KITCO GOLD FORUM
1997-1999

index
Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:59
IDT (Barb: Thanks to you as well) ID#228128:


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:58
D.A. (last.word.on.topic) ID#7568:
6pak:

I can not speak for anyone but myself, but it would seem to me that the interests of your country would align with those of mine. It's pretty clear that the stated intention of forcing SH to comply with the 'no NBC weapons' resolution is exactly what is the intent of the efforts, irrespective of the more esoteric conspiracy theories which have arisen to explain the policy.

Putting aside nationalities, doesn't it bother you that someone who obviously does not care for the type of civilization of which you and I are a part would like to arm himself with weapons that could exterminate millions of us in single shot, and then perhaps use them?


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:57
6pak (Myrmidon @ 23:45) ID#335190:
Do you travel abroad? For those of us who do, our lives will be more endangered if a war starts.

Myrmidon-- When you travel, do like many USofA travelers do. Get a Canadian Maple Leaf patch, and use EH! a lot. Or better still, do like the Israel secret service do, get forged Canadian passports.

Canadians may not have the military power of the USofA, but, Canadians do have a harmless image. Canada has no stick, just good people trying to live in peace, beside two ( 2 ) of the world's power brokers.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:56
sig__A (Not Pleasant At All.) ID#113316:
DA,

Quite a conundrum! As war must always be. A ground war is the only solution. I would rather be there than my son. Saddam is mad, and the average Iraq is no different than the average joe. Isn't it a sin!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:53
John Disney__A (Harmony vs Dbn-deep) ID#24135:
for SWP1
My own perposal way of looking at a gold mine is like
this. Establish ...
1. Proved and Probable reserves per share .. ( ie oz of
gold per share that doesnt require much finance to get at )
2. Resource gold per share ( finance will be required to
develop gold but no exploration )
3. AVERAGE Cost to produce the gold.
4. Then the cost of the stock to determine the PRICE you
are paying for the gold you buy in 1 and 2.

Harmony has lower costs than Deeps- say 310 versus 335
per oz roughly speaking.
Deeps have less shares outstanding .. about 41 mil vs 50
mil for harmony. Slightly More PP reserves say 15 mil oz vs
13. But Harmony have more resources say 70 mil vs 25mil (
Im guessing ... expecting to receive more info from deeps )
Harmony costs a little more than deeps - say 17 rand vs
maybe 13.5 rand per share.
This is a fundamental view. However deeps is getting big
US buying because Blanchard is pushing it and I think it had
a favourable write up in Barons .. Europeans tend to buy
Harmony.
I like both, But have bought mostly harmony. At a 400$ gold
price, Harmony will still make more money
per share I believe.
I really like RSA mines ( and some Australians ) because
they are much cheaper in terms of $ per oz of gold per share.
Also contrary to NA hype .. RSA mines are lower cost than
NA Mines. It may take a few years for North Americans to
find this out because they seem very reluctant to add,
subtract, multiply, divide, and think. Easier to ask broker
who just asks another broker while quarterly results
gather dust in a file somewhere unsullied by human finger
prints.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:49
tolerant1 (A moment of silence) ID#31868:
As we all sit here at our keyboards, there are many with family, friends far away.

They are in the midst of the heated debate/conflict.

I feel safe in saying that we wish all of them a safe return to those that love, and care about them.

Thank you.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:46
a.j. (Oris re:, your 23:05Cherokee RE: your 23:24) ID#257136:
It has been spoken of , even by mainstream news media that the Iraqis as well as other ME Nations, have anthrax, plague and possibly other means of mass Destruction.
It has been spoken of quite often on this site that no propellant other than a human body and small containers are neede to effectively use thw weapons of Mass Destruction. Where y bin Bo'? ( :+^ ) }[


Cherokee I agreee with the entirety of your post. ( 23:24 )
I am afraid the time comes that the remainder of civilized persons become aware of the realities, it will be too late.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:45
Myrmidon (@ D.A re: 23:02) ID#345268:

Sir, with due respect allow me to comment.

As an American I am concerned of seeing our nation from the most respected on earth becoming the most hated on earth due to failures of our foreign policy.

Soliciting to our allies for war is not good PR. Either we have the financial muscle to control some out of line dictators, or we are a paper tiger and we solve our problems with wars.

War results in loss of life and I am equally concerned for American, Israeli, or Arab life. I feel that our sanctions to Iraq were not fully implemented. There is still room for negotiations instead of a war campaign.

Have you thought the terrorist implications to the US if a war errupts. Do you travel abroad? For those of us who do, our lives will be more endangered if a war starts.

Please reconsider your views on this matter because you and I and many Americans believe that our financial might could avoid bloodshed.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:45
HighRise (AUS MINERS) ID#401460:
Sunday February 8, 9:01 pm Eastern Time

Miners lead noon Australian stocks quietly
Mining stocks outperformed the overall market after base metal prices edged up and as investors continued to look for
bargains in the sector. BHP ( BHP.AX ) rose 13 cents to A$15.20, Rio Tinto ( RIO.AX ) 24 to A$19.80 and WMC ( WMC.AX ) 14 to A$5.46.
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980208/miners_lea_1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:44
oris (John Disney) ID#238422:
Hi,Brother John, how are you?

Just stopped to say Hi..

Your Brother Oris.











Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:43
D.A. (when.is.the.time.right) ID#7568:
sig__a:

There is a lot to be said for the wait and see approach. In the short term no one gets hurt. The problem then reverts to how long. When if ever is the appropriate time to force the issue of compliance? If the answer is never then one must be comfortable with the sanctions being lifted and oil money flowing towards the inevitable development of weapons of mass destruction. Perhaps in 10 years or so, we will wake up to a Saddam armed with weaponry that could take out any city in the world. Wouldn't that be a pleasant thought.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:40
Old Soldier ( Oris' brilliant use of Occam's Razor) ID#185274:
Oris 23:05 Thank you! You have it precisely right. I wish that I could have stated the situation as well. Clearly it is in the Russian gnome to get diplomacy and strategy correct. How simple it is in the final analysis. The rules of engagement.

All. Please read Oris 23:05. He has it all very well summarized. No need for conspiracy or weapons of mass deception. It is very simple. Apply Occam’s razor.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:36
tolerant1 (D.A. a fine table we sit at, good food, and drink) ID#31868:
I stand, and raise a toast to you, Old Soldier and everyone else in the room for the opening of the Camdesuss Exhibit. Cheers, gulp.

Now excuse me as I want to kick the display once more just to be sure!!!

A roar comes from within-We GOT Camdesuss, how sweet it is.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:34
Scotty (US golden eagle Mintages) ID#290271:
For what it's worth. I just got the mintage numbers for the 1oz American golden eagle coins: 1997 production was 664,508 coins. 1996 production was 189,148. Hmmmmm......me thinks me sees a trend? It would appear that the little guy has figured out what we know already. The 1997 Platinum Eagle 1oz production was just 56,000.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:32
IDT (Speed: Thanks ) ID#228128:


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:31
tolerant1 (Heavy Hitter - Here, here) ID#31868:
We have nuclear powered ships protecting our oil interests. This makes sense. Not!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:29
D.A. (on.creation) ID#7568:
Tol1:

I don't know if it is fair to charactarize Saddam as a creation of the USA. I do not know whether we supported him in his rise to power or rather reached accomodation with him once he had wrested control. In any event it seems a bit of stretch to lay the multi-thousand year problems of the middle east at the doorstep of a country barely 200 years old.

I try to stay away from the word rights or only use it in the context where they are conveyed through civil consent. In so far as we have no civil understanding between ourselves and SH, rights are not an issue.

I too am not trying to pick a fight with you or anyone else. Rational discourse tends to lower defenses rather than to raise them. Besides, when you open up the IMF wing at EB's museum, I can't wait to see Camdessus stuffed and displayed in the appropriate diarama.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:27
vronsky (ANY WAR AND ANY FOXHOLE) ID#426220:

Old Soldier ( Attack on the USA from an ally ) :

Sir, I would follow you in any war, and share any foxhole with you.

Methinks those most unfamiliar with world history of the 20th century tend to be most critical of the USA.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:27
Heavy Hitter (BIG OIL IS TO BLAME) ID#403159:
If we spent more time developing other souces of
energy instead of big oil lobbyists owning us we
wouldn't be over there. If this war doesn't destroy
us we will mandate other forms of energy that is
better than fossil fuels for the enviroment. We
have the technology now lets get big oil out
of our leaders pockets. Big oil is a joke. Blame
them and our great leaders who are bought out
buy the same. It's all about money and now were
over there to defend the oil companies.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:26
a.j. (DA 223 and a myriad of others:) ID#257136:
Let me remind all of you that Herr Clinton and most of the leaders of the Western ( non--Islamic ) world, are front men for the folks who will gain from the sale of arms and commodities no matter where the war or who wins.
These puppet-masters always win.
Fellas and gals--it ain't a Conspiracy. It is simply business as usual and the devil take the hindmost. No personal animosity in any of the inhumane things done.
By any of the grouups.
U.S. France, Germany, Iran, Iraq, etc.
It will one day be made plain to all the current unbelievers that it is and has been fo a couple centuries the good ol' boys and their Profit Motives at work.
The scale of the operation growing increasingly larger as the Planet grows smaller and technology helps speed up the pace.
We all hope to gain from the coming cataclysm-don't try to disguise your desire ( greed ) by means of platitudes as to how sad or terrible it will be for Iraqi women and children, etc.
They already know as some of you must yet learn:
LIFE IS HARD.
There are no guarantees.
Do the best you can with the tools you happen to have been given and pray for the remainder who are not so gifted or fortunate!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:24
cherokee__A (@---------home-of-gollum...........after-his-preciousssssssssss.) ID#344308:

be assured--------IF iraq is attacked......iraq will
fire every-thing they have at israel..........

iran is ready to join in..........our navy will be
obliterated........tin cans, in a narrows surrounded
by missle-bearing martyrs..........

jeeeeezzeeee.......tuck tail.........become isolationist....
strengthen the military.......fast........and defend our shores.........
let them destroy each other as they have for all recorded history.......

cherokee!;.......wondering-about-gold-bonds-grains-------and-now-crude---

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:23
DEJ (Another Clinton witness.) ID#270236:
ABC is reporting that another witness has come forward to corroborate
part of Lewinski's story. Ashley Raines, Lewinski's closest friend
at the White House and still working for the government, heard some
of the phone messages Clinton left on Lewinski's answering machine.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:22
John Disney__A (I met her in Ve.Ne.Zu.E.E.E.E.E.E.LA with a basket on her head.) ID#24135:
For Ziva..
I have been defending you because I thought with name like
ZIVA you maybe are good looking Russian gymnast or tennis
player chick. Now I find out you are Grandmother!!!
Stop using bandwidth ... Ziva go home.
For Caper.
I refer you to 6pak 21:59. You have grown to love your
chains. I knew this was gonna happen. Free Quebec and all
provinces.
TO Las Cristinas Person
Somebody asked me about Las Cristinas. They said it has
15-20 mil Resources ( not P&P reserves right ) - 37 mil
shares .. trades $6.5.
37*6.5= $240 mil market cap/20 mil oz = 12$ oz for
high quality reserves. OK but no cigar. I assume there is
no money spinner piece in this pot and full finance is required.
If this is what youre looking for try Avgold in RSA
- better deal - plus money spin via Hartebeest. Take Las
Cristinas only if you speak only Spanish or like Venezuelan
chicks.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:21
tolerant1 (Old Soldier) ID#31868:
There is much truth in what you say. However Sir, with all due respect, once again the young men and women of our armed forces are being sent to put their lives at risk.

If the USA is going to start something I say lets finish and get it over with and not leave a festering cancer which will need to be cut out later.

Once again to you and D.A. with all due respect.

A table, some good drink and food, and I am sure that Sharefin, D.A. you and I and everyone else here could make a good evening of conversation of this and much more.

I for one will leave this topic alone.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:20
SDRer__A (Saudi Arabia: Opposed to military strikes by US against Iraq) ID#28594:
FT
MONDAY FEBRUARY 9 1998
By Roula Khalaf and David Wighton in London, Bruce Clark in
Washington and Mark Huband in Cairo

Prince Sultan said in the English-language daily Arab News yesterday: We'll not agree and we are against striking Iraq as a people and as a nation...At the same time we say to Saddam Hussein ( the Iraqi president ) to abide by the United Nations resolutions to protect his people and put an end to their seven year-long sufferings.

http://www.ft.com/hippocampus/v850c2.htm









Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:16
sig__A (America's oldest ally) ID#113316:
DA,

France is quirky when it comes to war. They have felt it twice this century and have lost in each instance. Given this experience, their caution is realistic. Where is the provocation with respect to Saddam? Shouldn't the condition of our attack be triggered by a hostile act? Any bellicose move against his neighbor [Isreal?] will result in an overwhelming distruction. Let him make the first move.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:15
DEJ (Hatred of U.S.) ID#270236:
Americans look at the nation's virtues and think the world should like us. It's because we have those virtues that they hate us. I'm of course
paraphrasing Ayn Rand.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:14
Ziva (Russia's Strategic Missile ready to repulse any foreign military offensive against Iraq) ID#302251:
RED ALERT
RED ALERT
RED ALERT



Russia's Strategic Missile ready to repulse any foreign military offensive against Iraq


Subject:
Russia
Date:
Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:09:58 -0600 ( CST )
From:
STRATFOR Systems Inc. alert@stratfor.com
To:
ZIVA, Kitco’s Queen, USA

_____________________________________

The Global Intelligence Update:
With Subscribers in Over 50 Countries
_____________________________________



Global Intelligence Update
Red Alert
February 6, 1998

Strange Russian Threats Over U.S. Iraqi Policy

On February 7, Iraq's INA news service reported that Bahraini Television
was quoting Vladimir Yakovlev, commander of Russia's Strategic Missile
Troops ( which controls Russian nuclear weapons ) , as stating that the RSMT
are ready to repulse any foreign military offensive against Iraq. Not
trusting INA's report, we searched for confirmation of General Yakovlev's
remarks, not expecting to find any. To our surprise, however, we
discovered the following TASS report dated February 6, 1998, which we quote
in full:

MOSCOW -- It will take minimum time for the Russian Strategic Missile
Troops to respond to an attack of a possible enemy, troops
commander-in-chief Vladimir Yakovlev said at a meeting of the State Duma on
Friday. Asked about the troops' readiness to repulse an aggression against
the background of a mounting tension in the Persian Gulf and the reports on
the U.S. possible use of tactical nuclear weapons against Iraq, Yakovlev
said the Russian missile troops are permanently on the alert and are ready
to give an adequate response to an armed aggression of any enemy to order
of the Supreme Commander-in-Chief -- the President of Russia. ( sic )

We would discount the importance of this report as well, save that Boris
Yeltsin claimed last week that U.S. actions could well lead to a world war.
We also note that Yakovlev was not making an offhand remark after being
ambushed by reporters at an airport, but was making a formal report to the
Russian parliament. This comment has been ignored by the world press, much
as Yeltsin's prediction of world war was dismissed as merely an indication
of Yeltsin's growing incompetence. However, we are forced to wonder
whether we are dealing with mental incompetence or a clear Russian policy.
It is noteworthy to us that Yeltsin went on to say this weekend that, I
realize it's not easy to break old habits... but I have to say that the
attempts of some countries to impose a unipolar model on the world, to
assume the role of leader, are unrealistic and even dangerous. The
remarks were made to an Italian newspaper. Yeltsin is scheduled to visit
Italy this week for meetings at the Vatican and with the Italian
government. It is important to note that Italy, still shocked by the
accidental collision of a U.S. Marine Corps EA-6 with a cable car, killing
20, has announced that it would not permit its territory to be used as a
base for launching attacks on Iraq.

As hard as this is for us to believe, we cannot escape the fact that in
addition to mounting an increasingly effective diplomatic effort to block a
U.S. strike against Iraq, the Russian government appears to be engaged in
some old fashioned saber-rattling. Assume for the moment that Yeltsin is
not merely a silly old man but rather the fully functional President of
Russia. This would mean that the President of Russia threatened the United
States with world war if it attacked Iraq and that the commanding general
of its strategic nuclear strike force has declared himself ready and able
to execute a nuclear strike whenever and wherever Yeltsin orders. Senility
aside, that is what happened last week.

Foreign Minister Primakov, busily negotiating with the Iraqis, tried to
soften Yeltsin's blasts by stating that U.S.-Russian relations have not
deteriorated over the Iraqi crisis. However, even Primakov closed his
comments by saying that, The development of relations can be based only on
such an equality... we will not allow anyone to speak to us in a command
tone. So, while attempting to defuse the more extreme implications of
Yeltsin and Yakovlev's remarks, Primakov not only was negotiating with
Saddam more as an ally than as an adversary, but was also joining Yeltsin
in warning the U.S. to back off on Iraq, and to stop ordering Russia
around.

This may or may not be related to everything reported above, but the United
States itself took a step to cool the crisis. As U.S. Secretary of Defense
William Cohen left for the Persian Gulf, he announced that the USS Nimitz
would be withdrawn from the Gulf on Sunday, following the arrival of the
USS Independence from Japan. There are good reasons for rotating the
Nimitz. Extended tours play havoc with personnel rotations as well as with
maintenance schedules. At the same time, in a genuine crisis, the Navy can
and has permitted extended deployments. The decision to rotate the Nimitz
out of the region leaves only two carrier battle groups with the Fifth
Fleet, cutting available naval strike aircraft from 108 to 72. Given the
fact that neither Turkey nor Saudi Arabia has yet given the United States
permission to use facilities in those countries for launching air attacks
on Iraq, this is a rather startling decision on the part of the Defense
Department.

There are several possible explanations here. First, the United States may
not be planning imminent military action. Certainly no action is likely
until the Turkish and Saudi positions are clarified. But the U.S. must be
expecting it to take several weeks to extract this permission, if it is to
be forthcoming at all, since it will take at least that long to get another
carrier battle group into position. The idea of delay jibes with reports
that the Japanese government is asking the United States not to launch an
attack while the Winter Olympics are under way. A UN resolution asking
that the Olympic period be considered a truce period for all conflicts is
in place. That would mean no attack prior to February 23, which gives
enough time to move another carrier from the Pacific into the Fifth Fleet.

Another explanation is that the United States does not expect the crisis to
escalate to a major air campaign because it is encountering extraordinary
resistance to its plans. Within the region, the inability to access U.S.
facilities in either Turkey or Saudi Arabia makes an extended air campaign
difficult to carry out for both technical and political reasons. Cohen
will be working that problem this week. But even if the regional problem
is solved, the most important fact appears to be that Yeltsin has decided
to challenge American power directly on all fronts including, astoundingly,
engaging in nuclear brinksmanship reminiscent of the worst days of the Cold
War. We assume that the U.S. government is taking these statements more
seriously than the mass media and may be trying to cancel or delay military
action.

Certainly, reaching an accommodation with Russia is becoming indispensable.
It is not clear that such an accommodation is possible. But it is clear
that the clock is now beginning to move backward more rapidly than
previously expected. The Russians are nowhere near as powerful as they
were ten years ago, but they are still a major power. If they ally with
China, the New World Order will be as dead as the old Cold War once was.



Correction: In a previous GIU, we wrote about F-111s being based in
Incerlik. A reader has kindly corrected us: the U.S. Air Force no longer
flies F-111s. However, land based aircraft such as F-15s and F-117s remain
indispensable for carrying extremely heavy burrowing bombs, and therefore
we stand by the basis of our report. Our apologies for this error.

___________________________________________________

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or Computer Security Alerts, sign up on the web at
http://www.stratfor.com/mail/>http://www.stratfor.com/mail/, or send your name,
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___________________________________________________

STRATFOR Systems, Inc.
3301 Northland Drive, Suite 500
Austin, TX 78731-4939

Phone: 512-454-3626
Fax: 512-454-1614
Internet: http://www.stratfor.com/
Email: info@stratfor.com




Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:09
Old Soldier (Attack on the USA from an ally) ID#185274:
Sharefin 19:50 OK Mate, I’m taking you on because I think you have broad shoulders and I otherwise respect you very deeply. The referenced post was stupid and uneducated. It seems popular for U.S. expatriates, wanabe U.S. expatriates and assorted foreigners to make various snide remarks about the USA. I put you in the assorted foreigners category. Correct me if I’m wrong. You had some questions. I have some questions.

What country ever had even the faintest possibility of defeating and dominating the entire world but never even tried?
USA

What country defeated the Nazis, with a lot of help from our friends, and then brought peace and prosperity to the European continent?
USA

What country defeated Imperial Japan, with a lot of help from our friends, and then brought peace and prosperity to Japan, East Asia and Australia?
USA

Why are you not making your stupid remarks in Japanese?
USA

Get a grip. If you love Iraq, join and support them and send the next echelon of Australians to fight and die for them. I wish you luck and happiness in the embrace of Saddam and tyrants like him!!!!

I expect nothing less than an honorable response from you. I will accept nothing less.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:07
tolerant1 (D.A.) ID#31868:
Not trying to pick a fight. My point was simply that the United States finds itself embroiled in problems around the world due to the fact that we
created them. When things don't work out we forget the suffering we created and then cause more.

Iraq is a powder keg in the midst of a world seething, covered in gasoline waiting to explode. We are about to ignite it.

There is no wisdom in this, none. Just because we don't understand something or someone does not give us the right, nor allow us to kill the object of our ignorance.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:05
themissinglink (Iraq) ID#373403:
I do not see how it is our best interest to invalidate the United Nations through unilateral action. Can't Russia, China, and France then enter their own conflicts waving the UN flag without United States support?

As far as diplomacy vs military, I would vote for military if it served our purpose. It currently does not. An air campaign to eradicate technology is a waste of resources at best and the equivelent of poking a stick in a hornets nest at worst.

Even if we were to succeed in a one time 100% effective de-W.O.M.D. campaign, the world we live in is a technology driven one and the knowledge behind the technology is impossible to erradicate. In the arena of biological and chemical W.O.M.D., the manufacturing capability and financial aspects are but a side thought for a rogue state. Once the technical aspect is overcome, the other two are rebuilt in a month.

Our commitment to air plus stationary defense was excellent for the goals in the Gulf War but fall sadly short for the stated goals for entering into military conflict now.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:05
oris (Old Soldier) ID#238422:
Sir, I'm interested in your opinion.

I think that many good fellows on this site
do not really understand so called rules of
engagement. I mean that Saddam can not afford
to attack the U.S. troops or civilians with
chemical or biological weapons. He is not a
a crazy SOB, just SOB, and he knows very well that if
he tries to do such stupid thing, then he is
just dead, because hidden rules of engagement
will allow the U.S. to wipe out everything that
has his name attached to it, including him.

Israel is a different story, it's his ARAB card.

However, Israel can inflict a very severe damage
on Iraq if forced to retaliate, but then other
Arabs may support Saddam. Then it's going to be
a real serious conflict. I believe this is a main
problem that the U.S. can potentially face, because
then oil supply can be cut off for some time.

And so, what we got? We got a situation when
the U.S. must effectively protect Israel, and not
because of nationality of people living there, but
because it can prevent problem for the U.S. itself.

However, I do belive that rules of engagement will
provide complete safety for the U.S. itself from
the Iraqi weapons of mass distruction.

What do you think?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:04
Heavy Hitter (FARFEL) ID#403159:
I'll second that and raise you $50ml.
BUY BUY BUY BUY BUY
Where is Cherokee is he ready
for LIFTOFF.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 23:02
D.A. (risks) ID#7568:
Myrmidon:

Yes. The government and by extension those that elect that government are constantly at 'war' with people or groups of people who choose to break the civil covenants of the society. A society without laws and the means to enforce them is in anarchy, where the risks are much greater.

You are probably correct that I am at greater risk from someone in my neighborhood than S.H. It is also irrelavant. Since the two risks are totally uncorrelated, my expectation of survival will increase irrespective of which one I eliminate.

Since it appears that your position does not support the use of force to get S.H. to comply with the terms of his surrender, what would your proposal be? Would it be acceptable to you to allow S.H. to acquire weapons of mass destruction and the means to deliver them?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:59
farfel (@ALL...THIS WEEK....THE EXCITEMENT BEGINS...) ID#28585:
For investors, there are two words that will lead to happiness this week:

Gold & Silver.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:56
tsclaw (DA, your 22:14) ID#318118:
I couldn't have said it better myself! However, I was about ready
to try until I read your post.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:55
6pak (D.A. @ 22:14) ID#335190:
Like you, I represent but one ( 1 ) Canadian voice, out of 35,000,000 Canadians. As this Canadian voice has a bias, that bias is pro Canadian interests. Obviously, your voice is pro USofA interests. I respect that voice.

Your voice is being heard by your President, he has the interests of your nation in his view. Yes, you and he wish to get rid of a ruthless dictator

I only request one very basic consideration. The USofA has interests in the Middle East, not Canada.

I suggest the USofA go it alone, you have the military power, go get the job done.

But do it without the B*** S*** demanding my nation must give assistance, as if canada will not assist in a time of real need. The USofA policy demands such military action, what the hell has such policy ( need ) got to do with Canada being a friend.

Yes, Canada will assist a good friend, our nation will assist when the USofA requires a reasonable voice to be heard. Canada is not a military power, hell, Canada has other more pressing social and economic problems.

Take Care.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:51
Myrmidon (@ vronsky) ID#345268:

it says: File not Found

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:50
Ted (D.A.(22:14)) ID#330175:
I'm with ya bro!...............go Gold + Israel!! SadDamn SUKS!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:49
Prometheus (@sharefin) ID#210235:
Your post re Russian readiness to support Iraq is extraordinary. This would negate the diplomatic back-pedaling that went on right after Yeltsin's apparent gaffe about WWIII. Perhaps his words weren't so off-the-cuff and unintended as they were made to appear.

I'm trying to remember this, and it's been awhile since student days, but weren't there several complex but unannounced treaties that got triggered at the beginning of WWI, which caused a rapid escalation of events?


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:48
SWP1 (Seeking comparison HM & DD) ID#233199:
Could someone please help me with a comparison between Harmony and Durban Deep. I am especially interested in the differences as regards being highly geared and safety as a function of asset base.

Thanks from newcomer...

Steven ( user787748@aol.com )


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:47
D.A. (bizarre.metaphor) ID#7568:
Tol1:

I am at a loss to understand how a political relationship can be compared to a familial one, so I won't even try.

