what use a satellite might be to North Korea.
In the famine of the past few years hundreds of thousands are reported to have died and the country is dependent on foreign aid.
But our correspondent says that exports of missile technology mainly to the Middle East are believed to have raised hundreds of millions of much-needed dollars for North Korea http://www.news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/asia-pacific/newsid_171000/171564.stm

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:48
LGB (No more posts today) ID#269409:
I know the letters LGB are overstaying their welcome, so no more paosts today. Besides, very important rocket science awaits...we have a launch tonight ( PanAmSat ) and I SURE don't want to see a repeat of last week's fiasco!

Have a profitable day...I'm buying some LOR stock and silver coin today!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:46
STUDIO.R (@da' gold stox........) ID#119358:
da' worm...he may not be a turnin'...but he sho' is squirmin'.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:45
LGB (All about new Russian Foreign Minister....Ivanov) ID#269409:
Copyright © 1998 LGB/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Forget all the policy and European connection stuff below. The important thing to note here of course, is that his taste in clothing is well reported in this article.

uesday September 15, 1:32 pm Eastern Time

New Russian foreign minister vows open diplomacy

By Gareth Jones

MOSCOW, Sept 15 ( Reuters ) - Russia's new foreign minister, anxious to reassure Western countries that
Moscow remains a reliable partner despite swirling economic turmoil, vowed on Tuesday to pursue an
open, democratic foreign policy.

Igor Ivanov, praised by Russian newspapers as a shrewd and elegant diplomat, will hold a series of meetings with foreign officials in the
coming days in which he is expected to stress continuity in Russian foreign policy.

``Our primary task is to create external conditions favourable to the continuation of the democratic changes pursued by the Russian
government,'' Ivanov told reporters after holding talks with President Boris Yeltsin in the Kremlin.

Ivanov, who is 53, said Yeltsin had urged him to promote Russia's national interests on the global stage while seeking cooperation on a wide
range of issues including security.

Prime Minister Yevgeny Primakov, Ivanov's predecessor as head of the foreign ministry, also attended the meeting and was quoted by
Interfax news agency as saying Yeltsin had praised the new minister's professional qualities.

The balding Ivanov, known for his taste in elegant suits, is a former ambassador to Spain and served as first deputy foreign minister until his
latest promotion, which followed Primakov's confirmation by parliament last Friday as prime minister.

Foreign Ministry spokesman Vladimir Rakhmanin said on Tuesday that Ivanov would brief three European Union ministers in Moscow on
Thursday on Russia's situation.

Germany's Foreign Minister Klaus Kinkel, Austria's Foreign Minister Wolfgang Schuessel and Britain's Minister for Europe Joyce Quin will
represent the so-called ``troika'' of present, previous and next holders of the EU presidency.

They are expected to tell Ivanov the 15-nation bloc can offer Russia no new financial aid but will continue to support its market reforms.

Ivanov has already held telephone conversations with Kinkel -- Germany is Russia's most important Western trading partner -- and with U.S.
Secretary of State Madeleine Albright.

Ivanov will travel to New York next weekend to attend part of the 53rd annual session of the United Nations' General Assembly. Rakhmanin
said Ivanov would hold a series of meetings with many foreign counterparts during his visit.

``The foreign policy of Russia remains unchanged,'' Rakhmanin told a regular news briefing. ``We shall do everything to ensure Russian
foreign policy remains consistent, predictable and constructive,'' he said.

Ivanov, who speaks Spanish and English, is expected to maintain Primakov's line of building closer ties with China, Japan, India and a host of
countries in the developing world.

Unlike Primakov, an Arabic-speaking Middle East expert, Ivanov has stronger professional ties with Europe and has been involved in efforts
to bring peace to former Yugoslavia.

But Rakhmanin dismissed suggestions that this might herald any shift of emphasis in Russian foreign policy.

``When somebody becomes a minister he can't allow personal sympathies to guide his decisions. Europe remains a top priority but this does
not mean we give up on the Middle East, China, Japan or the United States,'' Rakhmanin told Reuters.

He said Ivanov was widely respected in the ministry as a professional diplomat who had flourished under successive governments since Soviet
times. ``He represents the best of our tradition here at the foreign ministry,'' Rakhmanin said.

Russian newspapers on Tuesday echoed his warm words.

``Ivanov scrupulously abides by the model of the apolitical state servant,'' the liberal Izvestia newspaper said in a front-page article entitled
``the diplomat beyond party.''

The Nezavisimaya daily said Ivanov was a workaholic, citing rumours that he had worked thoroughly on as many as 900 documents in a
single day.

The paper said Ivanov's discreet, shy manner concealed a tough operator but added that Primakov, who has dominated Russian diplomacy for
the past two and a half years, might continue for some time to influence foreign policy.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:42
crazytimes (@ Gold Dancer) ID#342376:
Yes, the September issue is out. I got mine yesterday. When the biggest gold newsletter makes a statement about the best gold stock to have, you'll see the stock rise just on that. At least that's my guess why DROOY is exploding today.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:35
LGB (@Sharefin....Even MORE Puetzkian post eclispe effect) ID#269409:
Copyright © 1998 LGB/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Curbs on BUY programs by NYSE? What's with this market manipulation! Where's SHarefin stand on this dammit!


Tuesday September 15, 1:27 pm Eastern Time

Dow jumps in late trading on buy program, Merck

Dow up 74 points to 8019 in afternoon trading as a buy program helped sweeps the average above the
8,000 mark, analysts said. NYSE set curbs on certain computer buy programs at 1258 EDT/1658 GMT.
Merck, up 4-3/8, also helps boost the Dow. of monetary policy. S&P, Nasdaq also higher but not pacing
the Dow. S&P up nearly six points to 1035, Nasdaq up only one to 1666. Advancers and decliners almost
even on Big Board. Long bond up 2/32 to yield 5.23 pct. DOW S&P500 NASDAQ U.S. RETAIL SALES
UP MODESTLY IN AUGUST [nN1579169]

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:33
Gandalf the White (Error in naming the Sub (Gollum)) ID#433301:
Youse should have named it the XAU rather than the INDU
GW

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:32
LGB (More Puetzkian Post Eclispe effect) ID#269409:
Copyright © 1998 LGB/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Tuesday September 15, 1:18 pm Eastern Time

Argentine shares surge on Brazil optimism

BUENOS AIRES, Sept 15 ( Reuters ) - Argentine shares surged ahead in early floor trade Tuesday
following gains in Brazil and optimism that world leaders will lend Latin America a hand in fighting the
economic turbulence rocking the world.

The MerVal index of most traded Buenos Aires shares was up 10.87 percent at 376.68 points at 1400
local/1700 GMT. Volume was robust at 24 million pesos.

Argentine shares with ADRs in New York and highly liquid stocks were leading the rally, with Telefonica at the front, up 15 percent to 2.55
pesos.

``It's accompanying a rise in telecommunications shares across the region,'' said fund manager Nicolas Max at Santander Investment.

``These are very liquid shares that are easiest to get into and out of,'' he said.

Stocks surged across Latin America Monday when the Group of Seven industrialized nations released a statement later echoed by U.S.
President Bill Clinton that they would extend help to the region's economies, should they need i

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:31
STUDIO.R (@and for the oileys..........) ID#119358:
Okla. crude oil production for the first six months of 1998......down 31% from same period last year ( which was an 80 year low! ) less than 32 million barrels. remarkable. studio's.shut.in.too watch out world...fill 'er up!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:29
Gold Dancer (Crazytimes) ID#377196:
I have a subsctiption to Blanchard. Is the Sept. issue out yet? I
have not received mine yet.

Thanks, GD

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:28
LGB (@ Sheller) ID#269409:
Admit it Mike, you and QT are one........

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:24
LGB (GOLD Exploration budgest being cut......Future production fall?) ID#269409:
Copyright © 1998 LGB/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Monday September 14, 6:09 pm Eastern Time

Gold exploration cuts can impact output in 3-5 yrs

NEW YORK, Sept 14 ( Reuters ) - Gold's recent skid to 18-year lows will eventually put pressure on
future exploration projects that could be felt by the gold market in three-to-five years, according to Bakes
Mitchell, senior research analyst at consulting firm Metals Economics Group.

``On a year-to-year basis, exploration budgets are off ( substantially ) and if the price remains below $320
an ounce, they could be trimmed further,'' Mitchell said.

At Monday's close, COMEX December gold was at $293.40 an ounce, a decline of $3.40 on the session.

Mitchell said many future mining projects were dependent on gold prices being above $375 an ounce.

``Fifty percent of ( prospective ) projects slated for the U.S. are on hold, and 26 percent of projects in Canada are on hold,'' he said.

``Regionally, ( exploration budgets ) have been cut across the board, but wouldn't be felt in the market for three-to-five years,'' he added.

Echo Bay Mines ( Toronto:ECO.TO - news ) went from an exploration budget of $100 million to 1997 to $4 million in 1998. Inmet Mining
Co ( Toronto:IMN.TO - news ) and Pegasus Gold ( Toronto:PGU.TO - news ) have also cut their exploration budgets for the coming year.

Even larger diversified companies like Broken Hill Proprietary , Rio Tinto Plc ( quote from Yahoo! UK & Ireland: RIO.L ) and Newmont Mining
( Toronto:NEM.TO - news ) were expected to cut their exploration budgets as well.

Companies bucking the trend, he said, were Placer Dome ( Toronto:PDG.TO - news ) , Anglo American Gold , Homestake Mining Co
( NYSE:HM - news ) , and Normandy Mining , all of which are not expected to cut their exploration budgets.

The two main factors affecting future exploration include political risk and co-product pricing.

``We're not sure if the political risk is part of a structural change, but it is causing some concern for investors,'' Mitchell said, particularly in
the Democratic Republic of the Congo, Indonesia and Russia.

Many gold projects are developed with its copper content in mind, he said.

``Right now, copper's prospects are not good,'' he said, with benchmark London Metal Exchange three-month prices hovering close to its
13-year low.

Gold companies, therefore, are likely to look to acquisitions to increase their production of gold. While gold stock prices are at historic lows
and are seen by many as a bargain, junior gold companies want to see an upturn in the market rather than selling their stock at fire sale
prices, he said.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:23
STUDIO.R (.....my sweeeeeeeet lOrd...........) ID#119358:
tank you...tank you.....tank you.....leeeeetle rangitO y beeeeeeeeeeeeeg DroOyO....si' si'.....aye ya ya ya!!!!! studio.saved allelujah!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:23
Mike Sheller (QT) ID#347447:
Your exposition is magnificent. I have saved it as I am on the run. Enjoyed all of them!
I should be studying at your feet, my friend.
Bravo.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:23
CC (DROOY) ID#334219:
Copyright © 1998 CC/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
'Most of the September issue is devoted to DROOY as THE best gold stock'

There has to be little doubt that DROOY is the most leveraged of the gold stocks given its very low market cap, strong reserves and decent production of 600,000 ounces/year. It will certainly have one of the best performance if gold go North and allow DROOY to start making big profits per share.

However, DROOY cash costs are still very high near $300. Its balance sheet is not in good shape. If gold go south and makes a prolonged trip below $250, DROOY will be in big trouble unless it can find a few friendly banks.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:21
James (It looks like QT singlehandedly denied access to many of us ) ID#252150:
earlier today.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:18
strat (powmain 13:12) ID#93241:
NY Times

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:14
crazytimes (Good action in DROOY and RANGY today....) ID#342376:
DROOY up almost 15%, RANGY up 10% even though Gold price down a little. My guess is part of the reason is the latest issue of Jim Blanchard's Gold Newsletter. Most of the September issue is devoted to DROOY as THE best gold stock.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:12
powmain (Please someone convience me this is not 1929 on a gobal scale) ID#21275:
What was CNBC's name in 29?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:10
tolerant1 (He uses God...his family...his Cabinet...his supporters...and America...he is a dirtbag) ID#373284:
to me and always shall be...Tolerant1-9-15-98 and now some thoughts from someone else...

´´Corruption of morals is rapid enough in any country without
a bounty from government. ...the Chief Magistrate of the
United States should be the last man to accelerate its
progress.´´ -- Noah Webster

http://www.TheFed.com



Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:09
SteveIS (@sharefin) ID#280339:
Your 12:28 was excellent. I enjoy hearing diverse opinions regarding the market. When people give the reasons for their market beliefs it helps increase everybodies understanding.

If people are later ridiculed for mistaken beliefs then they stop posting. With fewer posts the forum becomes less informative. Thats the last thing we want.

Thanks for the rant.

Buy GOLD!!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:09
sharefin (What's going on?) ID#284255:
-
The dow is up 55
Nasdaq square
SP500 more than double the strength of the SP100
And the Russell down.

Then you only need to look at the dow on a 60 minute chart.

If it fails here its all over.

Seems like a few stocks are gently nudging the dow higher.
But an insipid rally.

Where have all the rampant bulls gone?

Seems like its wobbling along the road just trying to stay between the lines.
Wanders to the down side and the PPT prod it back.

Veers to the highside and smartmoney sells it back just a tad.

Whats missing is the seriousness of the investor.
They should be driving it higher or lower.

But they seem to be just waiting caught in the spotlight.

The momentum is flaccid and weak.

Spirit broken - directionless in its meanderings.

Watch out when it builds up some speed this time.

Whipsaw coming. Real soon.
IMHO


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:07
EJ (Gollum) ID#229207:
If someone hangs you off a ledge by your ankles and then pulls you back again, the world looks so much more beautiful than it did before you were hung off the ledge, although the world is just the same. You feel great until the thrill of surviving wears off and you start to notice the problems again. Then someone else comes along and hangs you off the ledge by your ankles.
-EJ

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 13:01
strat (All) ID#93241:
Check out the latest issue of Esquire magazine. The cover has a broken head and poses the question Daddy, what did you do after the crash? I was picking up groceries and saw it. It's about the upcoming market crash. Soon to be a reality near you. I wonder if their editors have been hanging out here?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:57
LGB (@ Realistic, Sharefin, QT) ID#269409:
Realistic...I agree with you on silver. It's staying depressed for now but just wait......

Sharefin.... Enjoyed your rant and agreed with much of what you had to say. Especially the point about Bull market guru's who advocate never selling or thinking, etc. ( though they'll historically be right and profitable a lot more often than Puetz ) . Diversity of views, like diversity in the investment portfolio are good. I'm still Bearish on Puetz though!

QT.....arghhhhh!!!!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:54
QT (Sheller/Spanky dialogue ~ Puetz/LGB wager ~ Astrological running of the bulls out of town.) ID#232390:
Copyright © 1998 QT All rights reserved
Hello Mike, ~ as I mentioned to you previously, in an e-mail, and not in the hallowed halls of Kitkopia, I’ve been looking into this “astrology” since the first of the year. Though I’ve about the grasp of this subject as a film star to physics, I have, however developed at least a fundamental cognizance of the art’s design. And since you have been vaulting the dialogue of portention in this land of Bollingers and Ganns, Eliotts and Fibonachi Cupcakes with the astro science; I thought I’d post a few upcoming astro events which may add to the mix of dynamic you sketched out for Spanky this morning:

“On the more immediate horizon for Iran, Mars opposes its Sun Friday September 25, actually sweeping in opposition to Iran's Mars/Sun/Mercury lineup between September 16th and September 27th. The first 3 days of October, Mars squares NYSE Sun, opposes USA Moon, and conjuncts Bill Clinton's Sun. So very end of September may be American fallout resulting in earlier action in or by Iran...if we want to focus on the Iran scenario as Spanky suggests.”

The Sun, the golden planet, lord of ambition and brokers, casinos and coin; governments, presidents and financial speculation alike will stage it’s annual “running of the bulls” ( out of town ) around this time as well. Generally speaking these aspects don’t necessarily portend anything more than a wallet flogging, an alley mugging, a misplaced check and a cancelled rendezvous, but in light of the delicate ambivalence our madam market has been enjoying of late, I believe some attention to this phenomenon may be warranted.

As the countours of our birth charts describe attitudes and proficiencies with money, evidenced by the lords and ladies of the second house, their attendants and enemies, and our creative proclivities in the art of speculation, by the cast of characters frolicking in the fifth, so to the chart of our Nation.

The national chart for the US has the emotional distinction of having our collective second house, and all her inmates, ruled by the changeling matriarch of all earthly dynamics ~ the moon. Not just ruled by the moon, by virtue of the property line of the house cusp resting just astrological minutes inside the sign of the Moon’s congenial patroness Cancer, but within the governance of Cancer in a critical degree ~ 0+18 min.
I could go into the significance of this critical degree in a cardinal sign, and in Cancer’s case it’s inclination to overcompensate in areas of security and inclination to emotional hyperventilation, but these subtleties are better left to students of the arcane more familiar with this subject than I. Suffice it to say that the second house of our Nation is ruled by Cancer; caretakers of real estate and silver, farmers and fish, crops and milk and houses and homes, memory emotion and weather.

Those inmates of heaven which chose to make their presence known in this house of our nation’s money, this house of govenance of the Fed, of banks and bonds and stocks, are: Venus, Jupiter and the Sun.

Venus ~ benefactress of banks everywhere, which are but tempered temples to the idol of her lavish love and licentiousness, Venus is “cake” we enjoy as a Nation. She is the Goddess of fashion, romance and rouge. Wine , women and song.

Jupiter ~ by Jove, is the God of Prosperity, large institutions, interest rates and income. He is the Buddha of beneficence on the earthly plane, the godfather of us all. Picture in your mind the cornucopia you made in art class every Thanksgiving. The horn of plenty just overflowing. This is the Polaroid of a Jovian brunch.

Sun ~ which we saw in the opening paragraph of this postcard is the golden guy, the president, coin and casinos...is about to begin it’s annual run around the bases of the bull, bat in hand, in “square” to the three inmates of our Nation’s birthchart which inhabit the frat house of money..