Leaving aside the metaphors, our prior support for Saddam apparently stemmed from a desire to have a counterbalance to Iran. The policy, rightly or wrongly, perceived that if no nation in the middle east had military superiority there would be 'peace' even if the basis was mutual fear.

It is interesting that many people find it morally repugnant to support a dictator for political purpose yet find Jimmy Carter to be the weakest President of the 20th century. Carter's single guiding light in foreign policy was truthfulness and support for democracy.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:47
vronsky (DR, PAUL HEIN) ID#426220:

Sorry, the webpage is - again without the letters en in word golden
http://www.golden-eagle.com/editorials_98/hein011298.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:47
Heavy Hitter (A NEW CYCLE BEGINS) ID#403159:
We are in great danger if indeed Clinton takes a fall
on these new charges and we enter a war. This is
the worst tragedy at a time when everyone is spoiled
by low unemployment and values are in the toilet.
There may not be takers willing to risk their lives in
the face of a demoralized president. The call to duty
my cause a war here at home.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:45
Ted (Heavy Hitter...............................and joke) ID#330175:
good-N~~~~~~~~~

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:44
vronsky (IT'S THE TRUTH THAT'S BEING DEVALUED!) ID#426220:

Dr. Paul Hein shares an insightful analysis with us regarding DEVAUATION. He uses Indonesia as the example. His thoughts ring with Churchillian logic and clarity.

See following website - but delete the letters en in the word golden.
http://www.golden-eagle.com

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:37
sharefin (Perhaps pertinent?) ID#284251:
LAW v JUSTICE
by John Laird

Why complain
That evil men grow fat
And wealth increases for them
When justice costs so dearly
The common man is dispossessed
Of justice, in this land
For justice in this country
Justice gives place to the Law
And the lawyers thus grow fat.

The strength of government
Is the Law
But when Law invites corruption
Government itself becomes a victim.

When the Law is weak
Interpretation defeats justice
To suit the purse
Even our judges are confounded
And appeal but proves the flaws
The costly folly of our laws.

We need a government
Whose strength is justice
Rather than the law.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:31
Heavy Hitter (D.A.) ID#403159:
So much for the United Nations. When it
comes to money Nations will ununite.
Posses a very unstable situation.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:30
Myrmidon (@ D.A.) ID#345268:

Dear Sir,

You and your family are at greater risk from street gangs than S.H. weapons. Are you going to start a war against all criminal elements in America?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:29
snowbird (D.A Congratulations on your silver reversal call) ID#285392:
You were as close as a person could get on your call for shorting silver. Great analysis!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:27
tolerant1 (D.A. your 22.14) ID#31868:
Since the USA created and then nurtured S. Hussein. Essentially what you are saying is that if a child you and yours created threatened your family you would kill the child.

Just trying to figure out your logic.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:26
Leland (Bill, I want you to lean close so Hashimoto won't hear this..) ID#316193:
What Warren has been doing with silver, don't you think the U.S. play should start doing the same with gold? Oh! I didn't know
that. Your impeachment? No, I didn't realize. I suppose your
priorities are different.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:22
snowbird (D.A. Very well said) ID#285392:
You present a clear perspective.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:19
Heavy Hitter (JOKE) ID#403159:
Clinton and Jesse Jackson are at the Whitehouse taking
a squirt in the mens bathroom. Clinton asks Jesse how
he stays so big. Jesse replies he hits it three times on the
bed post every morning.
Hillary is in the Whitehouse master bedroom suite getting
dressed and Clinton walks in and hits it 3 times on the
bedroom post and Hillary yells out is that you Jesse.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:16
snowbird (James I agree with you but I qualified my statement) ID#285392:
In a previous post I suggested that a form of WW two Marshall plan in Germany would do more to insure peace in the Middle East than bombing the hell out of them. In this post I said We can't always agree but we can at least rally round in the times of need.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:14
D.A. (own.self.interest) ID#7568:
James:

As but one citizen out of the 260,000,000 or so here in the USA I believe that the government is acting in our own best interests in this situation.

I don't think that very many people would argue with your point that Iraqi citizens have suffered at the hands of Saddam H. Few would also take the position that the injuring innocents is a good thing.

That being said, it is also abundantly clear, that left to his own devices, S.H. would do everything in his power to obtain weapons of mass destruction and would have not the slightest compunction about using them. Since the US is one of his least favorite places, it might be concluded that I and my family are potential targets.

It's nice to abide by the live and let live credo. It's nice to take for granted that your little corner of the world is OK and that other parts of the world will just take care of themselves, and that everybody else is more or less a good guy, just sometimes we have cultural differences. The problem is, that some of the other people in the world are not good guys, and would just as soon slit your throat as have a beer with you.

For a site that attracts the libertarian type that wants honest money ( gold...had to get that in ) , believes largely that Clinton should be impeached or worse for his morals, I find it remarkable that there is support for a ruthless dictator who took it upon himself to invade a sovereign neighbor, got his ass kicked and now is bitching that the terms of his surrender are an affront to his people.

It makes me sick to see our 'allies' the French, worried about poor Saddam because they stand to lose some oil drilling contracts. Next time the Germans go marching through Paris, I'll applaud.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:13
vronsky (INGENIUS QUESTION: LIVE IN IRAQ OR ISRAEL?) ID#426220:

D.A. ( paradox? ) Sharefin:

If you were forced to live the rest of your life in either Israel or Iraq where would you go?

D.A. - I salute you sir! Nothing will more defines a person's real beliefs and feelings about this very controversial Middle-East situation than your very poignant and searching question:

If you were forced to live the rest of your life in either Israel or Iraq where would you go?

Any ethnic, political or religious group can best define its true opinion by answering the question while alone looking in the mirror. BRAVO - BRAVO!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:09
sharefin (Who? not me. ) ID#284251:
DA,
Sorry mate but I despise them too.
I would rather a soapbox on the beach,
From which I could cast my bait.
And watch for Tsunamis

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Strange Russian Threats Over U.S. Iraqi Policy

On February 7, Iraq's INA news service reported that Bahraini Television
was quoting Vladimir Yakovlev, commander of Russia's Strategic Missile
Troops ( which controls Russian nuclear weapons ) , as stating that the RSMT
are ready to repulse any foreign military offensive against Iraq. Not
trusting INA's report, we searched for confirmation of General Yakovlev's
remarks, not expecting to find any. To our surprise, however, we
discovered the following TASS report dated February 6, 1998, which we quote
in full:

MOSCOW -- It will take minimum time for the Russian Strategic Missile
Troops to respond to an attack of a possible enemy, troops
commander-in-chief Vladimir Yakovlev said at a meeting of the State Duma on
Friday. Asked about the troops' readiness to repulse an aggression against
the background of a mounting tension in the Persian Gulf and the reports on
the U.S. possible use of tactical nuclear weapons against Iraq, Yakovlev
said the Russian missile troops are permanently on the alert and are ready
to give an adequate response to an armed aggression of any enemy to order
of the Supreme Commander-in-Chief -- the President of Russia. ( sic )

We would discount the importance of this report as well, save that Boris
Yeltsin claimed last week that U.S. actions could well lead to a world war.
We also note that Yakovlev was not making an offhand remark after being
ambushed by reporters at an airport, but was making a formal report to the
Russian parliament. This comment has been ignored by the world press, much
as Yeltsin's prediction of world war was dismissed as merely an indication
of Yeltsin's growing incompetence. However, we are forced to wonder
whether we are dealing with mental incompetence or a clear Russian policy.
It is noteworthy to us that Yeltsin went on to say this weekend that, I
realize it's not easy to break old habits... but I have to say that the
attempts of some countries to impose a unipolar model on the world, to
assume the role of leader, are unrealistic and even dangerous. The
remarks were made to an Italian newspaper. Yeltsin is scheduled to visit
Italy this week for meetings at the Vatican and with the Italian
government. It is important to note that Italy, still shocked by the
accidental collision of a U.S. Marine Corps EA-6 with a cable car, killing
20, has announced that it would not permit its territory to be used as a
base for launching attacks on Iraq.

As hard as this is for us to believe, we cannot escape the fact that in
addition to mounting an increasingly effective diplomatic effort to block a
U.S. strike against Iraq, the Russian government appears to be engaged in
some old fashioned saber-rattling. Assume for the moment that Yeltsin is
not merely a silly old man but rather the fully functional President of
Russia. This would mean that the President of Russia threatened the United
States with world war if it attacked Iraq and that the commanding general
of its strategic nuclear strike force has declared himself ready and able
to execute a nuclear strike whenever and wherever Yeltsin orders. Senility
aside, that is what happened last week.

Foreign Minister Primakov, busily negotiating with the Iraqis, tried to
soften Yeltsin's blasts by stating that U.S.-Russian relations have not
deteriorated over the Iraqi crisis. However, even Primakov closed his
comments by saying that, The development of relations can be based only on
such an equality... we will not allow anyone to speak to us in a command
tone. So, while attempting to defuse the more extreme implications of
Yeltsin and Yakovlev's remarks, Primakov not only was negotiating with
Saddam more as an ally than as an adversary, but was also joining Yeltsin
in warning the U.S. to back off on Iraq, and to stop ordering Russia
around.

This may or may not be related to everything reported above, but the United
States itself took a step to cool the crisis. As U.S. Secretary of Defense
William Cohen left for the Persian Gulf, he announced that the USS Nimitz
would be withdrawn from the Gulf on Sunday, following the arrival of the
USS Independence from Japan. There are good reasons for rotating the
Nimitz. Extended tours play havoc with personnel rotations as well as with
maintenance schedules. At the same time, in a genuine crisis, the Navy can
and has permitted extended deployments. The decision to rotate the Nimitz
out of the region leaves only two carrier battle groups with the Fifth
Fleet, cutting available naval strike aircraft from 108 to 72. Given the
fact that neither Turkey nor Saudi Arabia has yet given the United States
permission to use facilities in those countries for launching air attacks
on Iraq, this is a rather startling decision on the part of the Defense
Department.

There are several possible explanations here. First, the United States may
not be planning imminent military action. Certainly no action is likely
until the Turkish and Saudi positions are clarified. But the U.S. must be
expecting it to take several weeks to extract this permission, if it is to
be forthcoming at all, since it will take at least that long to get another
carrier battle group into position. The idea of delay jibes with reports
that the Japanese government is asking the United States not to launch an
attack while the Winter Olympics are under way. A UN resolution asking
that the Olympic period be considered a truce period for all conflicts is
in place. That would mean no attack prior to February 23, which gives
enough time to move another carrier from the Pacific into the Fifth Fleet.

Another explanation is that the United States does not expect the crisis to
escalate to a major air campaign because it is encountering extraordinary
resistance to its plans. Within the region, the inability to access U.S.
facilities in either Turkey or Saudi Arabia makes an extended air campaign
difficult to carry out for both technical and political reasons. Cohen
will be working that problem this week. But even if the regional problem
is solved, the most important fact appears to be that Yeltsin has decided
to challenge American power directly on all fronts including, astoundingly,
engaging in nuclear brinksmanship reminiscent of the worst days of the Cold
War. We assume that the U.S. government is taking these statements more
seriously than the mass media and may be trying to cancel or delay military
action.

Certainly, reaching an accommodation with Russia is becoming indispensable.
It is not clear that such an accommodation is possible. But it is clear
that the clock is now beginning to move backward more rapidly than
previously expected. The Russians are nowhere near as powerful as they
were ten years ago, but they are still a major power. If they ally with
China, the New World Order will be as dead as the old Cold War once was.

Correction: In a previous GIU, we wrote about F-111s being based in
Incerlik. A reader has kindly corrected us: the U.S. Air Force no longer
flies F-111s. However, land based aircraft such as F-15s and F-117s remain
indispensable for carrying extremely heavy burrowing bombs, and therefore
we stand by the basis of our report. Our apologies for this error.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 22:03
Heavy Hitter (TED) ID#403159:
RIGHT ON.......

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:59
Ted (Heavy Hitter) ID#330175:
will do~~~~~~~~~~!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:59
6pak (Big Brother @ Super-efficient Central Tax Administrator, Corporate Canada, SUITS KNOW BEST) ID#335190:
February 8, 1998
Revenue Canada wants to go it alone

OTTAWA ( CP ) ­ Big Brother wants out of the family nest. Revenue Canada, the biggest, most intrusive and most critically important government department in Canada, is gearing up for quasi-independence.

There's no doubt about it, this is one of the most significant initiatives in the government in many years, Revenue Minister Herb Dhaliwal said in an interview.

The proposal to create a super-efficient central tax administrator is built on two pillars: Federal-provincial co-operation to reduce overlap and an agency's ability to recruit, reclassify and pay staff in competition with the private sector.

Trouble is, the provinces aren't buying in and some observers see the staffing question as an excuse to cut workers or inflate executive salaries, or both.

What are the benefits, really? said Prof. Vern Krishna, head of the CGA-Taxation Research Centre at the University of Ottawa.

Primarily a little less direct control ( by government ) . Primarily some greater leeway on compensation and payment to its employees.

It's not as great a concept as is being put out for public consumption. Yet the movement toward agency status, first floated in the 1996 federal budget, seems unstoppable.

Framework legislation should be introduced in the Commons by the end of April. The new agency could be up and running by Jan. 1

Revenue Canada is Canada's biggest bureaucracy, with 40,000 employees representing 20 per cent of the federal public service. Its long arm reaches into every household and business, every province, territory and municipality.

The federal auditor general recently questioned whether accountability is being lost as government moves its functions out of house.

How will Canadians and parliamentarians have assurance that the public interest is protected? wrote Denis Desautels in his December report.
http://www.canoe.ca/NationalTicker/CANOE-wire.Revenue-Canada.html

Soooooooooooooo, Mushrooms-R-Us AND Be Quiet...Consume...And Die.

Only in Canada eh! The Question IS...Can Canadians do anything about this? A Liberal Government, screwing the PEOPLE in Canada, via a Corporate agenda, made at the International level.
Dollar low -Gold reserves sold - Private Tax Collection.

Sending Canadians off to war because of U.N. policy,? and support for USofA policy

A Labour government in Britain, sending the PEOPLE ( Workers ) off to War, because of support for U.N. policy and USofA policy

A USofA President, representative of the little guy We The People Sending the We the People off to war. Because of, U.N policy

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:58
tsclaw (@ John Disney) ID#318118:
After alot of research and your help I'm jumping on board Harmony
at the opening bell.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:53
Charles Keeling (@ THE HATT) ID#344225:
RE: Delay in the start up of the Euro.

A theory exists that once the EURO is
placed into operation, the Oil Country's
will price their oil based on that new
currency. This would send the dollar
lower, and gold would move in the opposite
direction.

So-if this scenario is correct,the hoped
for increse in POG will be delayed with
a postponement in implementation of the EURO.

If they don't make the 1-1-99 deadline, they
will probably not make it by the year 2000
either since the Y2K bug fix is a hard date.

Some think that if the EURO ever gets off the
ground it will be a miracle. What country
really wants to give up the right to print
their own currency?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:53
Heavy Hitter (myrmidon) ID#403159:
True, but not everyone's a Prince. And
these trades don't come and go everyday.
Don't forget in general the people of
Saudia Arabia are not happy. It will be
very interesting on how it plays it self
out. I agree that oil has no problem
seeing $20 or $25. But, $10 oil. NO

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:53
Barb Hughes (ALL) ID#20783:

US Spot Silver currently $6.92

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:51
Myrmidon (@ James) ID#345268:

Why should president Clinton be concerned about the war?

Neither him, nor his children will go there to fight. Just
our youth which will be shipped there will be faced with the consequences, their families too.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:47
223 (Thoughts on Clinton) ID#26669:
I heard Mr C. talk last week, first in the state of the union speech then in a joint press conference with the British P.M. One thing stood out. He stated plainly that he was trying to step out of the stereotypal labels of right wing wersus left wing...to find a third way.

This has haunted me for 'left and right', unlike their common usage were described in the last century as being merely arbitrary divisions within the socialist revolutionary party. In reality conservatives are not counted at all; in revolutionary parlence they are royalists or counterrevolutionaries to be killed or the masses who will bow to the will of the revolution just to keep their own peace, judged too stupid to know either their own will nor their own needs.

Despite all his faults, Mr. C. is an educated man and he's well schooled in the parlance of socialist doublespeak. The US Democrats have labeled conservatives as 'right wing' purely for their own convenience in order to allow the less well educated to confuse them with the Nazi national socialists. Actually the 'right wing' of his party is the faction which espouses violent socialist revolution consisting of the union thugs, the radical feminist/homosexual coalition and the radical environmentalists and the left is the welfare/education/arts/healthcare reform coalition.

What I fear is his announcement reveals that the old society is so deconstructed that he judges it is time to consolidate power and complete the revolution. So his next step will be to absorb the 'right wing' of the Democratic party, the ones who will step up the violence in their revolution.

All, of course in my humble and demented opinion. So pay no attention. Merely the mumblings of an overeducated fool...

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:46
Myrmidon (@ Heavy Hitter) ID#345268:

correction in last sentence: Expensive oil and growing western investments.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:45
James (Snowbird@Americans Are Nice People) ID#252150:
I think we can all agree to that. But that does'nt mean that their gov't is just & fair & always acts in their best interests. I don't doubt that the average German was a nice person when Hitler was in power.
What has this got to do with attacking Iraq & causing more hardships & suffering for the average Iraqi? The average Iraqi has suffered terribly since the last attack & 500,000 children have died, but Saddam & the elites are eating as well as ever. Would it be any different after another attack? What bothers me the most about all this is the sheer hypocrisy. The Gov't has no intention of removing Saddam & is fully aware of the suffering they have caused. I wonder if Chelsea has ever asked her Dad why the Iraqi people have had this terrible privation visisted upon them? Probably not, she probably swallowed the party line like all the other automatons.
I served 23 years in the Cdn Navy & Air force, & I can honestly say that if I was still serving I would refuse to go. There is absolutely no honour in participating in that farce of a war. Even less ( if that's possible ) than there was serving in Viet Nam. And I say that not to take away any respect for the people who do go or who are forced to go. My quarrel & disagreement is strictly with the Govt's.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:44
D.A. (career.change) ID#7568:
Sharefin:

You have the makings of a politician.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:42
Myrmidon (@ Heavy Hitter) ID#345268:

A run to $20 - $ 25 per barrel is not unlike. Yes ideally, they would like the most for their commodity without affecting their western investments. Higher prices will put western economies in a tail spin.
Remember the Arab prince who invested $150 mil. in Apple Computer 8 months ago?. There are others like him.

Summarizing, they can't have both, ie. cheap oil and growing western investments.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:41
Heavy Hitter (cheezman) ID#403159:
Oil at $10. Full employment here in the US with a large world
demand. It's not in the cards, not yet anyway. Good investing.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:40
Speed (Myrmidon) ID#286199:
I'd never heard of it before tonight.
The amex link I posted is pretty cool.
Back to Under Siege 2
BBL

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:39
golddkm ((Mapleman) is this an answer...) ID#432148:
By rising against all currencies, gold escapes manipulation.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:35
Myrmidon (@ Speed) ID#345268:

How does it differ from the Nikei index?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:35
Heavy Hitter (MYRMIDON) ID#403159:
The Arabs don't seem very content with cheap
oil. The majority are not happy. In fact debt is
piling up and they are having serious problems paying
their bills. King Fahad is in bad health and his son
will soon replace him. His son is not a fan of the
US. They are very aware of the good life here
due to cheap oil. In the mean while the Arabs
can't pay their bills. Something is going to give
and soon.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:34
sharefin (What, my choice?) ID#284251:
DA, RLM

I would choose neither.
To me paradise lies at Mission Beach.
160km's Sth of Cairns.

A paradise far away from the crazy world.
Where fools trade sex for war.
And bend and twist reality to suit themselves.
To line their pockets with others woes.

I have no aspiration to rub shoulders with their ilk.
I despise their intentions.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:30
Speed (IDT- link stops too soon- search options on JPN) ID#286199:
Amex JPN

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:28
Speed (IDT - GOT IT! The Japan Index) ID#286199:
http://www.amex.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/AmexWeb.woa/7619100000601220000039170000000723/MainNavBar.wo/19011000002723/5/7/205.187.189.19?36,25

Description of Index
The Japan Index is a modified price-weighted index that measures the aggregate performance of 210 common stocks that are actively traded on the Tokyo Stock Exchange and representative of a broad cross section of Japanese industry. The Index,denominated in U.S. dollars, is calculated once a day and disseminated before the openingof trading based on closing prices of the component stocks on the Tokyo Stock Exchange.
( Index components follow. )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:27
GOLDEN CHEESEHEAD () ID#431263:
Herr Heavy--

Agree, fundamental value looks great--BUT, I seeem to recall oil below $10 once upon a time and if Iraq relents, and UN rewards Saddam with greater oil-for-food sales, and China devalues leading to another round of Asian contagion--well, $16 oil might look like $390 gold does today! Just a thought to keep us from getting too cocky about a market over which we have absolutely zilch control!: )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:26
Myrmidon (@ Heavy Hitter) ID#345268:

We should bear in mind that Arab money is invested in western stock markets. The Arabs by raising the price of oil may end up losing more money from markets collapsing than gains from oil.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:23
Lan Man (@China Gold - Not All That It's Cracked Up To Be) ID#31766:
Heck, I'm sticking with my investments in Venezuela and S.A., much lower risk…

-----------------------------------

News Release

Jan. 15, 1998 ASIA MINERALS CORP ( AMP )

Asia Minerals issues a notice of intent to terminate the Yingezhuang Gold Mining Joint Venture in China

Asia Minerals reports that a Notice of Intent to Terminate the gold mining joint venture in Zhaoyuan City, Shandong, China was issued by the company to the Zhaoyuan Gold Industrial Group Corp. on 12 January 1998.

Yingezhuang is the first Sino-Foreign gold mining joint venture to obtain full approval from the State Planning Commission and the Ministry of Foreign Trade and Economic Cooperation. A business license was issued to the JV in October 1997.

The Company prepared mine expansion feasibility study during the period June 1996 to November 1997 at a cost of US$1.5 million. The feasibility report, containing a technically and economically viable expansion plan, was submitted to Zhaoyuan in November 1997.

Since October 1997, Zhaoyuan has breached numerous principles and provisions of the JV contract. As a result of these breaches, the Company has concluded that the expansion of the Yingezhuang mine would not be commercially viable for technical, economic and management reasons.

Examples of non-compliance include:

1..Zhaoyuan rejects the authority of the JV Board of Directors to determine the operating gold grade of the mine, insisting that both ore reserve and production grades are set and approved by the State Planning Commission;

2. Zhaoyuan has unilaterally entered into agreements with respect to the expansion of the mine that are directly in conflict with the feasability study, such that significant addional capital costs will be incurred and the engineering design will not meet international industry standards;

3. Zhaoyuan has materially increased the existing debt of the Yingezhuang mine;

In addition, the JV has to date been unable to secure a mining license or preferential tax policies that were offered prior to the Issuance of the Business License.

------

Sooooooooo, everyone THOUGHT that gold mining would expand in China, JV's all over the place, tons of gold being taken out of the ground and put into the market, yada yada yada. Bet that this major setback to AMP will make other outfits think twice. Face it, Asia is just not the place to be trying to start up a mine these days, or investing in stocks for that matter. Honestly now, who really thought that the Reds were going to open up and let all those N.A. miners come in without calling all the shots? Oh, by the way, the Zhaoyuan Directors did not even bother to show up at the January 8 meeting that was called by AMP to discuss those defaults.

Bottom line? 100's of tons of gold should be discounted in estimating future world production. Take THAT Andy!


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:22
Heavy Hitter (cheezman) ID#403159:
Big difference with gold at $380 and oil at $15. If oil gets any
cheaper they may as well start giving it away. $380 gold
was no bargain back then. Now it is. BUY BUY BUY BUY

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:21
mapleman (GIVE ME SOME HELP !!!!!! ) ID#348127:

I've been doing my homework for some time now and have come to a conclusion that the POG is completely manipulated by someone. Don't know who, could be BILDERBERGERS, OR TRILATERAL
Could be a smaller faction run outside these groups. I know in my gut that gold will make a run this year, but I am puzzled as how it will get away from the manipulation and trade at an open market price. I this is a vague question, lets see if anyone can help.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:17
Heavy Hitter (TED) ID#403159:
Nice work. Keep em comin !!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:17
GOLDEN CHEESEHEAD () ID#431263:
Herr Heavy--

No where to go but up,huh? Sounds like the talk around here about gold when it was building a base at $390 before soaring to $278! Never say never! Manipulated markets today can go anywhere! By the way, Asia tonight on a tear higher! 2%plus for most markets.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:15
Lou_Jan (Crystal Ball) ID#316238:
Any ideas on the price of silver and silver stocks in the upcoming week...?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:15
James (Sharefin@You're No Fun) ID#252150:
Why did you have to give us all the answers to your Q&A? Luckily for the
U.S. gov't, Joe 6pak will never see it & if he did he would'nt believe it.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:14
Ted (Poorboys..........thankx for the 'Looney Tunes') ID#330175:
Looks like it's down so far t'nite....trigger finger-itchy!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:13
Heavy Hitter (cherokee) ID#403159:
I already stepped on the plate and boarded the train 3
weeks ago. Oil has no where to go but up. I'm now
waving good-bye.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:13
D.A. (EMU.delay) ID#7568:
DEJ:

I second your motion on the consequences of EMU delay. One other reason that gold might get a boost is that there would be a major unwinding of the bond market convergence trades which have taken place over the last few years. If Italy had its EMU umbilical cord cut, it might not be able to survive both a currency and debt market attack. It could make SE Asia look like a picnic.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:10
Ted (JOKE) ID#330175:
St. Peter meets Mother Theresa at the Gates Of Heaven and says, You were
a good woman. I'm
giving you a nice halo. Mother Theresa is walking around Heaven when
she sees Princess Di, and the Princess has a much bigger halo. Mother
Theresa goes back to St. Peter and says, St. Peter, I spent most of my
adult life helping the poor and the sickly. Princess Di did no where
near the amount of charitable work I did. Why does she have a
bigger halo? St. Peter says, That's not a halo. That's a steering
wheel.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:05
DEJ (Delay should be good for gold.) ID#270236:
Could be wrong but a delay in the EMU would hurt the dollar and boost
the mark. Also the European countries who are potential gold sellers
have already sold i.e. Belgium and the Netherlands. France, Germany
and Italy have no plans to sell gold. The Swiss also have no current
plans. So I would think it would be positive.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 21:03
Selby (Randfontein URL at 19:49) ID#286230:
Unless you have a desire to see pictures of the actual mill and workings the other info doesn't warrent the hour it takes to down load.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:58
The Hatt (Delayed EMU) ID#294232:
How would a delay effect the POG? ANYONE?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:57
cherokee__A (@-----here?.....) ID#344308:


http://router.minot.com/~bohl/display.pl

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:55
cherokee__A (@-----possible?--------or-realistic-----------) ID#344308:

the last big spike.......jan91....
the us led co-alition bombs iraq........

oil went to $40bbl+...........

dec98 2400 calls are $140.00.........


http://router.minot.com/~bohl/display.pl

step-up to the plate.........

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:54
Myrmidon (@ RLM) ID#345268:

Everyone thinks his dog is the best, his kid is the smartest, and the country he was born the best place on earth.

You still did not answer the question.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:50
223 (Jack tnx for url) ID#26669:
Thanks for the url, Jack. I've never seen it before. Just skimming through, it looks like the sort of info that otherwise would take up endless search time. I think that silver has gotten bad press ever since the Hunt boys and am glad to see it come back.

I wish though they'd give more links and less Madison Avenue cuteness.




Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:47
RLM (Israel or Iraq? ) ID#403335:
Sharefin:

If you were forced to live the rest of your life in either Israel or Iraq where would you go?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

D.A.

I would volunteer an answer, neither!!

I would choose the good ole USA even with the scandals.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:45
TYoung (Ziva) ID#317193:
ENOUGH ALREADY! Tom

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:42
MoReGoLd (EMU - To Launch or not to Launch) ID#348286:
February 8, 1998

German academics' bid to derail EMU gains ground

 FRANKFURT, Feb 8 ( Reuters ) - A bid by German academics to derail the launch of the European single currency gained ground on Sunday as the country's highest court looked set to admit a legal challenge and 155 professors called for the euro to be delayed.
  One of four academics making a legal bid to stop Bonn from joining the currency said the Federal Constitutional Court was preparing to admit the case, in a move he said might hold up the euro's launch.
  Professor Karl Albrecht Schachtschneider, a law professor leading the so-called gang of four, told Reuters the court had decided to ask the government, parliament, federal states and other bodies to respond to issues raised by the case.
  Bonn will shudder when the request for a statement arrives, Schachtschneider said. Now Bonn must acknowledge that the constitutional court is taking this seriously.
  The court could not be reached for comment. A German government spokesman said he was not aware of any request from the constitutional court.
  A letter from the court to Schachtschneider, made available to Reuters and dated February 4, requested that he provide 25 copies of the 350-page petition which would then be passed on to the bodies for comment.
  Schachtschneider said the request was a clear sign the court was about to admit the case.
  He said that would make it substantially more likely that the court would grant the academics' request for an injunction stopping Bonn from deciding to join economic and monetary union ( EMU ) while the main case was being reviewed.
  Separately, 155 German and Austrian economics professors, led by Renate Ohr of Hoehenheim University and Manfred Neumann of Bonn, said they would publish a manifesto in newspapers on Monday calling for a postponement of the single currency on the grounds that economic conditions were not right.
  Analysts said the news could put talk of a delay back on the agenda just three months before European Union governments are scheduled to choose members of the single currency, due to be launched on January 1, 1999.
  But they noted that the political will to launch monetary union remained strong, and that governments could point to real progress in economic convergence.
  The weekend news gives new edge to the option of EMU postponement, said David Marsh, director of UK and European research at Robert Fleming, the London-based investment bank.
  Marsh said the case could influence the legislative timetable for EMU in Germany, which was beginning to look extremely tight, with German deputies leaving themselves just three weeks in April to pass the law allowing EMU to go ahead.
  Yet Juergen Pfister, senior economist at Commerzbank AG, said: It still seems very unlikely that one constitutional court can halt a process which has been agreed by 15 nations.
  Pfister said there were few grounds to delay EMU on the basis of economic data. Belgium and Italy's debts were, strictly speaking, too high to meet Maastricht treaty requirements but both countries had produced clear plans to reduce them.
  Pfister said the news could nonetheless cause irritation in financial markets on Monday.
  Both government and opposition politicians have said they see little chance that the case could derail EMU.
  The gang of four's petition, submitted to court on January 12, argues that launching EMU in 1999 as scheduled would violate the basic rights of Germans by forcing them to swap the revered mark for a much weaker currency.
  They argue the court should stop Bonn joining EMU because countries do not meet the economic targets laid down in the Maastricht treaty designed to underpin the euro's stability.
  Failure to stick to those targets -- which include limits on government borrowing -- would jeopardise a right to economic stability enshrined in Germany's Basic Law by forcing up inflation and unemployment, the group says.
  The professors hope the judges will follow through on the court's 1993 opinion that Maastricht must be interpreted strictly to help them win the case.
  They also hope to mobilise a German public which, although sceptical towards EMU, has until now only expressed passive resignation in the face of the euro juggernaut.
 

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:33
Midas__A ((Thanks for your Post #284251 at 21:59, Tis the Truth that we dont want to admit to because of Bias) ID#340459:
.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:27
Barb Hughes (@IDT RE:Japan) ID#20783:

Might help?

http://satellite.nikkei.co.jp/enews/index.html

http://www.tocom.or.jp/souba_e.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:22
MoReGoLd (@CNBC SILVER) ID#348286:
Down .22 at 7.03, Kitco shows even lower

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:17
Speed (IDT - JAPAN Index) ID#286199:
Here's the quote for it, I'll keep digging.
http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=^JPN&d=t

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:15
ROR (High Rise) ID#35767:
I am interested in this cite because of the open truthful discussion. As to being a left winger I guess its true true. Though I think if you analyzed your true beliefs you might find you are more left wing than you think. I was an ardent Reagan supporter and Republican until I realized that it was big business that was corrupting politics and was against the interests of most Americans. The happy talk about Clinton and the economy is all part of the game to allow the rape to continue. The truth will be known. The manipulatoras love Clinton as by claiming right wing conspiracies it fuzzies the true purpose of Clinton. Say prayers for our brothers and sisters in the middle east who may die because of this greedy game.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:15
D.A. (paradox?) ID#7568:
Sharefin:

If you were forced to live the rest of your life in either Israel or Iraq where would you go?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:14
WetGold (WHY are U folks jumping ZIVA's bones ?) ID#187218:
ZIVA has had some pretty good posts IMHO.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:13
Ziva (BART KITNER......proposed change to *** ***) ID#302251:

BART: proposed change to *** ***

1. No GOLD discussion will be allowed in this forum
if it includes political discussions of any sort.

2. No GOLD discussions about the effect of coming wars on GOLD.
No WW3, or Anthrax, or oil nonsense.

3. No Gold discussions will be allowed which will hint in any way that religious fundamentalism ( Jewish or Moslem ) ,
may effect the price of GOLD.

4. All ordinary Gold investors who are not GOLD Traders,
should be removed form this forum, as they are incapable
of maintaining the high intellectual level required by us.

5. To maintain a good quality people on this forum,
every participant should pass a test as to his ability
to analyze Elliot Waves,
Vronsky may be happy to include a test page on his web-site.

6. Mike Sheller should be immediately removed from this forum,
as we don’t want to associate our forum
with this Astrology Shcmonstrology nonsense.

7 And while we are at it, lets remove CHROKEE too.
He is beginning to provide us URLs
which hint at possible conspiracies.

8. And while we are at it, lets BAND all conspiracies discussions
even when they are related to gold. CNN clearly tells us the truth.
We should maintain a respectable forum here.

9. And while we are at it, let’s remove ANOTHER too.
He make too many of us wonder about who he is,
instead of what he is saying.
His message is: * DOOM & GLOOM * ! No, we don’t need this nonsense.

10 Women should be excluded from this forum as they are too emotional,
and they do not blend very well in the conversation,
especially late at night when some kitcoits are drunk.

11. You should reprogram your computer to eliminate any post which
includes dangerous words such as Saddam,
Trilateral, Larouche, Netanyahu, etc.

12. Kitcoits should be encouraged to report to you immediately
when any participant does not include the word GOLD
at least three times in his/her post!!!

13. Kitcoits should be encouraged to be more innovative
in expanding these rules, and provide you
with additional guidelines to control this forum.

*

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:13
GOLDEN CHEESEHEAD () ID#431263:
Herr Highrise--

Clinton never was his own man. He's simply a stooge for the shadowy figures behind the scenes who really call the shots! Perhaps this war will be the last chance Clinton has to bail himself out of the scandal which they've now allowed to consume him Gott im Himmel! I'm beginning to sound like you know who!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:12
WetGold (sharefin@19:28) ID#187218:
Thanx for the work - it helps ( un ) solve the mystique ..

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:12
SDRer__A (South Africa ‘Global Leaders for Tomorrow’, WEF) ID#288155:

Name/Title/Organization/Category
1. Colin Coleman/Director, Public Finance/STANDARD CORPORATE&MERCHANT BANK ( SCMB ) /Money
2. Robert Michael Godsell/Chairman and CEO/ANGLO AMERICAN CORPORATION
OF SOUTH AFRICA Minerals/Mining
3.Andrew K. Lukhele/Chairman/NATIONAL STOKVELS ASSOCIATION OF SA/?
4.Cyril M. Ramphosa/Deputy Executive Chairman/NEW AFRICA INVESTMENTS
LIMITED ( NAIL ) /Money
5. Ebrahim Patel/National Labour Conventor/NATIONAL ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT LABOUR COUNCIL/Politics
6. Issac O. Shongwe/Managing Director/LETSEMA CONSULTING ( PTY ) LTD/? 7. Jay Naidoo/Minister of Posts/Telecommunications/Telecommunications
8. Johann Rupert/Executive Chairman/REMBRANDT GROUP LIMITED/ Minerals/Mining ( and a lot of other stuff! )
9. Michael L. Davis/Executive Director/GENCOR LIMITED/Minerals/Mining
10.Sakumzi Macozoma/Managing Director/TRANSNET LTS/?
11.Sam Shilowa/General Secretary, South African Congress/Politics
12.Simon W. Barlow/Owner/RUSTENBERG ESTATE/Minerals/Mining[RUSPLAT]
Theuns Eloff Chief Executive Officer NATIONAL BUSINESS INITIATIVE
Tito Mboweni Minister of Labour of South Africa Government
Trevor Manuel Minister of Finance of South Africa Government
Wendy Luhabe President BRIDGING THE GAP ?


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:10
IDT (Index options) ID#228128:
Does anyone know what the Japan Index is an index of. I presume that it is not the Nikkei 225 but outside of that I have little knowledge. If anyone has a URL that they can post to read up on it, I would appreciate that also.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:06
Heavy Hitter (ZIVA) ID#403159:
Gold is going to the moon? Too bad you weren't.
Hope you can make the trip soon though. But
when you do go see if you can keep on going.
If you can get past Mars that would be great.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:06
GOLDEN CHEESEHEAD (Random thoughts on what's about to happen) ID#431263:
Herr Sharefin--

Amazing isn't it? Only explanation one can offer for our lack of integrity on this issue is that if we don't do it, Israel will! And then Syria and Iran! And I don't think they would be as surgically precise as we intend to be! Don't forget,Israel knows that the prevailing westerlies will blow the fallout over Iran and Pakistan far away from Israel!

Yet, Saddam has brought it on himself and unfortunately, like Hitler, he's convinced the Iraqi people that he is their savior! Why must history keep repeating itself? Sadly Saddam will probably escape again while his people suffer the folly of their ignorance!

And then there's the capitalist greed of the US military/industrial complex! No wonder Eisenhower felt it necessary to warn us! The NWO marches on toward one-world-government and Islam stands in the way! Next will be Christianity! By the way, anyone know why Yeltsin felt it necessary to schedule a meeting at the Vatican with the Pope? Something stinks in Denmark--and it ain't cheese!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 20:05
HighRise (ROR) ID#401460:

ROR, My friend President Clinton is not who you thought he was and never was. He is very far from left wing or right wing. He is for what ever serves him and those above him. He governs by polls. He should have polled the UN before he moved 4 naval battle groups into the gulf.

Again ROR, how can you are so far to the left and have interest here on Kitco, a capitalistic materialistic Precious Metals site? No complaints just curious, that's all.

HighRise

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:59
Preacher (Iraqi situation reversed?) ID#225273:
Snowbird,
I would like to know what you mean by if the Iraqi situation were reversed.
Do you mean if Iraq was attacking the U.S.?
Or do you mean if Iraq was attacking Canada?
Or, do you mean if the US. were attacking Canada you would be asking Iraq for help?
That statement wasn't clear to me.

Also, the U.S. is clearly the aggressor if it wages an unprovoked war with Iraq. I thought the U.S. was the aggressor last time, but very few agreed with me. This time, I don't see how there's any doubt.

The Preacher

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:52
snowbird (As a Canadian I say let us support our allies) ID#220325:
I have studied at several US universities and lived in the US off and on over a period of 10 years. There are no finer people than Americans. If the Iraqi situation were reversed believe me we would be on your doorstep asking for help and hoping to get it. What's more I believe you would be there to support us. We can't always agree as families but we can at least rally round in the times of need.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:51
Heavy Hitter (SHAREFIN) ID#403159:
Ziva and Clinton.... A match made in heaven. Ziva would
hen peck it off then Clinton could solve all his problems.
Peck...swallow..gulp.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:50
sharefin (Q & A) ID#284251:
From the Orlando Sentinel newspaper today: by Charley Reese
Just so you can keep up with the perpetual crisis in the Middle East, Here are some questions. Answers may surprise you!

Question: Which country in the Middle East has nuclear weapons?
Answer: Israel

Question: Which country in the Middle East refuses to sign the nuclear non-proliferation treaty and bars international inspections?
Answer: Israel

Question: Which country in the Middle East seized the sovereign territory of other nations by military force and continues to occupy it in defiance of United Nations Security Council resolutions?
Answer: Israel

Question: Which country in the Middle East routinely violates the international borders of another sovereign state with warplanes and artillery and naval funfire?
Answer: Israel

Question: Which Amereican ally in the Middle East has for years sent assassins into other countries to kill its political enemies ( a practice sometimes called exporting terrorism ) ?
Answer: Israel

Question: Which country in the Middle East have high-ranking military officers admitted publicly that unarmed prisoners of war were executed?
Answer: Israel

Question: Which country in the Middle East refuses to prosecute its soldiers who have acknowledged executing prisoners of war?
Answer: Israel

Question: Which country in the Middle East created 762,000 refugees and refuses to allow them to return to their homes, farms and businesses?
Answer: Israel

Question: What country in the Middle East refuses to pay compensation to people whose land, bank accounts and businesses it confiscated?
Answer: Israel

Question: In what country in the Middle East was a high-ranking United Nations diplomat assassinated?
Answer: Israel

Question: In what country in the Middle East did the man who ordered the assasination of a high ranking U.N. diplomat become prime minister?
Answer: Israel

Question: What country in the Middle East blew up an American diplomatic facility in Egypt and attacked a U.S. ship in international waters, killing 33 and wounding 177 American sailors? Answer: Israel

Question: What country in the Middle East employed a spy, Jonathan Pollard, to steal classified documents and then gave some of them to the Soviet Union?
Answer: Israel

Question: What country at first denied any official connection to Pollard, then voted to make him a citizen and has continuously demanded that the American president grant Pollard a full pardon? Answer: Israel

Question: What country on Planet Earth has the second most powerful lobby in the United States, according to a recent Fortune magazine survey of Washington insiders?
Answer: Israel

Question: Which country in the Middle East is in defiance of 69 United Nations Security Council resolutions and has been protected from 29 more by U.S. vetoes?
Answer: Israel

Question: Which country is the United States threatening to bomb because U.N. Security Council resolutions must be obeyed?
Answer: Iraq




Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:49
Selby (Randfontein Estates) ID#286230:
Anyone interested in Randfontein can go to the following URL and download the 6 Feb 1998 report. Takes about an hour with a Pentium 75. May take longer for Ted.

http://www.jci.co.za/pr11.htm


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:42
ROR (OIL OPTIONS) ID#35767:
I have noticed that the oil calls are getting an increase in premium while oil is stagnant. I bought four calls/ I hope I lose if winning means a war and the death of innocent people all over the middle east. THEY ALL have brothers/sisters mothers/fathers and most importantly children and infants who will be maimed or killed to hold up the pride of the arrogance in my own country. This is unspeakable and inhuman/ Iraq is no more of a threat than any other country which has chemical weapons thus to kill over this is unbelievable. Anyone with a concience should oppose this action. Ziva said most in the syngogue due as indeed Israel has alot to lose. The polls are rigged and someone is TRYING TO FORCE THIS AND CLINTON DOWN OUR THROATS THRU POLLS. I voted for Clinton twice so I am far from being right wing. What is going on is at best reprehensible/ what is being suggested BY CLINTON is inhumane!!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:34
sharefin (I know not what I do, but I must keep on doing it!) ID#284251:
What is it with this Clinton dude.
First he tells us to sell our gold,
Then he tells us we must join him in war.

Local troups in Townsville on alert.

How long will the world kowtow to this man,
Who brings the world to it's knees.

For the sake of his political power.
For the sake of his sexual deviances.

Clintons private motto:
( I know not what I do, but I must keep on doing it. )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:31
Explorer (A QUOTE BY REP. HOWARD BUFFETT, CONGRESSMAN FROM NEBRASKA) ID#22882:

Perhaps blood runs deep. http://fame.org/quote/Q041197.htm

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:28
sharefin (ANOTHER's transcripts - updated) ID#284251:
http://www.kitcomm.com/pub/discussion/ANOTHER6.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:13
golddkm (Currency report...) ID#432148:
Looking at 70 world currencies versus gold, since January 9, ( start

of gold move ) a few things stand out: the Australian dollar, the Japanese yen, the Phillipine peso, the Thai baht, the Malaysian ringgit, the Indian rupee, and platinum have remained approximately flat against gold.

Every other currency depreciated from 5-10% versus gold, except for the South Korean won, which rose from 503,000/oz on 1/9/98 to 464,000/oz

on 2/4/98. The largest gain versus all currencies and gold was made by silver.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:10
SDRer__A (WEF--Davos--Global Leaders for Tomorrow...dB) ID#287277:

1. The names, titles, organization name, country are all directly from the WEF ‘Global Leaders for Tomorrow’, which have been entered into an Access dB so that we can sort, manipulate, analyze and hopefully survive and prosper.

a ) If you are interested in having the list for your country, let me know and I’ll be happy to e-mail it to you.

2. Early days on this, so feed-back will be enormously helpful. There are MANY WEF information ‘disparities’, e.g.,” George Stephanopoulos, Visiting Professor of Political Science”, which may well be true, but which tells us very little about what he has done, or is doing having left the WH.


3. Started ‘investigations’ with South Africa, for a number of reasons ( all of which are no doubt obvious to this board ) . Again, early days, but rampant surprise at the tight linkage between Major Gold ( ZA the only gold corps listed on WEF ) and banks--Standard Charter and Merchant is on the list, but covers ZA, Africa, offshore--Isle of Man, Jersey--, London, Taiwan, Hong Kong and New York.
http://www.sbic.co.za/scmb/structure.html

Everyone ‘holds’ major pieces of everyone else, rather as if they looked at Japan, South Korea and found the method ‘good’. ( Rembrandt Group--Rupert on WEF List ) is a good example of this. Also, I get the impression that ZA gold is World Gold, thanks to Anglo, Gencor etc. Rustenberg Estates ( wine--Barlow on the list ) is also Rustenberg Platinum...which, one wonders, is more relevant?
a ) Because ZA is unfamiliar territory, and because ‘holding companies’ are the very devil to unravel, I’ve followed oblique paths ( genealogy was surprisingly productive! ) ...again feed-back will be much appreciated.

I’ll post the South African list of ‘Global Leaders’ first. 12 names, titles, organizations/institututes. Again, if you would like the list for your country, now--i.e. before I've researched the 'leader' and 'company/institute--I'll be happy to e-mail it.

--There is one actress on the list--female, American...care to guess?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:09
Donald__A (@Oris) ID#26793:
I learned how to read Russian from a book called Tyniki Braka e Technika Krasoti. No kidding.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:03
vronsky (THAT'S GOLDEN WITHOUT THE LETTERS en) ID#426220:

http://golden-eagle.com
just delete the letters en in the word golden for the correct URL

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:03
oris (Auric) ID#238422:
You are correct, it means Happy New Year.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:00
Prometheus (@Iraq and the markets) ID#210235:
This morning's ( USA ) news full of imminent war talk. Iraq iraq blah blah. I imagine the tone was much the same in Iraq.

But look at the markets. Asian and European markets are remarkably calm. OK, Mali was down 7% Friday. The USDollar is down since early January. This media war blitz is totally surreal when not backed up by world money movement. No flight to safety of one sort or another.

So, what gives?

Is the Clinton administration's position so weak all expect this brinkmanship to fizzle?

Still watching the money flow - Prometheus

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:00
vronsky (FIVE NEW ANALYTICAL REPORTS AT golden-eagle ) ID#426220:

World-acclaimed analysts in their particular areas of expertise://

WHEN CENTRAL BANKS SELL GOLD, THEIR CURRENCIES DEVALUE - vronsky//

UNDERSTANDING BUFFETT’S SILVER PLAY - Milhouse//

General Market View For February 1998 - Wayne Crimi//

Some Thoughts on Inflation - Dr. Paul Hein//

Peter Dag Portfolio Strategy - Dr. George Dagnino//

See golden-eagle Hot-News Box at URL:

http://www.golden-eagle.com


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 19:00
Auric (Hooked on Russian Phonics) ID#255151:

oris--Thanks for translation, and thanks to Junior for his upbeat assessment of the precious metals market. DoesSno Veem Go Dome, phonetically enunciating, mean Happy New Year?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:58
Barb Hughes (@Spock) ID#20783:

See the bottom of my 2-8-98 11:21 post

Silver up .14 @ 7.37 6:46 NY time according to Kitco


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:55
Donald__A (All this war talk) ID#26793:
If Bill Clinton had made Monica Lewinsky Secretary of State instead of Madeline Albright tensions in the Middle East would have been reduced by now.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:48
6pak (WAR @ Veterans & USofA 1918 & Bonus March 1932) ID#335190:
Between July 28 1914, and November 11 1918, some 10,000,000 young men were killed in that vast orgy of mass murder known as World War I. An estimated 20,000,000 more were maimed, crippled, burned, and wounded, their youth lost by mutilation. At the same time 13,000,000 civilians died in that great HOLOCAUST; there were 10,000,000 refugees, 5,000,000 war widows and 9,000,000 war orphans.

It has been said The blood ran into the ground, the brains oozed out of the cracked skull and were licked up by trench-rats, the belly swelled and raised a generation of bluebottle flies...

1918 -- The New Year, brought the USofA in the war, the USofA were sending their army over seas as fast as it could be raised, untrained and inexperienced, and their equipment lagged further behind.

1932 -- MacArthur wins Battle against the WWI Veterans Bonus March - Veterans demanded before the House Ways and Means Committee payment to feed their families due to the depression.

So-called bonus = the adjusted service pay which provided for additional pay of $1 a day for World War I service in armed armed forces at home and $1.25 for service overseas, but with payment deferred for thirteen years.

( under the provision for adjustment service pay - payment - at $50 to $100 in 1932 was considered a fortune )

The Veterans were told it was Communists that called for the Bonus March. The Veterans were reported to have declared We don't give a damn who called it, We want our money. Money isn't Communist.

The mob was a bad-looking one. General MacArther continued. It was one marked by signs of revolution. The gentleness and consideration with which they had been treated, they ( the Veterans ) had mistaken for weakness.

President Hoover issued a proud and ringing statement A challenge to the authority of the United States has been met swiftly and firmly. he said. After months of patient indulgence, the government met overt lawlessness as it always must be met...The first obligation of my office is to uphold and defend the Constitution and the authority of the law. This I propose always to do.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:47
oris (Auric) ID#238422:
Junior ( 18:31 ) said in Russian:

Very good. Good day and good bye. ( My ) work awaits me..

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:45
Jack (THE SILVER INSTITUTE?) ID#252127:

This is the first time That I ever seen their url.
Quess I'm falling behind. http://www.silverinstitute.org/frames.htm Hope it works

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:45
Spock (Silver's Future) ID#210114:
Has anyone got any well sourced and reliable information on Silver? Will it fall in a correction or will continue to soar?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:42
Auric (Kitco) ID#255151:

Junior @ 18:28--My thoughts exactly! Re your 18:31--Didn't understand a damn word, but it sounded good. I second your 18:31!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:41
oris (RJ) ID#238422:
Whatever, it's exactly who this ziva is...

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:36
Ziva (ROR) ID#302251:

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:17
ROR ( IRAQ AND POLLS ) ID#35767:
The polls say Clinton has a 79% approval rating. ................
Further, the poll that says 69% want to attack Iraq seems unreal.
THERE IS AN AGENDA BUT WHAT.
None of this even comes close to reality.
The roarin 20s and the Liein' 90s/

============================

These Polls are rigged!
I talked to many people in the Synagogue yesterday.
NO ONE LIKES CLINTON !!!
NO ONE WANTS TO ATTACK IRAQ !!!

*

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:34
Barb Hughes (ALL) ID#20783:
RE: Silver Market 2-9-98

http://www.afr.com.au/content/980209/market/markets11.html


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:31
Junior (Oris) ID#248180:
Ochin gharashouw! Dobeirie Dein EI Dosveydahniya. Rabouta Shduyts menya.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:29
Barb Hughes (ALL) ID#20783:
Australia to back US attack

http://www.afr.com.au/content/980209/news/news1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:29
RJ (..........) ID#411259:

Oris -

You say its Russian…… Sounds like Klingon to me…………

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:28
Junior (@ Oh Yeh BART!!! ) ID#248180:
Gold, Gold & Gold!!!
Platinum, Platinum & Platinum!!!
Silver, Silver & Silver!!!
Rhodium, Rhodium, & Rhodium!!!
Buy PM's & Mining Stocks and everyone will be the richer!!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:27
Ziva (JUNIOR @ WAR) ID#302251:
I AGREE,
It would be interesting
if a few Arabs will join the conversation,
so that we could hear it from thier point of view.
After all, GOLD is an integral part of thier lives.
Some participants in this forum are very THICK-HEADED
and they will contiue to analyse Elliot Wave to death
even when Anthrax is already in thier local subway.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:26
oris (Junior) ID#238422:
Privet, bratok!