What, the unwitting Kitkopian who has erroneously stumbled onto this page thinking it to be yet another condemnation of Clinton, or an update on CB gold transfer all done up as “sale”, a currency shock, an analysts crock or a gold bull all dressed in bows, “What?” our tireless devotee of the yellowed fever may ask is a “square” and what does this mean for our three inmates in the house of money? Very well. Right you are to ask. well now lets see.
Let us imagine Venus, so splendid, and Jove so extravagant, and the Sun of our gold and coin all enjoying what luxury and bounty and confidence we have in the home of our collective Money ( I choose not to use the image of a Bank here in this parallel because banks lack good stereo’s and there is no complimentary bar ) . This is a snapshot forever imprinted on the destiny of our nation. Let us store this now in the back-up files and see what’s happening in the “now”, in the overlay of verity, in the second part of the exposure we must comprehend in order to see in stereovision.

Enter the Dragon.
The Sun, Bruce Lee, can scorch deserts and he can melt winter snows into spring rivers which then soothe the parched lands he previously left to wither. The Sun, in every year, circles the Zodiac, touches every degree in every sign. Sometimes scorching the rainless wheat, sometimes warming a wintry ice to quench thirsts we do not even know exist.
When the Sun comes round to visit, conjunct, the degree’s which were inhabited by our three inmates of the second house, he reassures, with his warmth and confidence that everything is good, golden and full of possibility. When he is opposite the degree he demands some self reflection and analysis, stands in opposition.

Now we get tot he nub of it, the trine and the square of it, the angles of ricochet and of “not today”. The glance of a turn in the cosmic wheel which sets the spinning wheel to spin ever more, and the other one which bars the way and steps on toes and beats back those who don’t know to adjust to it, fail to see the left hook , the rising mercury in the thermometers posted around the ice sculpture garden of our portfolio.

Enter the Dragon, the square end of it, the waning wand of our SOLicitations turning back to rap us on the knogen. The Sun, in Libra ( partners and prosecutions ) will begin to turn and drag against the gyroscopics of our chakras dancing in the second house of our Nation’s money. The Sun becomes a dragon and breathes on the party decorations, roughs up the doorman and turns the punchbowl on the floor ( do I detect something biblical here or is it your imagination... )

First Venus, then Jupiter, then the remnant image of the Sun itself are all squared in less than a dozen days, by the Sun itself.

On the 26th of September the games begin with the transiting Sun “squaring” our Nation’s Venus.
On the 29th of September transiting Sun “squares’ our Nations Jupiter, our Jove our godfather.
On the 6th of October the sun itself is “squared” by it’s own image and on the waning end of it’s circuit.

And when the day is done, and the band is packed and gone and the buzz in your head turns to lead don’t be discoursged. It’s only a temporary thing. This too shall pass.

Well, there it is sports fans. I leave the rest of it up to you home run hitters who scour the lease rates, you surfers who ride the deep oceanic waves of finance and forbearance and you fiscal detectives of every stripe who lurk below transoms and rummage through memos and have IV’s of the world’s tickertapes feeding directly into your gold colored veins.
Though I know I’ve got till the end of the year before all CB threats are moot, I intend to give myself a very Christmas/Christmas present this year, gold frankinsence and myrrh, I also suspect the next few weeks will not be kind to the feint hearted who have more than their share of risk exposure on the upside.
All Puetzicisms aside, “lets be careful out there”, this may just be another alleyway mugging. Then again it might not. Maybe LGB would like to wager the market to be UP when these bases have been tagged, I, for one, certainly would not.





Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:54
QT (Sheller/Spanky dialogue ~ Puetz/LGB wager ~ Astrological running of the bulls out of town.) ID#232390:
Copyright © 1998 QT All rights reserved
Hello Mike, ~ as I mentioned to you previously, in an e-mail, and not in the hallowed halls of Kitkopia, I’ve been looking into this “astrology” since the first of the year. Though I’ve about the grasp of this subject as a film star to physics, I have, however developed at least a fundamental cognizance of the art’s design. And since you have been vaulting the dialogue of portention in this land of Bollingers and Ganns, Eliotts and Fibonachi Cupcakes with the astro science; I thought I’d post a few upcoming astro events which may add to the mix of dynamic you sketched out for Spanky this morning:

“On the more immediate horizon for Iran, Mars opposes its Sun Friday September 25, actually sweeping in opposition to Iran's Mars/Sun/Mercury lineup between September 16th and September 27th. The first 3 days of October, Mars squares NYSE Sun, opposes USA Moon, and conjuncts Bill Clinton's Sun. So very end of September may be American fallout resulting in earlier action in or by Iran...if we want to focus on the Iran scenario as Spanky suggests.”

The Sun, the golden planet, lord of ambition and brokers, casinos and coin; governments, presidents and financial speculation alike will stage it’s annual “running of the bulls” ( out of town ) around this time as well. Generally speaking these aspects don’t necessarily portend anything more than a wallet flogging, an alley mugging, a misplaced check and a cancelled rendezvous, but in light of the delicate ambivalence our madam market has been enjoying of late, I believe some attention to this phenomenon may be warranted.

As the countours of our birth charts describe attitudes and proficiencies with money, evidenced by the lords and ladies of the second house, their attendants and enemies, and our creative proclivities in the art of speculation, by the cast of characters frolicking in the fifth, so to the chart of our Nation.

The national chart for the US has the emotional distinction of having our collective second house, and all her inmates, ruled by the changeling matriarch of all earthly dynamics ~ the moon. Not just ruled by the moon, by virtue of the property line of the house cusp resting just astrological minutes inside the sign of the Moon’s congenial patroness Cancer, but within the governance of Cancer in a critical degree ~ 0+18 min.
I could go into the significance of this critical degree in a cardinal sign, and in Cancer’s case it’s inclination to overcompensate in areas of security and inclination to emotional hyperventilation, but these subtleties are better left to students of the arcane more familiar with this subject than I. Suffice it to say that the second house of our Nation is ruled by Cancer; caretakers of real estate and silver, farmers and fish, crops and milk and houses and homes, memory emotion and weather.

Those inmates of heaven which chose to make their presence known in this house of our nation’s money, this house of govenance of the Fed, of banks and bonds and stocks, are: Venus, Jupiter and the Sun.

Venus ~ benefactress of banks everywhere, which are but tempered temples to the idol of her lavish love and licentiousness, Venus is “cake” we enjoy as a Nation. She is the Goddess of fashion, romance and rouge. Wine , women and song.

Jupiter ~ by Jove, is the God of Prosperity, large institutions, interest rates and income. He is the Buddha of beneficence on the earthly plane, the godfather of us all. Picture in your mind the cornucopia you made in art class every Thanksgiving. The horn of plenty just overflowing. This is the Polaroid of a Jovian brunch.

Sun ~ which we saw in the opening paragraph of this postcard is the golden guy, the president, coin and casinos...is about to begin it’s annual run around the bases of the bull, bat in hand, in “square” to the three inmates of our Nation’s birthchart which inhabit the frat house of money..

What, the unwitting Kitkopian who has erroneously stumbled onto this page thinking it to be yet another condemnation of Clinton, or an update on CB gold transfer all done up as “sale”, a currency shock, an analysts crock or a gold bull all dressed in bows, “What?” our tireless devotee of the yellowed fever may ask is a “square” and what does this mean for our three inmates in the house of money? Very well. Right you are to ask. well now lets see.
Let us imagine Venus, so splendid, and Jove so extravagant, and the Sun of our gold and coin all enjoying what luxury and bounty and confidence we have in the home of our collective Money ( I choose not to use the image of a Bank here in this parallel because banks lack good stereo’s and there is no complimentary bar ) . This is a snapshot forever imprinted on the destiny of our nation. Let us store this now in the back-up files and see what’s happening in the “now”, in the overlay of verity, in the second part of the exposure we must comprehend in order to see in stereovision.

Enter the Dragon.
The Sun, Bruce Lee, can scorch deserts and he can melt winter snows into spring rivers which then soothe the parched lands he previously left to wither. The Sun, in every year, circles the Zodiac, touches every degree in every sign. Sometimes scorching the rainless wheat, sometimes warming a wintry ice to quench thirsts we do not even know exist.
When the Sun comes round to visit, conjunct, the degree’s which were inhabited by our three inmates of the second house, he reassures, with his warmth and confidence that everything is good, golden and full of possibility. When he is opposite the degree he demands some self reflection and analysis, stands in opposition.

Now we get tot he nub of it, the trine and the square of it, the angles of ricochet and of “not today”. The glance of a turn in the cosmic wheel which sets the spinning wheel to spin ever more, and the other one which bars the way and steps on toes and beats back those who don’t know to adjust to it, fail to see the left hook , the rising mercury in the thermometers posted around the ice sculpture garden of our portfolio’s

Enter the Dragon, the square end of it, the waning wand of our SOLicitations turning back to rap us on the knogen. The Sun, in Libra ( partners and prosecutions ) will begin to turn and drag against the gyroscopics of our chakras dancing in the second house of our Nation’s money. The Sun becomes a dragon and breathes on the party decorations, roughs up the doorman and turns the punchbowl on the floor ( do I detect something biblical here or is it your imagination... )

First Venus, then Jupiter, then the remnant image of the Sun itself are all squared in less than a dozen days, by the Sun itself.

On the 26th of September the games begin with the transiting Sun “squaring” our Nation’s Venus.
On the 29th of September transiting Sun “squares’ our Nations Jupiter, our Jove our godfather.
On the 6th of October the sun itself is “squared” by it’s own image and on the waning end of it’s circuit.

And when the day is done, and the band is packed and gone and the buzz in your head turns to lead don’t be discoursged. It’s only a temporary thing. This too shall pass.

Well, there it is sports fans. I leave the rest of it up to you home run hitters who scour the lease rates, you surfers who ride the deep oceanic waves of finance and forbearance and you fiscal detectives of every stripe who lurk below transoms and rummage through memos and have IV’s of the world’s tickertapes feeding directly into your gold colored veins.
Though I know I’ve got till the end of the year before all CB threats are moot, I intend to give myself a very Christmas/Christmas present this year, gold frankinsence and myrrh, I also suspect the next few weeks will not be kind to the feint hearted who have more than their share of risk exposure on the upside.
All Puetzicisms aside, “lets be careful out there”, this may just be another alleyway mugging. Then again it might not. Maybe LGB would like to wager the market to be UP when these bases have been tagged, I, for one, certainly would not.





Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:51
QT (Sheller/Spanky dialogue ~ Puetz/LGB wager ~ Astrological running of the bulls out of town.) ID#232390:
Copyright © 1998 QT All rights reserved
Hello Mike, ~ as I mentioned to you previously, in an e-mail, and not in the hallowed halls of Kitkopia, I’ve been looking into this “astrology” since the first of the year. Though I’ve about the grasp of this subject as a film star to physics, I have, however developed at least a fundamental cognizance of the art’s design. And since you have been vaulting the dialogue of portention in this land of Bollingers and Ganns, Eliotts and Fibonachi Cupcakes with the astro science; I thought I’d post a few upcoming astro events which may add to the mix of dynamic you sketched out for Spanky this morning:

“On the more immediate horizon for Iran, Mars opposes its Sun Friday September 25, actually sweeping in opposition to Iran's Mars/Sun/Mercury lineup between September 16th and September 27th. The first 3 days of October, Mars squares NYSE Sun, opposes USA Moon, and conjuncts Bill Clinton's Sun. So very end of September may be American fallout resulting in earlier action in or by Iran...if we want to focus on the Iran scenario as Spanky suggests.”

The Sun, the golden planet, lord of ambition and brokers, casinos and coin; governments, presidents and financial speculation alike will stage it’s annual “running of the bulls” ( out of town ) around this time as well. Generally speaking these aspects don’t necessarily portend anything more than a wallet flogging, an alley mugging, a misplaced check and a cancelled rendezvous, but in light of the delicate ambivalence our madam market has been enjoying of late, I believe some attention to this phenomenon may be warranted.

As the countours of our birth charts describe attitudes and proficiencies with money, evidenced by the lords and ladies of the second house, their attendants and enemies, and our creative proclivities in the art of speculation, by the cast of characters frolicking in the fifth, so to the chart of our Nation.

The national chart for the US has the emotional distinction of having our collective second house, and all her inmates, ruled by the changeling matriarch of all earthly dynamics ~ the moon. Not just ruled by the moon, by virtue of the property line of the house cusp resting just astrological minutes inside the sign of the Moon’s congenial patroness Cancer, but within the governance of Cancer in a critical degree ~ 0+18 min.
I could go into the significance of this critical degree in a cardinal sign, and in Cancer’s case it’s inclination to overcompensate in areas of security and inclination to emotional hyperventilation, but these subtleties are better left to students of the arcane more familiar with this subject than I. Suffice it to say that the second house of our Nation is ruled by Cancer; caretakers of real estate and silver, farmers and fish, crops and milk and houses and homes, memory emotion and weather.

Those inmates of heaven which chose to make their presence known in this house of our nation’s money, this house of govenance of the Fed, of banks and bonds and stocks, are: Venus, Jupiter and the Sun.

Venus ~ benefactress of banks everywhere, which are but tempered temples to the idol of her lavish love and licentiousness, Venus is “cake” we enjoy as a Nation. She is the Goddess of fashion, romance and rouge. Wine , women and song.

Jupiter ~ by Jove, is the God of Prosperity, large institutions, interest rates and income. He is the Buddha of beneficence on the earthly plane, the godfather of us all. Picture in your mind the cornucopia you made in art class every Thanksgiving. The horn of plenty just overflowing. This is the Polaroid of a Jovian brunch.

Sun ~ which we saw in the opening paragraph of this postcard is the golden guy, the president, coin and casinos...is about to begin it’s annual run around the bases of the bull, bat in hand, in “square” to the three inmates of our Nation’s birthchart which inhabit the frat house of money..

What, the unwitting Kitkopian who has erroneously stumbled onto this page thinking it to be yet another condemnation of Clinton, or an update on CB gold transfer all done up as “sale”, a currency shock, an analysts crock or a gold bull all dressed in bows, “What?” our tireless devotee of the yellowed fever may ask is a “square” and what does this mean for our three inmates in the house of money? Very well. Right you are to ask. well now lets see.
Let us imagine Venus, so splendid, and Jove so extravagant, and the Sun of our gold and coin all enjoying what luxury and bounty and confidence we have in the home of our collective Money ( I choose not to use the image of a Bank here in this parallel because banks lack good stereo’s and there is no complimentary bar ) . This is a snapshot forever imprinted on the destiny of our nation. Let us store this now in the back-up files and see what’s happening in the “now”, in the overlay of verity, in the second part of the exposure we must comprehend in order to see in stereovision.

Enter the Dragon.
The Sun, Bruce Lee, can scorch deserts and he can melt winter snows into spring rivers which then soothe the parched lands he previously left to wither. The Sun, in every year, circles the Zodiac, touches every degree in every sign. Sometimes scorching the rainless wheat, sometimes warming a wintry ice to quench thirsts we do not even know exist.
When the Sun comes round to visit, conjunct, the degree’s which were inhabited by our three inmates of the second house, he reassures, with his warmth and confidence that everything is good, golden and full of possibility. When he is opposite the degree he demands some self reflection and analysis, stands in opposition.

Now we get tot he nub of it, the trine and the square of it, the angles of ricochet and of “not today”. The glance of a turn in the cosmic wheel which sets the spinning wheel to spin ever more, and the other one which bars the way and steps on toes and beats back those who don’t know to adjust to it, fail to see the left hook , the rising mercury in the thermometers posted around the ice sculpture garden of our portfolio’s

Enter the Dragon, the square end of it, the waning wand of our SOLicitations turning back to rap us on the knogen. The Sun, in Libra ( partners and prosecutions ) will begin to turn and drag against the gyroscopics of our chakras dancing in the second house of our Nation’s money. The Sun becomes a dragon and breathes on the party decorations, roughs up the doorman and turns the punchbowl on the floor ( do I detect something biblical here or is it your imagination... )

First Venus, then Jupiter, then the remnant image of the Sun itself are all squared in less than a dozen days, by the Sun itself.

On the 26th of September the games begin with the transiting Sun “squaring” our Nation’s Venus.
On the 29th of September transiting Sun “squares’ our Nations Jupiter, our Jove our godfather.
On the 6th of October the sun itself is “squared” by it’s own image and on the waning end of it’s circuit.

And when the day is done, and the band is packed and gone and the buzz in your head turns to lead don’t be discoursged. It’s only a temporary thing. This too shall pass.

Well, there it is sports fans. I leave the rest of it up to you home run hitters who scour the lease rates, you surfers who ride the deep oceanic waves of finance and forbearance and you fiscal detectives of every stripe who lurk below transoms and rummage through memos and have IV’s of the world’s tickertapes feeding directly into your gold colored veins.
Though I know I’ve got till the end of the year before all CB threats are moot, I intend to give myself a very Christmas/Christmas present this year, gold frankinsence and myrrh, I also suspect the next few weeks will not be kind to the feint hearted who have more than their share of risk exposure on the upside.
All Puetzicisms aside, “lets be careful out there”, this may just be another alleyway mugging. Then again it might not. Maybe LGB would like to wager the market to be UP when these bases have been tagged, I, for one, certainly would not.





Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:45
QT (Sheller/Spanky dialogue ~ Puetz/LGB wager ~ Astrological running of the bulls out of town.) ID#232390:
Copyright © 1998 QT All rights reserved
Hello Mike, ~ as I mentioned to you previously, in an e-mail, and not in the hallowed halls of Kitkopia, I’ve been looking into this “astrology” since the first of the year. Though I’ve about the grasp of this subject as a film star to physics, I have, however developed at least a fundamental cognizance of the art’s design. And since you have been vaulting the dialogue of portention in this land of Bollingers and Ganns, Eliotts and Fibonachi Cupcakes with the astro science; I thought I’d post a few upcoming astro events which may add to the mix of dynamic you sketched out for Spanky this morning:

“On the more immediate horizon for Iran, Mars opposes its Sun Friday September 25, actually
sweeping in opposition to Iran's Mars/Sun/Mercury lineup between September 16th and
September 27th. The first 3 days of October, Mars squares NYSE Sun, opposes USA
Moon, and conjuncts Bill Clinton's Sun. So very end of September may be American fallout
resulting in earlier action in or by Iran...if we want to focus on the Iran scenario as Spanky
suggests.”

The Sun, the golden planet, lord of ambition and brokers, casinos and coin; governments, presidents and financial speculation alike will stage it’s annual “running of the bulls” ( out of town ) around this time as well. Generally speaking these aspects don’t necessarily portend anything more than a wallet flogging, an alley mugging, a misplaced check and a cancelled rendezvous, but in light of the delicate ambivalence our madam market has been enjoying of late, I believe some attention to this phenomenon may be warranted.

As the countours of our birth charts describe attitudes and proficiencies with money, evidenced by the lords and ladies of the second house, their attendants and enemies, and our creative proclivities in the art of speculation, by the cast of characters frolicking in the fifth, so to the chart of our Nation.

The national chart for the US has the emotional distinction of having our collective second house, and all her inmates, ruled by the changeling matriarch of all earthly dynamics ~ the moon. Not just ruled by the moon, by virtue of the property line of the house cusp resting just astrological minutes inside the sign of the Moon’s congenial patroness Cancer, but within the governance of Cancer in a critical degree ~ 0+18min.
I could go into the significance of this critical degree in a cardinal sign, and in Cancer’s case it’s inclination to overcompensate in areas of security and inclination to emotional hyperventilation, but these subtleties are better left to students of the arcane more familiar with this subject than I. Suffice it to say that the second house of our Nation is ruled by Cancer; caretakers of real estate and silver, farmers and fish, crops and milk and houses and homes, memory emotion and weather.

Those inmates of heaven which chose to make their presence known in this house of our nation’s money, this govenance of the Fed, of banks and bonds and stocks, are: Venus, Jupiter and the Sun.

Venus ~ benefactress of banks everywhere, which are but tempered temples to the idol of her lavish love of licentiousness, Venus is “cake” we enjoy as a Nation. She is the Goddess of fashion, romance and rouge. Wine , women and song.

Jupiter ~ by Jove, is the God of Prosperity, large institutions, interest rates and income. He is the Buddha of beneficence on the earthly plane, the godfather of us all. Picture in your mind the cornucopia you made in art class every Thanksgiving. The horn of plenty just overflowing. This is the Polaroid of a Jovian brunch.

Sun ~ which we saw in the opening paragraph of this postcard is the golden guy, the president, coin and casinos...is about to begin it’s annual run around the bases of the bull, bat in hand, in “square” to the three inmates of our Nation’s birthchart which inhabit the frat house of money..

What, the unwitting Kitkopian who has erroneously stumbled onto this page thinking it to be yet another condemnation of Clinton, or an update on CB gold transfer all done up as “sale”, a currency shock, an analysts crock or a gold bull all dressed in bows, “What?” our tireless devotee of the yellowed fever may ask is a “square” and what does this mean for our three inmates in the house of money? Very well. Right you are to ask. well now lets see.
Let us imagine Venus, so splendid, and Jove so extravagant, and the Sun of our gold and coin all enjoying what luxury and bounty and confidence we have in the home of our collective Money ( I choose not to use the image of a Bank here in this parallel because banks lack good stereo’s and there is no complimentary bar ) . This is a snapshot forever imprinted on the destiny of our nation. Let us store this now in the back-up files and see what’s happening in the “now”, in the overlay of verity, in the second part of the exposure we must comprehend in order to see in stereovision.

Enter the Dragon.
The Sun, Bruce Lee, can scorch deserts and he can melt winter snows into spring rivers which then soothe the parched lands he previously left to wither. The Sun, in every year, circles the Zodiac, touches every degree in every sign. Sometimes scorching the rainless wheat, sometimes warming a wintry ice to quench thirsts we do not even know exist.
When the Sun comes round to visit, conjunct, the degree’s which were inhabited by our three inmates of the second house, he reassures, with his warmth and confidence that everything is good, golden and full of possibility. When he is opposite the degree he demands some self reflection and analysis, stands in opposition.

Now we get tot he nub of it, the trine and the square of it, the angles of ricochet and of “not today”. The glance of a turn in the cosmic wheel which sets the spinning wheel to spin ever more, and the other one which bars the way and steps on toes and beats back those who don’t know to adjust to it, fail to see the left hook , the rising mercury in the thermometers posted around the ice sculpture garden of our portfolio’s

Enter the Dragon, the square end of it, the waning wand of our SOLicitations turning back to rap us on the knogen. The Sun, in Libra ( partners and prosecutions ) will begin to turn and drag against the gyroscopics of our chakras dancing in the second house of our Nation’s money. The Sun becomes a dragon and breathes on the party decorations, roughs up the doorman and turns the punchbowl on the floor ( do I detect something biblical here or is it your imagination... )

First Venus, then Jupiter, then the remnant image of the Sun itself are all squared in less than a dozen days, by the Sun itself.

On the 26th of September the games begin with the transiting Sun “squaring” our Nation’s Venus.
On the 29th of September transiting Sun “squares’ our Nations Jupiter, our Jove our godfather.
On the 6th of October the sun itself is “squared” by it’s own image and on the waning end of it’s circuit.

And when the day is done, and the band is packed and gone and the buzz in your head turns to lead don’t be discoursged. It’s only a temporary thing. This too shall pass.

Well, there it is sports fans. I leave the rest of it up to you home run hitters who scour the lease rates, you surfers who ride the deep oceanic waves of finance and forbearance and you fiscal detectives of every stripe who lurk below transoms and rummage through memos and have IV’s of the world’s tickertapes feeding directly into your gold colored veins.
Though I know I’ve got till the end of the year before all CB threats are moot, I intend to give myself a very Christmas/Christmas present this year, gold frankinsence and myrrh, I also suspect the next few weeks will not be kind to the feint hearted who have more than their share of risk exposure on the upside.
All Puetzicisms aside, “lets be careful out there”, this may just be another alleyway mugging. Then again it might not. Maybe LGB would like to wager the market to be UP when these bases have been tagged, I, for one, certainly would not.





Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:44
QT (Sheller/Spanky dialogue ~ Puetz/LGB wager ~ Astrological running of the bulls out of town.) ID#232390:
Copyright © 1998 QT/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Hello Mike, ~ as I mentioned to you previously, in an e-mail, and not in the hallowed halls of Kitkopia, I’ve been looking into this “astrology” since the first of the year. Though I’ve about the grasp of this subject as a film star to physics, I have, however developed at least a fundamental cognizance of the art’s design. And since you have been vaulting the dialogue of portention in this land of Bollingers and Ganns, Eliotts and Fibonachi Cupcakes with the astro science; I thought I’d post a few upcoming astro events which may add to the mix of dynamic you sketched out for Spanky this morning:

“On the more immediate horizon for Iran, Mars opposes its Sun Friday September 25, actually
sweeping in opposition to Iran's Mars/Sun/Mercury lineup between September 16th and
September 27th. The first 3 days of October, Mars squares NYSE Sun, opposes USA
Moon, and conjuncts Bill Clinton's Sun. So very end of September may be American fallout
resulting in earlier action in or by Iran...if we want to focus on the Iran scenario as Spanky
suggests.”

The Sun, the golden planet, lord of ambition and brokers, casinos and coin; governments, presidents and financial speculation alike will stage it’s annual “running of the bulls” ( out of town ) around this time as well. Generally speaking these aspects don’t necessarily portend anything more than a wallet flogging, an alley mugging, a misplaced check and a cancelled rendezvous, but in light of the delicate ambivalence our madam market has been enjoying of late, I believe some attention to this phenomenon may be warranted.

As the countours of our birth charts describe attitudes and proficiencies with money, evidenced by the lords and ladies of the second house, their attendants and enemies, and our creative proclivities in the art of speculation, by the cast of characters frolicking in the fifth, so to the chart of our Nation.

The national chart for the US has the emotional distinction of having our collective second house, and all her inmates, ruled by the changeling matriarch of all earthly dynamics ~ the moon. Not just ruled by the moon, by virtue of the property line of the house cusp resting just astrological minutes inside the sign of the Moon’s congenial patroness Cancer, but within the governance of Cancer in a critical degree ~ 0+18min.
I could go into the significance of this critical degree in a cardinal sign, and in Cancer’s case it’s inclination to overcompensate in areas of security and inclination to emotional hyperventilation, but these subtleties are better left to students of the arcane more familiar with this subject than I. Suffice it to say that the second house of our Nation is ruled by Cancer; caretakers of real estate and silver, farmers and fish, crops and milk and houses and homes, memory emotion and weather.

Those inmates of heaven which chose to make their presence known in this house of our nation’s money, this govenance of the Fed, of banks and bonds and stocks, are: Venus, Jupiter and the Sun.

Venus ~ benefactress of banks everywhere, which are but tempered temples to the idol of her lavish love of licentiousness, Venus is “cake” we enjoy as a Nation. She is the Goddess of fashion, romance and rouge. Wine , women and song.

Jupiter ~ by Jove, is the God of Prosperity, large institutions, interest rates and income. He is the Buddha of beneficence on the earthly plane, the godfather of us all. Picture in your mind the cornucopia you made in art class every Thanksgiving. The horn of plenty just overflowing. This is the Polaroid of a Jovian brunch.

Sun ~ which we saw in the opening paragraph of this postcard is the golden guy, the president, coin and casinos...is about to begin it’s annual run around the bases of the bull, bat in hand, in “square” to the three inmates of our Nation’s birthchart which inhabit the frat house of money..

What, the unwitting Kitkopian who has erroneously stumbled onto this page thinking it to be yet another condemnation of Clinton, or an update on CB gold transfer all done up as “sale”, a currency shock, an analysts crock or a gold bull all dressed in bows, “What?” our tireless devotee of the yellowed fever may ask is a “square” and what does this mean for our three inmates in the house of money? Very well. Right you are to ask. well now lets see.
Let us imagine Venus, so splendid, and Jove so extravagant, and the Sun of our gold and coin all enjoying what luxury and bounty and confidence we have in the home of our collective Money ( I choose not to use the image of a Bank here in this parallel because banks lack good stereo’s and there is no complimentary bar ) . This is a snapshot forever imprinted on the destiny of our nation. Let us store this now in the back-up files and see what’s happening in the “now”, in the overlay of verity, in the second part of the exposure we must comprehend in order to see in stereovision.

Enter the Dragon.
The Sun, Bruce Lee, can scorch deserts and he can melt winter snows into spring rivers which then soothe the parched lands he previously left to wither. The Sun, in every year, circles the Zodiac, touches every degree in every sign. Sometimes scorching the rainless wheat, sometimes warming a wintry ice to quench thirsts we do not even know exist.
When the Sun comes round to visit, conjunct, the degree’s which were inhabited by our three inmates of the second house, he reassures, with his warmth and confidence that everything is good, golden and full of possibility. When he is opposite the degree he demands some self reflection and analysis, stands in opposition.

Now we get tot he nub of it, the trine and the square of it, the angles of ricochet and of “not today”. The glance of a turn in the cosmic wheel which sets the spinning wheel to spin ever more, and the other one which bars the way and steps on toes and beats back those who don’t know to adjust to it, fail to see the left hook , the rising mercury in the thermometers posted around the ice sculpture garden of our portfolio’s

Enter the Dragon, the square end of it, the waning wand of our SOLicitations turning back to rap us on the knogen. The Sun, in Libra ( partners and prosecutions ) will begin to turn and drag against the gyroscopics of our chakras dancing in the second house of our Nation’s money. The Sun becomes a dragon and breathes on the party decorations, roughs up the doorman and turns the punchbowl on the floor ( do I detect something biblical here or is it your imagination... )

First Venus, then Jupiter, then the remnant image of the Sun itself are all squared in less than a dozen days, by the Sun itself.

On the 26th of September the games begin with the transiting Sun “squaring” our Nation’s Venus.
On the 29th of September transiting Sun “squares’ our Nations Jupiter, our Jove our godfather.
On the 6th of October the sun itself is “squared” by it’s own image and on the waning end of it’s circuit.

And when the day is done, and the band is packed and gone and the buzz in your head turns to lead don’t be discoursged. It’s only a temporary thing. This too shall pass.

Well, there it is sports fans. I leave the rest of it up to you home run hitters who scour the lease rates, you surfers who ride the deep oceanic waves of finance and forbearance and you fiscal detectives of every stripe who lurk below transoms and rummage through memos and have IV’s of the world’s tickertapes feeding directly into your gold colored veins.
Though I know I’ve got till the end of the year before all CB threats are moot, I intend to give myself a very Christmas/Christmas present this year, gold frankinsence and myrrh, I also suspect the next few weeks will not be kind to the feint hearted who have more than their share of risk exposure on the upside.
All Puetzicisms aside, “lets be careful out there”, this may just be another alleyway mugging. Then again it might not. Maybe LGB would like to wager the market to be UP when these bases have been tagged, I, for one, certainly would not.





Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:41
EJ (The trouble with Greenspan setting high expectations of an interest rate easing...) ID#229207:
Copyright © 1998 EJ/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
...even if he never really said anything to set those expectations.

The assumption is that ( Greenspan ) is going to cut rates.
It could be a disappointment if he denies it, Collins said.
-----

Dow eases again, market awaits Greenspan
NEW YORK, Sept 15 ( Reuters ) - U.S. stocks were lower in
relatively muted morning activity dominated by program trading
ahead of Friday's triple witching expiration of options and
futures, dealers said.

The market was pausing for breath after an impressive
two-day rally that sent the Dow up 330 points, or more than 4.0
percent. Many awaited new clues on monetary policy from Federal
Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan on Wednesday when he speaks to
the House Banking Committee.

A lot of this is just run by programs, said Ned Collins,
head of trading at Daiwa Securities America.

This is a crazy week because of the expiration, Collins
added.

At 1054 EDT/1454 GMT, the Dow industrials were off 16
points at 7930. The Nasdaq composite fell seven points to 1659
and the S&P500 lost three to 1027.

Advancers outpaced decliners by almost 7-6 on the Big
Board. The Russell 2000 index of smaller stocks fell 1.61
points to 356.11.

Hopes for a concerted Group of Seven interest rate cut were
dampened on Tuesday by Bundesbank President Hans Tietmeyer.

Speaking at a news conference in Frankfurt, Tietmeyer said
economic conditions around the globe were too varied for a
coordinated policy easing and that, at least in Europe, there
was no fundamental reason to cut interest rates.

Tietmeyer was interpreting a Group of Seven communique on
Monday which seemed to raise prospects for rate cuts by saying
inflation was low or falling in many parts of the world.

The assumption is that ( Greenspan ) is going to cut rates.
It could be a disappointment if he denies it, Collins said.

( ( Marjorie Olster, 212-859-1730 ) )
REUTERS

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:29
Gollum (DOW +32) ID#43185:
EJ, are you sure those were ordinary sheeple? They were'nt politicians were they? You know those are full of hot air.

This yellow submarine is getting ready to turn into our beautiful ballon.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:29
Gollum (DOW +32) ID#43185:
EJ, are you sure those were ordinary sheeple? They were'nt politicians were they? You know those are full of hot air.

This yellow submarine is getting ready to turn into our beautiful ballon.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:28
sharefin (LGB - rant mode on....) ID#284255:
-
Hardly a chastisement.
It would take a lot more than that. ( :-^ ) ) ) )

I just think there's room for lots of diverse opinions.
I agree with 90% of what you say.
And yes that has been correct up to now.

But then we both know that these markets are rigged politically.
They would have eased off ages ago if not for the intervention of the PPT.
Look at the massive futures intervention last Oct.
And at other points prior to this.

This massive 4 year rally has been totally political.

Ask Oldman - you have to go where the moneys going.
Esp when BC comes on TV.

So perhaps Steve may have been right but was side kicked because of the intervention.

And then I see the perspective where times are changing.
Many say the Dow Theory bear is here.
Certainly smells like it.

Financial contagion abounds.
Seems like they should have let the steam out of this market two years ago and then the globe would never have been in this mess.

Now we stand at the edge of time where perhaps we will see a major breakdown in the financial world.

Now what of the Wall street gurus who are saying that the market keeps going up - forever.
Don't ever sell and you'll die rich.
These spin-meister who have been right all the way up but are now blinded to these coming changes.

These prophets of profits ar going to cost the mums and dads much.

Their calls when they say to the public don't think, don't sell
Are equally as bad as Steve being wrong before.

Steve has always advocated playing only with money you can afford to lose.

They are saying play with all your eggs - everything.

They will have a lot to answer to when the dow is under 4000.

I think eventually it'll go down to the 1000 level.

How many mums and dads will lose 90% of what they own.

I think it's criminal for the PPT to prop the markets alluring in ignorant investors under a cloud of safety.

If in six months time the dow was down to 4000
And you'd lost everything you had.
Wouldn't you be angry for what the Gov't had done.
Suckering in the last bit of liquidity in an absolutely crazy mania.

Where are there honest valuations on shares?
Only in the mining sector?

Seems to me a devious game has been played and the losers have been sucked in.
Distribution at the top as smart money exits.

Steve may have spooked a dozen investors to sell out of late.
Perhaps they will think of him in six months time with absolute respect.
Not because his call was right or wrong.
But because they got spooked out and didn't lose everything they had.

Many in six months time will wish that they too had listened.

You yourself have already bailed from what you could.
Smart thinking.
Perhaps some of those un smart investors needed reminding that we are indeed at lofty heights.

I know he has been wrong before and will be again.
But in the current market - more unsmart investors would be safer/wealthier if they follow his advice.

Put the dow chart on monthly candlesticks.
It looks damn deadly.

I personally hope someone will read my comments and Steves and exit at these levels.
Save them some later anguish.

Seems I play the same sort of game with Y2k.
I have to work hard to turn heads and make them think about what is happening.
99% are in absolute denial.

But I plug away and raise awareness.
Many here on Kitco would know more about Y2k than most.
Maybe they will make a wrong move and wish they had never seen me post.

But I think many more will one day thank me quietly under their breath as they struggle through these changing times.

Already I get 3 or more emails of thanks on a daily basis.

And yet the tide has not even turned.
The tsunami is not even yet visable.

But one can hear the whisper.

I do not look back on where we have come from, rather peer into the future as to what is coming.
I can't see clearly but I can sense what's going to happen.
My words of warning will stand a few in a better position to weather this coming storm.

This is no different than what Steve has done.
He has looked forward and seen what is coming.
Many others on this board would agree with him.
Financial chaos ahead.

Perhaps his timing has been out.
Perhaps his targets a bit pessimistic.
But over the long run, perhaps in a years time when the dow is at 4000.
The people who listened to him will be a lot happier.