Kak dela?


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:23
oris (Prometheus) ID#238422:
Thank you for your concern...

I appreciate it.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:18
Junior (@ Oris 18:01) ID#248180:
Now, Now, and Here, Here, Dah,Brrat!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:17
ROR (IRAQ AND POLLS) ID#35767:
The polls say Clinton has a 79% approval rating. I hear they hired retired Soviet Poll takers. I know of no one who really likes Clinton. Further, the poll that says 69% want to attack Iraq seems unreal. THERE IS AN AGENDA BUT WHAT. None of this even comes close to reality. The roarin 20s and the Liein' 90s/

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:15
oris (Petronius) ID#238422:
That's what I said also some time ago.

You like it or not, the only friend of the U.S.
in the ME is Israel. It's a fact, proven by the history.
In regard to the U.S. politics in the ME - it is not
only stupid, it is naive.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:15
Junior (@WAR) ID#248180:
I suggest that if the USA President was to accept it as mandatory that his own children were to accompany the front line troops in any war; we would not be discussing war strikes! It sickens me when I hear that the USA can act against the wishes of the Securtity Council and prepare to strike the so-called enemy. Who's enemy? Threat to what & who? The USA created Saddam & the present Irac.
I am also extremely conserned for humanity that the USA has convinced by threat to the rest of the World that weapons of mass distruction are only safe in the hands and control of the USA. I can only think of one nation that has used weapons of mass distruction on another nation. Anyone care to guess and advise me how safe that was for the Japanese women and children? I am not a hater of the USA as child born there and now reside in Australia it sickens me with embarrassment when I view the USA from another perspective. There are many wonderful people in the USA and many of those that are participants on this site and my friends and relatives and I am sure that can also be said for Iraq. Trade is the answer to most of these problems not an embargo or war. Citizens of the USA read some history and consider the great empires of the past and then understand your future. You are represented by greedy morally bankrupt persons and your country has lost its way.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:13
Ziva (GOLD IS GOING TO THE MOON) ID#302251:


Economic Collapse vs Economic Destruction
============================================
.......... As economies continue to implode, world
leadership continues to show a total
misunderstanding of financial dynamics. Policy is
to treat current events in Asia as a crisis of
currencies and banks to be solved by an increase
in debt and liquidity.

It fails to realize that the real problem is
too much debt and too little profit by
corporations, governments, and individuals. It
is this problem ( too much debt and too little
profit ) that causes first a banking and then a
currency crisis.



In a market plagued by over capacity and falling
demand, profits can only be restored by the
elimination of capacity. Instead, we see
governments and banks propping up insolvent
companies, who continue to undercut prices, *thus
seriously weakening stronger companies.

Governments, with their high taxes and large
deficits continue to take large sums out of the
economy, making the financial condition of
companies and individuals more difficult. It is totally
ironic that what much of the world calls wealth is
the accumulation of these government losses
( budget deficits ) ..........

http://www.golden-eagle.com/frames.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:13
RJ (..... Somebody is hiding in you refrigerator .....) ID#411259:

Ziva @ 03:36: You may or may not agree with some of this. I look forward to some interesting discussion

I think, as the votes are being tallied, the consensus is you have nothing interesting to say at all. You cut and paste drivel to people who have zero interest in your delusions. Please find some KKK, trilateral, black helicopter, conspiracy site where you may share this pabulum with other like minded wackos. You posts have graduated from mildly curious to tedious and dull. You seem a bit too thick headed to have the good graces to be embarrassed by your litter, so let me say it plain, Nobody is interested! Don't bother to respond to this, I will scroll past all posts with the Ziva moniker so your protestations will be swallowed by the aether, and there join company with the rest of the nonsense you post hereabouts.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:13
Jack () ID#252127:

Some who scribe upon these walls rap their prose in arsenic balls, yet those who read these those words of wit eat these poison balls of sh-t.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:12
Prometheus (@Oris) ID#210235:
As much as our curiousity is aroused, we don't want you to get Bart's hackle's up. : )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:08
oris (Mike Sheller/Your 17:24 is just WONDERFUL!) ID#238422:



Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:01
oris (My statement for all who speaks Russian.) ID#238422:

----------------------

Ziva - staraya PIZDA.

----------------------

For those, who do not speak Russian,
I'll gladly translate upon request,
but it is really, really very bad word...
Nothing comes close in English...


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:01
Poorboys (1000-1) ID#224149:
OldGold –Odds of 1000-1 and all the logical reasons for Gold not to bottom at 187 – When has Gold had any logic except for the high 870 on Jan 21 1980 the possible collapse of the American dollar. As you know my prognosis is based on over 200 indicators with the use of Astrological cycles .I let the charts tell me the future not the rumors and newsletter writers or the lost brainwashed media as they say “To each his own” The proof can be found in your bank account. Gold is a strange animal it rises and falls,but never changes hands.Prices explode or wilt for any reason or no reason .-----Only if we had the thoughts of this great writer ----MARK TWAIN-By law of Periodical Repetition,everything which has happened once must happen again and again and again-and not capriciously,but at regular periods,and each thing in its own period,not another's,and each obeying its own law...and the same nature which delights in periodical repetition in the skies is the nature which orders the affairs of the earth. Let us not underrate the value of that hint.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 18:00
geoffs (To 6pak) ID#424187:

Hope Canada says YES. Get the FACTS .We have NO alternative .
Our troops NEED the experience especially the OFFicer Corp.
Also GOOD for GOLD

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:53
Ziva (rj) ID#302251:
u have nothing to contribute ?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:44
RJ (..... Bored to tears .....) ID#411259:

At the risk of violating proper Kitco etiquette:

Ziva…………… SHUT UP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:40
6pak (As A Canadian @ I say HELL NO, WE WILL NOT GO USofA WAR not a Canadian WAR) ID#335190:
February 8, 1998

OTTAWA ( CP ) ­ U.S. President Bill Clinton has formally asked Canada to contribute to possible military attack against Iraq

OTTAWA ( CP ) ­ U.S. President Bill Clinton has formally asked Canada to contribute to possible military attack against Iraq.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:39
James (U.S.@Administration Hatred For Iraq) ID#252150:
Has anyone considered how much the Iraqis have irritated & incurred the wrath of the U.S. leadership by having an image of George Bush's face placed in the tile of the entrance to the largest hotel in Baghdad. Thousands of Iraqis walk over his face & spit on it & curse him. It is this sort of insubordination & defiance that will be the main reason for an attack. There is no way that the U.S. will ever relent until Bush's image is removed.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:38
Miro (For Now, Good By All) ID#347457:
Folks, going through this conspiracy nonsense is too much waste of time. I'll check back a few days later. At this point of time I have better ways how to spend my time. It sure goes down the hill with this forum

take care - Miro

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:37
Snowball ((@ Preacher ) ) ID#234218:
Thanks for the input. I'm pretty green at this yet, so I always like to get all the data I can. I thought ALTA looked pretty decent. Like I said, I was a little surprized that I hadn't heard much about them. I always like to hear opinions from those that know more than me. Again, thanks for gettin' back to me.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:36
SDRer__A (Mike Sheller--That was beautifully said!) ID#28594:
Actually, I was questioning ( in my rather oblique way ) whether or
no we had Another hint?
Pointing to Iran? Well, in the fullness of time...


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:28
Mike Sheller (SDRer) ID#347447:
There is something to be said for beauty in a unit of money. A gold or silver coin, well designed, is not just a value for the sweat, intelligence, and capital it takes to bring a rare substance out of nature, but because it is, in itself, a universally recognized thing of beauty. One need only hold one in one's hand to sense this. You are right.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:28
Miro (@JTF and Kuwait support (not)) ID#347457:
JTF, I guess I did not come out very clearly. Letting us to use their bases does not mean that they support our actions. They talked about the fact that majority of Kuwait people, as well as leadership, do not support the idea of attacking Iraq. However, they don't see any way how to reject the US request. This will antagonize Kuwait even more and push them into anti-US camp. Nobody likes to be forced to side with faraway country against your neighbors

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:24
Mike Sheller (MidEast Tensions) ID#347447:
Since my sympathies are always with the troops that have to actually go out there and eat all that horrible powdered eggs, gristly steak, and all that other GI food ( as well as getting punctured and burned and blown up ) and I also feel great empathy for the American taxpayer ( being one myself ) , would it not be reasonable to leave Kuwait and Saudi Arabia to their own devices ( or the ones we've sold them ) and let THEM handle Saddam? I think a re-invasion of Kuwait by Hussein and a subsequent push into Saudi Arabia, while America watches the olympics or something, might be salutory. Then it could be made clear, once we become entranced with the baseball season and have no time for such nonsense, that Saudi and Kuwait will have to call upon Israel to pull their chestnuts out of the fire.
I wonder how they might phrase such a request.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:19
James (Ziva@A Tiny Fraction Of Your Drivel) ID#252150:
I did not hit the enter key 10 times. But in the interest of saving bandwith I will be careful to eliminate any unnecessary headers. Regardless,it amounted to a TINY FRACTION of the wacko conspiracy nonsense & drivel that you posted.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:17
SDRer__A (Mike Sheller, yes of course....but not as) ID#280245:
pretty! Just a longing to have currency with weight! And jingle...

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:14
Mike Sheller (SDRer) ID#347447:
The gold Daric, while very Sagittarian with an archer on the back, may not have been what Another was thinking. Perhaps something a bit more generic from the past, like a gold-backed note. Really a very simple and quite fool-proof idea.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:14
Ziva (CHEROKEE found another support for my allegations last year, Re: ANTHRAX + Iraqi women) ID#302251:
http://www.tex-is.net/users/csbrocato/anthrax.htm

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:13
SDRer__A () ID#280245:
Petronius ( US Persian-Gulf Strategy. Could anybody imagine anything more
idiotic?! ) ID#17155:

Electing a man whose character is questionable ( at best ) ?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:07
Petronius (US Persian-Gulf Strategy. Could anybody imagine anything more idiotic?!) ID#17155:
US has a VERY interesting track record in the Persian Gulf - All its FRIENDS have a tendency to do 180 degree turn. Let us examine history:

1. Shortly after Iran becomes main US friend in the region a revolution replaces the Shah with a fundamentalist-Islamic government. Main rallying points were ( partly justified ) claims of total corruption of the Iranian government by US and US corporations.
2. To contain Iran, US taxpayer financed a takeover of Iraqi government by its new friend in the region, Saddam Hussein. Iraq was such a good friend that US provided it with all sorts of advanced weapons ( including chemical and biological weapons facilities ) . When an Iraqi missile hit a US navy ship killing a bunch of sailors, it was all forgiven ( in the name of friendship, you see ) . Several years latter, Hussein decided not to be complete US puppet and started some games on his own. As a result, US taxpayers paid to destroy what was only several years earlier built with their own money: Iraqi war machine.
3. In order to gain support of his people, Hussein portrayed himself as a defender of Iraq from US interference ( convenient and true statement ) .
4. To contain Iran and Iraq, US pumped huge amount of money and military hardware to Saudi Arabia ( US's new friend ) . While US's help enriches the ruling family, an average person there experiences only poverty and humiliation. Saudi Arabia now experiences huge popular resentment against the US, and many analysts see repeat of Iranian history written on the wall. Bomb attack on US troops should have been a clear enough hint!


The question is: Does it all make sense? Is it simply stupidity of US leadership that every dollar invested into peace turns out to be a 100 dollar war debt?

Does is make any sense or is it only a convenient way to create need for and sell more and more military junk?! Welcome to US of A, the world's leading peddler of military hardware!!!

Having these issues in mind, please read this:

http://www.bullatomsci.org/issues/1991/o91/o91hartung.html

How do you like seeing US active-duty military personnel being used for marketing of military technology?



Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:06
Preacher (Snowbird & Alta Gold) ID#227290:
Snowbird,

Alta has continued turning a profit despite the low gold price, although I don't have a report from 4th quarter '97 yet.

Alta has two projects scheduled to come on line in the near future: Copper Flats could make a lot of money with copper at $1.00 but the current low price makes it marginal.
And Olinghouse could produce 100,000 ounces of gold per year once up and running. Forecast is only for 18,000 ounces this year.

I don't think you're missing something negative about this company. It doesn't have a lot of reserves, though. This is it's only drawback.
The good thing about Alta is that management finds a viable deposit in U.S. and mines it. They don't worry about proving up 2 million ounces first. They just start mining. There are plenty more deposits when these run out.

The Preacher

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:01
Ziva (CHEROKEE; Thanks for this post, STAN DEYO is a good friend of mine) ID#302251:
Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 12:13
cherokee__A ( @------seeds----------------- ) ID#344308:
and a whole bunch of factual data------
http://www.iinet.net.au/~standeyo/Priority_One_A.html

=====================================
He is an American,
formerly with a very secret military operation.
He refused to cheat the American people.

When it became obvious that the Military
is going to assassinate him he run to Perth Australia,
where he lives today.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 17:00
SDRer__A (As Tolerant1 would say, Mmmmmmm... ) ID#280245:
Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:51 ANOTHER ( THOUGHTS! ) ID#60253:

No currency is large enough for this race, so a new one will arrive from the past.

The daric was an ancient Persian gold coin of Darius bearing on one side the figure of an archer.

#C004: A Gold Daric of the Persians, Enemies of The Greeks, Circa 450-330 BC.

http://www.edgarlowen.com/coins.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:57
6pak (The People of the Gulf @ WILL BE IMPRESSED with the USofA WAR PLAN (Canadians at the ready )) ID#335190:
February 8, 1998
FOCUS-U.S. gives up on Saudi bases for air strikes

JEDDAH, Saudi Arabia, Feb 8 ( Reuters ) - The United States has decided to do without air bases in Saudi Arabia for launching any air attacks on Iraqi targets, U.S. Defence Secretary William Cohen said on Sunday.

But neighbouring Kuwait and Bahrain are willing to let the United States hit Iraq from their territory, he told reporters aboard the plane taking him to the Saudi port of Jeddah, where he met King Fahd for 20 minutes on Sunday evening.

Cohen said the United States had not asked to use Saudi bases for combat planes and did not plan to ask. We have not made such a request and it is not my intent to do so because we don't think it's necessary, he said.

Cohen, who is visiting all six conservative Gulf states over the next three days, tried to play down Saudi reluctance to let the U.S. forces use its territory.

On Saturday Chancellor Helmut Kohl of Germany made the political gesture of offering air bases in Germany. Canadian Defence Minister Arthur Eggleton said on Sunday that military action might be needed to bring Iraq into line.

Reminded of past complaints that U.S. attacks provoked rather thantamed Iraq, he said: ( This attack ) would be very substantial and most people throughout the Gulf would be impressed with the plan.
http://canoe2.canoe.ca/ReutersNews/IRAQ-COHEN.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:54
Bart Kitner (Kitco) (Silver Market) ID#25867:
Based on questions I've been asked recently there seems to be some confusion over the difference in silver quotes between London Spot, New York immediate delivery, and COMEX futures. We've included a very brief description at our main quote page but I'd like to link it to a full page explanation of the pricing on the current silver market that will answer the following questions :

- What is the difference between the London and New York Spot Markets?

- Why are the silver quotes on the London market higher than on New York's?

- How do these markets relate to the COMEX, and why are the COMEX prices lower than both spot markets?

If anyone who has a clear understanding of these issues is interested in writing a one-page explanation in layman's terms, we'll put a link to it from our main quote page. There's no financial incentive for the contribution, but we will include the author's name and email.

Please send any drafts to me at bkitner@kitco.com.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:51
sig__A (swing high, swing low) ID#113316:
We've gone from the sage, wise George S. Cole to ziva and marshall


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:45
Ziva (HIGH RISE) ID#302251:


The Trilateral are hoping that we will have another *Desert Storm*,
and they can continue to manipulate the Gold market as usual.

HOWEVER ! as I told you last year, 1998 will be different.
WW3 is here.

In their grid for money, the Trilaterals are
doing NOW A FATAL MISTAKE in front of our eyes.

As I told you last year,
the Arabs will unit,
and with the help of Russia and China,
we will have WW3.

You may remember that I was the only one in this forum
who pushed relentlessly WW3,
while most of you relentlessly ridiculed me.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:44
Auric (ZIVA) ID#255151:

The following URL is must reading for Ziva. http://www.kabalarians.com/female/ziva.htm Says you're constipated. Oh, my!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:35
Barb Hughes (ALL) ID#20783:
GULF News Links:


GULF NEWS
Location: DUBAI
http://www.gulf-news.co.ae/


BANRAIN TRIBUNE
Location: BAHRAIN
http://www.bahraintribune.com/home.asp

also see:

http://www.alayam.com/


KHALEEJ TIMES
Location: DUBAI
http://www.khaleetimes.com/index.html


6pak…Thank you for your 15:52 post.




Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:34
Snowball (We will return to ww III after after a word from our sponsor!!! ) ID#234218:
Does anyone have any opinions or info on ALTA gold I've been looking at some of the numbers on them and with my limited knowledge, they look fairly solid.
One of the few that turned a profit. They seem to be a pretty good buy. Guess I'm surprized to find it at the lower end of the scale. Unless I'm missing something.

Thanks, and now we can resume the war.

P.S. The POG ain't worth a war!!! I think Little Willie has stepped in somethin' he ain't gonna scrape of his boot too easy. I only hope and pray no one has to die to get him out of it. I'd much rather see the POG zoom outta sight cause he was filmed in a brothel!!!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:34
6pak (Highrise @ 16:01) ID#335190:
Right On ! Consider, if you will, the various success rates of the USofA government, in regards to the many national WARS such as drugs - Crime etc. We The People must have an insight into the quick actions of these various WAR efforts.

Thanks, Take Care.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:32
Ziva (JAMES) ID#302251:
you better read my post again
befor you open your mouth TOO MUCH.

POSTING.......
DOES NOT MEAN HITTING THE *ENTER* KEY 20 TIMES.
You should be considered of your fellow Kitcoits
and dont force us to watch a blank screen.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:31
HighRise (Ziva) ID#401460:

Desert Storm had quite an affect on Gold, it went down if I remember correctly.
Does anybody here have a feel for what it might do this time?

HighRise

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:20
HighRise (JTF) ID#401460:
There I go again.

It takes one to know one, I mean, Clinton and Saddam should know each other's strategy one of words.

What if they they are both in total denial of reality.

HighRise

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:17
Ziva (IS THIS A GOLD FORUM OR WW3 FORUM ?) ID#302251:

just kiddding,
keep talking,
GOLD IS A POLITICAL METAL!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:16
Isure (The Great Lie) ID#368244:
Even though this is not gold related, it is something I learned as a boy. I submit it respectfully, with honor, to all the brave men, who have died or will die in the future, all in the name of their country. It is my supreme hope that Bill Clinton, Sadam Hussein, and all the leaders of the world, might read this and try to understand the meanings of their actions.

Wilfred Owen

from Dulce Et Decorum Est ( 1920 )

Dulce Et Decorum Est

Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,

Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,

Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs

And towards our distant rest began to trudge.

Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots

But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;

Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots

Of tired, outstripped Five-Nines that cropped behind.

Gas! GAS! Quick, boys--An ecstasy of fumbling

Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time;

But someone still was yelling out and stumbling

And flound'ring like a man in fire or lime . . .

Dim, through the misty panes and thick green light,

As under a green sea, I saw him drowning..

In all my dreams, before my helpless sight,

He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning..

If in some smothering dreams you too could pace

Behind the wagon that we flung him in,

And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,

His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin;

If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood

Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,

Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud

Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues--

My friend, you would not tell with such high zest

To children ardent for some desperate glory,

The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est

Pro patria mori..

--Wilfred Owen


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:15
HighRise (JTF ) ID#401460:

It takes one to know one, which liar is better? Who will win this confrontation of the unreal and untrue - Saddam or BJ Clinton? Or could it be they are fooling each other - they will both win destroying us all.

HighRise

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:02
JTF (Kuwait says we can use their bases, but we cannot bomb Iraq?) ID#57232:
Miro: If that is what you saw on one of the TV news reports, what do the Kuwaitis expect us to do with all the planes that would be refueling?

You raise a serious question about BC. He is in a tight spot at home, and needs a distaction like 'bomb Iraq'. As far as I can tell, world opinion matters very little to him, but the opinions of the average American citizen do. If he was convinced by the polls that he had American support to bomb Iraq, would he do this, irrespective of the lack of support he got from the Middle East countries? If he did this, the political fallout might be very severe, even if special deals are offered to friendly ME countries to soften the blow.

I think the better solution is a show of strength, not actual bombing. Our presence in the gulf is effective at discouraging others from being aggressors, and may make Saddam back down. If we attack unprovoked, we will appear the aggressors.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:01
HighRise (6pak) ID#401460:

I am sorry, I fall back into that form of expression once in a while. I did learn early on at Kitco you can not post in a reverse sarcastic way - people don't know what you are saying, if they can't see your face.

I am against this war, I am truly afraid of what may happen and what the possible results of such a strike will be. I am not an antiwar type of person, I just feel it is wrong to go to war with only one very small insignificant country in the region on your side - Kuwait.

Media reporting:
No UN support of 150 for out of 180 against
No regional support
No moral consensus
Terrorist backlash
Travel Warnings
No aggression by Iraq
No precision Bombing no targets
No Military Plan
Has not used chemical weapons
Dead Children, Hospitals
Not ready for land war

The ABC special concluded that as a result of the US’s foreign policy for the last 6 years, Saddam is stronger than ever before. France, China, Russia and others have a large financial interest in Iraq. The Radical Muslims are just waiting for a cause to activate their revolutions in Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and other Muslim countries. And with the economic crisis in Malaysia and Indonesia make their Muslim populations ripe for exploitation.

HighRise

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 16:01
6pak (Miro @ 15:48) ID#335190:
Kuwait will let US ( or is it USofA ) use their bases.

I as a Canadian, suggest that if the We The People in the USofA, consider that Iraq is the enemy of the We The People. Hell, go get them, as a Canadian, I read history, WWI & WWII the USofA was Johnny come lately. SOoooooo Go get them alone USofA, obviously, the We The People demand such action. I would guess.

Thanks Take Care.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:54
Speed (More SA gold mines with ticker and cusip) ID#286199:
RANDGOLD & EXPLOR CO LTD COM RDGEF S6696M107
RANDGOLD & EXPLOR CO LTD SPONS A D R RANGY 753009208
RANDFONTEIN EST GOLD MNG A D R RNDEY 752336206



Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:52
6pak (USofA Financial Markets @ Discounted the Iraq Noise & Sex Scandal & Asian Turmoil ) ID#335190:
February 8, 1998
US markets in steady mood despite Iraq standoff

NEW YORK ( Reuters ) - As Defense Secretary William Cohen makes the rounds in the Middle East to muster support for an attack on Iraq, the financial markets back home still look to a positive week, with the Dow Jones industrial average poised to hit new highs, analysts said Sunday.

Among the troika of issues that have troubled the U.S. markets in recent weeks -- Asian turmoil, the Clinton sex scandal and Iraq's standoff with the United Nations -- only Iraq has built up any steam over the weekend.

It's unfathomable, however, that we would have a military attack during the Olympics, said David Orr, chief capital markets economist at First Union.

The financial markets have probably already begun to discount the impact of any military strike on Iraq as saber rattling gets louder, Orr added.

Investors will tune in on Thursday when Treasury Secretary Robert Rubin, his deputy, Lawrence Summers, and Federal Reserve Chairman, Alan Greenspan, all testify on the Asian turmoil issue before the Senate foreign relations committee.

Rubin will also testify on the federal budget before the House appropriations committee Wednesday.

The week's key economic indicator will be January's retail sales on Thursday. Other data due are fourth quarter productivity and unit labor costs Tuesday.
http://canoe2.canoe.ca/ReutersNews/MARKETS.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:50
JTF (Some good news from Iraq -- the real crises come later, not this time.) ID#57232:
All: This is from Jerusalem post. The consensus is that Iraq is unlikely to start lobbing weapons of mass destruction on Israel, mainly because of the lack of intact delivery systems. He apparently does have VX ( 3,800kg unaccounted for ) , anthrax, botulinum, and aflatoxin waiting for delivery in some manner -- possibly after the conflict is over. The consensus from that part of the world is that Saddam is likely to concoct a delayed retailiation 'scheme' after the US makes an impressive but ineffective air attack to destry the WMD.

From reading various posts, I get the impression that the only way to neutralize Saddam's WMD is to use ground troops, which of course we will not do. And, that would be the only way we could depose Saddam, as well. Too bad we did not support those northern Iraqi's when they asked for help.

So -- it would seem in this 'war of nerves', Saddam will weather the air attack, relinquish access to some of his 'palaces', and the UN inspection team leaves him alone to make more WMD.

The only way this scenario might not work would be if Saddam is under too much local pressure to step down, and decides on self-immolation, by sending something devastating into Israel. The more I think about this, given Saddam's survival power, I think he is betting that he will always win a 'war of nerves' with us, and will be able to take care of local opposition in his usual ruthless manner.

http://www.jpost.com/Features/Article-2.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:48
Silverbaron (Selby) ID#288295:

Sorry - I forgot to give you the URL for Yahoo finance - it is

http://quote.yahoo.com

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:48
Miro (@6pak - Yes, We Are Alone, Kuwait does not support Iraq bombing!) ID#347457:
6pak, based on middle East experts I just heard on TV, Kuwait will let us use their bases but does not support Iraq bombing. They all agreed that if the US bomb, it’ll have a great political consequences and the US will pay the price. It’ll just unite the Arab ( including Iraq ) world against the US and their allies ( are there any left?! )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:35
6pak (Selby) ID#335190:
You Got Me ! : ) : ) : ) You can not believe all you read eh! There you go ! Take Care

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:32
James (Ziva@Supervision) ID#252150:
Auric-- She either needs supervision or different meds.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:32
Earl () ID#227238:
Auric: Bravo! Well done.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:31
Silverbaron (Selby) ID#288295:

Yahoo Finance seems to get the BB quotes which I have tried; also you can do a search for listings on the other North American Exchanges by company name or by symbol.