I would guess the'd be estatic if they avoid a 4000 point fall.

Sorry for the length of the rant.
But I think he does a damn good job of spooking unaware investors out at the moment.
Not like the current dow10000 spin meisters.

The smart investors don't need to listen to him they can make up their own minds.


Same with Y2k.
I hope to reach an audience.
To wake them up so they can do something for themselves and their families.

I would spend 16 hours a day raising Y2k awareness.
Trying to stimulate them to think.

The best, hardest hitting articles that when you read enough of them you have to stop and think and wonder what the hell's going on.

btw
What's your thoughts with what youv'e read of late.
Buying more gold.
Putting a little food away.
Learning some more.
I certainly hope so.

We're all going to need some help with what's coming.

TSUNAMI inbound.

watch out.

rant mode off.



















Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:28
Realistic (Silver!) ID#410194:
Copyright © 1998 Realistic/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
With several countries sending out strong signals that enough is enough about the deterioration of worldwide interconnected economies and with the gradual settling down of the chaotic events of the past several months, some commodities will do some catch up in order to regain their respective values.

So don't forget about Silver! With the inventory levels at their lowest levels in many many years and the demand scenario bound to improve even more with a gradual recovery of the economic situation of several countries, Silver's prices will need to readjust to reflect a more realistic value.

With some possible little downside journey left in its prices, the ensuing upwards adjustment could happen rather violently.

Old Silver bulls should come back to the gambling table, the odds are turning to the bull side again!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:26
6pak () ID#335190:
Copyright © 1998 6pak/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
FEDOROV FACING CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION?

Moskovskii komsomolets reported on 15 September that Prosecutor-General Yurii Skuratov has sent a letter insisting on a thorough investigation of Deputy Prime Minister Boris Fedorov's activities.

The newspaper links the letter to the activities of one of Fedorov's subordinates, Ivan Moskovskii, and a U.S. company called Golden ADA, whose owner, Andrei Kozlenok, was recently extradited to Russia from Greece.

According to the newspaper, Moskovskii organized a deal between the Russian Federation's Precious Metals and Gems Committee and Golden ADA, which turned out to be a dummy corporation.

Moskovskii komsomolets concludes that Fedorov might be charged with abuse of power or neglect of duties resulting in considerable losses to the Russian state. JAC

EAST-CENTRAL EUROPE

LARGEST UKRAINIAN MINERS' UNION WANTS GOVERNMENT TO RESIGN

The Independent Miners' Union has called for Ukrainian Prime Minister Valeriy Pustovoytenko and his cabinet to resign and has asked the parliament to consider the demand, AP reported on 14 September.

Union leader Mykhaylo Volynets said that a June government resolution to pay wage arrears is not being honored.

Ukrainian miners are owed some 2.2 billion hryvni ( $860 million ) by the state.

Volynets said the decision to call for the government's resignation was made because the union fears money earmarked for the miners will be spent on next year's presidential elections and on servicing the foreign debt. PB

http://www.rferl.org/newsline/fulltext.html

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:20
Gold Dancer (Hugo and charts and don't be the source of supply) ID#377196:
Copyright © 1998 Gold Dancer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I am a chart reader myself, also elliot wave for 30 years. I have
made some great calls using charts and some real dumb ones. Your gold
call is suspect in my opinion. Charts don't tell everything.

More than that, I think something else has been happening for some
time. I suspected this some years ago but didn't have the courage to
believe it. It is the following: Smart money is using Eliot wave
patterns against those that use that system. They do this by knowing
where supply and demand can be calculated. Elliot wave users become
the supply or the demand. We are fried.

So, when it comes to gold, the most regulated market because it is the
most politcal market, charts don't help that much.

They only was to win in these markets is to take a longer time frame
than the market participants do: which means longer!!!! A simple buy
and hold is the only way you can assure yourself of profits and not
getting left out.

I don't think gold is going to pull back that much. DROOY is in
an uptrend. I own a lot of it and don't plan to trade it. So far I would
have been better off doing that. But in the long run I know that I
would have beeen left at the starting gate for a much greater move.

Just my thoughts, good luck in your trading.

Thanks, GD

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:18
Who Cares? ( I am not worthy of the Puetz Newsletter ) ID#242214:

Bought five more eagles yesterday. : )

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:05
tolerant1 (please excuse the bandwidth...many have asked to see this list again...so here it is...) ID#373284:
Copyright © 1998 tolerant1/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
SEARCH ENGINES
http://profusion.ittc.ukans.edu/
http://www.excite.com/
http://www2.infoseek.com/
http://www.hotbot.com/index.html
http://metasearch.com/
http://guaraldi.cs.colostate.edu:2000/form
http://www.lycos.com/
http://www.northernlight.com/
http://www.altavista.digital.com/
http://www.yahoo.com/search.html
http://www.webcrawler.com/
___________________________________________
SURVIVAL SITES and Y2K SITES
http://www.survival-center.com/guide/index.htm
http://www.teleport.com/~ammon/gn/cover.htm
news:rec.food.preserving
http://www.home-canning.com/tips.html
http://waltonfeed.com/
http://amhydro.com/index.html
http://amhydro.com/pages/commercial/nftsys.html
http://www.artrans.com/rmsg/default.htm
http://www.equipped.com/home.htm
http://www.equipped.com/earthqk.htm
http://www.doubleought.com/survivalism.html
http://www.doubleought.com/links.html
http://www4.viaweb.com/glitchproof/
http://www.webleyweb.com/y2k/y2k.html
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rsandler/Y2KFAQ.htm
http://y2kwatch.com/
http://www.year2000.com/y2karticles.html>http://www.year2000.com/y2karticles.html
http://www.y2kchaos.com/
http://www.euy2k.com>http://www.euy2k.com
http://www.y2ktimebomb.com/>http://www.y2ktimebomb.com/
http://wrstone.novacon.net/wrstone/millennium_bug/wrs3_bug.html
http://www.baproducts.com/y2knl.htm
http://www.yardeni.com/y2kbook.html
http://www.gao.gov/y2kr.htm
http://www.farmwholesale.com/
http://www.kurtsaxon.com/foods03.html
http://www.akula.com/~tooch/resist/blkpdr.html
http://www.jewishworldreview.com/
http://www2.misnet.com/~wfugitt/
http://www.powells.com/
http://www.hydro4u.com/
http://www.gate.net/~dlpaxton/Welcome.html
http://www.snowcrest.net/backwood/index.html
http://www.realgoods.com/main.html
http://home1.gte.net/jseitz/foods.htm
http://www.survivorssurplus.com/
http://www.accessone.com/~sbcn/index.htm
http://www.gate.net/~dlpaxton/TMEN.html
http://www.greatdreams.com/survival.htm
http://www.survival-center.com/dl-list/dl1-toc.htm
http://members.aol.com/keninga/index.htm
http://members.aol.com/keninga/ldsstore.htm
http://search.excite.com/search.gw?search=LDS+food+storage
http://www.beprepared.com/
http://www.beprepared.com/Product/kitchac.html
http://www.burgoyne.com/pages/gpope/epm/index1.htm
http://www.burgoyne.com/pages/gpope/epm/firstaid.htm
http://www.thefamily.com/parenting/parent2.html
http://www.ldschurch.net/bin/prep/links
http://ndsuext.nodak.edu/extnews/askext/foodstor.htm
http://ndsuext.nodak.edu/extnews/askext/mainlist.htm
http://lep.cl.msu.edu/msueimp/htdoc/mod01/master01.html
http://waltonfeed.com/grain/cookin/
http://www.trufax.org/menu/store.html
http://ext.usu.edu/qa/food/foodqa.htm
http://members.aol.com/rafleet/hazmaps.htm
EPICENTER SURVIVAL PRODUCTS ( EXCELLENT! )
http://theepicenter.com/lights.html
http://www.geoduck.com/epicenter/order.cgi?page=foodh2o.html&cart_id=%%cart_id%%
http://theepicenter.com/kits.html
http://theepicenter.com/packs.html
http://theepicenter.com/toolacc.html#light
http://www.geoduck.com/epicenter/order.cgi?page=surplus.html&cart_id=%%cart_id%%
http://www.geoduck.com/epicenter/order.cgi?page=onsale.html&cart_id=
http://www.geoduck.com/epicenter/order.cgi?page=lights.html&cart_id=%%cart_id%%
DEWEY RESEARCH CENTER - SURV. MED/ASST. SUPPLIES
http://www.4drc.com/
http://www.4drc.com/generator.html
Emergency Food Storage
http://www.northlink.com/~gwiatt/
http://www.northlink.com/~gwiatt/2person-hvstpck.htm>http://www.northlink.com/~gwiatt/2person-hvstpck.htm
http://www.northlink.com/~gwiatt/about-us.htm
http://www.northlink.com/~gwiatt/deluxe-program.htm
http://www.northlink.com/~gwiatt/2person-hvstpck.htm
ARTICLES OF INTEREST ON HOW-TO...
http://www.exit12.com/survival
http://www.foodsafety.org/dhhome.htm
http://www.lifelink.com/emergenc.htm
http://www.colorado.edu/hazards/
http://www.lifelink.com/foodwtr.htm
http://www.mindspring.com/~treeline/altitu~1.htm
http://www.specops.com/heatillness.htm
http://www.specops.com/water.htm
http://205.243.132.23/water.html
http://www.specops.com/maggot.htm
http://www.learn2.com/05/0511/0511.html
http://www.learn2.com/05/0512/0512.html
http://www.learn2.com/04/0450/0450.html
http://www.discovery.com/news/earthalert/earthalert.html
ARE YOU READY FOR A...FLOOD...TORNADO...ETC.
http://www.lifelink.com/heatwve.htm
http://www.lifelink.com/tornado.htm
http://www.lifelink.com/storm.htm
http://www.lifelink.com/flood.htm
http://www.lifelink.com/erthqke.htm
http://www.lifelink.com/hurr.htm
MILLENIUM ARK - Y2K SITE
http://www.millennium-ark.net/geophysics.html#volcanic
http://www.millennium-ark.net/geophysics.html#seismic
http://www.millennium-ark.net/geophysics.html#Oceanographic
http://www.millennium-ark.net/geophysics.html#solar
http://www.millennium-ark.net/News_Files/Community/Community_DB.html
ZETA TALK - Y2K BUG SITE
http://www.zetatalk.com/thub00.htm
http://www.zetatalk.com/thub.htm
ED YOURDON'S Y2K ARTICLES
http://www.yourdon.com/articles/y2ksafehaven.html>http://www.yourdon.com/articles/y2ksafehaven.html
http://www.yourdon.com/articles/9802cw.html
http://www.yourdon.com/articles/9804cw.html
OTHER POPULAR Y2K ARTICLE SITES
http://www.garynorth.com
http://www.year2000.com
http://www.y2knet.com
http://www.webcom.com/~yardeni/y2kbook.html
http://www.y2ktimebomb.com
http://www.y2ktimebomb.com/index.htm
http://www.kiyoinc.com/HHResCo.html
http://www.euy2k.com
http://www.yourdon.com
http://www.spr.com
http://www.heritagefarms2000.com
MR. SOLAR - HOMEPAGE -- EXCELLENT INFORMATION! NICE FOLKS!!
http://www.mrsolar.com/
http://members.aol.com/renewpwr/links.htm
http://www.mrsolar.com/entiresystems.html
http://www.mrsolar.com/courselink.html
http://www.mrsolar.com/coursesolarelectric.html
http://www.mrsolar.com/articles.html
http://www.mrsolar.com/friendly.html
ALT MEDICINE SITES AND ARTICLES
http://altmedicine.miningco.com/index.htm>http://altmedicine.miningco.com/index.htm
http://www.keelynet.com/biology/hcl.txt
http://www.navi.net/~rsc/index.html
http://www.navi.net/~rsc/rifersc1.htm#frq
RIFE INFO
http://www.rt66.com/~rifetech/
http://www.kalamark.com/devices/
http://www.kalamark.com/batyah/
http://www.kalamark.com/rife_bare/
http://www.navi.net/~rsc/bareset1.htm
http://members.tripod.com/~healingtools/biofreq.html
http://www.eskimo.com/~reid/list.html
DR. RICHARD SCHULZE -- THIS SITE IS VAST! LOTS OF ARTICLES WORTH SAVING!!
http://www.healthfree.com//schulze/herbs/index.html
SOUND HEALING - LEARN HOW TO HEAL WITH SOUND! REALLY!
http://www.frognet.net/biosound/
http://ds.internic.net/cgi-bin/enthtml/health/aaah.b
http://www.bison.com/index.html
http://www.newciv.org/GIB/BOV/BV-5.HTML
http://www.spiritsound.com/
http://www.healingsounds.com/JG.html>http://www.healingsounds.com/JG.html
http://www.newdimensions.org/Health/Health5.htm
http://www.sandiego-online.com:80/forums/health/musict.htm
http://www.bison.com/shealers.html
http://www.bison.com/healing.html
http://www.healingsounds.com/
http://www.bison.com/healing/hykes.html
TOM HARRELSON SITE--HELP THIS MAN IF YOU CAN! NEEDS PRAYERS, TOO.
http://www.angelfire.com/biz/healingtools/index.html
THE WATER CURE--READ THIS!
http://www1.mhv.net/~donn/water3.html
http://www.waking.com/titles_xyz/your_bodys_water.html
http://kinsman.epix.net/water/Multiple.htm
http://kinsman.epix.net/water/Vision.htm
http://kinsman.epix.net/water/Health.htm
http://www.watercure.com/reviews.html
http://kinsman.epix.net/water/BATIN.htm
BECK ZAPPERS - Action Electronics
http://www.action-electronics.com/pgs2/mpg1.htm
http://www.action-electronics.com/ps.htm
http://www.action-electronics.com/pgs2/index.htm#ps2pages
http://explorepub.com/articles/beck/hiv_article.html#anchor105827
http://www.msn.fullfeed.com/~prosfnd/midjan97/Bob_Beck
http://www.action-electronics.com/ccd.htm
BRAIN TUNER -- GET OFF ADDICTING SUBSTANCES QUICK! -- BOB BECK
http://www.angelfire.com/biz/healingtools/MSG.html
http://www.angelfire.com/biz/healingtools/BT.html
GASTON NAESSENS SITE--CANCER CURE IN CANADA! AMAZING TECHNOLOGY!!! http://www.cose.com/co01imga.htm
http://www.cose.com/index.html
http://www.livelinks.com/sumeria/tech/naessens.html
http://www.cose.com/ti01imga.htm
http://www.interlog.com/~amadis/714x/hpromis.html
http://www.interlog.com/~amadis/714x/basics.html
http://www.interlog.com/~amadis/714x/bloodfud.html
http://www.interlog.com/~amadis/714x/speech.html
http://www.interlog.com/~amadis/714x/parasit.html
http://www.cose.com/ti05imga.htm#Cycle
http://www.cose.com/pr05imga.htm
http://www.cose.com/iaso/index.html
http://www.cose.com/pr01imga.htm
http://www.cose.com/pr03imga.htm
http://www.cose.com/pr02imga.htm
http://www.cose.com/or01imga.htm
FASTING / DETOX SITES
http://www.teleport.com/~boydroid/benzene.htm
http://www.healthworld.com:80/library/books/Haas/detox/fasting.htm
http://www.healthworld.com:80/library/books/Haas/detox/general.htm
http://www.newhope.com/public/NSN/NSN_backs/Dec_95_NSN/liver.html
ENERGY HARMONIZATION ( WOW!! )
http://www.Bioharmonics.com/menu.htm
BOB DRATCH AND THE GODBOX:
http://members.aol.com/BDelphin/notice1.htm
http://www.drunvalo.net/
http://members.aol.com/BDelphin/Bi01001.htm
http://members.aol.com/BDelphin/Bi01000.htm
http://members.aol.com/BDelphin/index.htm
http://www.execpc.com/vjentpr/drunlect.html
http://www.spiritweb.org/Spirit/merkaba.html
http://www.spiritweb.org/Spirit/merkaba-meditation.html
http://www.spiritweb.org/Spirit/lightwork.html#DrunvaloMelchizedek
http://members.aol.com/BDelphin1/Ci01000.htm
http://members.aol.com/BDelphin/contents.htm
http://members.aol.com/BDelphin/Bi02002.htm
http://members.aol.com/BDelphin/Bi03000.htm
http://members.aol.com/BDelphin/Bi04001.htm
http://members.aol.com/BDelphin/Bi09000.htm
ASSORTED HEALTH / HEALING SITES
http://www.mineralhealth.com/every_about_minerals.html>http://www.mineralhealth.com/every_about_minerals.html
http://www.net5000.com/ibc/earth.htm
http://www.lagunabeachca.com/deaddoc.htm
http://www.lookup.com/Homepages/85209/alt_heal.html
http://accessnewage.com/html/zminor.htm
http://infoventures.com/cancer/
http://mothernature.com/wwwboard/
http://www.vitabuy.com/Ecol.htm
http://www.elixa.com/
http://www.homeopathic.com/ailments/hesinf.htm
http://www.lyghtforce.com/Athena/index.html
http://www3.eu.spiritweb.org/Spirit/networks-healing.html
http://www.healthlink.com.au/natural_resources/
http://www.o3zone.com/database/index/htm
http://www.mind.net/aware/reiki.htm
http://www.aidsauthority.org/rethink/archives/immune-120395/0002.html
http://www.livelinks.com/sumeria/sites.html
http://www.calcoast.com/bth/html/wellnessplan.htm
http://www.tznet.com/busn/unusual/
CANCEMA - ALPHA OMEGA LABS - HOXSEY FORMULAS!! THIS WORKS, FOLKS!!
http://www.altcancer.com/can5.htm
HEALING ARTICLES -- MORE
http://www.keelynet.com/biology/cancdiab.txt
http://www.goulburn.net.au/~shack/antiox.html
http://www.mineralhealth.com/every_about_minerals.html
http://www.maharishi.co.uk/mak2.htm
http://www.goulburn.net.au/~shack/welcome.html
http://www.lifeplusvitamins.com/lvitamin.html
http://www.realtime.net/anr/phytonu.html
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/JohndeR/longevit.htm
http://www.lagunabeachca.com/h&fger.htm
N U T R I - M A R T - Nutricology/Allergy RescgProds. - EXCELLENT
http://www.nutrimart.com/literatu.htm
http://www.nutrimart.com/NC.htm
http://www.nutrimart.com/36nc.htm
http://www.nutrimart.com/ge-132.htm
THIOCITIC ACID - Notes from Underground
http://library.jri.org/library/news/notes/notes0030c.html
EMU OIL SITES
http://members.wbs.net/homepages/a/u/s/aussiepol.html
http://www.cbl.com.au/aei/
http://www2.southwind.net/~norr/emuoil.html
http://www.emu-products.com/emu_oil.html
http://www.montana.com/emu/about.html
http://www.acay.com.au/~caffers/
http://search.yahoo.com/bin/search?p=Australian+Emu+Oil&n=50&s=a&w=w
Collodial Silver - MAKE YOUR OWN! HERE'S HOW!
http://www.keelynet.com/biology/colloid.htm
http://www.nmia.com/%7Egesch/silver.html
http://www.newciv.org/Colloidal_Silver/index.html
http://www.elixa.com/silver/
Guide to Medicinal Herbs Online - FANTASTIC!!
http://www.egregore.com/herb/herbhome.htm
http://www.healthfree.com/botanicals/
http://www.egregore.com/herb/disease.htm
http://www.egregore.com/herb/Uses.htm
http://www.egregore.com/herb/herbindx.htm
http://www.egregore.com/herb/bibliogr.htm#magicofherbs
PresentMoment - BULK HERBS & Natural Healing Site
http://wvw.presentmoment.com/pm/shop/bulkherb/bulk_tuv.html
http://wvw.presentmoment.com/pm/index.html
PhytoPharmica - WOW! Super Suppliment List - Hard to find!
http://www.herbsinfo.com/pages/phytoidx.htm
http://www.herbsinfo.com/pages/pgar4000.htm
http://www.herbsinfo.com/pages/pprogest.htm
http://www.herbsinfo.com/pages/phytopri.htm
http://www.herbsinfo.com/pages/shipterm.htm
MORE HERB INFO SITES -- EXCELLENT!
http://www.herbsinfo.com/default.htm
http://www.herbsinfo.com/pages/ncerbulk.htm
http://www.herbsinfo.com/pages/bulku21.htm
http://www.herbsinfo.com/pages/books.htm
http://www.herbsinfo.com/pages/fcerorga.htm
http://www.herbsinfo.com/pages/fchinher.htm
http://www.ica.net/users/ianw/bstsuz.html
http://www.herb-doc.com/document.htm
http://www.herb-doc.com/index.htm
http://www.freeyourself.com/testimon.htm
ALLERGY / CANDIDA INFO
http://cord.iupui.edu/~pjstone/cpt499/cause.htm#pollu
http://ergo.human.cornell.edu/350DEAfiles/Vent/Biogenic.Particles.html
http://www.panix.com/~candida/
http://ergo.human.cornell.edu/350DEAfiles/Vent/vent.notes.2.html
AGING/DNA Twist - THIS IS REALLY INTERESTING! ( FROM KEELYNET.COM )
http://www.newphys.se/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/biology/age3.asc
http://www.newphys.se/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/biology/age6.asc
http://www.livelinks.com/sumeria/health/aging.html
http://www.newphys.se/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/biology/dnamast1.asc
http://www.newphys.se/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/biology/age5.asc
http://www.newphys.se/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/biology/age7.asc
http://www.newphys.se/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/biology/dnamast2.asc>http://www.newphys.se/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/biology/dnamast2.asc
http://www.newphys.se/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/biology/dnamast2.asc
http://www.newphys.se/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/biology/age8.asc
Alternative Medicine - Welcome from The Mining Co.
http://altmedicine.miningco.com/index.htm
MISCL. SITES ON HEALING PRODUCTS OR ARTICLES
http://www.macrobiotics.org/minerals.html
http://www.celtic-seasalt.com/salt/salt.html
http://www.hscti.com/
http://home.inreach.com/dov/hd.htm
http://www.cnsp.com/newscience/