BTW - I used this search engine to I find the Randfontein info, and find it to be one of the best for my needs.

http://www.hotbot.com

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:30
Selby (A joke) ID#287207:
6pak. Merely a joke. With all the things that are currently getting Ted into a frenzy to emigrate I thought the idea of Communists protesting against the upcoming war against Iraq might be a bit humorous --even if the topic itself is not. BTW the leader of Canada's Young Communists is Larouch ( sp ) but I thought that might have started a flood of posts we don't need here.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:28
James (An Ode to Donald@Strong$@Deflation@Gold) ID#252150:
In 1985 the economists said:
Italy will take a dive
Their deficit is explosive
And their debt is atrocious
Germany is the model:
Prudent to the core
With surpluses galore
In 1998 with EMU looming
The economists are fuming
A 3% deficit for Italy is automatic
But for Germany very problematic
Like Alice's wonderland
What should be up is down
In the great U.S. of A.
To the pessimists' dismay
The economy is booming
And prosperity abounds
Things are never what they seem
With the plunge protection team

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:24
Auric (James) ID#255151:

Maybe Bart could fix it so that every time Ziva is written, the post would automatically be cut off after say, 50 words or less. After a decent interval in rehab, Ziva could be allowed a little more bandwidth. Under proper supervision, of course.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:22
6pak (Highrise @ 15:07) ID#335190:
Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:07
HighRise ( 6pak - EMU ) ID#401460:
Earlier News report from CNN Live
and a correction we are not totally alone, Kuwait is with us.
_____________________________________________

I do not understand we are not totally alone, Kuwait is with us

Selby commented about Canadian young communists, were demonstrating in Toronto against the pending WAR.

Yes, I am against any such WAR. Will I have to go against my take on the pending WAR, because the young communists are against the WAR. Will my beliefs make me a communist

Thanks for your post. I post material and never get comments. Yes, I do appreciate your reaction. I consider your input at KITCO to be great. Just didn't understand. Take Care.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:22
Selby () ID#287207:
Silverbaron Thanks for the info. It is humbling to look around for several days and then have someone find the answer in a matter of mintues. But it is good for my character I guess. Now I find none of my Quote services get to the NY over the counter market--which may explain some of my problem. Do you have an URL to get to the NY OTC?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:09
James (Ziva@SPACE IS WHAT YOU HAVE BETWEEN YOUR EARS) ID#252150:
I repost 2 articles from the Times totalling less than 1000 words and you accuse me of taking up to much space. Within 10 mins of that accusation you repost a ridiculous, whacko trilateral diatribe of 5409 words ( 0407 ) .
Including the other garbage & drivel you posted, you were well over 10,000 words, probably as much as everyone else combined, & absolutely none of it of any interest to 90% of the participants on this forum.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 15:07
HighRise (6pak - EMU) ID#401460:
Earlier News report from CNN Live
and a correction we are not totally alone, Kuwait is with us.
_____________________________________________
Another related report:
Sunday February 8, 1:11 am Eastern Time
Saudi defense minister opposes Iraq strike - paper

DUBAI, Feb 8 ( Reuters ) - Saudi Arabia's Defense Minister Prince Sultan said his country would not agree to a military
strike against Iraq, the daily Arab News reported on Sunday.
``We'll not agree and we are against striking Iraq as a people and as a nation,'' Prince Sultan said.
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980208/iraq_saudi_1.html
_____________________________________________

6pak, doesn’t the division over Iraq between the Allies, France and Germany potentially threaten EMU? France will not help or even back while Germany will let us use their bases.

Did you see the ABC special yesterday, with Peter Jennings, where the US let the Northern Iraqis down by not showing up? They had video of them just waiting for the US air strike as Saddam’s tanks approached their town. Thousands were killed. The Northern region of Iraq was lost to Saddam and a sizable resistance force was destroyed. What a leader we have - he lies to all.

Jennings had Clinton’s man there, and he ask him “did you not tell them we would help?” The guy just smiled and used some of Clinton’s double talk, it sounded as if we would be there, it was definitely not a no, we won’t be there. It was one of those “I did not have sexual relations with that women” did you or didn’t you? “I never ask any body to lie” - just choose your words correctly so the courts cannot call it a lie. kind of lies.

HighRise

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 14:58
Speed (South African Gold Mining Companies traded on U.S. Exchanges) ID#286199:
http://cbs.marketwatch.com/data/dbcfiles/SOAFRAt.htx?source=htx/http2_mw

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 14:53
Barb Hughes (ALL) ID#20783:
Israel Defense Forces New Web Site Launched Fri 2-6-98

http://www.idf.il/English/MAIN.HTM

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 14:34
6pak (Germany & EMU @ We The People = Constitutional Court via Gang of Four to the OVENS, EH!) ID#335190:
February 8, 1998
German academics' bid to derail EMU gains ground

FRANKFURT, Feb 8 ( Reuters ) - A bid by German academics to derail the launch of the European single currency gained ground on Sunday as the country's highest court looked set to admit a legal challenge and 155 professors called for the euro to be delayed.

One of four academics making a legal bid to stop Bonn from joining the currency said the Federal Constitutional Court was preparing to admit the case, in a move he said might hold up the euro's launch.

Professor Karl Albrecht Schachtschneider, a law professor leading the so-called gang of four, told Reuters the court had decided to ask the government, parliament, federal states and other bodies to respond to issues raised by the case.

Bonn will shudder when the request for a statement arrives, Schachtschneider said. Now Bonn must acknowledge that the constitutional court is taking this seriously.

A letter from the court to Schachtschneider, made available to Reuters and dated February 4, requested that he provide 25 copies of the 350-page petition which would then be passed on to the bodies for comment.

Schachtschneider said the request was a clear sign the court was about to admit the case.

Yet Juergen Pfister, senior economist at Commerzbank AG, said: It still seems very unlikely that one constitutional court can halt a process which has been agreed by 15 nations.

Failure to stick to those targets -- which include limits on government borrowing -- would jeopardise a right to economic stability enshrined in Germany's Basic Law by forcing up inflation and unemployment, the group says.

The professors hope the judges will follow through on the court's 1993 opinion that Maastricht must be interpreted strictly to help them win the case.

They also hope to mobilise a German public which, although sceptical towards EMU, has until now only expressed passive resignation in the face of the euro juggernaut.
http://canoe2.canoe.ca/ReutersNews/GERMANY-EMU-COURT.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 14:29
HighRise (News Flash!) ID#401460:


Saudi Arabia will not let US use bases!

We are alone in the Region.

HighRise

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 14:18
Silverbaron (Selby @ Randfontein EUREKA!) ID#288295:

Randfontein Estates trades on the OTC Bulletin Board under the symbol RNDEY

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 14:15
OLD GOLD (Musings) ID#238295:
Poorboys: $187 gold means the shutdown of the entire global mining industry and dollar at 200 yen or better. Odds against this scenario a thousand to one by my reckoning.

I do believe the gold bear is ending, but I cation Kitcoites not to expect too much too soon. The fundamental cause of the gold bear -- the unprecedented dominance of the US militarily, economically, and politically -- is starting to peak out, but the inevitable reversal will be a lengthy process.

The current situation of total US dominance is unnatural and cannot last. Other nations will inevitably band together to counter the unprecedented arrogance of the US today. US actions re: Iraq remind me more and more of the Nazi attitude towards Poland.

The recent Asian collapse will greatly accelerate this trend as will any US attack on Iraq. But the process of building coalitions and currency arrangements to offset US dominance will take time; Rome was not built in a day. Gold will go up hugely the next few years as US dominance starts to wane, but I doubt if we will get above $350 this year.

BTW, the media have completely distorted the Iraq situation. Current crisis has little to do with any weapons the Iraqis may or may not have. No, the key factor here is the failure of the US sanctions to oust the current Iraq government.

In fact current goings on could be a cover for a US retreat. US could bomb Iraq, Hussein would then agree to allow the inspections and the US would start to ease sanctions. Would be proclaimed as a great US victory, but would actually be a major defeat.

Seems to me the short-run impact of a US attack would be bullish for paper and bearish for gold as the media play up US triumphs real and imagined. But the long-term impact will be very bearish for paper and very positive for gold and oil as the political ramifactions become evident. In fact there is a good chance the US stock market will make its final peak on or soon after the day the attacks begin. Gold probably will drop at least $5 when hostilities commence -- providing another great buying opportunity for the bulls.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 14:08
Silverbaron (Selby @ Randfontein) ID#288295:

Here's some stuff I dug up on Randfontein; appears to be part of the JCI group, & yes, gold production costs are high like DRD. You might try contacting JCI to obtan the CUSIP number of Randfontein Estates, if you want to buy it.

http://www.jci.co.za/mp1203.htm

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 14:00
Barb Hughes (ALL) ID#20783:
Blair: Conflict inevitable unless Iraq relents
By HILLEL KUTTLER and news agencies
WASHINGTON ( February 8 ) -- The US and Britain will take military action against Iraq if President Saddam Hussein does not yield in the dispute over UN inspections, Prime Minister Tony Blair said yesterday.

Undoubtedly there will be military action unless there is a diplomatic solution, Blair said in television interviews aboard his plane returning to London from a three-day visit in Washington, his first as prime minister.

It was the firmest affirmation yet by Blair or Clinton, who said repeatedly in Washington that they are prepared to go for the military option despite Russian, French, and Chinese reservations.

Blair also said it is likely that Clinton will visit Northern Ireland in May, around the time the peace talks there are supposed to finish.

The peace process is going well, said Blair. It's on track for a good settlement, and I believe he [Clinton] will be very keen to do that.

Blair's visit put US-British relations on a new high, both personal and political, and drew praise and gratitude from the embattled US president.

We share a common view of the changes that are occurring in the world, Clinton said at an East Room news conference, his first since allegations surfaced that he had a sexual relationship with former White House intern Monica Lewinsky and tried to cover it up.

Blair and Clinton, accompanied by their wives, Hillary and Cherie, wound up the visit with an overnight stay at the president's Camp David retreat.

At the press conference, Clinton and Blair predicted that US-British ties would remain as unshakable in the next century as throughout the 20th and reiterated warnings to Saddam to grant full access to UN weapons inspectors or face military retaliation.

I stand foursquare with you in our determination to bring Saddam into line with the agreement he made at the end of the Gulf War, Blair told Clinton. He said the Iraqi leader has stockpiled enough chemical and biological weapons to wipe out the world's population.

Meanwhile, Israeli defense officials and the Pentagon have been holding discussions on what Israel might need in the event of an Iraqi attack in response to US air strikes against Baghdad, an Israeli Embassy official here said.

The US is ready to supply most of the things we have asked for. There's no problem with that, he said. When asked why he used the word most, the official quickly changed his characterization and said the US was prepared to supply all that Israel required. He said that everything is ready to be transported, but that shipments have not necessarily begun.

Israel's right to self-defense in the event of an attack by Iraq was spelled out by Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu to the diplomatic corps on Friday at a briefing on the Gulf crisis. While Israel does not regard itself as part of the showdown over weapons inspections, Netanyahu said, it will retaliate if targeted by Iraq's Scud missiles or other weapons.

One has to remember that we reserve the right to self-defense, which is a natural right of any state, any nation under potential or real attack, Netanyahu said. However, he pointed out that the probability of an Iraqi attack is very, very low.

In a conference call Friday with the Conference of Presidents of Major American Jewish Organizations, US Secretary of State Madeleine Albright reiterated that Israel has an absolute right to defend itself against an Iraqi attack.

She said we are doing all we can to meet [Israel's] requests and that our response if they're attacked would be very strong, said a participant in the call.

She evaded questions on whether the administration is sending a mixed message, after US Secretary of Defense William Cohen said Wednesday night he would urge Israel not to retaliate against an Iraqi attack.

In the call Friday, Albright also said she told Arab states during her visit that there is absolutely no linkage between the Iraq crisis and the deadlock in the peace process and that Saddam Hussein does not make his decisions based on the peace process, according to the source.

She told the conference that she is disappointed with the state of Israeli-Palestinian negotiations, but that she is prepared to continue working to achieve a breakthrough as long as the parties are serious. She added that the US will not seek to impose a solution.

Albright also said the administration is looking into seeking the PA's transfer to the US of terrorists responsible for the murder of American citizens in Israel and the territories.

Former US secretary of state Alexander Haig said in remarks broadcast yesterday that Israel must retaliate if attacked by Iraqi missiles.

Haig, who served in the Reagan administration when Israeli warplanes bombed an Iraqi nuclear reactor in 1981, said the prospect a US offensive against Baghdad could push Saddam to unleash a missile strike against Israel.

If Israel is attacked, they must retaliate. And there should be no restraint, Haig told Israel Radio.

Batsheva Tsur adds:

Israel is legally obliged to provide gas masks for foreign workers, other visitors, and Palestinian residents of Area C for which the IDF is responsible, Attorney-General Elyakim Rubinstein said over the weekend.

The Defense Ministry is examining the possibility of obliging employers to provide protective gear for foreign employees and discussions are continuing about how to distribute the masks and where the funding will come from. Residents of Area C are entitled to receive masks following an earlier High Court of Justice ruling.

Jay Bushinsky contributed to this report.

copyright The Jerusalem Post 2-8-98


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 13:59
Auric (Earl--At Your Service) ID#255151:

There are strange things done by the Kitco sons, And the posters who moil for Gold. The Fibo waves have their secret raves, That would make your trades run cold. The Aussie Nick rhymes to the quick, But the quickest you ever did see. It was on the night at the Kitco site, they cremated the paper tree.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 13:53
6pak (Donald_A & Auric @ 9:22) ID#335190:
BOJ ( Central Bank ) @ Two Workers receive $44,000 in bribes. BOJ spokesman “intends” to draw up a code of conduct, and make it official, and maintain strict discipline in future.

DO NOT GET CAUGHT ! - RIGHT ! )

*Only in Japan you say* - NO !, this is a standard of USofA Corporate Business,taking care of Business.

1894 -- U.S. Treasury “gold” reserves fall to $41,394,000 as economic depression continues, but the New York banking houses of J.P. Morgan and August Belmont join forces to loan the Treasury $65 Million in “gold” to be paid for at a stiff price in government “bonds”

1894 -- The USofA Supreme Court rules the income tax provision of the “Wilson-Gorman Tariff Act” was unconstitutional. 5 to 4 decision in the ( Pollock v. Farmers’ Loan and Trust Co, )

1902 -- New York political boss George Washington Plunkitt “Everybody is talking about Tammany - ( political organization -New York - 1872 - municipal political control, associated with corruption, and bossism ) men growing rich on GRAFT. “

Plunkitt says “ but nobody thinks of drawing the distinction between honest GRAFT and dishonest GRAFT. There’s an honest GRAFT, and I’m an example of how it works. I would sum up the whole thing by saying, ** I seen my opportunities and I took em. “ **

1913 -- Establishment of the Federal Reserve Corporation ( USofA Central Bank )

1913 -- USofA House Committee on Banking and Currency “exposes” the “ Money Trust “ that controls USofA Financial power ( Arsene P. Pujo heads the Committee )

1913 -- “Economic Interpretation of the Constitution “ by Columbia University History Professor Charles A. Beard ** America’s founding fathers were “ALL” men of property.

1913 -- Sixteenth Amendment to the Constitution proclaimed in force by Secretary of State Philander C. Knox empowers Congress to levy graduated income taxes on income above $3,000 per year.

1925 -- USofA President Coolidge states before the American Newspaper Editors “The Business of America is Business,”

1925 -- USofA President Coolidge tells congress he opposes the cancellation of French and British war debts. ** “ They hired the money, didn’t they ? “ **

1925 -- USofA Congress passes the “Corrupt Practices Act “ makes it “unlawful for any national bank, or any Corporation to make contributions, in any election, to any political office.” But permits an individual to contribute $5,000 to a political committee, but, no limited on number of committees.

Soooooooooo................................... “WE THE PEOPLE”
Conspiracy - NOT ! Doom and Gloom - NOT ! - JUST - Business taking care of Business. -AND-

Mushrooms-R-Us - AND - Be Quiet...Consume...And Die. - AND -

Bankers can hire half the working class, to kill the other half.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 13:48
ted butler__A (Rob@9:43) ID#317184:

Rob,

Thanks for the suggestion, but if you knew how many times I have submitted various articles to those organizations and others, to no avail, I think you would be surprised. I don't want to say they ( journelists ) are not intelligent enough to grasp new concepts, but I think it has to do with looking down on any research that's not submitted on a letterhead with a lower Manhatten address.

What's more amazing to me, is the reaction I've gotten from regulators who I've contacted about the leasing scam and the absurd short interest in silver. These people are mandated by law to prevent just the very things I've tried to convey to them in very simple language. If you saw the responses I've gotten, I think you would be shocked by their lack of understanding and knowledge, and what silly arguements they counter my contentions with. It is kind of scary.

Even after these last two pieces, I have seen very little comment ( agreeing or disagreeing ) , even though silver lease rates were at one point this week 100 times the rate of last April/May, when I first posted on the internet. And as concerns the obscene short interest in silver, which I would think would be strongly embraced or rejected by both fundamentalists and technicians alike, the silence has been overwhelming. If the metal community refuses to consider ( not necessarily agree ) and debate such issues, why would a mainstream publication?

I've resigned myself to be proven right or wrong in due course, after all the facts are out. In the meantime, if you feel others should read this stuff, have at it. It would probably look less self-serving coming from a third party.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 13:48
ted butler__A (Rob@9:43) ID#317184:

Rob,

Thanks for the suggestion, but if you knew how many times I have submitted various articles to those organizations and others, to no avail, I think you would be surprised. I don't want to say they ( journelists ) are not intelligent enough to grasp new concepts, but I think it has to do with looking down on any research that's not submitted on a letterhead with a lower Manhatten address.

What's more amazing to me, is the reaction I've gotten from regulators who I've contacted about the leasing scam and the absurd short interest in silver. These people are mandated by law to prevent just the very things I've tried to convey to them in very simple language. If you saw the responses I've gotten, I think you would be shocked by their lack of understanding and knowledge, and what silly arguements they counter my contentions with. It is kind of scary.

Even after these last two pieces, I have seen very little comment ( agreeing or disagreeing ) , even though silver lease rates were at one point this week 100 times the rate of last April/May, when I first posted on the internet. And as concerns the obscene short interest in silver, which I would think would be strongly embraced or rejected by both fundamentalists and technicians alike, the silence has been overwhelming. If the metal community refuses to consider ( not necessarily agree ) and debate such issues, why would a mainstream publication?

I've resigned myself to be proven right or wrong in due course, after all the facts are out. In the meantime, if you feel others should read this stuff, have at it. It would probably look less self-serving coming from a third party.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 13:42
Selby () ID#287207:
John Disney: I was looking for Randfontein to see if it had about the same leverage as Durban Deep. But if I can't find it after this effort --who cares. Thanks for your help.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 13:40
Selby () ID#287207:
sweat Thanks: I couldn't find it in my version of GOLDSHEET.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 13:16
Earl (Point of order, point of order.) ID#227238:
Auric: We have a case study right here in this pristine forum. Sharefin. The sentiment is lovely and a joy to behold ....... but his poems don't rhyme. ; )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 13:12
tolerant1 (Hmmmmm) ID#31868:
Tanzania to become a leading African gold producer

Copyright © 1998 Nando.net
Copyright © 1998 Agence France-Presse

Market Indices | Dow Jones Industrials | Internet Stocks | Most Active | Gainers | Losers

DAR ES SALAAM ( February 8, 1998 10:26 a.m. EST http://www.nando.net ) - Tanzania is to produce 675,000 ounces of gold annually from the year 2000 when four major mining companies start production, minierals commissioner Gray Mwakalukwa said here on Sunday.

Mwakalukwa told AFP that during the same period, the mining sector's contribution to the national economy was expected to increase from the current two percent to 10 percent of the Gross Domestic Product ( GDP ) .

The current upward trend of mining activities could turn the sector into a rapidly growing one and with an estimated volume of 28 tons annually, Tanzania would become the third biggest gold producer in Africa after South Africa and Ghana, Mwakalukwa said.

According to Mwakalukwa, two companies -- Resolute and Samax, situated in the central district of Nzega -- would produce 180,000 ounces of gold per year, Kahama Mining Corporation, a subsidiary of Sutton Resources, 300,000, Afrika Mashariki in nothern Tarime district bordering Kenya 135,000, and Rangold Resources/Pangea of Shinyanga 60,000.

In addition, Mwakalukwa said, more than 100 foreign investors were also expected to apply for licences to mine in Tanzania.

In a move to attract and boost investor confidence in Tanzania, the government has organised a special conference in the northern Tanzanian town of Arusha on Wednesday, during which President Benjamin Mkapa will meet with some 40 chief executives of mining companies in Tanzania for discussions on the problems facing the industry.

In another private sector initiative, the government was due to move a bill in parliament next week which would facilitate easy application for and acquisition of mineral rights, Mwakalukwa added.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 12:41
golddkm (Mexican mine listing, including Industrias Penoles...) ID#432148:
http://www.imdex.com/c_i.htm#Industrias Penoles

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 12:39
chas (James re my mistake) ID#342398:
Sorry, i found my mistake re WTC. The mouse is in denial. Thanx again

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 12:19
cherokee__A (@-------options.........) ID#344308:

all the talk of bombing iraq------

http://router.minot.com/~bohl/history/option/Crude_Oil

crude-oil dec98 2500 calls are $100.00
crude-oil dec98 2300 calls are $190.00

when the first bomb explodes........so will the price of oil........

ALLABOARD..........realistic--------ally


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 12:18
tolerant1 (cherokee_A) ID#31868:
For the complete paper, scroll down until you see the white paper link, print this puppy out and read. When done, don't buy a plane ticket without me, we will get this bastard together. Oh Camdesuss where are you hiding you scum?

And our government and the presidential IMF employee Clinton that traitor dog wants to give his boss more money/debt paper with the foot prints of unknowing babies on them.

http://www.buildfreedom.com/plott2.htm

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 12:13
cherokee__A (@------seeds-----------------) ID#344308:

and a whole bunch of factual data------

http://www.iinet.net.au/~standeyo/Priority_One_A.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 12:10
Barb Hughes (ALL) ID#20783:
MUNICH, Germany
Sunday, February 08,1998 - 11:30 AM ET

( Reuters ) U.S. Defense Secretary William Cohen ended today the European leg of a whirlwind tour to drum up support for Washington's tough line on Iraq having gained support from some key allies.

Meanwhile, Secretary of State Madeline Albright told CBS News Chief Washington Correspondent Bob Schieffer on Face the Nation this morning that Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein has weeks to meet U.N. resolutions and that any attacks on Iraq would be sustained, substantial, and heavy.

Cohen, who left Germany to fly to Saudi Arabia, faces a far tougher job winning over the Gulf states he believes face the greatest threat from Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein's suspected arsenal of chemical and biological weapons.

Cohen was due to meet King Fahd and Defense Minister Prince Sultan, who was reported in Sunday's Saudi papers as saying his country did not approve of U.S. preparations for an attack on Iraq.

We'll not agree and we are against striking Iraq as a people and as a nation, the English-language daily Arab News quoted the prince, who is the king's brother, as saying.

Prince Sultan's comments were in stark contrast to German Chancellor Helmut Kohl's strongest expression of support to date for Washington's drive to get Baghdad to respect United Nations resolutions requiring it to open sites to military inspectors.

Kohl on Saturday offered to make German air bases available to support any military action against Iraq in a gesture that perhaps has little practical significance but was still warmly welcomed by Cohen.

Canadian Defense Minister Arthur Eggleton on Sunday stiffened his government's backing for the U.S. military buildup in the Gulf.

Military force can be used perhaps to ensure that U.N. resolutions are abided by, Eggleton said on the second day of a high-powered security conference. Canada is considering its possible participation in this matter.

British Defense Secretary George Robertson reiterated that London was prepared to back up political support with military deeds. Failure to stop Saddam would have potentially disastrous consequences, he warned.

If he gets away with undermining the credibility of the U.N., what then? Robertson asked. What chance have we in the future of stopping some rogue dictator from using chemical weapons, the poor man's nuclear bomb?

Although Cohen said he had very positive talks on Saturday with French Defense Minister Alain Richard, Paris remains committed to exhausting all diplomatic options to get Baghdad to reopen suspect sites to U.N. weapons inspectors.

Moscow, meanwhile, remains deeply suspicious of American motives, with one representative of the state Duma at the conference questioning whether Baghdad's arsenal of weapons of mass destruction existed at all.

Cohen departed from the prepared text of a speech he was due to give to spell out the evidence the United States has of Saddam's weapons stockpile.

If Saddam Hussein has nothing to hide, he has nothing to fear, Cohen told the symposium.

But Saddam Hussein and his government have lied consistently in the past. They said they had no chemical and no biological weapons -- that proved to be a lie.

Cohen cited stockpiles of anthrax and the deadly nerve agent VX.

Iraq admitted to having the anthrax, one spore of which can kill if it enters the lungs, and VX, of which a single drop on the finger is lethal, he said.

Cohen on Saturday ordered six stealth fighter-bombers, six B-52 bombers, six F-16 fighters, one B-1B bomber and 23 support aircraft to join the huge U.S. force of warships and planes gathered in the Gulf and on Britain's Indian Ocean island base of Diego Garcia.

The additional weaponry will bring the number of U.S. warplanes in the region to about 375. Scores are aboard three U.S. aircraft carriers in the strategic waterway.

Cohen will visit six Gulf states in three days to try and win their backing for what he says would be substantial strikes to disable Iraq's ability to menace its neighbors with weapons of mass destruction.


©1998 Reuters Limited. All Rights Reserved.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 12:09
cherokee__A (@-----questions.................a-plenty......) ID#344308:

and another-----

http://www.tex-is.net/users/csbrocato/anthrax.htm

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 12:08
cherokee__A (@------read-on------) ID#344308:

bio's?

here is some info........enjoy...

http://norden1.com/~hawkins/CIVIL.HTM


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 12:03
cherokee__A (@------not-a-conspiracy---------a-careful-plan---------for-the-peopleo----) ID#344308:

tolerant1-----

incredible........why would the imf need these stats?

an accord has been reached......this war-lord, stands with
your war-lord...................

camdessus-----------------------foot-fodder--------

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 11:41
tolerant1 (Mr. Mick) ID#31868:
Hello, I have not finalized the decision. I am waiting to hear back from some friends. I will most certainly post as the process is furthered.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 11:37
tolerant1 (ALL RIGHT HOLD THE PHONE!!!) ID#31868:
Another, schmanother, lets discuss something real. Pardon to you who are not citizens of the US, but I would read the following anyway and find out what laws in your country may be similar.


Get that bastard Camdesuss has never meant more to me than now!!!