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:03
SDRer (The new Defense Organization...) ID#290172:
Copyright © 1998 SDRer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
South China Morning Post Hong Kong
September 15, 1998

Attack on deadline rule

Thirty of Hong Kong's biggest banks and securities firms met last night to form a united opposition to a key government measure aimed at fighting speculators. The unprecedented alliance is expected to present a submission today to the Government, Hongkong Clearing and the Stock Exchange of Hong Kong stating that the strict imposition of the T+2 settlement deadline threatens Hong Kong's status as a leading financial centre. The alliance represents the first co-ordinated industry challenge to the Government's crackdown on trading practices in the wake of speculative attacks that have decimated share prices and threatened the Hong Kong dollar's pegged exchange rate. Last night's meeting WAS DOMINATED BY FOREIGN FIRMS, INCLUDING MERRILL LYNCH AND GOLDMAN SACHS, but included representatives from fund management, custodian bank and the broking industry. Representatives from HSBC Securities and Jardine Fleming were also present at the meeting, which was held at the offices of ABN Amro Asia Securities. The head of one foreign broking firm at the gathering said it was HOPED THE ALLIANCE WOULD TAKE ON THE ROLE OF DEFENDING THE INTERNATIONAL BROKING COMMUNITY, which has come under government attack for its role in the speculative attacks.

What most people don't seem to realize is that there is just as much money to be made out of the wreckage of a civilization as from the upbuilding of one. Margaret Mitchell


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:02
LGB (Starr report..... Clinton subject to blackmail?) ID#269409:
Does it strike anyone else who read the Starr report this weekend..that Clinto was allowing a 21 year old, extremely immature and imbalanced flighty female...to essentially blackmail the president of the United States by getting his to dance to her tune on many ocassions...or else?

This issue is NOT about private behaviour which doesn't effect job performance. No way, No f..ing way.

Those who have not read the report, ought to do so, alternately nauseating, and absurdly comical ( in a black comedy way ) though it may be.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 12:00
Goldteck (SWISSAIR CRASH LEFT FORTUNE ON OCEAN FLOOR ) ID#431200:
Copyright © 1998 Goldteck/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
The crash of Swissair Flight 111 has left a Picasso painting, diamonds and possibly millions of dollars in currency and gold on the ocean floor in Nova Scotia. By DENISE BUFFA
A Picasso called The Painter, worth an estimated $1.5 million, was aboard the flight, Swissair officials said.
The guess is that the painting did not survive the impact, said Swissair spokesman Eliot Hoff.
Swissair would not disclose the identities of the sender and receiver of the painting, but said it was in a normal freight container.
It was unclear whether the painting was the same Picasso entitled The Painter - a 1930 oil on wood - that was stolen along with other works in 1993 from the Swedish Museum of Modern Art in Stockholm, in one of the largest art heists in history.
That Picasso was later recovered.
We don't know, Hoff said.
Art experts note that Picasso was a prolific painter who often used the same title for a variety of works.
The title and the artist in this case is just not enough information to identify it, said Anna Kisluk, director of the Manhattan-based Art Loss Register, a private firm that maintains a database of stolen artwork.
Swissair said another unidentified artwork was also on the flight that plowed into the sea off Peggy's Cove, Nova Scotia, on Sept. 2 - killing all 229 people on board.
The flight was also carrying nearly 110 pounds of cash and 4 pounds of diamonds.
The money was being sent from a U.S. bank to another U.S. bank in Switzerland.
The plane also was carrying a locked box containing as much as millions of dollars in currency and gold, according to Swissair.
The airline, which often transports money in and out of Geneva, wouldn't say to whom the fortune belonged or where it was going.
None of the goods have been recovered, and Swissair wouldn't estimate their value.
The cargo was insured for at least $20 per kilogram but may have been insured for more by the owners, Hoff said.
Jim Harris, a spokesman for the National Transportation Board of Canada, said the treasures are not the top priority of the ongoing search of the underwater crash site.
We're interested in the wreckage and the human remains. That's our main focus right now, Harris said.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:58
hugo (charts) ID#402151:
Copyright © 1998 hugo/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

sold out on Fri near the top. You have to be quick
Expect gold to move back down to the $288 or lower level ( Dec ) . Could see it go to the low 280's.
Perhaps Greenspan will give stocks a boost tomorrow. My bond put should do nicely. Expect to jump back into gold with both feet in a couple days.

The daily gold chart looks strikingly like the weekly silver chart of a year ago. We should be headed for a bottom corresponding to the low of the week of 10/31/97. From there we should move to the 308 area for a brief rest and then up up and away. No doubt the move will not unfold exactly like the weekly silver, so you've got to be flexible and nimble.

The current silver chart looks promising too. I can see a move to over $6 in the coming weeks. This incipient uptrend should see a pullbackin the next 2 days. If we hold the 480 level ( Dec ) , silver should take off.

In either case call options buying will be rewarded handsomely. It'll also be the last good opportunity to by gold this cheap.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:54
STUDIO.R (@T#1.........hmmmmmmmmmmmm....good thinkin' as always.........) ID#119358:
Yes, if Mr. Reno eats Clitton post procedure.....then sobeit. 'tis the cost of doin' da bizness.
I was more concerned with removing the infant from Reno's presence...for rather obvious reasons. agreed?

and as always, un GulpO y un PuffO to YA!!!!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:50
Gollum (@ravenfire ) ID#43185:
Not untill after lunch, and after we get our skiers back in. Aiming for 16 fathoms.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:48
LGB (Brazil soaring....... Post eclispe effect still strong....) ID#269409:
Copyright © 1998 LGB/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
uesday September 15, 11:27 am Eastern Time

Brazil shrs fly, index up 9.45 pct on G7 statement

SAO PAULO, Sept 15 ( Reuters ) - Brazilian stocks soared in late morning trade Tuesday as investors
continued to cheer news that the G7 nations would support Latin American markets if the current crisis
required emergency aid.

The 57-share Bovespa index rocketed 9.45 percent to 6,368 points at 1140 local time/1040 EDT/1440
GMT. The index had been depressed by more than 3 percent early on following weak interest at the
privatization auction of power utility Gerasul .

The October Bovespa future contract was up 10 percent at 6,490, indicating that traders see more rises ahead in the index.

Stocks have surged since Monday after the G7 released a statement saying they would back financial aid programs to emerging market
economies if needed.

The Bovespa has advanced 17.2 percent between Monday's 7.78 percent rise and this morning's gain.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:45
ravenfire (gollum) ID#333126:
oh captain, when are we flooding the ballast tanks and putting 6 degrees down on the hydroplanes?

what depth should we make, sir?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:44
Who Cares? (Modified LGB / Puetz Wager) ID#242214:

Loser:

LGB - must post ten times, I am not worthy of reading Puetz's
newsletter

Puetz - must post ten times, Central banks are more powerful
than newsletters

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:43
LGB (Bill C's dog Buddy) ID#269409:
What's the difference between Bill Clinton and his dog Buddy?

One humps on every female leg in the White House, the other is
a Labrador Retriever.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:37
tolerant1 (STUDIO_R, Namaste' and a cloistered gulp to ya for the parturition post...although) ID#373284:
it is still up for grabs ( sorry use of a term ) whether or not this might be a death sentence as I understand JR eats the male after the...ah......
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm...the...ah...the procedure...yeah...that's what it could be called...ick...yikes...............

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:36
STUDIO.R (@O'Sharefin........uh huh.........) ID#119358:
a brilliant essay.....life becomes so much clearer here@kitco. salud y G&P to YA!!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:33
LGB (@ Sharefin....chastisement) ID#269409:
Copyright © 1998 LGB/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Now Finmeister...I understand why you're chastising me for giving grief to Puetz. Some here have discerned my motives, and it isn't meanness.

Here's the thing. When a guy who is a professional / financial analyst / guru / Newsletter writer / Book seller...comes along and preaches these Doomsday scenarios month after month..scenarios which never pan out...and when we also KNOW that thousands read and are influenced by professional analysts when it comes to their investment dollars........

In this kind of case, it's a whole different ballgame from you or I or other serious investors, posting their opinions about Gold or stock markets moving up, down, or sideways.

Damage can be done when people eat up this intentionally sensationalistic nonsense. Sure it's Buyer beware in the world of ideas, and I would be the LAST person to advocate Puetz not posting whatever he pleases....but his peer review should be more critical than that applied to the average shmoe...particularly with his track record, don't you think?

There are a few things I prize greatly in the world of ideas. Reason, truthfulness, honesty, sincerity, fairness, objectivity. Can we really look at Puetz's record of quite strongly stated predictions and views, and come to the conclusion that this guy is being honest about the past, sincere about the beliefs, objective in the view presented?

Questions like the ones Realistic posts are never answered. Yet those questions are very important. They're not simply 20/20 hindsight. We all make faulty market calls and we all are entitled to share our various market views.

But a guy who's profession is to influence folks about their portfolios, ought to be held to a somewhat higher standard of peer review... particularly if that person;

a ) Relies on sensationalism and extreme predictions to achieve a hearing

and

b ) Has a virtually FLAWLESS record of bad market calls

and

c ) May be doing this to boost Newsletter subscription rates rather than boost subsriber portfolio balances.

Remember last Tuesday's Crash that was going to be ushered in by the Full Moon / Eclispe? When the market instead had the biggest one day point gain in history? That Puetz call would be amazing in and of itself.....yet this wasn't the first....or second....or third...or fourth, fifth, or sixth time that the market has responded this way to Puetz's extreme calls. Nor will it be the last.

You and I and every other reader of the forum knows, that in spite of world financial turmoil, the U.S. economy still remains too strong for a DOW crash to 3000 by the end of September, fear, bubble market, and margin calls notwithstanding. I have to believe Puetz knows this as well.

I hate to say this Finmesiter.... but I am having more and more difficulty believing that Puetz genuinely believes what he says. He has too much market knowledge, educational background, and history to really believe in his wild predictions.

Oh I'm sure he genuinely feels the market is poised for a fall due to excessive derivitaves positions, similarities to 1929, bubble market mania, and all that, but as to the extremist market calls I don't think we're getting a genuine heart felt belief. That's why I proposed a gentleman's wager, ( which I obviously knew was statistically a bad bet ) , that's why I badger Puetz incessantly.

Puetz could have valuable contributions to make....if he would cease from the extremist / sensationalist / flawlessly bad market calls. He thinks he builds a base of followers with these wild speculations..instead he discredits himself.

Words mean something. At least to me they do. Puetz's words should be viewed with extreme skepticism.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:32
DUC (just for u Eddy) ID#269320:
hey Eddy this is one of the best places. check it out.....

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:31
geoffs (Hedge Funds) ID#432157:
Please let me know the names of some Hedge Funds that are in trouble ?

Thankyou

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:30
Gollum (DOW +6) ID#43185:
Copyright © 1998 Gollum/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
What a gorgeous day. The sun is out with little white clouds here and there. Temperature about 60, it never does get very warm out here in the bay. The water is quite calm with just a slight chop. We are leaving a pretty good wake with pennants and flags flying from the conning tower as we pull our intrepid water skiers along.

Get this. I have learned that one of the skiers is none other than Sergeant Pepper.

The captain tells me that it's getting close to lunch and after we bring our skiers in and have a bite to eat, we'll be heading out to the deep water and some viewing of undersea life.

I never knew one of these things had hydroplanes. Or maybe it's only the yellow ones.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:28
EJ (Gollum) ID#229207:
Yessir! I stuffed the hold with sheeple, sir! They're more dense than water and will cause the sub to sink pronto at your commmand, sir!
-EJ

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:28
tolerant1 (LGB, Namaste' and a NY Giants gulp to ya from the Island that is Long on the 49ers) ID#373284:
crush Washington post...yes...I too slept better...much better...I just love a good augury...heh...heh...heh...

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:22
Gollum (@Mad Hatter ) ID#43185:
Yes it is. What a sight! Big plumes of spray as our yellow submarine pulls our water skiers across the bay.

Soon, I presume, we'll reel them in as we prepare for the underwater prtion of our journey.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:21
STUDIO.R (@as a result of much prayer and counsel.......) ID#119358:
Copyright © 1998 STUDIO.R/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I have received divine ( andy ) thought as to the appropriate punishment for Billy Clitton's misconduct. amen.
Billy must report to confinement for an indefinite time period. In this confinement, he will not be able to wear any clothing. Otherwise, he will be afforded the comforts of a normal existence. One wall of the confinement space shall be constructed of glass. American citizens may visit and view Billy at any time.
Janet Reno will also share the confinement space with Billy. Like Billy, she will be afforded a normal life's needs excepting clothing.
A non-private potty will be provided.
There they will coexist until Reno gives birth to a child of Clitton's loin. When the child is born, they both will be released back into society. The child will be conveyed immediately unto the Morman Church in Salt Lake or the Vatican in Rome.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:20
sharefin (Who will be the next bucket head?) ID#284255:
-
All babies start out with the same number of raw cells
which, over nine months, develop into a complete female
baby. The problem occurs when cells are instructed by
the little chromosomes to make a male baby instead.

Because there are only so many cells to go around, the
cells necessary to develop a male's reproductive organs
have to come from cells already assigned elsewhere in
the female. Recent tests have shown that these cells are
removed from the communications center of the brain,
migrate lower in the body and develop into male sexual
organs. If you visualize a normal brain to be similar to a
full deck of cards, this means that males are born a few
cards short, so to speak. And some of their cards are in
their shorts. This difference between the male and female
brain manifests itself in various ways.

Little girls will tend to play things like house or learn to
read. Little boys, however, will tend to do things like placing
a bucket over their heads and running into walls. Little girls
will think about doing things before taking any action. Little
boys will just punch or kick something and will look
surprised if someone asks them why they just punched their
little brother who was half asleep and looking the other way.
This basic cognitive difference continues to grow until
puberty, when the hormones kick into action and the trouble
really begins.

After puberty, not only the size of the male and female brains
differ, but the center of thought also differs. Women think
with their heads. Male thoughts often originate lower in their
bodies where their ex-brain cells reside. Of course, the size
of this problem varies from man to man. In some men only
a small number of brain cells migrate and they are left with
nearly full mental capacity but they tend to be rather dull,
sexually speaking. Such men are known in medical terms as
Republicans. Other men suffer larger brain cell relocation.
These men are medically referred to as Democrats. A
small number of men suffer massive brain cell migration to
their groins. These men are usually referred to as.....
Mr. President.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:05
Gandalf the White (Attn: Yellow Sub (Gollum)) ID#433301:
Dive, Dive
GW

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:05
Isure (@JTF) ID#368244:

Clintons wagon is way overloaded. As the wheels run off, look for GOLD to move up, and the market to head down. There is to much going on to keep everything under control. Talk about pressure!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 11:01
LGB (GOLD miners BEAT Washington D.C.) ID#269409:
There's just something gratifying about watching the home team, the SF 49'rs ( names after the GOLD miners who settled the area o' course ) BEAT the Washington D.C. team 45 to 10. ( Redskins indeed.... )

Just makes me sleep better at night somehow.....

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:57
LGB (Gold & metals stocks are going to move higher) ID#269409:
Copyright © 1998 LGB/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

Tuesday September 15, 10:43 am Eastern Time

Toronto stocks set to soften, metals will shine


CHANGE CHANGE
TSE300 ( CLS ) 5879.70 -9.74 HI 5974.16 LO 5879.46
DJIA ( CLS ) 7945.35 +149.85 GOLD ( LONDON ) US$290.35 +0.15
FTSE 5200.10 -68.50 GOLD ( COMEX ) US$295.00 +1.30
NIKKEI ( CLS ) 14227.37 +310.39 LME CASH NICKEL US$4085 +36
CANDLR 1.5040 LME CASH ALUM US$1338.0 -1.0
CAN 30-YR 136.65 +0.40 BRENT CRUDE US$12.93 +0.08

--------------------MARKET COMMENT------------------------- * Toronto stocks poised to dip along with New York but higher metal and
gold shares should mitigate weakness. * Bank stocks were likely to trade actively after the release of the McKay Task Force report on the
future of Canadian financial services due out at 0900 EDT/1300 GMT.

TORONTO, Sept 15 ( Reuters ) - Toronto stocks looked set to open softer along with New York issues on Tuesday but any weakness should be
mitigated by strength in base and precious metals shares.

``I think it's one of those profit-taking days,'' said David Jarvis, liability trader at Levesque Beaubien Geoffrion.

``Golds and metals stocks are going to move higher.''

Prices for the yellow metal overseas rose on softness in the U.S. dollar. Japanese markets were closed for Respect for the Aged day and
traders expected New York to set gold's direction for the remainder of the day.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:55
JTF (E-mail) ID#254321:
chas: Sorry. My E-mail got trashed when ATT pulled me off line. Should be back up tonight -- will post tonight.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:54
LGB (@ Mozel) ID#269409:
Your earlier AM posts were brilliant one and all. Next they'll be telling us Clinton is innocent of all federal crimes because Paula Jones was pulled over yesterday for expired plates ( dutifilly reported on ABC today, as the critically important news it is and all.... )

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:53
JTF (Starr Indictments Imminent) ID#254321:
Copyright © 1998 JTF/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
All: Looks like WJC will be forced to testify in a number of trials, with eventual indictments against him and the first lady.

On the indictment list: Hamilton Jordan, Harold Ickes, James Carville.

'Everyone in the White House is in desperation mode. They are on code red', according to an Attorney on Kenneth Starr's staff.

More references to Section 595 ( c ) and the fact that there are more grounds for impeachment.

http://www.WorldNetDaily.com/exclusiv/980915.exbre_starr_indict_.html

My intuitive guess is that Kenneth Starr is steadily raising the pressure on WJC and his wavering supporters.

I wonder -- what is going to happen when the Paula Jones stuff goes on the web ( today, I think ) ? Susan Webber Wright has probably had it with WJC. I'll bet that she supported him in the past -- he was one of her teachers when she was in law school I think -- all of that has changed now that it is clear that 'WJC' perjured himself with her, too.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:45
TYoung (Gollum...are you in dive mode?) ID#317193:
Back to work...

Tom

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:44
chas (JTF re email) ID#147201:
I'm having trouble emailing you. Please send me one so I can check it out. Mine is cdevoto@abts.net Thanx, Charlie

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:44
sharefin (Diversify your wealth overseas privately, securely, and inexpensively ) ID#284255:
http://www.cyberhaven.com/advertising/perthmint/
There is a little-known way to hold gold and other precious metals overseas, privately It's called the Perth Mint Certificate Program ( PMCP ) , and it is an excellent way to ensure your wealth securely, discreetly, flexibly and inexpensively.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:43
Mad Hatter (Gollum) ID#284230:
Is it a Yellow Submarine?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:38
ravenfire (Gollum (re: submarine controls)) ID#333126:
Doh! didn't they tell you that that big lever saying ballast control is what you use to get the sub to sink?

subs. much better than planes, as far as altitude control is concerned. just be sure you don't have leaks anywhere before starting out.

ever read Tom Clancy?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:37
Gollum (DOW -2) ID#43185:
This things got some pretty good engines. Right now we're pulling a couple of water skiers as we head out into the bay.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:35
Gollum (@wombat ) ID#43185:
Japanese financial and government offices closed last night due to holiday.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:29
wombat (Japan) ID#23947:
Can someone tell me if Japan traded today, or was there a holiday in Japan.

Thanks Wombat

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:27
LSteve (New lurkers) ID#316256:
I've been having trouble getting Kitco access this morning. This is a trend I've noticed starting a few weeks ago. I suspect that there are many more lurkers peeking in to see whats going on with gold. Seems like whenever there is some action Kitco availability is adversely affected. With that said, will all you lurkers go buy some gold, you know its going up and supplies with get short, so just do it now.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:26
Gollum (@ravenfire ) ID#43185:
I sold out to that Japanese investment banking group a couple of weeks ago.

I'm not altogther sure I like this submarine outfit either. For a sub it seems awfully light in the water.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:18
sharefin (Tantalus) ID#284255:
You means he's not the boss

I always thought he pulled the strings. ( :-^ ) ) )

------------------
Here's an Internet Weather Report*
http://www.internetweather.com/

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 10:08
ravenfire (Gollum submarines) ID#333126:
what happened to the Airline service? who bought it?

can i pre-book my ticket for next week's ... erm ... journey?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 09:55
BillD (Drooy up ~ 1/4...volume almost) ID#258427:
400,000 this morning...big move...heavy's coming in


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 09:48
Gollum (DOW -12) ID#43185:
Cruising out of port heading for deep water. EJ, did you load all the ballast last night?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 09:31
Allen(USA) (Repentance is always available to a broken heart) ID#240327:
Do not to readily scoff at the possiblity that WJC could be seeking something more than political cover here. I know that there are many who faithfully pray for this country and its leadership. Certainly it is better to withhold judgement ( not to suspend it ) until things can be more clearly seen. If he is really seeking help then we must all be thankful for that for his sake and for ours as well. If not then we are in for very bad times indeed for God is not mocked.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 09:21
Allen(USA) (shlomo) ID#240327:
Thank you. I am, as I wrote, a foolish man. I have no doubt regarding what I heard but do doubt how I handle it. Possibly it is this week. I do not know. I was not given a date per se. So who knows, eh? If this is some help then it doesn't matter about an exact date so much. Just my pride getting in the way again .. ( sigh ) .

Amos 3:1-8

Thank you for your patience and understanding.

I am praying for a more solid hearing and seeing in the future.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 09:19
6pak (Religion-Clerics-Lies-Sinned-Confessed @ CIA-Religion-Lies-Sinned-Undermine governments @ Taxpayer) ID#335190:
Copyright © 1998 6pak/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
September 15, 1998

Clinton selects clerics for guidance

WAYNE, Pa. ( AP ) -- U.S. President Bill Clinton has asked at least two ministers to serve as spiritual advisers, pray with him weekly and help him resist temptation.

He said he spent several hours speaking with the Clintons on Thursday before spending the night in the Lincoln Bedroom.

The following morning, the president confessed at a prayer breakfast that he had sinned and delivered his extensive public apology for the Lewinsky scandal.
http://www.freecartoons.com/WorldTicker/CANOE-wire.Clinton-Ministers.html

September 15, 1998

Report: CIA bankrolled Tibetan independence movement

LOS ANGELES ( AP ) -- The CIA provided the Tibetan exile movement with $1.7 million US a year and paid the Dalai Lama a subsidy of $180,000 annually during the early 1960s, the Los Angeles Times reported today.

The decade-long covert program to support the Tibetan independence movement was part of the CIA's worldwide effort to undermine Communist governments, particularly in the Soviet Union and China, the newspaper said.

The purpose of the program . . . is to keep the political concept of an autonomous Tibet alive within Tibet and among foreign nations, principally India, and to build a capability for resistance against possible political developments inside Communist China, according to a memo written by top U.S. intelligence officials.

http://www.freecartoons.com/WorldTicker/CANOE-wire.Tibet-CIA.html

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 09:18
vhale (Auric) ID#424424:
Got a better URL for that Augusta article, I can't find it?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 09:18
sharefin (The Ultimate Hedge Against a Y2K-Induced Financial Calamity ) ID#284255:
-
http://www.y2ktimebomb.com/Tip/Lord/lord9837.htm
A number of Westergaard readers have forwarded questions about the intricacies of owning gold and silver coins as protection against some sort of serious financial calamity brought on by the Year 2000 Computer Problem. This article addresses some of those questions.

As a preliminary comment, the likelihood that Y2K will cause a total economic meltdown is probably small. That does not mean, however, that prudent steps should not be taken to prepare for this eventuality. I don't plan to die soon but I still buy life insurance. The possibility of my death may be small but that event would be financially catastrophic for my family. Consequently, I find it prudent ( and caring ) to protect my family against that possibility.

In the same way, gold and silver have long been recognized as the ultimate hedge against the worst possible financial calamity. Owning them does not mean you believe the worst will happen - only that you wish to be prepared in case it does. Because the Year 2000 Computer Crisis has no precedent in human history, the level of uncertainty is very high. No one knows what will happen but the range of possibilities is quite severe. For the ultimate financial protection, therefore, I recommend holding cash as well as gold and silver in the form of coins.

Because owning gold and silver as a hedge against calamity is not a widespread practice in the United States, many people have questions about how to go about doing so. Here are some we have received.

Why should I invest in gold coins and not gold wafers or 1 ounce bars minted by a reputable company?

I recommend coins because they are a known commodity and are difficult to counterfeit. A scale isn't needed to weigh the metal and chemical testing isn't needed to determine its purity. The government that minted the coin has already taken care of that chore. If social and economic circumstances are such that gold and silver become the standard for commerce, these will be important considerations. Wafers and bars will be more difficult to use regardless of the manufacturer because of the greater difficulty of verifying their validity.

How do I know I'll be able to convert my coins into cash in the year 2001?

The only thing that guarantees this convertibility is thousands of years of human history. In virtually all cultures and at all times, gold and silver have been recognized as a storehouse of value. I don't think Y2K or any other event will change that circumstance. The more meaningful question would be what assurance would you have that any post-calamity currency would be convertible into the real wealth represented by your gold or silver coins?

If paper money goes down the tubes, and you have a $5 gold piece to exchange for something that cost $3, what are you going to get for change?

Small silver coins would be my guess. That's why I recommend both gold AND silver coins. The gold would be used for big-ticket items and the silver for everyday smaller commerce. I would also expect small amounts of other tangible goods such as tobacco, for example, to serve this purpose. In fact, for many decades in Colonial America, tobacco was the primary currency because of a shortage of British coinage.

Without a 'computerized' market for gold and silver ( assuming loss of electricity and/or computer crashes ) , how would you know the fair market value of your coins? How would someone know what value to assign the coins for barter, etc.?

The fair market value of all economic goods is dependent on two things, communications and the law of supply and demand. If a means of communications is present by which to inform the marketplace of prices, supply and demand will operate to determine the proper ( or equilibrium ) price of all commodities. Computerization has made markets more efficient because they make it easy to keep track of things and they facilitate rapid communications.

These elements are not necessary, however, for efficient markets to exist. Remember, we human beings have been operating markets for dozens of centuries without computers, telephones or satellites. Strong, effective, non-automated markets exist even when governments or those in authority are intensely opposed to their existence. Consider, for example, illegal drugs, ticket scalpers, and black markets such as those that operate in prisons or in totalitarian societies.

As a matter if interest, one of the most interesting aspects of gold's history is its remarkable consistency of value in relationship to other goods. Two hundred years ago a fairly good man's suit could be purchased with one ounce of gold. The same relationship holds relatively true today even considering market fluctuations. The same cannot be said of any currency or of any other economic good.

How does one find private safe deposit box facilities? All I could find in the Yellow Pages were storage facilities for storing furniture, etc. I wouldn't feel secure keeping large amounts of cash or coins at home due to possible theft ( particularly, armed robbery --- with a gun at my head I would definitely open any at-home safe ) .

Private safe deposit facilities are hard but not impossible to find. As an alternative you might need to get a little creative. Other kinds of business concerns use safes or vaults and might be willing to accommodate your needs for a fee. Jewelers and hotel operators come to mind.

Another good possibility might be companies that provide secure storage of computerized data for high tech businesses. Look for companies that advertise Disaster Recovery or Technology Escrow Services. I also expect that companies providing private safe deposit services will begin to proliferate when widespread public awareness of Y2K becomes common.

I should point out that keeping valuables in a safe or vault outside the home will not provide protection from an armed robber such as you describe above. A determined bad guy would just keep his gun at one family member's head while another goes to the bank ( or wherever ) .

A good quality, in-home safe is recommended. Buy a used one, though, as safes don't wear out and a used one can be purchased at half the cost of a new one. Some security experts recommend two safes. Install a cheap decoy in a location that is relatively easy to find. Put a little bit of cash and some important looking papers inside. Install your high quality safe in a secure location that will take even you twenty minutes to get into. Your good stuff goes in this one. Stuff like cash, gold and silver coins and your copy of my book ( grin ) .

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 09:10
Tantalus (@Sharefin - Clinton speaks to the Council on Foreign Relation) ID#317211:
Like reporting to the Board of Directors, yes?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 09:05
Gollum (@panda ) ID#43185:
That's why I like submarines so much better than aeroplanes. It's so much calmer below the surface.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 09:05
OLD GOLD (Shepler) ID#242325:
Copyright © 1998 OLD GOLD/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
SHEPLER MARKET TIMER
for 9/15/98

Current Position: Rydex Ursa fund since 8/12/98
Purchase NAV: 10.24 ( split adjusted )
Current NAV as of 9/14/98 close: 10.68

Return on current trade: 4.30%

Shepler Market Timer Returns since 4/8/98 inception: 15.61%
Buy and Hold S&P 500 Index Returns since 4/8/98: -6.64%


Market Commentary:

To quote from yesterday's Shepler Market Timer:

...we see Friday's gains as having little potential for follow through
beyond another 1-2 days at most before another severe decline gets
underway... Another extremely high TICK reading of +950 was registered
at the close Friday. Closing TICK readings that high usually signal a
short-term top within 1-2 days. Also, our proprietary buy/sell indicator
could produce a sell signal at the close if Monday's trading sees
another strong up day. The current wave structure of the market also
suggests to us that this rally will top sometime between now and Tuesday
9/15. From that point we would expect to see a strong decline lasting
4-6 days, and taking the market down to at least SPX 900, and DJIA
7000.... If 1027.72 SPX is surpassed Monday...then look for a run to the
1040 SPX region. For short-term index options traders... close out puts
on any move above 1027.72 SPX... then look to re-enter puts on a move to
the 1040 SPX level.

After another round of frantic short-covering Monday morning pushed
the market above last Wednesday's intraday highs at 1027.72 SPX, the
bulls, as expected, made a run at critical overhead resistance around
1040 SPX. At around 1 PM EST Monday the market hit an intraday high of
1038.38 SPX. At this intraday high, hourly RSI and hourly stochastics
had both reached extremely overbought levels, and hourly momentum was
flashing a bearish divergence. In addition an extreme +1147 TICK was
recorded intraday Monday, giving a strong bearish signal. From the
intraday high of 1038.38 SPX the market turned downward and closed at
1028.46 SPX, well off the day's highs. We feel the probability is very
high that mid-day Monday saw the termination of the current rally phase,
and that a drop to sharply lower prices will follow in the coming days.
In addition to the many bearish signals that were flashing intraday
Monday, at Monday's close we received a sell signal from our proprietary
buy/sell indicator. When a sell signal is received from this indicator
the market will usually top within 1 day of the signal, but in this case
we think the top of this rally is already behind us. The wave structure
of the market is also confirming the bearish outlook we are receiving
from our other indicators. Of the three wave counts we are following,
all call for a move below the 9/1 lows of 939.98 SPX within the next 4-6
days. Our initial target for this next downleg is 900 SPX, and 7000
DJIA, but these are only initial targets, and we feel we could see much
lower prices than these.
Market internals show that the rally that began Friday 9/11 was
another manufactured smoke and mirrors bear market rally. The DJIA
gained 520 points from Friday's intraday low to Monday's intraday high.
Yet, during this rally, new highs increased by a mere 3 issues. On
Thursday 9/10, new highs registered 21 issues. On Friday 9/11, this
reading grew to a mere 24 issues. On Monday 9/14, new highs stagnated at
24 issues, unable to post any gain over Friday's reading despite a 150
point gain in the DJIA. With new highs flatlining at this incredibly low
level, it is hard to believe the rally lasted this long. Then again, the
bulls did have some help from all the high profile bubble boys
( Greenspan, Rubin, and Clinton ) going all out to pump the bubble back up
with hints of rate cuts and bailouts. Only problem is that these
bureaucratic market manipulators don't have the ability to solve the
pervasive corporate earnings weakness, which is the real reason this
market has fallen so precipitously since July 20th.
Short-term market sentiment is the only piece of the puzzle which is
not currently in support of our bearish outlook. The OEX put/call ratio
was 1.55 on Monday, a bullish reading from a contrary standpoint.
However, one day of such a reading is not enough to warrant concern yet.
Especially since the OEX put/call open interest ratio is still very
bearish at .73, and this becomes a much more important indicator as we
get closer to option expiration this Friday. The Rydex ratio continued
to drop slightly to a reading of 122%, well below last Thursday's 186%
reading.
We have a strong short-term sell signal from several indicators, and
expect the market to accelerate to the downside in the coming days. For
fund switchers, we remain in the current profitable Ursa trade, with no
expectation to switch out anytime soon. For short-term option traders,
we advised buying index puts when the SPX approached the 1040 SPX area.
Traders should have had an opportunity to buy puts around mid-day Monday
when the market topped out at 1038.38 SPX. For option traders who did
not buy puts Monday, we would suggest using any rallies Tuesday as an
opportunity to do so.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:51
panda (Gollum) ID#30126:
You should always check out the market forecast before taking the sub out for a spin. Here it is,

http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/dd.htm

Looks kind of 'turbulent' to me......... :- ) )

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:46
Auric (Bad News For the President) ID#240288:
From the Augusta Chronicle, September 15,
1998. Clinton's videotaped testimony at the
White House, on August 17th, could be made
public soon. Henry Hyde wants to release the tapes. The Clintons and their palace
guard are fighting this release. Here is what
they are trying to hide.
http://wire.ap.org/?SLUG=CLINTON%2dCONGRESS

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:41
sharefin (MRCI Correlation) ID#284255:
Dec 98 Gold
http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/lbrc018.JPG

Feb 99 Gold
http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/lbrc019.JPG

Dec 98 Silver
http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/lbrc020.JPG

May 99 Silver
http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/lbrc021.JPG

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:40
ptwoskool (John Disney,) ID#225369:
I believe I have read that you like Harmony the best of all the S.A. gold mining companies. Would you please indulge one who cannot remember whether this is fact or wishful thinking.