Read the following, please;


From the WHITE PAPER ON STATE CITIZENSHIP
T. Collins-10/04/94

You may also find it disturbing to know how an administrative procedure can remove your children from you. In 1921 Congress passed the Sheppard-Towner Maternity Act that created the United States birth registration area ( see Public Law 97, 67th Congress, Session I, Chapter 135, 1921. ) That act allows you to register your children when they are born. If you do so, you will get a copy of the birth certificate. By registering your children, which is voluntary, they become Federal Children. This does several things: Your children become subjects of Congress ( they lose their state citizenship ) . A copy of the birth certificate is sent to the Department of Vital Statistics in the state in which they were born. The original birth certificate is sent to the Department of Commerce in the District of Columbia. It then gets forwarded to an International Monetary Fund ( IMF ) building in Europe. Your child's future labor and properties are put up as collateral for the public debt.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 11:36
A.Goose () ID#20137:
Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 11:01
ANOTHER ( THOUGHTS! ) ID#60253:
I will be gone for some time.

Thanks for your postings. Your have helped us pull together some senarios that have been very inlighting.

I wish you and yours the very best in good times and in difficult times.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 11:35
Auric (ANOTHER) ID#255151:

ANOTHER--Those mysterious, cryptic posts are damned entertaining to say the least. I would like to know your top 5 investment picks for the next 6 months to a year. As Lou Rukeyeser would say, You can give names. Thanks.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 11:26
Carl (I see Another has struck again.) ID#333131:
Think guys and gals. Forget his mysterious tone and ethical self contradictions. The bottom line is that somehow the world oil market is to be changed such that a barrel of oil can only be purchased with $4 and an amount of gold equivalent to $4. Is this plausible? Wouldn't this require a cartel with solidarity way beyond the capability of OPEC at it's greatest? Either there is a world market in gold and oil or there is not. How can there be a market if these two things are fixed with respect to one another? Who has the power to fix this relationship? Wouldn't fixing the dollar to gold be small potatoes beside such an task?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 11:21
cherokee__A (@----------another---------squirrel----------playing-with-his-nuts-------) ID#344308:

another--

bring back some buffalo wings and dip.......you know...from work....

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 11:21
Barb Hughes (ALL) ID#20783:
BERKSHIRE HATHAWAY INC.
PRESS RELEASE
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE February 3, 1998

Because of recent price movements in the silver market and because Berkshire Hathaway has received inquiries about its ownership of the metal, the company is releasing certain information that it would normally have published next month in its annual report.

The company owns 129,710,000 ounces of silver. Its first purchase was made on July 25, 1997 and its most recent purchase was made on January 12, 1998.

During 1998, Berkshire has accepted delivery of 87,510,000 ounces in accordance with the terms of the purchase contracts and the remaining contracts for 42,200,000 ounces call for delivery at varied dates until March 6, 1998. To date, all deliveries have been made on schedule. If any seller should have trouble making timely delivery, Berkshire is willing to defer delivery for a reasonable period upon payment of a modest fee.

Over 30 years ago, Warren Buffett, CEO of Berkshire Hathaway, made his first purchase of silver in anticipation of the metal's demonetization by the U.S. Government. Since that time he has followed silver's fundamentals but no entity he manages has owned it. In recent years, widely-published reports have shown that bullion inventories have fallen very materially, because of an excess of user-demand over mine production and reclamation. Therefore, last summer Mr. Buffett and Mr. Munger, Vice Chairman of Berkshire, concluded that equilibrium between supply and demand was only likely to be established by a somewhat higher price.

All metal was purchased for London delivery through a single brokerage firm. No options have been or are held by Berkshire. No purchases have been made that established new highs for the metal and all buying has been after dips. Berkshire has had no knowledge of the actions or positions of any other market participant and today has no such knowledge.

Berkshire has no present plans for purchase or sale of silver. The position at cost comprises less than 2% of the company's investment portfolio.

--END--

Above actual press release...worth a read...I don't think it's over...
( time will tell--hindsight 20/20 ) ...gut instinct could be a start of 79'.
Much buying & selling of physicals this weekend ........ Monday should be
very interesting..........................

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 11:01
ANOTHER (THOUGHTS!) ID#60253:
I will be gone for some time.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:52
Donald__A (Silver mining news) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/980206/cqn_pacifi_1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:45
ANOTHER (THOUGHTS!) ID#60253:
Reply,
Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:24
WetGold ( ANOTHER ) ID#243180:
Since Arabia will be protected AND the U.S. has a strong allie in Arabia ---
Will the relationship sour or will be united with a common goal ?

Sir,
Please see Another’s post from yesterday AM and on. You and all western minds must weight this offer as it is heavy for your side! A great many losses will be for the holders of debt and paper things, but the gains are for a better life. There will be many for NO! Time will prove all things!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:41
John Disney__A (East-dagga) ID#24135:
For Rob
I dont know - They pay a dividend of around 30 %
even at these gold prices. Look I had a lot of it as a
defensive play just so I could had an interest and
get the big yield .. But if you assume the bottoms
in place - then you see a max 2.5 times move up for
daggas versus maybe a 10 times for mines like deeps
or harmony or randfonts. I know Ive been switching out
into the more highly geared stocks. I assume others
may feel the same way.
Also a lot of this buying has been foreign sourced.
I dont think dagga have adr and I dont think they are
well known outside RSA.
If dagga takes ergo from anglos.. I cant see anglos
in slime treatment ( not enough class ) .. then they
would gain a lot of LIFE and easily see 16 rand again.
Problem is harmony would be 60 along with deeps.
I know of no other possible reasons.. Ive talked to
the CEO on the phone .. This is partly what he told
me.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:39
CJS1__A (More- @WetGold 10:21) ID#329157:
India keeps UAE Gold trade ablaze [1997] - Indians taking gold by the bagfull
http://www.mmorning.com/1997/1271/art15.htm

Sept. 1997: Last year's precious metal re-exports to India were Dh535.78 million, the largest single item...
http://www.gulf-news.co.ae/180997/business.htm

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:38
Isure (@ cjs1 reference another analysis) ID#368244:

After reading your post analysing A nother, I feel that you should run for office. Are you saying you don't know anything about him { her}? Why did you take so long to say it?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:35
MoReGoLd (@EMU & GOLD) ID#348286:
I saw an interesting hypothesis on SI about why EMU and the new CB will want to hold enough Gold to back the new currency.
Europe imports massive amounts of oil from the middle east, and the last thing they would want is to have to pay for it in US Green, when they are promoting their own currency.
As ANOTHER has pointed out the oil countries like Gold, and in order for them to accept a currency in payment they would want it backed by
what they are actually after ...... GOLD.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:31
sweat (Selby) ID#23782:
rndey - according to goldsdheet spresdsheet

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:31
ANOTHER (THOUGHTS!) ID#60253:
Date: Sat Feb 07 1998 21:28

refer ( ANOTHER @ THOUGHTS ) ID#41229:

Is your warnings to us of something that may happen?, something you feel

will happen?, or something that is in progress and you know will happen?

Mr. refer,

I submit to you that, thruout time the progress of men does proceed at many speeds.I do offer my thoughts on a direction that is taken for a chosen time. But, who can know the minds of builders? Of my life and times, I do say, this structure will be completed of the well being of all! For this new system to fail, it will be as Mr. Donald has said, withmuch destruction of commerce.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:26
MoReGoLd (@ANOTHER) ID#348286:
$30000. Gold? I have seen a paper that shows that the US could revalue it's Gold reserves, and pay down the entire Gov't debt.
In addition all Gold mines would be taxed on a sliding scale, with the revenues going to pay the Gov'ts expenses.
The mines would still be paid thousands for each ounce, so their stocks would soar.
The price range given for this plan to work was between
$25000. to $55000. per ounce AU.
Not a bad plan, and you would want to have a few ounces kicking around if this ever comes into being...........

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:25
puttonce (Ziva . re:conspiricy theories) ID#224243:
NUTS!!!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:24
WetGold (ANOTHER) ID#243180:
Since Arabia will be protected AND the U.S. has a strong allie in Arabia --- Will the relationship sour or will be united with a common goal ?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:21
WetGold (CJS1__A) ID#243180:
Excellent sites -- thanx for the insight...


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:17
ANOTHER (THOUGHTS!) ID#60253:
Reply,

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:42

Forklift ( CJS1__A ) ID#156161:

“it is also something of great value which they cannot defend”

Mr. Forklift,

You must place yourself in that time! Nations with gold and armies will stand for Arabia! $8.00us/bl oil is indeed a resource to fight for!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:17
John Disney__A (Randy - no adr.) ID#24135:
For Selby
I looked in the MJ and they do NOT show adrs for randy. I
wouldnt worry too much - Harmony at theses prices is good
too .. Or Rangy even ... If you want safety take the new
anglo gold company particularly if they get wes Areas. I have
a lot of Randfonts but Im indifferrent between them and
Harmony at the relative prices.


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:16
STUDIO.R (@YO! from Kansas City....here I am.....) ID#249356:
Just hooked up my daughter's computer at her new place....testing to see if I'm in touch with unreality. Jazz, rum ...it's a gas, gas, gas....Be back to okc tomorrow...I see Mr Another is logged on...great...haven't had time to read posts....Go Goldbugs! Get Camdessus!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:01
Selby () ID#287207:
John Disney: Randfontein may have an ADR but the symbol isn't RANDY apparently. Could be it is not available in the US.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:51
ANOTHER (THOUGHTS!) ID#60253:
Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:50

CJS1__A ( Replies ) ID#329157:

Sir, I would say you have chosen well! Over many seasons, the currencies have come to bid in this race and all were found as “low bid”. The time for “full production” is at hand. No currency is large enough for this race, so a new one will arrive from the past!

This you say: An alligator is, they say, all mouth and no ears.

This is good, I show a great smile!

Mr. Pete, I have written of this. See the list from Mr. Fin. Try using $30,000/gold, the value is better for all!


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:51
Rob (all the gold ever mined still exists) ID#410114:
All the gold ever mined still exits is a reason the bears give that gold will not enter a serious bull market. Well what about stocks and bonds?

those things can be created with a key stroke and have been. Dispite the infinite capability to create bonds and shares out of thin air, the world has undergone a gigantic bull mrket in them. Companies and gov't issue bonds or stocks they can't issue silver or gold.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:49
Donald__A (More on strong dollar, deflation and gold.) ID#26793:
Until the situation described in that story on chemical prices is resolved ( in hundreds of industries ) the dollar will remain strong, gold will remain weak and deflation will continue. Resolution will most likely be by bankruptcy and default as the players give up the futile fight and only the debt free, or nearly debt free, survive. That will be the panic phase and all stock and bond/credit markets will decline during it. All paper will be suspect so paper must be disposed of NOW and gold must be accumulated NOW even during a declining gold market.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:43
Rob (Ted Butler silver leasing) ID#410114:
Ted Butler


Why don't you submit your two PM lease articles to the New York times and
Wall street Journal letters to the Editor section. You can do it by e-mail if you chose

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:42
Forklift (CJS1__A) ID#156161:
Indeed, Sauda Arabia is on top of a lot of oil, more than they need or could use forever, but it is also something of great value which they cannot defend.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:38
Donald__A (I repeat my claim that the dollar is strong (and gold weak) for the wrong reason. See example below) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980206/asia_curre_1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:35
Poorboys (Looney forever) ID#224149:
Ted ---C$ ----Short term .7050 ---- Intermediate term 6 months .7250 ----Long term year .7600 ----Pipe dream scenario .7050 breakout to .7350 by end of February .As I only play future markets my tech indicators told me ---buy stop .7009 or higher ---short on close if close is .6894 or lower. In relative terms .7050 has some substantial resistance.If you have a further time period before conversation then more profits are in your hand .Now if you trade for a living play the game between .6894 ---.7009 with stops to protect any breakouts. This is live from The Poorboys Gambling Den –Happy Trails

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:35
Auric (Donald_A+) ID#255151:

Thanks. The Nikkei seems to thrive on bad news lately. I wonder if the Japanese Central Bank Bribery Scandal will be shrugged off as well?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:31
CJS1__A (WetGold 9:17) ID#329157:
The UAE is building a three billion dollar Abu Dhabi Free Zone which will include facilities for precious metals and is the first of its kind in the Arab Gulf, to be completed around 1999 or 2000. Dubai's gold imports reached 350.5 tonnes in 1996 and the city ranked as the world's second largest gold redistributor just behind Singapore.

See:

UAE Industry
http://www.ecssr.ac.ae/00uae.2industry.html

Dubai Update January 1997
http://www.dctpb.gov.ae/dctpb/news/Dubai-Update-Jan-97.html

UAE
http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/cabs/uae.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:28
Rob (Bulls v. Bears) ID#410114:
The PMG bulls didn't have a clue as to the duration and extent of the 17 year bear market in the metals and I Iexpect that the bears will be just as suprised at the duration and extent of the current bull move in the PMG.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:28
Pete (ALL & ANOTHER, re: my 04.06 post) ID#22451:
Further thoughts on my last post. Even if the annual production of gold increases by 2 to 4000 tons/yr, I estimate that it would take $1.40 worth of gold in current US Dollars at $300.00/oz to dry up annual production of gold for many years.

4000t/yrx2000#/t/tx16oz/#/75000000bl/dx365d = 0.00468 oz/bl

0.00468oz/blx$300.00/oz = $1.40 in US dollars @ $300.00 gold.

The projected price of gold = $300x$9.00/bl/$1.40bl = $1,928.00/oz.
( refer to ANOTHERS 2/07/98 20:51 post. $17.00/bl - $8.00/bl = $9.00/bl
Imagine what drying up future production of gold for many years would do to the price of gold.

THIS IS WHAT I BELIEVE ANOTHER IS ALLUDING TO.

PLEASE, ANYONE, GO OVER MY ESTIMATES FOR ANY ERRORS I MAY HAVE MADE!


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:22
Rob (East Dagga) ID#410114:
John Disney, do you know the reason for East Dagga's poor preformance?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:22
Donald__A (Japanese Central Bankers implicated in bribery scandal (courtesy of Auric) ID#26793:
http://www.nando.net/newsroom/ntn/world/020798/world27_27171.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:17
Donald__A (Indonesion Riot Police prepare for Election Day (Courtesy of Auric) ID#26793:
http://www.nando.net/newsroom/ntn/world/020798/world24_3741.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:17
WetGold (CJS1__A) ID#243180:
You said ... Emirates, which undertake great trade in gold, and are a major conduit for gold to the subcontinent...

May I ask where this information is derived ?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:10
Donald__A (@Mr. Mick) ID#26793:
I am leaning toward the opinion of the Japanese economist quoted yesterday. The Chinese want an advantage over their competitors but do not want to set off a new destructive round of devaluations. A ten percent devaluation or less might fit that goal. Timing is also important. It would be done at a time when the IMF was either finished or impotent and unable to respond. That would let them retain an advantage. Things could be moving so fast that China is forced to act sooner.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:50
CJS1__A (Replies) ID#329157:
ANOTHER ( Sat Feb 07 1998 23:22 ) :
'Mr. Forklift... Stand here with me as we view this race of two!...'
The two 'fine Arabian horses' that come to mind in this race to the winning post are Saudi Arabia, which floats upon a great well of oil, and the Emirates, which undertake great trade in gold, and are a major conduit for gold to the subcontinent. Is my thinking faulty?

Midas__A ( Sat Feb 07 1998 22:18 ) : 'USA will attack Iraq after Olympics...' An interesting theory. However, I think it will be any time after the end of the Eid Al-Fitr holiday ( February 8th... ) but before the annual Hajj to Mecca, for political reasons.

Ziva ( Feb 08 1998 03:36 ) 'CJS1_A...............NO ONE REPLIED TO YOUR POST !'
You replied ( Feb 06 1998 23:06 ) , also Cmax ( Fri Feb 06 1998 22:23 )
Preacher ( Fri Feb 06 1998 22:23 ) , SDRer__A ( Feb 06 1998 20:17 and Feb 06 1998 19:48 ) , sweat ( Fri Feb 06 1998 19:43 ) and WetGold ( Feb 06 1998 19:07 ) and ANOTHER ( Sat Feb 07 1998 18:45 ) Mr. Cjs1, To say “this is good” or “your view is a good one” in my world, is to say “I agree” in your world. “good thoughts flow as cool water for a thirsty mind”

An alligator is, they say, all mouth and no ears.

Bart: How much bandwidth would be saved by a selective short-format listing for posts above a certain length ( say a reasonable length paragraph, rather than a single line ) ?

cherokee__A: Sharks?....... big deal........ Mine is also water tight----
go for a swim.......

Today's left-field prediction of the next turning point in the POG: take the geometric mean of the best and worst predictions... square root of $140 * $10000 = $1183. Probably.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:31
vronsky (WHEN CENTRAL BANKS SELL GOLD, THEIR CURRENCIES DEVALUE) ID#426220:

There is one cardinal factor which destines a currency to DEVALUATION... that is when a country's Central Bank embarks upon the foolhardy exercise of selling off its GOLD RESERVES.

The analysis correlates Central Bank Gold Sales to subsequent
devaluation of its currency in terms of the U.S. dollar. Frankly, the results - although not surprising to this researcher - are overwhelmingly convincing.

The study shows the Currency Charts of the seven hapless major countries which sold a good portion of their Gold Reserves in recent years, thus causing substantial devaluation of their paper money.

The bottom-line conclusion is startling. You may read the entire study at the golden-eagle website - just delete the letters “en” in the word “golden” -
http://www.golden-eagle.com/analysis_98/vronsky020798.html



Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:26
Ted (Panda-----have fun and thank the good(?) Lord that they made it-----------) ID#330175:
Simpler....eh

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:24
Ted (Poorboys and Canadian Dollar @ Lake Simeco) ID#330175:
My friend: What is your upside target for the Lonnie? and when? ( my trigger finger is gettin itchy! )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:23
Mr. Mick (Donald - re: China and their lack of foreign investment $....) ID#345321:
do you think it will kick off another round of devaluations? The Yuan, at least.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:23
panda (Ted) ID#30116:
Good morning Ted! I'll be back later. I have too many things left undone this weekend due to the 'new' and 'simpler' and .... tax code changes.

BBL...........

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:22
Ted (Panda + Tort..............YOU feel bad------------I have to do tax forms for the USA +) ID#330175:
Canada fer christ sakes~~~~~~~~~~away to scratch me head

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:20
Ted (CherOkee(23:42)) ID#330175:
Great post---he really is just 'another' BSer ( unless one believes in the tooth fairy that is )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:20
panda (Tortfeasor) ID#30116:
Tortfeasor -- I feel ( some of ) your pain as I try to do my schedule D, pre-tax simplification of course! Then I can go back and figure out what the new holding periods and the date change for those new holding classifications mean to me. Now, who do I send MY bill to?

I think I'll go and wash the car..... It's more fun than doing the tax return... :- ) )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:18
Ted (Selby.........................from SUNNY Cape Breton) ID#330175:
Thankx for Stephane's sites ( I Really got alot ( ? ) out of em! ) Re-Young Commies of Canada get together:Wish I could have been there ( sounds like they had a hell of a turnout ) ~~~~~~~~~~~

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:15
panda (Donald__A ) ID#30116:
Donald__A -- ( Ref: Date: Sat Feb 07 1998 10:27 )
The peak in the Dow/silver ratio took place on 7/23/97.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:04
Mr. Mick (Tolerant - did you decide not to give Glenn a coin?) ID#345321:
for his trip into space? Let me know, please. Haven't been able to access this page lately due to high traffic. Sorry.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:59
sosmiley (John Disney) ID#276219:
As one of the knowledgeable members of this forum, could I ask you if anyone outside the US and Canada ever looks at Venezuela's gold activity?

I am wondering simply because of the upcoming Supreme COurt decision in that country that apparently, for the 4th consecutive time, will perfect title to the mining rights of an estimated 15 to 20 million ounces of gold, mineable at a reported $180 to $200 per ounce, to a company with 37 million shares currently trading at $6 1/2.

Seems to me, this Las Cristinas and KM 88 area, part of the Guyana Shield deposits, should be of interest, but, just wondering.

Thanks for your response when you get a minute, cause no one on the KRY forum seems to have a global picture like perhaps you might.

best

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:56
Tortfeasor (Joke of the Morn) ID#36965:
Having been up to my armpits in preparing tax returns ( for myself, kids, sisters, brother, dad ) which is not something you want festering in your armpit I have not had a chance to read the site for a couple of days. As I tune in the talk is the same and it is comforting to be able to turn to an old friend. To show my good breeding for tuning in to Kitco I post the following:

A lady from Chicago was visiting New York City. Her hostess
was determined to make the Midwesterner feel cheap
and unimportant.

My dear, said the New York matron snobbishly, here in the
East we think breeding is everything.

Oh, I don't know, the lady from the Midwest replied. Out
where I come from we think it's fun, too, but we try to have
a few outside interests as well.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:46
Donald__A (Indonesian military readies for the worst. ) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980207/indonesia__1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:41
Donald__A (China tightens grip on metals traders after $200 million zinc loss) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980207/china_meta_1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:34
Donald__A (Things starting to look gloomy for Chinese economic expectations) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980208/china_econ_1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:33
Auric (Mike Sheller) ID#255151:

I'll be wearing my KITCO tee shirt saying Go Gold!. I suggest we have a limo waiting outside when we are asked to leave.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:33
sharefin (For our children's children's children.) ID#284251:
http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/3795/debt.htm
Grandfather Economic Report on Debt

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:32
Mike Sheller (JOHN DISNEY) ID#347447:
Your 4:06 is just ONE of the reasons I kan't keep away from Kitco. It is always a pleasure to be surrounded ( if only in a cyber way ) by witty and observant people keeping us abreast of all kinds of news and information. A tip o' the turban, deep!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:28
Mike Sheller (AURIC) ID#347447:
And I'll be planted in the audience shouting Now THAT'S poetry! ( whereupon I'll slap my knee a few times, and loudly pop open a pull tab on a Budweiser wrapped in a brown paper bag ) ..

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:28
sharefin (Peace before sleep.) ID#284251:
Beneath the wide south sky I lie
And marvel
Worship sometimes
At the rich and living gold
Of the stars
The floor of heaven indeed
Is thick encrusted with patina
Of fine gold.
So Shakespeare saw it
For he too
Lived in a place and day
When the glorious floor of heaven
Was not obscured with smog
And men were not robbed
Of the wonder of the skies
By the reflected glare
Of incandescent light
Nor blinded by the blaze of neon.

What wonder we deny ourselves
Such glory and such splendour
Our lives and spirit
Are the meaner
For such irreparable loss.



Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:24
Donald__A (South African gold stocks predicted to be weak this week) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980206/safrica_st_1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:13
Donald__A (Prosecutors raid more banks in Japan bribery scandal) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980203/hokkaido_t_1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 07:07
Donald__A (Notable quotes from Davos; note Dornbusch on Japan) ID#26793:
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980203/swiss_foru_1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 06:59
Auric (John Disney) ID#255151:

Yep. A certain eccentricity does keep it entertaining. Someday I am going to attend a poetry recital and start loudly complaining that their poems don't rhyme! Some idiot will challenge me to recite some poetry. I'll be ready with The Cremation of Sam McGee. Might be a good idea to have a beer or two on board when I go there.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 06:58
Donald__A (Monica refused to be wired to get immunity) ID#26793:
http://www.nypostonline.com/news/302.htm

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 06:32
John Disney__A (A spot of madness) ID#24135:
For Auric.
Never ban Ziva. She adds a dash of nuttiness to the site.
As you can tell from my posts, I like that sort of thing.
Nothing is more boring than tuning in, and a couple of
jerks are telling eeverybody dont talk about anything other
than gold. and going rubard rubard to one another.
Thats worse than having no one here at all - like now.
But maybe she could be foreshortened a tad.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 06:28
sosmiley (New Venezuelan Effort to advance gold mining) ID#276219:
Perhaps those interested in Venezuela should check out the following... which related to a not well known Crystallezx and a better known Placer Dome...who is reported to be ending its relationship forever in Venezuela..

http://www.vheadline.com/9802/3728.htm

and for further info, perhaps you want to spend a few hours at

http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/8832/kry.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 06:19
Auric (Gold) ID#255151:

Earl--Good post @ 01:59. To Kitco--I don't propose we ban Ziva, but can we at least limit the length and number of posts?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 06:14
Hedgehog (ROTHSCHILDS The making of a dynasty) ID#39845:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk/newsid_50000/50997.stm

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 05:59
Hedgehog (Singapore bankruptcies up 10% on previous record year of 1987 ) ID#39845:
RECORD NUMBER OF BANKRUPTCIES IN
SINGAPORE
Sunday 8 February, 1998 ( 6:32pm AEDT )




New figures show a record number of Singaporeans went
bankrupt last year.

Reuter's newsagency quotes local reports as saying nearly
17-hundred people were declared bankrupt last year, 30 per
cent more than in the previous year.

Officials say the new record is almost 10 percent more than
the previous record year, 1987, which saw 1,570
bankruptcies.

Official estimates show that the number of bakcruptcies is
expected to rise again this year.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 05:14
John Disney__A (Even More freedom for canadians) ID#24135:
for caper
Taking your money limits your freedom..You're starting
to love your chains ... better luck in the next referendum..
smaller unit means less politicians.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 05:12
GoldenEagle (Rumour of Homestake takeover of Macraes Mining (NZ/Oz) ) ID#42782:

Someone posted something about this earlier today. Can anyone substantiate this? Any information welcomed


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 05:11
Ziva (ON LIBERTY) ID#302251:

Men make their own history,
but they do not make it just as they please...
the tradition of all the dead generations
weighs like a nightmare on the brain of the living.

KARL MARX ( 1818 -1883 )

*

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 05:02
Ziva (ON LIBERTY) ID#302251:

To be governed is to be at every move,
at every operation,
at every transaction,
noted,
registered,
enrolled,
taxed,
stamped,
measured,
numbered,
assessed,
licensed,
authorized,
admonished,
forbidden,
reformed,
corrected,
punished.
It is, under pretext of public utility,
and in the name of the general interest,
to be placed under contribution,
trained,
ransomed,
exploited,
monopolized,
extorted,
squeezed,
mystified,
robbed;
then, at the slightest resistance,
the first word of complaint,
to be repressed,
fined,
despised,
harassed,
tracked,
abused,
clubbed,
choked,
imprisoned,
shot,
machine-gunned,
judged,
condemned,
shot,
deported,
sacrificed,
sold,
betrayed;
and, to crown all,
mocked,
ridiculed,
outraged,
dishonored.