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:36
Gollum (@Junior ) ID#43185:
Well, it's more like guest Gollum. I haven't definitely decided yet if I want to get into the submarine business, so I'm kind of just along for the ride. They did indicate they might give me a turn at the wheel though.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:34
Gollum (@EJ ) ID#43185:
Good golly, did some one leave some sheeple in the torpedo tubes?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:33
Gollum (@Silverbaron) ID#43185:
That sounds about right, except those correlations are based on data from past years and I have a gut feel that events are somewhat accelerated from what we've seen in the past.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:26
sharefin (Clinton Warns of Financial Emergency, Calls for G-7 Emergency Summit) ID#284255:
-
http://www.garynorth.com/y2k/detail_.cfm/2577
On September 14, President Clinton spoke to the Council on Foreign Relations, the most influential private club on earth.

He warned of worldwide economic crisis. Now, let me just say it all again very briefly: in short, we must improve our ability to address the current financial emergency. . . . He said he has called the members of the G-7 nations for a meeting to be held within 30 days to deal with this emergency.

Then he said that Congress must pass yet another IMF bailout. We must bail out Asia, he said. Twice he mentioned the excessive debt load of Asian businesses. But the IMF loans money. What has an IMF loan got to do with excessive debt of Asian businesses? Could it be that the money will be lent to Asian banks in order for them to roll over the loans on more favorable terms? ( This may be hard to do in Japan, where interest rates are already at a subsidized 1%. )

Why is it the duty of American taxpayers to bail out those businesses? And not just businesses; he called for the creation of a safety net for all poor Asians. He said: We must do more to establish an adequate social safety net in recovering nations. . . . There is simply not enough being done. I asked them to double their aid through an expanded social compact initiative focusing on job assistance, basic needs and economic transition, on children and the elderly, on groups most vulnerable to economic change. A safety net for 1.2 billion mainland Chinese? Why is this your obligation? Or mine?

It will cost more than $15 billion. $15 billion a week, maybe. This project would be a bottomless pit.

More to the point, how can Western governments and NGOs ( nongovernment organizations ) expect to bail out Japan, Taiwan, and Red China when those nations have been lending to the West the equivalent of hundreds of hundred of billions of dollars every year? The trade deficit that the West runs with Asia is paid for by Asian investment here. We are dependent on Asia. How can Western governments expect to bail out the gigantic Asian economy?

I ask you: What does this mean? We must work to lift the weight of private sector debt that has frozen the Asian economies. It means that Asian businesses are about to default on their loans. It means toppling banks in Asia. It means defaults by Asian firms to Western banks. It means, in short, that it's time for another big bank bailout with U.S. taxpayers' funds.

The President did not mention y2k. It is obvious from his speech that y2k is off his radar screen and off the CFR's, too. They can see only the looming Asian collapse. They do not see the permanent worldwide collapse that is less than 15 months away.

Y2K awareness? Sorry, folks. There isn't any worth talking about. Follow the money. Y2K isn't in the budgets. We need that money -- and a whole lot more -- to fund Asian banks.

The good news is this: these club members have only 14 months to go. Then their tidy little world, with its safety nets funded by taxpayers, will end in a wave of broken promises to pay. The grand experiment in fractional resseve central banking has terminal y2k cancer.

Over the next 24 months, every safety net funded by any civil government higher than the county will break. Rock-a-bye baby, in the tree top. The welfare State has lured a billion people high into that tree. The victims in 2000 will learn not to trust governments again.

In the meantime, down at the club, they will continue to sing the old songs. It reminds me of Singapore in January, 1941. ( After you watch THE TRIGGER EFFECT, watch PARADISE ROAD. They make a good double feature. )

----------------------------------
Public Utilities Stonewall California PUC
http://www.garynorth.com/y2k/detail_.cfm/2575

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:12
Silverbaron (Gollum) ID#289357:

Are you aware that MRCI has seasonal correlations on Gold and Silver?

These aren't public access, but they were kind enough to grant me a temporary look. The correlations indicate a next ( higher ) low in mid-late October for gold, but it looks like we wait until late February for silver.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:06
Shlomo (Allen(USA)/Panics starting/Sept. 14) ID#288399:
Dear Allen ( USA ) : Have reviewed your August 31st, 16:54 post. 2Tim2:12. Am with you, brother, watching and waiting. Spot gold @ $292.00 in London this morning. BEar Stearns guy just said gold bottom is in.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:03
Junior (Gollum - Yellow Submarine & Co, ) ID#248180:
Gollum, will it be Admiral or Captain Gollum? I like it dive, in our Yellow Submarine, our Yellow Submarine~~~ We all live in a Yellow sub~~
Cheers Good night & Good morning to you chaps up thar, JR.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:01
EJ (Gollum) ID#45173:
Hand on the air valve, ready to take on water.

A recording of the event might sound like this:

Blub, blub, baaaaaaah! Blub, blub, baaaaaaaah, blub, baaaaaah!

-EJ

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 08:01
robnoel (hamlet...I'am a proud member of the vast right wing banana club....) ID#410198:
.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 07:58
fiveliter (Sharefin-Jo Anne Effect) ID#341312:
Copyright © 1998 fiveliter/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
The Jo Anne effect doesn't apply to embedded systems like those on ships because those systems deal with the current clock setting and not fiscal years. Lloyd's shouldn't have any trouble with insuring the ships until late 99. However, as you pointed out, fixing and testing a complex system requires time so the impact of ships going offline for repairs will start to be felt next year. The Jo Anne effect starts whenever the companies fiscal year starts but some programmers think that these problems will be easy to conceal from the general public. I'm guessing there will be a lot of creative accounting and inventory going on in most businesses as they try to deal with software that no longer accurately records data for the current fiscal year. One approach might be to use a 6-month fiscal year and double the results! Who knows? It might actually work on some systems. Or, maybe not. BBML

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 07:51
Gollum (Gollum Aquanautics) ID#35571:
With the ides of September in my rear view mirror, I plunge into September. Having not so long ago sold Gollum Airlines, I have found a small submarine company that looks attractive. Today I will be testing one of their products to see if they might be a good investment. Dive! Dive! Dive!

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 07:50
bmacd (CNBC) ID#261322:
Well here's one to get up to. CNBC's sector spotlight on Squawk Box is Gold and Silver. They've actually mentionned gold.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 07:25
Mike Sheller (Spanky - IRAN & AFGHANISTAN) ID#347447:
Copyright © 1998 Mike Sheller/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Yesterday Spanky suggested we all keep an eye on Iran and Afghanistan, what with perceptions that Iran was massing troops along a border region between the two, if I understood Spanky's concern correctly. I promised to look at the horoscopes of both nations. Those who are astrologically challenged may move along, but with all the brilliant and witty scientists at Kitco, most should have no trouble at least following the planetary positions, if not their significance.

While I do have the 'scope of Iran's latest incorporation as of the overthrow of the Pahlevi dynasty on February 11, 1979 by Khomeini, I do not have the date that the Taliban effectively took control of the government in Afghanistan ( Donald? Are you listening? ) . I will use the previous government's July 17, 1973 date. Be that as it may, the old chart for Afghanistan ( things move so rapidly these days, don't they? ) has been under enormous pressure the past couple of years - this last especially. Pluto conjuncting this nation's Neptune has heralded some severe earthquakes, while Uranus conjuncted its Moon/Jupiter at 8.57 Aquarius in January of this year. Uranus went on ahead to 12 degrees, then retrograded in May and is steaming back toward that powerful 8.57 degree Aquarius mark for Afghanistan. It gets to exact conjunction with Afghani Moon/Jupiter on September 30 - just a couple of weeks from now. Monday, October 5, Mercury hits Afghan Uranus - could be a news flashpoint.

Iran seems to get major action when Uranus goes forward and sweeps its Mars/Sun/Mercury conjunction between 17 and 23 Aquarius from the year 2000 to the year 2002. This will be VERY important. We want to be especially watchful when Uranus gets to Iran's Mars ( planet of aggression, War, etc, among other things ) in February of 2000. In mid 2000, Jupiter and Saturn make a rare conjunction with each other at 23 Taurus ( exactly where Mercury in the NYSE 'scope happens to be ) , and as they do so, these 2 largest planets in the solar system will be in square with Iran's Sun at 22 Aquarius, in square with USA Moon at 25 Aquarius, and almost on top of the Sun of the NYSE chart at 26 Taurus. Verrrry heavy. Watch mid-2000!

On the more immediate horizon for Iran, Mars opposes its Sun Friday September 25, actually sweeping in opposition to Iran's Mars/Sun/Mercury lineup between September 16th and September 27th. The first 3 days of October, Mars squares NYSE Sun, opposes USA Moon, and conjuncts Bill Clinton's Sun. So very end of September may be American fallout resulting in earlier action in or by Iran...if we want to focus on the Iran scenario as Spanky suggests.

Calendar days to watch -
Afghanistan - September 30, October 5
Iran - September 16 - 27 especially around the 25th
NYSE, Clinton, USA - end of Sept, 1st week October, Especially Oct 1-3

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 07:16
sharefin (Gold up) ID#284255:
Last 4 hours globex falls 10 points.
And GCZ8 rises $3

Something happening out there?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 06:38
sharefin (We are advising that long-term investors stay the course,) ID#284255:
-
Mutual Funds Meet Y2K
http://www.courant.com/news/archive/Sep13-biz3.stm>http://www.courant.com/news/archive/Sep13-biz3.stm
----------------------------
First-generation computers halt production
http://www.courant.com/news/archive/Sep13-biz3.stm
------------------------
The article above speaks of supply and demand.
What will happen mid 99 when everyone wants the same parts.
At the same time.

-----------------------------
http://www.wowabunga.com/ps.html

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 06:38
Speed (Russian Gold Sales Denied) ID#9332:
-
September 15, 1998
Russia Hasn't Dipped Into Gold Reserves Despite Crisis, Says Central Bank Official

Dow Jones Newswires

MOSCOW -- The Central Bank of Russia hasn't sold any of its gold reserves or used them as collateral against loans during August or September, despite Russia's economic crisis, a central bank official said.

In fact, the central bank has been increasing the volume of its gold
reserves, said Sergei Kyshtymov, head of the bank's precious metals department.

On Monday, the reserves totaled 575 metric tons, or 30 metric tons more than at the beginning of the year, Mr. Kyshtymov said.

Recently, then-Chairman Sergei Dubinin, said the central bank was in talks with Western commercial banks over using its precious metals reserves as securities against loans.

The central bank plans to increase its gold reserves through the purchase of about 30 metric tons of additional gold on the internal market by the end of the year, Mr. Kyshtymov said.

Former acting Prime Minister Viktor Chernomyrdin said recently that the government planned to at least double the central bank's foreign exchange and gold reserves, as part of a plan to tie money supply to the size of the reserves. Despite the change of prime minister Friday, Mr. Kyshtymov said the plans to boost the reserves probably won't be scrapped.

It will probably continue, given that it is a sensible policy -- when a country increases its foreign exchange and gold reserves, it can get cheaper credits from international financial institutions, Mr. Kyshtymov said.

He didn't rule out using the reserves to back loans in the future, but said with new management just having been appointed to the central bank, it is impossible to judge the likelihood of such action.

On Friday, Viktor Geraschenko was reappointed chairman of the central
bank.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 06:37
sharefin (We are advising that long-term investors stay the course,) ID#284255:
Mutual Funds Meet Y2K
http://www.courant.com/news/archive/Sep13-biz3.stm>http://www.courant.com/news/archive/Sep13-biz3.stm
----------------------------
First-generation computers halt production
http://www.courant.com/news/archive/Sep13-biz3.stm
------------------------
The article above speaks of supply and demand.
What will happen mid 99 when everyone wants the same parts.
At the same time.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 06:32
pictech__A (Gold is turning) ID#214218:
Now $292.00

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 06:21
Auric (Correction of Last URL) ID#255151:

Here is the list of Bilderberger attendees-- http://www.cal-neva.com/money/bildebrg.htm

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 06:16
Auric (Those Wacky Bilderbergers) ID#255151:

Here is a list of attendees to the 1996
Bilderberger meeting in Canada. The attendees were some high rollers, including Kissinger, Wm. F* Buckley, and George Soros. Even Queen Beatrix of the Netherlands was there. Wonder if Queen Beatrix sold her Gold like the Dutch government did. She probably has a few ingots buried in the Royal flower pots, eh! http://www.cal-.com/money/bildebrg.htm

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 05:30
CPO@AU (mozel(@On excusing a lie ID#153110) ID#329186:
Copyright © 1998 CPO@AU/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
In agreement with you 100% but I am finding the response to the whole affair pathetic as I watch the lawyers attempting to save Klinton the gutless & their own skins, and wonder if they have any children or if their parents are alive.

What on earth happens if there is a military crisis ( not one of the self created type ) how would the US public react to the draft dogger sending troops to fight for his a**S.
My conclusion is that peoople make excuses about those that bring perceived benefits to themselves.and the system now so currupt that people just accept it.
As I see it from kitco those who want to cling on to klinton wish to do so on the bassis of the devil you know but did i not read there were question marks ( legal ) against Al Gore )

Go Gold dump currupt politicians
cpo







Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 04:57
mozel (@On excusing a Lie, Subornation of Perjury, and Obstruction of Justice) ID#153110:
Copyright © 1998 mozel/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
No one compelled Clinton to Lie in his testimony in the Paula Jones case. He was merely pursuing his self-interest when he chose to Lie.

He then used his office to obstruct justice and suborn perjury to protect his Lie.

Does it even matter that Paula Jones' suit was dismissed ? What has that to do with Clinton's actions ? Shall the robber be excused from justice if there is little or no money in the till at the time of the act ? It is a fact that federal prosecutor's have made a policy of prosecuting perjury in civil litigation, especially so during the Clinton administration. If Clinton escapes, it will be yet another atrocious instance of one standard for the law-enforcers and another, more strict standard for the civilians.

And, lest we fail to see the forest for the trees, let each father of a daughter and brother to a sister and mother's son answer this question. If the governor of your state used a state trooper to summon your female relative, a state employee, to a hotel room and then dropped his trousers and indicated he desired fellatio from her, would you feel a tort, a wrong, had been done to her ? Is the law not to defend the dignity and innocence of the upright ? Or in our worldly wise insouciance in which we are so intent not to defend the faith are all men's daughters, sisters, and mothers to be presumed whores ?

I fear so. The tendency, anyway, in an occupied country is for all the women to become Hookers. Chaos and degeneration both feature diminished order, but they are otherwise not at all the same.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 04:50
mozel (@$ocialist$ Where $ is Military Scrip) ID#153110:
Self-interested and $elf-interested come together in lobbies.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 04:00
sharefin (Something's catchy) ID#284255:
-
5th case of mad cow disease confirmed in Belgium

Another case of mad cow disease in Belgium was confirmed Thursday at a
dairy farm in east Flanders, the Belgian Agricultural Ministry said on
Friday. It is the fifth case of mad cow disease, or bovine spongiform
encephalopathy ( BSE ) , discovered in Belgium. The last case was discovered
in April. The diseased 4-year-old cow was slaughtered on
Thursday. The farm's 38 other cows were slaughtered on Friday, the
Agricultural Ministry said in a statement.
http://www.healthnet.org/programs/promed.html
--------------------------

Mozel
Do you mean that is why they call them $ocialist$

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 03:50
hamlet (Robnoel banana republic Y2k) ID#390259:
As I like bananas and we have import restrictions on them in the EU:
Are your republican bananas Y2k compliant ?

al the best !
hamlet

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 03:44
Auric (Derivatives) ID#240288:

Well, them big shot derivative boys had their meeting in picturesque Burgenstock, overlooking Lake Lucerne, eh! I wonder if the Bilderbergers realize what these boys are doing, and how leveraged they are. 100 trillion US$ is a lot of money, even for a Bilderberger! A good read on derivatives be had here. Good night Kitco, and go Gold! http://finance.wat.ch/burgenstock/98/

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 02:47
mozel (@NY Times ::: My Candidate for This Year's Lenin Medal for Editorial Excellence) ID#153102:
Capitalism is not self-interested. Those who offer a product or service to the market absent an interest in the Other's Wants and Needs simply don't sell much. This is true even in the current Market Corporate milieu, which is not capitalism, because there is no capital at risk.

It is Socialism which is self-interested. Because it is socialism which devotes every minute of every waking hour to the question who is going to take what from whom.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 02:11
sharefin (~The Seventh Sign~) ID#284255:
-
Self-interested capitalism is not designed to handle a system wide,
global risk to collective well-being. N. Y. Times, on the Y2K
problem
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mainstream Bumper stickers:
Stop repeat offenders. Don't re-elect them!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
White House: Y2K needs $3B+
http://www.fcw.com/ref/hottopics/y2k/fcw-newsy2k-9-7-1998.html

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 02:09
Auric (sharefin--Should I buy more Gold? ) ID#240288:

Wouldn't hurt, mate. Also, wouldn't hurt to adopt a bunker mentality for the next few months.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 02:08
John Disney (word of caution ..) ID#24135:
for lakefoil ..
Get everyone to spend all their paychecks on Rangy
if you like..
Buy before you do .. the DIVERGENCE between drooy
and rangy is probably caused by rangy's holding of
randgold resources..
The last time I had looked at UK stock site .. this
was trading at about 5$ .. It's now trading at about
$2.5 ..
RRS and the performance of Syama are central to
rangy's performance .. suggest you pay more attention
to RRS price and less to Drooy if you want to trade
rangy.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 02:01
sharefin (Auric) ID#284255:
I want to know what the insurance industry will do?

Should I by more gold?

You just have to have insurance.... 107 days to go.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 01:49
Auric (sharefin) ID#240288:

The signifigance of the Jo Anne Effect is the fact that it will arrive in about 107 days. The Jo Anne Effect will be the first big test to see if Y2K is real or not. It all sounds a bit nutty to me at times. Like buying and burying Gold.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 01:43
sharefin (J Stack) ID#284255:
We want to be careful about reading too much into these daily gyrations. But
as outlined on the weekend update, it LOOKS like the bottom's in place for
the 1st leg of this bear market - after 3 tests of the DJIA 7500 level. That
DOESN'T mean the bear market is over - far from it.

From the bottom up, this has all the characteristics of a bear market rally.
And a special note for bond holders, this definitely has ( at least for now )
taken away ANY incentive for the Fed to ease.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 01:40
tolerant1 (oops...) ID#373284:
you have to go to full text mode to get the urls...

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 01:38
tolerant1 (fin that shares, namaste' and a late night gulp to ya from the Island that is Long...) ID#373284:
Some interesting links on legal...insurance...current lawsuits...oh my...

http://www.2000legal.com/

http://www.year2000center.com/y2k/ndx-ins.html

http://www.isa.co.uk/cmi/cminews/library/service/itn/newswire/v1f6e8a.htm

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 01:35
lakefoil (rangy - drooy - harmony) ID#318183:
The divergence in rangy and drooy is interesting considering rangy owns 13.9% of drooy. The stochastics are even crossing. Yet I'm trying to talk the money people at work to spend all our next paychecks on rangy.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 01:28
James (The USD is a ridiculously overvalued currency, but because of the problems that) ID#252150:
Japan & Germany are facing I just can't see it weakening from here. Consequently, I sold my PDG today, having sold my FN last Fri. Also shorted Nortel & the TSE index.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 01:28
sharefin (Another Jo Anne effect) ID#284255:
-
Another aspect of this that I am aware of is in certain insurance areas.
Going back to my old fishing days.

To hire or ply for charter or reward - ie. to make a profit from a vessel upon the sea.
One must be fully insured.

Now if you own a vessel that is not Year2000 compliant
Then technically you are not allowed to engage in trade.
Because your insurance will not cover you as you are non-compliant.

The big Co's ( Lloyds ) are aware of this and have to make their minds up very soon.

Do they waver or hold firm?

Remember technically you are not insurable because of your non compliance.
Therefore you cannot ply for hire or reward.

This is a huge issue that will have to be resolved one way or another.

If no insurance - then no work.

Now start to think of all the global shipping?
Oil tankers have up to 10,000 chips - two months dry docking to repair.
General cargo ships.
Container ships
Passenger liners.
Plus all the small vessels that putter around within a 100 mile radius of their home port.

-------------------
Now back to the crunch.

If, because of the Jo Anne effect - a one year time frame.
The insurers decline to insure vessels that are non compliant.

Then as early as Jan 1st 1999 we could see the vast majority of vessels upon the seven seas
stopping totally.

Bang goes the global trade industry.

Bang goes the OIL SUPPLY.

Someone must make a decision before Jan 1st 1999.

And I am sure that this insurance effect would apply to many other sectors.

This is one hell of a hit for the insurance Co's with the Jo Anne effect.

Makes one think

------------------------------------
SDR
A toddy for the Wog t'would be great. ( :- ) ) )

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 01:12
tolerant1 (SDR_er, Namaste' and a good evening to ya as well...on those urls it must be noted) ID#373284:
that the fin that shares provided most of the work there...I was a very willing accomplice and portioned some of the links...sharfins's web page is excellent and growing every day...here it is if any of you missed it:

http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/Markets/Alternative.htm


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 01:02
SDRer (Tolerant1--and my thanks to you for the great Y2K urls you posted...) ID#290172:
( whatever day it was--getting just a litttttttle flakey am I {:- ) )
A neat dram to you, Sir. And happy-thoughts-goodnight!
Goodnight all.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:57
Randomwalker__A (lurking and linking) ID#409232:
More chowder for the Dogs of the Dow to chow DOWN on!

http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/980915/j.html

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:53
tolerant1 (SDR_er, Namaste' and a gulp and puff to ya from the Island that is Long and an) ID#373284:
over due thanks...gulp to ya for the A+...only one I ever got...death to the IMF...ahhhhhh...what lovely words to my ears...although I still want Camdesuss to pay for the antibiotics during his violation of my dog...my dog will settle up on his own when next they meet...

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:46
SDRer (Goodbye IMF. You are a short footnote in the financial history of the 20th century...) ID#290172:
Copyright © 1998 SDRer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
The IMF's Holdings of Gold. As of April 30, 1995, the IMF held 3,217,341 kilograms of gold ( 103.4 million fine ounces ) at designated depositories, valued at SDR 3.6 billion on the basis of SDR 35 per fine ounce.25 These holdings represent the balance of the Fund's stock of gold after the gold auctions and the restitution of gold to members in the period 1976-80, and following the Second Amendment of the Articles, in April 1978, which eliminated the monetary role of gold from the Articles. However, gold still remains an important asset in the reserve holdings of many member countries. Most notably, the Second Amendment eliminated gold as the common denominator of the par value system and as the basis of the value of the SDR. Any new par values must be expressed in terms of the SDR or of any other common denominator except gold. The Second Amendment also abolished the official price of gold of 0.888671 gram of fine gold per SDR by eliminating the limits to the price at which members may deal in gold. The abolition of the official price of gold also meant the removal of restrictions on dealings in gold among member countries, but the Second Amendment also explicitly forbade the Fund to re-establish a fixed price for gold or to manage its market price. In addition, the Second Amendment eliminated the obligatory use of gold as a means of payment to and by the Fund and also barred the use of gold as a currency peg by members of the Fund. Any use of gold in payments must be acceptable to both the Fund and the members using it. The Fund can accept gold only if such a step is approved by 85 percent of the total voting power as an indication of wide agreement among the Fund's membership.
http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/pam/pam45/II/IIE.htm

It would appear the ECU has decided to nullify the IMF's actions as outlined above; they evidently are quite ready, willing and able to reinstate gold as the common denominator of the par value system and as the basis of the value of the SDR.

Goodbye IMF. Your way didn't work...

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:41
tolerant1 (I'm watching Politically Correct on ABC and some fella just said that Clintler is single) ID#373284:
handedly responsible for the great economy...7 million off of welfare and creating 16 million new jobs...huh...what...huh...and Bill Maher the host agreed...huh...what...huh...

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:38
Who Cares? (Envy has no grasp of recent history...) ID#242328:

when Greenspan *did* drive down short-term rates dramatically
from 92-94, or so, in order to prevent a complete banking
collapse.

Although, at this time, I don't believe Greenspan will do anything
either, since investors have done it for him - they've driven the
30-year treasury and 30-year mortgage rates down into the
range that Greenspan needed.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:36
tolerant1 (there may be something in your local area...it may be something you folks might look into...) ID#373284:
http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/daycpg

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:24
JTF (Return of the bull vs bear market rally?) ID#254321:
Copyright © 1998 JTF/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
All: Worden Brothers' comments are usually pretty good, although they tend to shift postition like a weathervane, and they focus only on the technical.

The way I read what is happening is that the fear that caused our recent correction is waning, and the market is rising -- for a time.

The problem is knowing how long the up, before down returns. Could be a few days -- might even be a month if there are no new devastating revelations. And -- the derivatives markets behave themselves. Can't last much longer, I would think -- 1000 tonnes of gold missing from the hedges of the Hedge funds?

Eventually AG will lower rates, but I agree with ENVY ( I think that is who it was ) that AG is a grand master. Yes -- controlling the money supply is his first order of the day. But -- if he thinks we are heading for a recession -- he will not hesitate to expand the money supply one more time, and let gold rise. How else can he keep the monetary velocity up, if the economy is in a downturn?

It is fortunate that not all of our leaders seem to be lacking in leadership these days. The FED outshines the executive.

The situation in South America, Japan and Russia is far less optimistic, and there is the small matter of the plummeting US dollar of the last few weeks. It will be interesting to see whether the dollar rebounds, or continues to slide. It is all relative, as Einstein would say.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:21
SDRer (Humming Ode to Joy...which is, you'll remember, the ECU's national anthem ) ID#290172:

Well, are things beginning to fall into a recognizable pattern? Take a look at the referenced IMF doc, paying particular attention to the sale ( circa 1975 ) of 25m ounces...

EXPECT announcements of the like going forward. They MUST keep our darling sheltered from the lusting hoi polloi...and, although they are NOT ready for Y2K, they are aware of the problem...do you think they are in ANY WAY tempted to sell the one financial asset that has no liabilities attached? {:- ) )
Goodnight.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:21
Miro (@Silverbaron on Y2K and DB2) ID#347457:
Copyright © 1998 Miro/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I usually don't talk Y2K on this forum, however, I am asking for forgiveness and I'll make exception in this case. Your case is exactly what I preach in my Y2K presentation. My session theme is Don't Forget Your Data. We tend to focus too much on software in Y2K projects, not on data, and this mistake will hit you usually too late in the game when you may not have enough time to address the data problem.

No you are not doomed, however, you face a tedious process of data cleansing. Without knowing enough details about your system, there may be several strategies how to approach this. E.g., you say that the source of your problem lies in the original conversion, which was done a decade ago. There are usually timestamps showing you when the record was created and updated. You can use this timestamp to track when the date was introduced. You can go through DB2 logs and find which transactions introduced valid 12-31-1999 date. You can make a mandatory determination about cut off date for data cleansing, however, get your users involved. They know their data better than you do.

Don't forget that you need to clean up also any archive files, which you may eventually bring into operational environment. Don't forget any back-up files and transaction logs used for recovery purposes. Standard DBA strategy - synchronizing everything you may use in database operation.

It's a lot of work and that's the reason I am trying to bring these issues into attention to Y2K project people so that they may think about it and do it early enough.

You may have also additional problems with data. E.g. users use dates to indicate a special meaning. I saw too may 01-01-01 or 11-11-11 to indicate unknown value or open order with unknown delivery date, etc. You have to work with users and clean up that mess also before these dates become real and trigger some undesirable transaction.

JTF, you approach is essentially in the right direction, however, implementation in database environment is much more complex due to DB internals and different implementation logic.

OK, I am turning off my Y2K mumbo jumbo. Back to Gold. Did not I tell you? BEWARE! I am leaving town and that's when I loose money. There you go, even before I get on a plane, Gold is down :-o


Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:10
Auric (Bilderbergers!) ID#240288:

The Bilderbergers do indeed exist. Here are some articles from the press, including the Washington Post, which feature the Bilderbergers. Would like to especially recommend the January 27, 1998 article from the Washington Post. The one that recounts Bill Clinton being introduced to a Bilderberger meeting in 1991, by Vernon Jordon. http://www.tlio.demon.co.uk/reports.htm

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:08
Jack (Today sounded the death knell ) ID#237264:
Copyright © 1998 Jack/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

An injured president ( to be read as head of an injured USA ) blurted to his injured colleges at the CFR, that the diving world economy that the good buddies at the near dead IMF failed, to save the day, after the attempted plunder of sovereing nations -IS NOW ON LIFE SUPPORT.

Remedy, lower international rates and keep the charade going in hope that they may save the sorry asses of those Speculative Funds who started this mess in the first place.

We will hear about gold sales -to be sure- but grit your teeth cause these bastards are ready to go down like a certain ballyhood intern.

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:07
SDRer (Sharefin--You INCREDIBLE Gold Nugget!) ID#290172:
Thought you had the FLU! How is it that sick, you get more done
than I do well? {:- ) ) Take care of yourself. Have a little Wog...it is truly good for what ails yea! {:- ) )

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:06
tolerant1 (Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm...gulp........Hmmmmmmm...gulp...) ID#373284:
http://www.zdnet.com/anchordesk/story/story_2537.html

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:04
SDRer (Reprise? Is this a return to the original theme? Old familiar tune is best?) ID#290172:
Copyright © 1998 SDRer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved


Articles of Agreement of the International Monetary Fund
S C H E D U L E B
Transitional Provisions with Respect to Repurchase, Payment of Additional Subscriptions, Gold, and Certain Operational Matters
Back to Bretton Woods--sort of? Lordy
Articles of Agreement--Schedule B - Transitional Provisions with ...
Adopted at the UN Monetary and Financial Conference, Bretton Woods, New Hampshire, July 22, 1944. Entered into force December 27, 1945. Amended effective July 28, 1969, by
http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/aa/sched_b.htm

0-88867088 grammes of fine gold.
All the way back to Bretton Woods...trees and forests, yes?

So, the EU has looked back in time, and decided to refashion it all...with the Euro as the centerpiece!?

Date: Tue Sep 15 1998 00:04
sharefin (From the Y2k Weatherman) ID#284255:
-
I work for a local phone company ( on the wireless side ) and I am
amazed at the trust of the general public in our company to run
smoothly and more importantly, reliably. I hate to say it, but I
seriously doubt we will be operating post 2000. I asked the company
president at our company picnic, how we were doing on Y2K. I thought
the man was going to pass out! ( He gave pale a new meaning. ) It was
as though I had been a secret spy asking him about a highly guarded
secret; however, in retrospect, I believe the answer I wanted that day
was answered by the sweat on his brow.

I'm seriously worried if I'll have a job post 2000. But even if I do,
I may not even want a job here because I work directly with our
customers. Do I really want to attempt to explain to the Y2k-ignorant
why their phones won't work and endure their variety of irate
responses? I hope my nerves will last.

Just to let your readers in on a few things. Wireless ( cellular )
phones require land based phone lines in addition to the cell towers.
So, if land line phones don't work, cell phones won't work either.
Also, no electricity means no phones after the backup systems run down.

I'm don't know much about the systemic results of phones going down,
but it won't be pretty. My husband works for a security company. He
thinks looting could be a fairly common practice in the early months
of 2000. Most security systems alert local authorities by phone.
Guess what happens if the phones don't work! What good is calling 911
for an emergency when the phones are down?

Thanks,
Southern BELLe

---

// Y2k Weatherman Comments //

Since I work as a Y2k consultant to a large telecommunications
company, I'm very familiar with what Southern BELLe is talking
about. Although losing wireless communications would be a major
problem, it will pale in comparison to what will happen if the land
lines go down.

Before taking on my current assignment, I worked at MCI and before
that at Sprint. Almost a third of my computer carrer has been with
telecommunications companies. I also personally know people working
on the Y2k projects at MCI and Sprint. From what I've been able to
determine, Sprint is in REAL trouble. I've had two different Y2k
consultants from Sprint ( who don't even know each other ) tell me this.
I have no reason to doubt these grave concerns, especially since I
worked at Sprint and know how they manage their information technology
department.

I've heard conflicting reports about MCI. One engineer who was a
consultant on the MCI Y2k project told me he felt confident that the
MCI network would stay up. This is about the only good news I've
heard from anyone at any telecom Y2k project. Most people I've spoken
with at MCI are less optimistic. Nobody I've spoken with is sure the
billing will work correctly at either MCI or Sprint.

AT&Ts Y2k project is so huge, that I cannot even comprehend the issues
and problems they must be experiencing. The sheer size of the effort
is a problem in its own right, but I have no significant information
on AT&T's Y2k project. Still, I've never seen a technology project on
the order of magnitude of the AT&T Y2k Project that was delivered on
time.

The IRS, US Post Office, and other super-huge organizations have
unique issues with Y2k due to their sheer size. Projects this size
have VERY poor track records for successful completion. They're
almost NEVER done on time. The bigger the project, the further behind
they tend to get. This is a statistical fact, not speculation. We
have decades of metrics and statistic in the IT industry to prove
this.

Also, long distance carriers are just one piece of the
telecommunications puzzle. Phone calls are originated and terminated
by local exchange carriers. If your local phone company can't deliver
a dial tone, you won't be making any phone calls, local OR long
distance.

My personal perspective is that international calling is most at risk
since it is the most complex transaction to complete technologically.
Long distance calling in the lower 48 states may be less likely to
fail, but bottom line is that nothing works unless the local phone
companies can deliver dial tone. Without local exchange carriers
being up, the long haul carriers like AT&T, MCI/WorldCom, and Sprint
don't even matter. You won't be able to get to a long distance
carrier if your local exchange carrier is out of commission.

Next to the electrical utilities, the local phone companies are, at
least in my opinion, one of the most critical industry sectors for Y2k
compliance if we hope to have the world as we know it post 2000. The
prospects of reliable phone service post 2000 seem to be getting less
likely with each passing month based on the feedback I'm getting from
people I know in the telecom industry.

I really hope I'm wrong about this!

TIP: If electrical power is down in your area, but your phone company
has alternative power or is in an area where electricity is working,
your phone may still work *IF* you have a phone that doesn't require
an external AC power supply. Many cordless phones don't work if the
power is out. Ditto for some of the feature laden integrated
phone/answering machine devices. If your phone plugs into a 110V
electric socket in addition to the phone jack, check and see if it
works when unpluged from the electrical socket. If not, go buy a
cheap phone that works on just the phone jack alone w/o the need of
external power supply. This way you might be able to use your phone
in an electrical outage.

-------------------------------
Interesting how all these whispers are starting to pop up on the net.
I would be seeing a handlefull of them a day now.

Rumour or truth?

Even in our local town they are starting to surface.

Whispers before warnings before the Tsunami.

And we've been watching them within the financial markets for the last year.
And now we are seeing them start to unfold.

Time to rethink one's strategies?

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