That is government;
that is its justice;
that is its morality.


PIERRE JOSEPH PROUDHON ( 1809 -1865 )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:48
Caper (@Freedom For Canadians) ID#300202:
We are free!!!-Quebecers are free-several referendums have been effected
& La Belle Province voted NO to separation. This is a political game
with these politicians having their own agenda, distorting truths to
effect their own ends-& yet still, with these manipulations, the people
still vote No. Prior posting would seem to dictate that the Canadian
Government limits the freedom of individuals. I can accuse them of many
things, but not this.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:48
Ziva (ON LIBERTY) ID#302251:


[Anarchism is the] philosophy of a new social order
based on liberty unrestricted by man-made law;
the theory that all forms of government rest on violence,
and are therefore wrong and harmful,
as well as unnecessary,


EMMA GOLDMAN, ( 1869 -1940 )

*

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:36
Ziva ( ON LIBERTY ) ID#302251:
If ye love wealth better than liberty,
the tranquility of servitude
better than the animating contest of freedom,
go home from us in peace.
We ask not your counsels or arms.
Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you.
May your chains set lightly upon you,
and may posterity forget ye were our countrymen.
- Samuel Adams

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:34
John Disney__A (I want a bilderburger for lunch ...) ID#24135:
To All
Has anyone got a good recipe for a Bilderburger

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:29
John Disney__A (Forecasting is fun for idiots) ID#24135:
Dear Ziva
How can you accuse others of taking space?.
Id read all this crud before and here it is again... We have
a Greek guy here who thinks Britain has a oil field in the
Black Sea.. I think this guy actually runs a fish and chips
shop somewhere...the drongo cant tell the North sea
from the Black Sea.
Also what does Nostrodamus like in the Seventh Race at
Clairwood Park next week.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:23
mozel (Earl Starting Point http://announce.com/~behold/) ID#153102:


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:17
Ziva ( ***T*R*I*L*A*T*E*R*A*L*S*** are preparing Blair & Clinton 4 WW3) ID#302251:
http://www.jpost.com/

Blair: Conflict inevitable unless Iraq relents
================================================

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:17
Robh__A (Open interest in Gold) ID#407135:
Open interest in gold contracts according to http://www.the-privateer.com/gold6.html appears to have fallen sharply in late jan early feb. Can we read anything into this? Have the shorters given up at least temporarily?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:15
CEAUX-DUTHEIL Stéphane (technical analysis about GOLD, DJIA, CAC 40) ID#33024:
http://home.worldnet.fr/scdut/default.shtml

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:07
Ziva ( ***T*R*I*L*A*T*E*R*A*L*S***) ID#302251:

Date: Sun Jan 25 1998 03:51
Organ ( Bilderberg and Trilateral Commission -- Fascinating article )
ID#162309:
3 ) World Government, interview with an
insider....?

Section 1 mirrors a Greek site:
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/8604/strigas.txt

Athanasios Strigas, interviewed here, studied Political and Economic
Science
at the University of Heidelberg. He then took Foreign Relations and
International Strategy in the University of Georgetown in Washington D.C.

and Propaganda in Patris Lumumba of Moscow.

He started his career as an attaché and nowadays is a specialised consultant
to the supreme military
commander of NATO and has close connections with the Trilateral
Commission. Most of his time is
spent in Brussels and in the last year and a half he has published 4
successful books.

Strigas has revelaed some shocking facts in Greece about domestic politics
using secret
documents etc. as proof. He also predicted a military crisis between Greece
and Turkey 18
months before it happened and named exactly the small island which was
the focus of the
crisis. Unfortunately his books are only available in Greek but in them he
reveals a great deal
about the US National Security Agency and the Trilateral Commission and
the Bilderberg
Club, sometimes far more than anything you can find on the world- wide
web.

This interview is translated, imperfectly, from the original Greek.



* We all know that countries are being guided by their political and
military leaders. Big
countries and small do exist and also the small countries are dependant on
the big ones.
Despite this in your books you mention two international decision making
centres which, in
your opinion, are above countries and ideologies. Could you be more
specific about that?

* It may sound exaggerated but people these days are being guided by
political and military
leadership according to the orders of two global centres: The Trilateral
Commission and The
Bilderberg Club. This marks a new era and it is not something that has
happened in the past.

In the past, the world was ruled by ideologies. We know ideologies were
used to control the people.
But conflicting ideologies were also creating wars. Therefore, for a while,
countries formed alliances.

More recently there has been a change in the global scenery. Everything
has been globalised. The
world has become a global village. Therefore it needs global decision
making centres. From this point
of view the Planetarchy, if we can call it that, will be the politics of the
21st century. This marginalises
national governments which are now dependent on those international
centres.

Today we see that profit now determines the destinies of countries. The
world is already being ruled
by representatives of those two centres. The task of today's governments is
to look after 93% of the
international wealth. That is the wealth that those two centres own.



* What exactly are the Bilderberg Club and the Trilateral Commission?

* The Bilderberg Club is an international decision making centre named
after a hotel near the Dutch
town of Oosterbeek where its first convention took place in 1954. Its
headquarters is in The Hague
in Holland. In its conventions two types of people take part we can call
the 'protagonists' and the
'supernumerary'.

The supernumerary are something like guest speakers, they are only
allowed to speak a few minutes
and always on the first day of the convention. The Guidance Committee of
the Club protagonists is
made up of Americans and Europeans from the developed countries, never
has a person from the
Third World been on it.

The Club is made up of people with conservative 'aberrations' such as
Giovanni Anieli, Luns,
Rothschild etc. The Bilderberg Club's president is today James Callahan,
British ex- prime minister
and his assistant is the ex- General Secretary of NATO, Lord Carrington.
Maybe you remember that
in 1993 the Club met in Greece, in the Asteras hotel in Bouliagmeni.

The Bilderberg Club today controls 33% of the world's wealth. Some
members of the Bilderberg
Club, without having departed from it officially, established in June 1973 a
new, more powerful
group, the Trilateral Commission led by David Rockefeller, president of the
Chase Manhattan Bank.
Members of the Trilateral Commission operate in parallel with but
somewhat above the Bilderberg
Club as a centre of research and analysis. The founding members of the
Trilateral Commission are
Sirus Vance and Warren Christopher. David Rockefeller is president and
Zbigniew Brzezinski is
chief executive. The Trilateral Commission manages 60% of international
wealth.



* How do those centres get so much power?

* I think it is obvious that they take the power from the international
wealth they control and from the
various political appointments, presidents and prime ministers ( which are
mostly technocrats ) which
they control and guide.



* But how is possible to select candidates? Do top politicians accept being
only token leaders
of their countries?

* This is a reasonable question but remember, human ambition has no
limits. Skilful people exist that
do not care for means nor consequences in order to rise to the top of their
country's leadership. The
selection for suitable protagonists to serve the two centres is made after
checked information which
analysts of the NSA [U.S. National Security Agency] have collected, with
the help of organisations
such as CIA, DIA and DEA.

The NSA personal reports are transferred in the end to the Steering
Committee of the Bilderberg
Club. The Committee meets secretly and the conclusion is sealed in a
special envelope which is then
given to the Bilderberg Club and Trilateral Commission presidents. The
presidencies approve the
decision almost 99% of the time.

Qualifications for candidates are very fluid, [joke?] I mean elastic
consciousness or, if you want,
plasticity, to comply with the international decision making philosophy.
Another element of control is
that they must not disturb the global balance. This is essential because this
balance has nothing to do
with the balance of the world but simply balance of the global profit and
loss account. The members
must globally ensure the income of the two international centres funds.



* But didn't that happen also in the past?

* In the past if someone was a prime minister or a president he would
have come into conflict with
the great powers, he would have been characterised as 'troublemaker' and
underminer of liberty and
then would have been 'vanished' politically or biologically.

Today the politicians are servants whose masters do not allow them to
make any independent moves.
You have seen in the recent German elections ( which happened at the
same time as our [Greek]
council elections ) that the French were the ones that were celebrating the
victory of Kohl because the
Mark is supporting the French Franc. The leaders no longer have any
freedom. You likewise are
probably obliged to your friends to take them into consideration in your
own moves and plans.



* Could you give us an example?

* Let's imagine that this, or the next, Greek government had the will to
solve the Albanian and
Turkish problem and the dispute between Greece and the former
Yugoslavia for Macedonia. What
would they do? Just 300 men are enough to invade the Aktio base in
Preveza, Western Greece,
which belongs to the NSA and then every problem would be solved. If this
base were occupied all
communications in the Balkans and Turkey would be paralysed. But such a
move would need much
courage.



* What are the methods, groups and structures of the global decision
making centres?

* The methods that are being used are simple; I promote you as a president,
prime minister, military
leader; you satisfy your vanity and have ethical and economical profits. In
return you have to blindly
obey us. If not we destroy you by corruption, forced resignation or
assassination. At least this is what
happened up until now.



* What tendencies do you see in those centres today then?

* These days you can see a tendency for renewal. And therefore it was
decided in the last Bilderberg
meeting to give the people 2% percent more of their international wealth,
something that the old ones
did not accept. There are conflicts between conservatives and more liberal
types. But I believe the
last will in the end dominate.



* Recently, humanity watched anxiously the collapse of the Soviet Union.
Which dynamics led
to this collapse and what did it really mean?

* The collapse of the Soviet Union was begun in 1973 by the Trilateral
Commission and part of the
Bilderberg Club. The members who left Bilderberg and formed the
Trilateral Commission used shock
tactics and have brought the control of the remains of the Soviet Union to
the Bilderberg. This was
made possible because in the Summer of 1973, 30 July specifically, The
Trilateral Commission
controlled 60% of global wealth with their World Bank. So it became the
dominator of the game.
The purpose of the Soviet Union's collapse is to demonstrate internationally
the failure of the
Communist ideology and present it as a system that is inhuman.

Besides this, because the population of the earth is growing, the extra 2%
that will be given to the
people will be granted to the Soviet Union out of the mining of their
geological mineral wealth. The
soviet people must be educated as consuming citizens as in the west. In
order to control those people
many new countries will be created that will not have constant peace.



* What is the role of the International Monetary Fund?

* The International Monetary Fund is a branch of the World Bank. Today,
most countries are
obliged to borrow money because they cannot get it from private capital or
from other countries. This
necessity occurs either because of a failure to manage public resources or
because the 5 year plan
failed or because there is internal turmoil etc..

There exist of course also politicians that redeem the sympathy of the
people by offering them
short- term material comforts and asking from them the minimum of their
possible efforts. They do this
of course with money they take from the national budget that should be
normally given to
development projects.

Anyway, the point is that sometimes countries reach a dead- end. When
this happens the IMF
exploits the circumstances: it grants a pre- approval of the loan to those
countries but with its own
conditions. This means that you will get the loans from the banks ( that are
all controlled by the World
Bank ) if you take specified measures which are almost every time anti-
social. This results in turmoil in
the society. The government panic. In order to calm down the turmoil even
more money must be
borrowed.

In this way the government finally gets totally controlled by the IMF.

Let's take for example the Greek education system. 60% of the Education
Ministry outlays are
coming from loans of the IMF. So it is not at all odd that from the 150.000
kids only 40.000 go to
the public universities.

All the above explain also why public works in our country always begin
but never end.



* What are the global decision making centres most afraid of?

* One is the soft spot of the global leaders ( even if this sounds impossible
) and this lies in their
constant fear whether someday the people wake up and demand the wealth
that is rightly theirs. The
same happened in the ex- Soviet Union. The NSA had information that
some people were leading
millions of soviets to a revolution in order to get back more than 70 years
stolen wealth. They were
informed about this movement in time and prevented it by dismembering
the country.



* You mentioned before an enormous in power organisation, the NSA.

* Yes, that's right. The NSA ( National Security Agency ) was founded on
4th November 1952 by
president Truman and its headquarters is at Fort Mead USA. It has more
than 2,000,000 agents and
scientists all over the world.

There is no committee in Congress, not even any laws that control their
activities. In reality there is
not even an act to affirm its establishment. There exist only documents to
protect it.

The security standard is very high and its electronic equipment is unique.
It has the most perfect
computer centre in the world. Its computers are gathering and analysing
daily all the information from
the hundreds of monitoring stations that are on the whole planet and in
this way they oversee the
telecommunications of both the friendly and enemy countries. The Greek
part of the NSA network is
the American base of Aktio.

It is equipped with scores of satellites which, for example, monitor the
movements of the Serbs or of
Saddam and in seconds they inform the headquarters of the organisation.

If you ask someone which is the biggest secret service in the world, they
might mention the CIA, DIA
or KGB. The NSA has deliberately cultivated the impression that the secret
services of USA that do
everything are the CIA and the DIA. Many books and articles have been
written about these secret
services. But of the NSA no- one has ever written anything. In reality the
better known services are
executive organs of the NSA which, from its side, is the executive organ of
the two global decision
making centres that we mentioned before; the Bilderberg Club and the
Trilateral Commission.

Remember, the NSA manufactures politicians ( presidents and prime
ministers ) always according to
the orders of the two global centres. It recruits geniuses from all over the
world, it is said that it is the
inventor of the infections of the modern world and of many more things
that it is impossible for the
simple human mind to hold.



* How can anyone manufacture politicians?

* You mean well built?!! There is a committee of politician manufacturing
whose president is David
Rockefeller with vice president Richard Foren, who is a leading consultant
to General Electric.
Members of this committee are Henry Kissinger, Alexander Hague, Toshio
Nakamura, Edmold
Rothschild, Jovianni Anielli, Sirus Vans, Charles Duncan ( ex- president of
Coca- Cola ) and Helmut
Schmidt.

The politicians that are going to be presidents or prime ministers are
approved or turned down by the
above council which meets once a month in the central building of the
NSA.

When the candidate is approved or disapproved the brainwash from the
Mass Media begins. Money
is given from the Central Banks to help establish a party, campaign etc.. At
the same time the other
secret services take orders so that the NSA plan is carried out.



* What do you see in the near future? Will the status quo remain or will
there be changes in
the world?

* I think that the changes will begin in the area of Saudi Arabia, changes
that will have an effect on
the whole international scene. I predict the fragile balance of the oil cartels
will be altered when 3- 4
oil wells of Aramco's cartel are bombed. This will mean an increase in the
price of petroleum
products. The cartels for one or two years will have low profits.

If this happens Greece, with its oil, can play a leading role. Here we will
have a repeat of the Onasis
phenomenon which was recently made public with all its twisted situations.
This time Greece can play
a leading role in Europe because the economic strength of its oil will make
it the 3rd power in the
European Union. I mean that England will loose its oil wells in the Black
Sea, which belong to BP
and Shell, at the same time as the coup d'etat in Saudi Arabia. It is very
possible that the geographic
borders of Greece with Turkey, former Yugoslavia and Albania will change
and also the borders of
Germany and Poland ( the Oderneisser line ) .

England will loose Scotland because the Scottish autonomists will blow its
oil wells. After the IRA
has made an agreement with England a part of it will go to support the
Scottish autonomists.

Being under high pressure, and after having passed the economic
convulsion which will lead to the
global shock we mentioned before, the world's economy will make an
opening to China. China, of
course, will ask for something in return. An exchange could be India.

What does this mean? It means that China will be allowed to invade India
under false pretences. The
Bilderberg Club will supply India, and the Trilateral Commission will
renew the armour of China.

In this war, in order to reduce the world's population, the neutron bomb
will be used. One time
general of NATO's army, Alexander Hague, was fighting off proposals for
the neutron bomb, so on
29th June 1979 they tried to assassinate him.

If this happens Pakistan and Turkey will be dragged in, and Turkey will
split up in two halves,
Eastern and Western part. If this happens Tansu Ciller will put Turkey in
the European Union.

Taking this opportunity I should tell you that within the vast changes that
will happen in the near future
is a step- up of the Ecumenical Patriarchy of Konstantinopolis. I mean that
it will play a more
important role than today. Already Ciller has a draft law ready for the
Turkish parliament if conditions
allow it. In this law the Patriarchy will become a separate state, something
like the Vatican.



* Except for exploiting the global wealth where else do the two global
decision centres target?
Isn't it a little bit unreasonable to say that a small group of humans does
affect and control
almost all the countries on earth? How do they manage not to loose control
of them?

* Let's make something clear. Everyone that is in either the Bilderberg
Club or in the Trilateral
Commission is just a representative of the global cartels. Allied cartels
choose some persons to
represent them in the above decision making centres. Their opinion for the
international trend they
favour depends on the cartel they represent. Besides as cartel people the
only thing that they
understand is profit rates. The protagonists in those decision making
centres just bring gold to the
cartels.

Exceptional members such as Rockefeller, Mitsubishi etc. are just bright
exceptions or as it was
before in the Trilateral Commission Paul Austin the boss of Coca- Cola that
was sleeping during all
talks and resolutions!

Therefore the Bilderberg Club and Trilateral Commission propose to the
people of the cartels such
as Rockefeller, Hunt etc. the international politics that they will follow.

The second part of your question has this answer. In 1963 the Kennedys
tried to reduce tension
between the USA and the USSR and to stop the war in Vietnam. But the
cartels had budgeted that
they would collect billions of dollars with the continuation of the
investments in armour and the war.
John Kennedy knew that they would kill him. He decided to get sacrificed
because of his illness ( an

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:06
John Disney__A (A cons-TIT-tutional question) ID#24135:
To All
A recent letter to the Swaziland Times urged a
constitutional review of the Swazi custom of bare
breasted weddings. He said the practice is indeed
marvellous when the .. brides are fresh... with
attractive bodies ... well formed breasts
In the case of older brides however, he feels the
breasts look like flat slippers used to breast feed
a litter of puppies and are a horrible sight.
He urges that the new constitution be amended to
permit bare breasted-ness only for maidens with
reasonably attractive breasts ( and I agree with him
on this )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 04:06
Pete (ANOTHER:ENTIRE WORLD GOLD IN PRODUCERS HANDS IN LESS THAN 5 YRS?) ID#22451:
Regarding your 2/07/98-20:51 post, what do you consider a small amnt of GOLD?
According to my calculations, oil producers would own all of the existing gold above ground in approximately 5 yrs USING THE CURRENT VALUES FOR OIL AND GOLD.
Ref: golden eagle-Gold Digest Section, History of Gold states that the above ground gold in the entire world equals 120,000 tons with a production of +/- 2000 tons/yr.
Ref: http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiafieo97/oil.html states that the daily production of oil by OPEC=+/- 30 million bl/d and non OPEC producers= +/- 45 million bl/d for a total annual production of 75 milliom bl/d.

Assuming the above references are correct and using approximate values of oil at $17.00/bl, $300.00/oz for gold, I will attemt to calculate the amnt of gold oil producers would obtain in one yr. as follows:

1 ) You said in your post $8.00/bl plus a tiny amnt of gold. $17-$8 = $9.00 worth of gold.

2 ) $9.00 divided by $300/oz = 0.03 oz of gold.

3 ) 75 million bl/d times 365 d/yr time 0.03 oz of gold divided by 16 oz/# divided by 2000#/ton = 25,664 tons of gold annually.

4 ) 120,000 tons of existing above ground gold in the entire world divided by 25,664 tons paid to oil producers annually means that the entire worlds gold would be in producers hands in less than 5 yrs. In addition, the annual world production of gold could not satisfy producers demands. There would be a shortfall of +/- 23,000 tons of gold for years on end.

THE ABOVE CALCULATIONS ARE APPROXIMATE AND USING THE ABOVE ASSUMPTIONS AS RELATIVELY CORRECT, I CAN ONLY COME TO ONE CONCLUSION; OIL AND GOLD ARE DRASTICALLY UNDERVALUED RELATIVE TO THE US DOLLAR.

IF PRODUCERS DEMAND A PARTIAL PAYMENT OF GOLD FOR THIER OIL, EVEN A MUCH SMALLER QUANTITY THAN THE ABOVE 0.03 OZ/BL, THE PRICE OF GOLD WILL SKY ROCKET. THIS WILL SATISFY PRODUCERS BECAUSE THE VALUE OF THIER OIL WILL GREATLY INCREASE WITH GOLD AS PART OF THE EQUATION.

These are my humble opinions. I may have erred somewhere and would appreciate your input or show me the errors of my ways.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 03:52
Robh__A (Trilaterals) ID#407135:
The Trilaterals and the IOC seem to have much in common

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 03:51
John Disney__A (Nobody will seize these assets-who wants them) ID#24135:
For Myrmidon... You talk about what YOU think WILL happen.
I only talk about what HAS happened.. I dont KNOW what will
happen .. and BUDDY YOU DONT EITHER..Actually Growth in Africa
has been increasing. Black South Africans are better off than
ever before. Socialism is bankrupt in Africa. And all Africa
screams for foreign investment. RSA has no capital gains tax
and no tax on dividends. It may get worse but never to the
levels reached in NA and Europe. But thats just my opinion
which I wont bore you with. Please BUY as much BMG as you
can afford. Learn the Hard way. It will be GOOD for you.
Now lets get serious on this stock
Battle mountain... You know-these guys reported a profit
of 11.5 mill $ at the end of the 3rd quarter and now we
have a LOSS at year end .. How shocking to the poor
shareholder.. How pathetic really .. I think Some of
these fourth quarter one offs should have been
foreseen and RESERVED for out of 3rd quarter profits
to soften the blow in the fourth quarter.
Anyway .. we have revenue of 345 mill $ at year end 1997
versus 424 end 1996. and a loss of 22.3 mil last year
versus 74.3 mill for end 1996. This is much better by
inspection but 1996 was AWFUL. In scratching through
this accountants dream of a report, I find reference
to their production of 876,000 oz. They dont mention
it but this is DOWN from the prior year number that I
have ( 916,000 oz ) .
So ignoring the bushwa about cash cost blah blah.
lets see their cost of making gold ( 345+22.3 ) mil/876,000
and we get ... 419 $/oz. ( whoopee ) .
They say they have 10 mil of reserves ( MJ only had
six but they seem not to have included Phoenix )
So 10/234,000 = 0.042 oz/share.
In reading the report, page 6 referred to added
permits, approvals, and special interest groups
which I found intriging. Page 6 referred to their
Pajingo development operation in Australia .. I believe
that is where my ex brother in law him-fella-pie-
in-sky bernstein ( a Brooklyn born adopted aboriginal
and seeker of retroactively established sacred burial sites
based on serious dream time ) was last seen on a walkabout
expedition.
I was pleased to see BMG was closing their Panama
office - page 7. It must have been useful in keeping an eye
on the Canal.
Frankly I was thrilled to see they were exploring
in the Sierra Madre Occidental - page 8. I recall from
the GREAT JOHN HUSTON FILM that a major deposit lies
about 6 -10 days march south of the railway line
near a rain forest inhabited by indians. Durango is
a 10 day march westward from the Site to help zero
it in.
Watch out for Bandits.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 03:36
Ziva (CJS1_A...............NO ONE REPLIED TO YOUR POST !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) ID#302251:
http://www.kitcomm.com/comments/gold/1998q1/1998_02/980206.185743.cjs1__aee.htm

Date: Fri Feb 06 1998 18:57
CJS1__A ( ANOTHER's THOUGHTS Examined ) ID#329157:
A Transactional Analysis approach to ANOTHER's THOUGHTS

You may or may not agree with some of this. I look forward
to some interesting discussion...............



======================

MAYBE TOMORROW

*

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 03:24
Ziva (Nostradamus on the Trilateral and the bilderbergers) ID#302251:

............a secretive, conspirational cabal are
pulling the strings behind the scenes
to manipulate world politics and economies for personal gain.
These master puppeteers operate figureheads in many countries, governments, and the major world capitals.
They are united but are very clever in disguising their influence.
They hold positions that appear to be relatively minor,
like advisors and under-secretaries and such,
but are key positions of their power.

In the daytime they appear to be good, loyal,
model citizens working for the same goals
their governments are supposedly working for,
but behind the scenes they band together
and pool their information and contacts
to work for their own ends.
They do not appear to have any political power
but they really have a firm grip on world affairs,
like sharp teeth sunk into everything.

This secret organization has been in existence for several generations. Their existence is hinted in the family histories
of the banking powers and money centers of the world.
Only the families involved are aware.
The cabal of leaders has been very slowly
but surely building up a worldwide network of power,
because they want to take over
but stay behind the scenes.............

The Cabal families made their influence and fortunes
in the banking and commodities industries,
such as gold or diamond mines, leather, tins, etc,
like the colonial barons associated with
the European world empires who started their families' fortunes
exploiting the materials of the Third World nations.
The seventh and the fifth will have the same names,
and the seventh one will be considered part of the fifth.

The Cabal manipulates the economy to cause
the unemployment or inflation rates to rise or fall at their whim.
They have affected everyone's life.............

Somehow through the espionage powers of the Antichrist,
the seven key leaders of the secret cabal
will be discovered and destroyed.
This is his familiar technique
of throwing his enemies into confusion and chaos
to seize or take advantage of their assets in their weakened state.
At the time he knew only that they were financing the
European forces that opposed him...........


http://www.newage.com.au/library/nostrad1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 03:05
Miro (@Ziva) ID#347457:
No Ziva, I won't tell you that. I was born in Europe during WWII, members of my family ended in concentration camps and were executed ( they were not jews, but were in underground movement ) . And I never agreed with what happened in Vaco.
However, each conspiracy has some goal, trying to achieve some objective. I ask again, what is the goal and how will US benefit from conspiring to nuke Iraq?!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 03:01
Prometheus (@all) ID#210235:
Good nite, all. Good ride, Cherokee.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 03:00
Prometheus (@James) ID#210235:
Sunday Times post on Clinton details what George Orwell predicted. Less is more. When people demand what you don't want them to have, keep changing the definition of that thing until it means what you want them to accept. We have to keep repeating 2+2=4. Don't give it up.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 02:52
Explorer (DESERVES TO BE ON WATCH LIST OF THE PATIENT ) ID#22882:

Homestake and other majors discovered a AU resource of about 2 million ounces in NWT, while Inmet discovered hign grade base metals at Izod Lake.
This company now holds the gold properties and is wrestling to hold the base metal property but missed an option payment on it. Last quote in Toronto $0.27, for details Kit Resources symbol is ( kit ) web site is http://www.kitgold.com

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 02:51
2BR02B? () ID#266105:

Thanks Aur. Gotta hit the road for some days, work.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 02:47
Ziva (Miro) ID#302251:
and you will also tell us
that no one died at Auschwits or Waco.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 02:43
Ziva (James) ID#302251:
If you dont know how to post...DONT

U R taking 2 much space

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 02:43
Miro (@Marshall and Ziva) ID#347457:
Marshall: US plants BIO agent in oil field Blames IRAQ then NUKES them?!
Sounds like a real good plan, but, what is it the US tries to achieve by doing that?!
This site is turning into conspiracy nut's club ;- )

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 02:42
farfel (@DONALD RE:ASEAN NATIONS WILL TRADE WITH SINGAPORE DOLLAR? DOUBTFUL) ID#28585:
Personally, I do not believe the ASEAN nations will come together on the Singapore Dollar issue...and if they do, it will probably be a temporary solution or bridge toward the creation of a common, neutral currency for the entire region ( excluding China & Hong Kong ) .

For one thing, the linchpin of an Asian regional recovery is Japan's active involvement and blessing. The Japanese will feel threatened by a regional effort that strengthens the Singapore dollar to the detriment of the Yen. So, I do not believe Japan will be helpful or co-operative.

Actually, I am not surprised Japan has not actively intervened to help out ASEAN nations in their current economic dilemma. The true crisis point has not yet been reached. At a certain critical point, I expect Japan will invite all these nations to a private conference and introduce the notion of union and a common currency ( already under discussion by some of Japan's most notable economists ) . But, the main thing is Japan will want to call the shots and exert the greatest leverage in determining the exact nature of the union and the new currency. The longer Japan waits, the more desperate the regional situation grows, and the more likely Japan -- the healthiest Asian nation -- will maximize its influence over the union's vital decisions.

Finally, evidence continues to mount that Japan, in this particular global economic crisis, is slowly and carefully selling off American treasuries...and I will bet that they are placing a healthy portion of those funds into gold and silver. Again, if there is a common currency established for the region, I would expect it to be gold supported at the very least.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 02:34
James (CLINTON ONLY WANTS WHAT IS BEST FOR YOU) ID#252150:
From the Sunday Times:

ECONOMICS




Clinton goes on spending spree








A PRESIDENT's budget is the clearest statement of his programmes, priorities and personality. So with the budget President Clinton last week sent to Congress. The programme is to expand the welfare state; the priorities are education, childcare and healthcare; the revealed personality is best described by a phrase in an old Lorenz Hart song: the self-deception that believes the lie.

Start with the self-deception that has become a part of Clinton's personality. He told Congress his $1.7 trillion budget was the first balanced budget in 30 years, a balanced budget not only next year but as far as the eye can see. Unfortunately, that is more than a bit of an overstatement. Included in the figures are revenues the government may never see.

Clinton has counted as a sure thing $65 billion in revenues he hopes to get over five years if and when the tobacco companies and the government work out a settlement of pending litigation. But such a settlement is far from certain and, even if one is reached, there are lots of parties waiting to claim a piece of the pie, which will in any event be available for the slicing only if Congress loads $1.50 in additional taxes on each cigarette pack sold.

Then there is the $23 billion Clinton claims he will get over five years if Congress will only close loopholes ( a politician's way of saying raise taxes ) in the insurance and banking industries and increase death duties and taxes on multinational companies. Subtract all of what John McCain, the Republican senator, calls non-existent revenues, and the projected $9.5 billion surplus in 1999 becomes a deficit.

Clinton's personality is also reflected in his confusion between what he wishes and says is so, and what his own figures show. In his State of the Union message he said America had the smallest government in 35 years, a happy state of affairs he attributed in his budget message to discipline in the use of public funds. The facts are different: government spending has soared, with the federal government now claiming a higher share of gross domestic product ( GDP ) than in any year since 1969, when a tax surcharge was imposed to finance the Vietnam war. Federal taxes claim 20.1% of GDP, up from 18% in the 1970s and 1980s.

Clinton's personality is not all that is reflected in his budget. So, too, is his political programme. It is to expand government. He wants hefty spending rises for most departments: Commerce Department, up 12.2%; Department of Energy, up 5.6%; the Environmental Protection Agency, up 10.9%; Health and Human Services, up 6.0%; Justice Department, up 17.4% ( none of which goes to special prosecutor Kenneth Starr, of course ) ; Labour Department, up 12.2%; Education Department, up 10.4%. Remember: these rises are proposed at a time when inflation is nil.

And they reveal Clinton's priorities. Absent from agencies receiving more funds are the Defense and State Departments, reflecting his long-standing policy of speaking loudly in foreign affairs but carrying a small stick. Defence spending as a portion of GDP is now down to pre-Pearl Harbour levels, a thought several missile-building despots must find comforting. Clinton would rather spend money on education, healthcare and childcare. Although education has traditionally been a matter for state and local governments, he wants to use federal funds to hire 100,000 new teachers. He would also expand government healthcare coverage from the merely elderly to the middle-aged, and extend a day-care tax credit to the 27m families in which both parents have paying jobs or a single parent is working.

For many Republicans the old American saying applies: It ain't the money, it's the principle of the thing. Educational problems cannot be solved by throwing more money at them. After all, spending per pupil is highest in Washington and New York City, both of which specialise in turning out illiterate and innumerate students. Students would be served better, say Clinton's critics, if he would stop pandering to the teachers' unions and enact a school voucher programme that would allow parents to shift their children from bad schools to good ones.

Clinton's proposal to extend healthcare to people under 65 at what he promises would be zero cost to taxpayers also riles critics. His wife having failed to engineer a one-step takeover of the healthcare system, Clinton proposes to accomplish the same objective, but incrementally, moving from kiddie-care and elder-care to middle-age care. The cost could be staggering, especially if government coverage induces private employers to drop their own business-financed insurance plans.

But the most vociferous objections are reserved for Clinton's childcare proposals. There is a debate brewing here about the effect of institutional care as opposed to mother care, with recent studies showing non-maternal childcare is not in children's best interests - Hillary Clinton's It Takes a Village to Raise a Child notwithstanding. Yet Clinton would provide tax credits to mothers who work, but not to those who sacrifice pay cheques to stay at home and raise children.

Conservatives are ready to draw a line in the sand over this issue - or say they are. With Clinton's popularity at a high, the economy booming, and a budget that contains what Trent Lott, the Senate majority leader, describes as lollipops for everyone, the Republicans might just decide overt opposition would carry too high a price for them in this year's congressional elections.










































 

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 02:24
James (BLACK BOX ERASED) ID#252150:
Probably not a great idea for Americans to plan a skiing trip to the Dolomites.

EUROPE




Black box 'wiped' in cable-car crash jet


by John Phillips
Rome






MUCH of the data from the flight recorder of the American military plane that brought down a cable car in the Dolomite mountains last week, sending all 20 people aboard plunging to their deaths, may have been deliberately wiped out, the Italian magistrate in charge of the investigation has claimed.

Judge Francantonio Granero, said he believed the black-box recorder of the EA-6B Prowler surveillance plane had been ripped out immediately after the aircraft touched down at the nearby Aviano base in northern Italy shortly after the accident.

The device had only been made available to his team on Friday and it was not clear how much of the recording had survived.

Much of the data had been eradicated from the memory of the recorder because the black box was removed from the Prowler before its electrical circuits were shut off, Granero said. During the last 48 hours the apparatus remained at the disposal of the Americans and not of the Italian police.

The American authorities said Captain Richard Ashby, 30, the pilot, and three crew members had been arrested pending possible court martial. However, Granero said he hoped they would be tried in an Italian court.

President Bill Clinton has tried to defuse growing tension between the two countries by admitting that the plane had strayed from its flight path. He said he was heartsick and promised a no-holds-barred investigation.

Nevertheless, anti-American feeling still appears to be running high in Cavalese, the resort where the tragedy happened. Local people say they had complained repeatedly to the authorities at Aviano about the potential danger of low-level training flights.

A spokesman for the council in the local capital of Trento rejected as an insult an offer by the Pentagon of £60,000 to be shared by the families of the 20 victims, even though the Americans insist the money is intended only as an initial settlement.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 02:17
Myrmidon (@ John Disney) ID#345268:

Environmental controls in N. America impact mine profitability.
Nobody likes it, but it is spreading world wide. Look at Greece
and TVX. Miners in N. America have learned to account for it as
the cost of doing business. None of us investors like it, and
is nothing we can do about it. Fortunately, N. America is not
starving ( yet ) , so it is unlike for governments to impose heavy mine taxation for the purpose of feeding the people. S. Africa? what do you think? when the populace gets hungrier EXPECT TAXES THERE much greater than here.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 02:02
John Disney__A (Randy sounds cute...But who will be honest enough to buy it) ID#24135:
For Selby
Im sure Randfontein has ADRs .. But I have no Idea
of Symbol ... Could it be RANDY ... they wouldn't
dare..
For Myrmidon
AHA it was you ... YES you will still have assets in
Australia and the US. These guys will never take your
ASSETS.. They only take your PROFITS via special taxes
or new environmental laws ( or windfall taxes ... see
Oil industry in US in late 1970's ) .. nobody else did
that. Or maybe confiscate your gold like the US did in
early 1930s..
But as long as it makes you FEEL better .. that's
all I care about.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:59
Earl () ID#227238:
Earlier T1 posted a URL for Buildfreedom.com. If you have an interest in personal freedom and a desire to, quietly, declare personal independence from your masters, it's well worth a visit. Don't expect perfection but do expect to find a lot of links and some good ideas to pursue further.

What John D. and Mozel have been posting is the real world we live in. The net is going to make it possible for individuals to quietly live their lives with a minimum of terrocrat interference. It won't be dependent on a lot of jive talk but only on a personal committment to action in a private way. ....... one step at a time. One ounce at a time. Purchased in a quiet manner. ... BTW, the preceding was only a personal comment. I have no involvement with that site.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:45
Earl () ID#227238:
Cherokee: Amigo, the passenger list is distinguished, indeed. In such company, I feel compelled to limit my activities to carrying their books and ..... and pass ( ing ) the paper bag that holds the bottle .... as well as other lubricants conducive to civilized conversation.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:38
John Disney__A (Freedom For Canadians) ID#24135:
As you may have noticed, I sometimes react in a hostile
fashion when others express what I view as self serving
opinions about the country in which I happen to be living.
However, I believe rather strongly in maximizing the
rights and individual freedom ( and responsibility ) of
the individual. Growth in power of the state is the
major threat to what I believe in. I believe for
example that the South's loss of the Civil war was a
major disaster for the USA. States rights became
subservient to a central governmant that would maintain
future power through the use of patronage and
manipulation of its citizens.
For that reason, I believe that independence for
Quebec would be an excellent idea. This should be
extended to all the other provinces, in my view.
As an Australia, I also feel that the country
would be improved greatly by following the same path.
I would begin by stringing razor wire 10 meters
high around Canberra, Then granting it independence.
If it needed a bit of foreign aid now and then, I
would be generous ( I could afford to be ) .

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:38
Selby () ID#287207:
John Disney: I have been immersed in SA stocks for about 5 days now. Do you know if Randfontein Estates trades in the US and if so what the symbol is?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:37
Poorboys (Snowbird ---- Oldgold) ID#224149:
Snowbird ---Oldgold ------In regards to the C$ Soros and his group of slime suckers are now kicked out of our beloved Country and the fundamentals are more in line with productivity in this great white north as far as the BOC selling gold ? Sure they got a great price better than most.Why is the C$ rising now ? The Currency gangsters have been shut out and warned. Oldgold ---Yes I am still long term bearish on gold .If you remember I called a high this year of 334 and a low of 187 .As chart characteristics change I still stick to the 334 high but the 187 low may take many years on the timeline .As you know I am never married to any position but long term call me Mr.Bear until proven otherwise I will play the charts in both directions and so far -----Very Profitable ---Away to find Ted and the new American dream

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:36
cherokee__A (@-------finally-caught-uplink-to-another-transient-neutrino------the-mind-is-cleared-bull-sh!t!!!!!!) ID#344308:

earl-----

my fellow ssm rider------thanks for the efforts.....as mozart suffered
greatly from his 'connection'.........so do many others.......strength ebbs and flows......... as the moon moves its' assigned designees......
so the peopleo are prepared for their most incredible journey...they just know not of it ----------yet......

the task at hand cannot be comprimised.........i have added mozel
and 223 to the ssm seating list........the seeds here
are greater than i've ever seen.......several more to be added soon....
share-fin and nick@c have been added tam bien.....donald_a is a front row dude also..........with their respective silver feathers........gold ones being poured as we fly
amongst the ether....like to spend another night in babylon........not before the units in this mad machinery......have their run......it's begun..

yours, as always, ( ssm ) is in the front row..........ted----keeper of the flame.....arden.....handler of the hubbly-bubbly------and with his hand on the throttle.......share-fin..........my friend......donald...the navigator......me, as positioner of the eyes forward---by looking backward---------------------

earl----my friend......the ship is yours for the asking.....

cherokee-----!;...not-believing-what-i-'see'------coming-soon------nooooooooooooooooo,noooooooooooooooooooo, please no..........

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:28
Preacher (Western Copper) ID#227290:

Chas, I haven't followed all the posts about Western Copper tonight. But if anyone needs info on the company, just call the PR man, ( Iron ) Mike Halvorson, Investor Relations, ( 403 ) 414-0763.

He'll give yo u the straight scoop.

I'm hearing this is a major discovery

The Preacher

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:23
Ziva (glad you woke up ....MARSHALL) ID#302251:
Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:41
Marshall ( US plants BIO agent in oil field Blames IRAQ then
NUKES them ) ID#293211:
Is it possible that BLACK elements of US Govt spreads BIO agent on some
gulf state then Blames Iraq then
attacks Iraq with Nuclear weapon. GOLD and OIL sure to rocket............. News elements in US are organs of CIA.

==============================

Carl Berenstien said already in the seventies
that about 400 CIA agents
are controling the News Media in the USA.

There are reasons to believe
that everything that we heard for the last 30 years,
is what the CIA wanted us to think.


But don't blame the CIA,
they are the lowest part in the chain of command,
they just do the dirty jobs.

The Trilateral and the NSA
tell them what to do.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:23
Prometheus (Stock market discovered) ID#210235:
to be a giant hoax?

Read story at http://www.herald.com/archive/barry/archive/sep28.htm

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:21
James (Marshall@WHO WILL NUKE WHOM) ID#252150:
The only ME Country that is close to having the capability to manufacture nukes is Iran ( Israel already has them ) . Netanyhu ( sp ) has already stated that Israel is not prepared to stand by and give Iran the time to develop that capability.
I would not be surprised if under some pretext or other Israel attacks Iran in the not too distant future & takes out their nuke capability. I don't think they could do it during this next attack on Iraq ( if it occurs ) . Apparently they are waiting to take delivery of new fighter aircraft or bombers, which would have the range to hit Iran. I do think it will happen within 1 year, possibly with nukes.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:20
tolerant1 (opps) ID#31868:
http://biz.yahoo.com/n/b/bmg.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:19
Myrmidon (@ John Disney) ID#345268:
one more try

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/980206/rpt_battle_1.html

It should work, I missed the : after http, Sorry John.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:19
tolerant1 (John Disney_A - Myrmidon) ID#31868:
Try this link as well Http://biz.yahoo.com/n/b/bmg.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:16
Myrmidon (@ John Disney) ID#345268:

Yahoo says that the site I posted has expired.
Try this updated one:

http//biz.yahoo.com/bw/980206/rpt_battle_1.html

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:14
Ziva (damn quick.......Amen) ID#302251:
Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:02
cherokee__A
( @-----battling-sensory-over-load------------------------mfbbo!!!!!!!!!! )
ID#344308:


....i am consumed.....the diaspora is amux
us......what more signs are needed ziva? she was known here a year
ago by another nomer.....she/he/it is ok too......just hyper.....
everybody better get hyper DAMNED QUICK......

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:11
Myrmidon (@ John Disney) ID#345268:

Full info on Battle Mountain ( BMG ) is on:

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/980206/batlle_mou_2.html

John, BMG has also mines in Nevada, Washington, and Australia.
So something will be left after political instability IMHO.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:09
Earl () ID#227238:
Myrmidon: Speaking of refining and such; from friends in the film and chemistry side of the business, I get the impression that there are many who have silver banked with refiners and waiting for an opportune time to sell. This is anecdotal and I don't have any way to put a number on it.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:02
cherokee__A (@-----battling-sensory-over-load------------------------mfbbo!!!!!!!!!!) ID#344308:

beastiality at its' worst.........

the laws of the universe-------physics---------god-------

dictates there 'will be expansion and contraction........

gold has contracted an in-ordinately fashion from the doings of
man.......be-ware the righting of a wrong.........be-ware the
truth, as many of the faint of heart will not survive............................ the truth...
..life is strange and not of the seemingly constants we ahve witnessed
over the last 68 years........the hatt is one of the few, who.....
can interpolate the future into the present.....he/sheba/it.....keep
on keeping on.....you speak the truth........time escapes me.......
and the message-----the truth-------your---mine---------the same.......
mjst carry-on........time is oh so short, as to make mine eyes tear for
the inevitable, imminent chaos and flux, that i seemingly joy-fully posted time and time again over the last year..........the gravity has
just hit me........viewing from the third person to 'see' is insulary
to the ramifacations........the children.......mine.... yours........
too much absolut vodka.......i am consumed.....the diaspora is amux us......what more signs are needed ziva? she was known here a year
ago by another nomer.....she/he/it is ok too......just hyper.....
everybody better get hyper DAMNED QUICK......altruism........who? why?
the reasoning for being here? profit, as alluded to by some? or the
holy grail? the truth? there is an ancient truth that has been written
about by the greatest of all the poets and writers through-out history...

'bury the dead past, and trust not the future' longfellow...

the same thing by ALL THE GREAT WRITERS AND THINKERS OF ALL TIME!
the bible included..........the book of books.........
the modern day solicitor of the truth..........ken robert's......

'trust not the future, and bury the dead past'

who is trusting the paper-tiger? how many riders ( mutual funds ) are already insider-er? the bitch-dog is sick from ink-ingestion.....psted here
last year............read kitco.......the archives...to see who said
what and when.........oh yeah baby........

heading to s california ( newport beach area ) and then vegas around the
end of feb...............

eb let's party! big bear and the slopes.........and ss#1........life is good..........

cherokee!;......fixin-to-kick-ass------the-smell-of-gold---in-the-city-of-lights........big-bear.......brian-head-------here-i-come..........

flat-lander to-the-top-of-the-mountain-----------wtpogaha

chickens WILL have lips in the future...........sharks have ALWAYS had
water-tight p---!es.........iraq has set the trap......mark my words...
the trap is set...and it will be.......as the hopi time-line has portrayed.....

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 01:00
Myrmidon (Silver refining companies) ID#345268:

http://www.ipmi.org/bgcs0031.htm

I will check them out in detail.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:59
John Disney__A (..a whiter shade of pale..?) ID#24135:
I saw some posters express interest in BMG. Im
curious .. Have they announced results through
year end 1997
As I posted earlier, their average costs were 325
in 1995, 540 in 1996, and 420 for the first 9 months
of 1997. They seem low in P&P reserves at 6mill oz
for 234 mill shares or 0.025 Oz/share. About a third
of that is in Bolivia. They seem to have a small
interest in Lihir ?. They own a 65% interest in the
Dunkwa property in Ghana.
If Im not mistaken .. They same poster that is
interested in this mine would never touch Ashanti
for fear that a Black dictator may sieze his assets.
But Ashanti in in Ghana... just like Dunkwa.. Is it
is a safer part of Ghana I assume there is less
problem having your assets seized by a melanesian/
micronesian/Bolivian dictator than a Black one. It
would be more or less the same to me.
All this aside, Any ideas on their resource base.
I get thin numbers. Also their year end results,
I need revenue, profits ( loss ) , and gold production
for the year if anyone has them.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:58
James (WHERE Y'ALL FROM) ID#252150:
When I was stationed in W.Germany in the early 80's, I ran into people all over Europe, especially the Med Countries, who were wearing Canada tee shirts & ball caps & had funny accents ( for Canadians ) . Turns out that many were from the Southern U.S., & many other States. That was quite a while ago & Americans were'nt exactly popular in many Countries at that time. If any of the Kitco Americans are planning trips overseas,
I strongly recommend that you stock up on Canada tee shirts & ball caps
--especially if the attack on Iraq occurs.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:53
aurator (Ag --- Again and Again---Ag gain___) ID#257148:


I believe there are no more practical efficiencies available in the photographic recycling of Ag. The silver on the punched out spiggot hoes in the film is re -cycled, unless that is just a goldbug's myth.

There are several.....

Hit or myth?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:51
Myrmidon (@ refer) ID#345268:

Funny, you made my name a Biblical one! Myrmidon vs. Myridom!

For the benefit of all of us, can you please re-post the question to
Another? Thanks.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:41
Marshall (US plants BIO agent in oil field Blames IRAQ then NUKES them) ID#293211:
Is it possible that BLACK elements of US Govt spreads BIO agent on some gulf state then Blames Iraq then
attacks Iraq with Nuclear weapon. GOLD and OIL sure to rocket.There was a book written in
1979 that reads just like that. News elements in US are organs of CIA.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:40
Myrmidon (@ Earl, Aurator, Tolerant1) ID#345268:

Refining capacity is the issue. Silver will come into the
market from public hands. SSC will benefit and one should look
of similar companies. Recovery from imaging and photography is
one aspect. Refining is another and both must be considered.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:37
tolerant1 (Earl) ID#31868:
Take a look at ITRONICS, their line of fertilizer and other avenues which generate money are more than interesting.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:35
refer (Myridom) ID#41229:
Silver used used extensively in soldering applications also, englehard is a major manufactor of solder products w/silver.




Cherokee:

Thanks for the reply, received Option Vue 5 in the mail and was going to check it out.



WetGold:

ANOTHER has selective reading, has not answered 1 of my questions.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:32
Earl (Silver from base solutions.) ID#227238:
Mymidon: There are many in that business. Most small companies. A silver recovery unit will last many years. EPA reg's currently demand virtually all silver be recovered before water is discharged. ..... What's really needed are more photographers and radiographers. ..... We need to advocate routine chest films for everyone. Say a prayer for TB? That might be extreme.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:32
aurator (Refining.....) ID#257148:
Myrmidon
There's always
http:///gold.kitco.html
but Bart may take offence at the advertisement ;- )

Bart
You've made your point with Herr Dr. Vronsky, I thought it v humorous and an excellent repartee. Perhaps you could let the bald eagle off the hook now I am sure the Privilege will not be abused. Right Mr Vronsky?


looking for the happy medium ( Madame Zola on Prozac )

For, all things in moderation, including moderation

aurator_riding@GiantMOA_down themiddle_path_uhhu

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:27
tolerant1 (Prometheus) ID#31868:
I love the buildfreedom.com site - great site!!!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:26
tolerant1 (Myrmidon) ID#31868:
Thursday November 20, 8:03 am Eastern Time

Company Press Release

Itronics Annual Shareholder Meeting

RENO, Nev.-- ( BUSINESS WIRE ) --Nov. 20, 1997--Itronics Inc. ( ITRO ) shareholders re-elected the Board of Directors at the annual shareholder meeting.

The directors are John W. Whitney, Paul H. Durckel, Richard W. Stumbo, Jr., and Alan C. Lewin.

An increase in authorized shares from 50,000,000 to 250,000,000 was approved at the meeting.

Itronics Inc. is a Reno-based company specializing in recycling technology development, photobyproduct recycling, silver refining, and technical services for the mining and recycling industries.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Contact:

Itronics Inc.
John W. Whitney, 702/689-7696

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:25
James (Chas) ID#252150:
No response? I clicked on the URL that you posted & got it.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:19
Prometheus (@tolerant1) ID#210235:
Thanks for mentioning buildfreedom.com. A new site with some old names and great ideas, ideal feeding trough for gold bugs.
munch munch munch

Damn! Here comes the rain again. RJ, get the hell outta the hot tub!

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:18
Myrmidon (@ tolerant1) ID#345268:

1/4 a share. How many shares outstanding? Any others?

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:14
Myrmidon (@ tolerant1) ID#345268:

You are thinking ahead. I am checking it right now. Thanks.

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:13
tolerant1 (Myrmidon) ID#31868:
Tuesday February 3, 8:02 am Eastern Time

Company Press Release

Itronics Announces Lease/Option On New Facility

RENO, Nev.-- ( BUSINESS WIRE ) --Feb. 3, 1998--Itronics Inc. ( ITRO ) announced today that its photobyproduct recycling subsidiary, Itronics Metallurgical Inc. has entered into a lease, with option to purchase, to acquire a 35,000 square foot manufacturing facility on 3 acres of land in the Reno Stead area.

The purchase option price is $1,000,000 including a $300,000 down payment. The owner has the alternative to carry the $700,000 balance over 25 years at commercial rates with a 5 year balloon or by taking 2,615,845 shares of Itronics Inc. common stock.

The lease and occupancy are contingent on obtaining the necessary City of Reno Special Use and Environmental Control Permits. Application for the Special Use Permits was filed with the City of Reno on Jan. 15, 1998. The hearing with the Planning Commission is scheduled for March 4, 1998. If approved at that meeting occupancy is anticipated in May or June 1998.

The new facility will make it possible for Itronics Metallurgical Inc., Itronics' photobyproduct recycling subsidiary to expand commercial production of its fertilizer line which is marketed under the trade name Gold-N-Gro.

The new facility will also make it possible to expand the semi-works silver refining operation, and to initiate R & D on mine applications for its silver recovery and refining technology.

Itronics Metallurgical has been operating an R & D and semi-works recycling facility in Reno for the past 12 years, during which the fertilizer product line was developed, field-tested and initially marketed.

Itronics Inc. is a Reno-based company specializing in recycling technology development, photobyproduct recycling, silver refining, and technical services for the mining and recycling industries.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Contact:

Itronics Inc.
John W. Whitney, 702/689-7696

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:11
tolerant1 (Myrmidon) ID#31868:
Itronics. ITRO on nasdaq

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 00:09
Myrmidon (Double hit with silver) ID#345268:

With silver soon at $10,

let us for a moment consider the explosive sales of
companies that manufacture silver recovery equipment
for photographic and medical imaging applications.

This used to be very fashionable back un the Hunt days.
Let us get on the bandwagon now. In the California
gold rush those who made big money were the suppliers
of shovels. Now will be the silver recovery suppliers.

Any ideas of such companies?

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